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Twin Peaks Season 3 |OT2| It's Just A Change, Not An End

LProtag

Member
I liked that we got some reasonable conclusions in episode 17 with BOB being destroyed and Laura's death being prevented. It felt like a good wrap up to everything.

And then we got episode 18, which showed that the evil in the world is much more pervasive than we thought. I'm not sure if that was an alternate reality, Laura's dream, whatever, but it was sure something.
 
After sleeping on it long and hard, I def felt 17 was a much stronger ending if it was to actually end on that note. 18 was so oppressive and bleak but I like the theory that 17 was the ending while 18 was a new mystery.

I just want more peaks man :/
 

HotHamBoy

Member
Here's an interesting take on the series:

‘Twin Peaks: The Return’ Pushed Past the Limits of Nostalgia

I’m not going to pretend to understand much of what happened in the final two parts of The Return—certainly nothing that happens after Cooper ventures, alone, through the door of Room 315 at the Great Northern Hotel and into a succession of increasingly strange flashbacks and alternate dimensions. I do, however, find enormous resonance in how the final scene of The Return—an ending director David Lynch and cowriter Mark Frost actually planned, as opposed to the original series’ abrupt conclusion on ABC all those years ago—so closely mirrors the experience of watching the show. After 18 mind-bending hours, it’s apparent that nostalgia and a conscious effort to counteract it are essential to Twin Peaks: The Return and the powerful emotion it provokes in an audience hungry to be simultaneously serviced and surprised.

Something always rang a little false about the idea of Twin Peaks getting a revival in the vein of Peak TV rescue operations like Arrested Development, Roseanne, and Will & Grace. In 40 years of feature filmmaking, Lynch has earned his reputation as the ultimate auteur, a man so dedicated to his vision he took half a decade to will the hermetic dystopia of Eraserhead into being. The idea of a sequel felt distinctly un-Lynchian—let alone a sequel to the TV series he had a famously ambivalent relationship with, after network executives forced him and Frost to answer the question of who killed Laura Palmer earlier than they planned. (Which was never.) Was David Lynch really about to become just another player in the IP sweepstakes, giving the people what they want instead of striving to give us what we didn’t know we need?

In retrospect, it’s a silly question. It was immediately obvious upon The Return’s premiere in late May that this was not going to be the Twin Peaks of the ’90s, with its soap opera shape, good-natured quirk, and Angelo Badalamenti’s steadying compositions. What was not obvious, however, was just how aware Lynch and Frost were of our yearning for the original Twin Peaks,or how they would capitalize upon it to maximize the uncanny horror and visceral sadness of The Return.

There was the absence of Special Agent Dale Cooper, replaced by a pair of sublime performances from star Kyle MacLachlan as Cooper’s evil doppelgänger and a brain-damaged Las Vegas insurance salesman named Dougie Jones. Cooper was finally resurrected in last week’s “Part 16,” and in a quarter century of watching television, I’ve never felt a payoff register that deeply as a physical sensation of joy and relief. But those feelings didn’t erase the 15 hours of unease that preceded them. Cooper wasn’t simply gone for all those episodes: he was being strategically withheld until we simply couldn’t bear a world without him, or the violent, cruel place it had become.

At other times, Lynch and Frost seemed to confront the audience far more directly with the implications of uncomplicated nostalgia—of wanting to see Twin Peaks served back, untouched or reduced to the handful of touchstones that have come to symbolize it in popular culture. There was the way Dougie would come alive at any mention of Twin Peaks’ celebrated iconography: coffee, cherry pie, or, while watching Sunset Boulevard,the name “Gordon Cole.” There was Audrey Horne, now a nervous wreck, styled identically to the clothes and makeup as a teenage girl, in a way seemingly custom-designed to emphasize her age. There was the almost weaponized use of Badalamenti’s music, replaced largely by silence and ambient noise only to come crashing through when Bobby Briggs caught sight of Laura Palmer’s portrait in Episode 4.

These choices had the effect of highlighting audience expectations, often by following them to their logical conclusion. If you wanted the small Washington town preserved in amber, there it was. Shelly was still working as a waitress at the Double R; Ed and Nadine were still stuck in a marriage they both knew was a sham. But instead of being comforting, an unchanged Twin Peaks turned out to be deeply sad. Such is the natural result of our culture’s current mania for what used to be; Lynch and Frost simply had the guts to point it out.

