Support NeoGAF

[onQ123]

Nor are the reasons we find the games industry in the mess it’s in:

Games industry used to be run by straight dudes. They made games for themselves and the majority of the video gaming audience: also straight dudes.

Games industry has changed, and now run by a more diverse range of people, who want to make games for themselves. But the audience has not substantially changed. Still straight dudes.

I'm not sure about that the biggest games nowadays are played by everyone & kids too young to even care about this stuff.

 

[SegaSnatcher]

There have been beautiful female characters in video games for two decades now already. Even from Western developers. Saying that making true to life 3D models is a technical challenge is pure bullshit. It is a switch in agenda.

Well Japan doesn't have this issue. Its definitely a western thing. Acting like admiring beauty is a negative.

Nobody wants to play as someone for hours on end that is an eye sore.

 

[KungFucius]

I don't think Tati Gabrielle appreciates getting called ugly for starring in a video game.

I don't appreciate people who are disgusting on the inside calling people ugly. It's so shallow and cruel.

 

[Mister Wolf]

Modern day feminism is about ugly women telling other women that they can't be beautiful and that men can't like beautiful women.

And controlling men through shaming and other forms of emotional manipulation. "Accept this woman that goes against your proclivities, and if you don't you're a (fill in the blank)."

 

[FunkMiller]

I'm not sure about that the biggest games nowadays are played by everyone & kids too young to even care about this stuff.

Please do find and quote statistics that back this up. Remember, you have to find ones that break down what platforms people play games on, and what kind sof games they are playing.

Because:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_and_video_games

The study reported the following proportions of male and female gamers with respect to specific genres:

Genre	Women	Men	Outlier games within the genre
Match-3	69%	31%	Candy Crush Saga (83% women)
Family or farming simulator	69%	31%
Casual puzzle	42%	58%
Atmospheric exploration	41%	59%
Interactive drama	37%	63%
High fantasy MMO	36%	64%
Japanese RPG	33%	66%
Western RPG	26%	74%	Dragon Age: Inquisition (48% women)
Survival roguelike	25%	75%
Platformer	25%	75%
City-building	22%	78%
Action RPG	20%	80%
Sandbox	18%	82%
Action-adventure	18%	82%
Sci-fi MMO	16%	84%	Star Wars: The Old Republic (29% women)
Open world	