The Return takes place in a world where the forces of evil, in the first series’ finale, have triumphed over good and run rampant for the past quarter century; the series portrays the resultant devastation by expanding outward from its namesake location to New York, New Mexico, Las Vegas, and South Dakota. The Return drives home its dire status quo on a much smaller scale, too, by showing us the effects of time and decay on people we love. Several of The Return’s cast members passed away during, or even before, production, and the series dealt with these absences in different ways: Catherine Coulson’s Log Lady was given a fittingly haunting goodbye; David Bowie was recast as a sort of animatronic teapot; Frank Silva and Don S. Davis’s masklike faces were used. Even the living, however, became examples of what the intervening decades had wrought, and not always by simply demonstrating the effects of age and inertia. The vitality of Richard Horne, for example, is precisely what makes him so terrifying: what would once seem like an unalloyed good in the classic TV happy ending sense—Audrey Horne and Dale Cooper have a baby—has been curdled into something awful, because Richard’s father is Cooper’s evil doppelgänger.

Sure enough, anti-nostalgia manifests itself throughout the two-part finale. Evil Cooper reaches Twin Peaks before the real Cooper, and the dead giveaway that something’s not right is his refusal of an offer of hot coffee. Several of the scenes that follow Cooper’s passage into the hotel room literally rewrite Twin Peaks’history, including the very first scene of the pilot. And the very last line of dialogue in the entirety of Twin Peaks is Cooper, shaken and confused, asking plaintively: “What year is it?” He’s as taken aback as the rest of us.

Going into The Return,it was easy to be torn between a desire to revisit a beloved classic and a curiosity about what a creative force like Lynch would do after an 11-year hiatus from long-form visual storytelling. (His last feature, Inland Empire,was released in 2006.) Part of The Return’s genius is how it folds the former into the latter: piggybacking off our preconceived notions of Twin Peaks to push it to scarier, stranger, more powerful places. The Return killed our darlings for us, one episode at a time.
 

Airola

Member
a lot of people were convinced that it was going to circle back and make sense in a way they understood, and ep 16 really made it seem like it was headed in that direction

Judging by the comments each week, nearly every episode since episode 7 did that, though.

More people began to doubt it, more people began to talk smack to those who doubted.
Then after episode 16 doubters were half-proven wrong until in the end they were proven right :D
 

Flipyap

Member
I liked that we got some reasonable conclusions in episode 17 with BOB being destroyed and Laura's death being prevented. It felt like a good wrap up to everything.
Heh. "Reasonable."
I'd be a catatonic mess right now if the show ended with a Back to the Future sequence after a gimmick character punched archival footage of Frank Silva to death.
 

hamchan

Member
Laura screams. All the lights turn off with an electrical pop.

Suddenly all the lights turn on again. A figure walks out of the shadows in a slow mesmerising way. The figure has a shotgun slung over his shoulder.

DESMOND
Good evening, Federal Bureau of Investigation, Special Agent Chet Desmond. I'm here to rescue you.
 

Ashby

Member
The quick scene with Audrey in the white room looking into the mirror felt like the most "real" event in the whole show.
 

timberger

Member
So, uh... before even trying to think about any of the rest of it... did the Audrey stuff have any real point?

That last episode just left me a fucking wreck. Don't know how to process it yet.

edit: ah, I see we're all confused by the Audrey thing. Really surprised there was no follow up there at all... or maybe I'm not surprised at all... God, fuck you Lynch :(
 

-shadow-

Member
Man episode 17 was a weird one with the Bob fight, the dream aspect being very obvious and the ending. Just when things seemed like there was going to be closure they pull this one along with episode 18. But who's dream is it? What's up with Audrey and her looking in the mirror (what seemed like the only 'real' scene in the entire thing)? What was Cooper is business at the box? Is Sarah Judy? What's exactly up with Cooper's and Laura's 'new' reality?

Going to rewatch the series again soon, because this is so confusing, and I'm loving it!


Also, was this how people felt back in '91? :p
 

Airola

Member
Ok, here's what I think season 4 should be about:

In this reality where Cooper and Carrie are, there is a new girl being tormented by sinister forces, suffering from abuse and in danger to be murdered.

Just as Laura saw Mrs. Tremond and the Grandson, this new girl is seeing Cooper, Diane and Laura spooking around. Sometimes Cooper is inside Richard, Diane is inside Linda and Laura is inside Carrie. Sometimes they are just spirits.

Maybe Mrs. Tremond also had her own familiar version of the town where things were different than what she knew, but she walked around this unfamiliar version of Twin Peaks while trying to fix/correct/change things.
 

120v

Member
i think the particulars of audrey are kind of irrelevant. she could be in a mental institution, it could be a dream, whatever. i think the gist is she was in a dark place and consummating with mr. c put her there. she eventually snapped out of it but wherever she ended up didn't have her back in twin peaks dallying around the great northern per the audrey we knew
 
I haven't considered the symbol doppelcoop is after to be anything other than Black Lodge/Owl related, which I have to admit doesn't make sense since he doesn't want to go back there. I'm going to have to look up the older owl symbol and compare. I never realized it's a new symbol and I like the idea that it represents the frogmouth or Judy.

Also, I had nightmares/dreams about Cooper all night. I'm still reconciling the entire season (really series) in my head, but I know that Lynch/Frost somehow did it again in that they've left an ending that is deserving of the series. That's three now that Twin Peaks has given us, and they have each been incredible.
 
Rewatching. Huh. The diner in Part 18 where he gets Laura's address was called "Judy's."

Whatever the "switch" is, it seems to happen when Cooper goes to sleep that night in the motel. He wakes up and the motel isn't this ratty old place that he pulled up to in a classic 60s car. It's a moder double-decker motel and he's driving a slick government-issued black roadster and Diane is suddenly convinced he is Richard and she is Linda.
 

Necron

Member
Laura screams. All the lights turn off with an electrical pop.

Suddenly all the lights turn on again. A figure walks out of the shadows in a slow mesmerising way. The figure has a shotgun slung over his shoulder.

DESMOND
Good evening, Federal Bureau of Investigation, Special Agent Chet Desmond. I'm here to rescue you.

tumblr_ne2oo9WOUX1qdhps7o5_r1_250.gif

... man, I feel completely lost - much like Cooper.

How's Annie...
How's Annie?
HOW'S ANNIE?!
 

Airola

Member
There's nothing that proves the woman from 1954 was Sarah.

For some reason last night I had an epiphany where I understood that the girl was actually Diane.

I had perfectly proved it in my mind but now I don't remember any of the reasonings anymore.
 

Mariolee

Member
17: "Here it comes, the closure you've been waiting for!"
18: "Closure's just an excuse for people to forget the damn thing you've been watching"
 

Daffy Duck

Member
So the 8 is really meaning infinite isn't it, and time being a loop and Laura is always going to be in this state, the dot represents the starting point always different but ultimately travelling the same path.
 

Diggler

Member
On a rewatch it seems like the Fireman basically set a trap for Evil Coop all along. As soon as Evil Coop travels through the portal into what I presume is the white lodge, we see him stuck in some kinda cage, which is then immediately spat out directly at the entrance to the Twin Peaks sheriff station. Everything the Fireman has done has been to get this specific set of people to be at the station at this exact point in time, to kill Evil Coop and BOB, and it works pretty much perfectly.

I take episode 17 as almost a satire of the upbeat, happy ending to the series we probably all thought we wanted. After the above reunion, Cooper travels back in time, finds Laura on the night of her murder, and saves her life this time, altering the future like Marty McFly. With the music building up, and the scene of Pete going out fishing that morning, it's a beatiful moment. In many ways, that's your ending right there - and I think a certain type of audience member could definitely stop watching The Return at that point and call this a great success, with everyone living happily ever after. But having watched it twice now, I'm glad that's not what happens.

My take on ep 18 is that when Judy realises Cooper has changed the course of events and saved Laura from ever dieing, she yanks her away and traps her in basically a dream world prison alternate universe kinda thing. That's where Coop and Diane go in the final ep, to rescue Laura 'cos - presumeably - she's some kind of force for good or ultimately a weapon that will stop Judy permanently.

Coop thinks that finding trapped Laura in the dream world and driving her back to her house will snap her out of whatever spell she's under and whatever fake life she's living there, but when they arrive he realises it ultimately doesn't matter that they've driven all this way - they are still trapped in a fake reality in a fake time. I wonder if the more time he spends there the more he forgets that he's Coop too and sucumbs to this alternate world himself as well (drifting in and out of becoming "Richard"). We see this happen to Diane basically the first night they arrive and she bails on him.

I think it's ultimately an upbeat ending though, albeit a major cliffhanger, 'cos Laura does seem to snap out of it at that very final moment when she screams. I presume if we were to see just 10 more minutes of screen time, this fake prison dream world would come crashing down right there (which we see happening to the house), and Cooper and Laura would most likely be alive and well in the present, ready to face Judy. But we don't get that far.

----

Random other things; is Audrey also trapped in a similar kinda prison world? If so why/how?

Additionally, in ep 18 could Coop's change of persona from positive cheerful good old Coop, to somber serious Coop, also coincide with the birth of the new Dougie 2.0? Perhaps Cooper had to sacrifice some of himself to "give" to Dougie when creating him - the price he had to pay. Dougie sure seems happy when he shows up at the door, whereas our Coop doesn't crack another smile from that point on. In fact he's 100% ice cold for the rest of the ep.
 

zeioIIDX

Member
So after watching the finale last night as well as Lost Highway for the first time, I ended up having one of the worst nightmares of my entire life. I can't even tell you how fucking relieved and confused I was when I woke up this morning. I was physically shaking because I actually felt like my nightmare was reality. Fucking Lynch......
 

kevin1025

Banned
So after watching the finale last night as well as Lost Highway for the first time, I ended up having one of the worst nightmares of my entire life. I can't even tell you how fucking relieved and confused I was when I woke up this morning. I was physically shaking because I actually felt like my nightmare was reality. Fucking Lynch......

I had a dream that they put dragons in Star Wars to capitalize on Game of Thrones and that Rey's staff was a double-edged lightsaber after all. I also blame Lynch, he broke my mind.
 
So after watching the finale last night as well as Lost Highway for the first time, I ended up having one of the worst nightmares of my entire life. I can't even tell you how fucking relieved and confused I was when I woke up this morning. I was physically shaking because I actually felt like my nightmare was reality. Fucking Lynch......

Yeah, I had an eerily vivid nightmare last night too.
It was basically the Sarah Connor nightmare from T2 with the nuclear explosion, as I kept thinking about the atom bomb test sequence from Episode 8 after the finale was over.

When I came to, I had the first negative thought in my life that I've probably ever had about David Lynch. lmao
 

Ashby

Member
Laura screams. All the lights turn off with an electrical pop.

Suddenly all the lights turn on again. A figure walks out of the shadows in a slow mesmerising way. The figure has a shotgun slung over his shoulder.

DESMOND
Good evening, Federal Bureau of Investigation, Special Agent Chet Desmond. I'm here to rescue you.

Would be fucking dope if Desmond was the protagonist of next season
 

Necron

Member
So after watching the finale last night as well as Lost Highway for the first time, I ended up having one of the worst nightmares of my entire life. I can't even tell you how fucking relieved and confused I was when I woke up this morning. I was physically shaking because I actually felt like my nightmare was reality. Fucking Lynch......

How can you be so sure that you're not still dreaming?
 

EdmondD

Member
Thinking about the Cooper and Diane romance. Diane is stuck in the Lodge since Doop made a tulpa out of her. Coop's been in the lodge for 25 years. Maybe they fell in love in the lodge?
 
So after watching the finale last night as well as Lost Highway for the first time, I ended up having one of the worst nightmares of my entire life. I can't even tell you how fucking relieved and confused I was when I woke up this morning. I was physically shaking because I actually felt like my nightmare was reality. Fucking Lynch......

Every night will be like this
You'll experience it from different perspectives and eventually you'll scream and everything will go black
;p
I made sure to stay up a bit later and watch some funny stuff on adult swim to not have nightmares
Diane seeing Diane would have been nightmare fuel if I went to sleep after the finale


Thinking about the Cooper and Diane romance. Diane is stuck in the Lodge since Doop made a tulpa out of her. Coop's been in the lodge for 25 years. Maybe they fell in love in the lodge?

I was gonna say that Cooper is being a dick to Annie but since Diane was stuck in the lodge I'm sure they both spent time together
25 years is a long ass time
 
Here's the thing, if JUDY is this ultimate powerful evil that could yank people off into other dimensions and shit...why doesn't it yank people or the world and turn it into a hellscape for the minions to fester off on? Sometimes I wonder what the limit on these beings are or even why would there be a limit if you're this powerful.

i guess we wouldn't have a story then if it that happened
 

120v

Member
Here's the thing, if JUDY is this ultimate powerful evil that could yank people off into other dimensions and shit...why doesn't it yank people or the world and turn it into a hellscape for the minions to fester off on? Sometimes I wonder what the limit on these beings are or even why would there be a limit if you're this powerful.

i guess we wouldn't have a story then if it that happened

well judy seems to be the ultimate Big Bad but not necessarily all powerful. assuming s/he erased laura from existence by banging on her portrait via sarah, s/he was only able to do so after coop's time travel shenanigans
 

MikeHLS

Neo Member
My take on ep 18 is that when Judy realises Cooper has changed the course of events and saved Laura from ever dieing, she yanks her away and traps her in basically a dream world prison alternate universe kinda thing. That's where Coop and Diane go in the final ep, to rescue Laura 'cos - presumeably - she's some kind of force for good or ultimately a weapon that will stop Judy permanently.

Coop thinks that finding trapped Laura in the dream world and driving her back to her house will snap her out of whatever spell she's under and whatever fake life she's living there, but when they arrive he realises it ultimately doesn't matter that they've driven all this way - they are still trapped in a fake reality in a fake time. I wonder if the more time he spends there the more he forgets that he's Coop too and sucumbs to this alternate world himself as well (drifting in and out of becoming "Richard"). We see this happen to Diane basically the first night they arrive and she bails on him.

I think it's ultimately an upbeat ending though, albeit a major cliffhanger, 'cos Laura does seem to snap out of it at that very final moment when she screams. I presume if we were to see just 10 more minutes of screen time, this fake prison dream world would come crashing down right there (which we see happening to the house), and Cooper and Laura would most likely be alive and well in the present, ready to face Judy. But we don't get that far.

This is pretty damn close to how I'm netting out. Looking forward to the future readings that will flesh this out in detail.

Man, what an absolute masterpiece.
 

Krev

Unconfirmed Member
How can you be so sure that you're not still dreaming?
"Is it really you?"

What an utter masterpiece this was. I'm haunted by it. It's as clear a distillation of Lynch's big idea in his post Twin Peaks works (a failure to accept reality resulting in a destruction of identity) as episode 7 and 29 were of his big ideas at that time (innocents vs a great unknowable evil).

We can never undo what has been done. All we can do is confront pain, and slowly move on as best we can. Be thankful not to be someone like Sarah Palmer, so touched by grief we can't ever be truly happy again, and count ourselves blessed by what we have.
Cooper, always trying to solve the 'mystery', of 'how can an innocent girl die/how can something like the atomic bomb exist in our world/etc', can't let go. He can't just be. He can't grieve.

It was devastating psychological horror working at a level we haven't seen since the last time Lynch made a film.
 

cb1115

I Was There! Official L Receiver 2/12/2016
Cooper acted more or less the same in Part 18 as he did in FWWM, i think

doesn't fully explain why he acted like his old self in 16 and the beginning of 17 though
 

Vectorman

Banned
I think a lot of people will come around on episode 18 over time.

Doubtful. It's like rubbing salt on the wound. Was more than happy with the vague ending of 17's than the absolute depressing 'ending' of being stuck in a reality that is not their own.
 

Krev

Unconfirmed Member
I think it's ultimately an upbeat ending though, albeit a major cliffhanger, 'cos Laura does seem to snap out of it at that very final moment when she screams. I presume if we were to see just 10 more minutes of screen time, this fake prison dream world would come crashing down right there (which we see happening to the house), and Cooper and Laura would most like.
She's screaming because she's dead. There's no coming back from this. 'Judy', the evil in this world, can never be overcome to the level that would satisfy Cooper, the ever detective, always seeking answers when the true answers are staring him in the face. Challenging our interior and exterior world leads us astray. Accepting the world as it is while honestly acknowledging that pain and tragedy will exist is our only option if we want to be truly happy.

It's only upbeat as much as it gives us this message to help us better our own lives, and that it shows us a Cooper who doesn't allow himself to be overcome by his need to challenge and question pain rather than being vulnerable: Dougie walking through that door, accepting the love and good all around him.
 
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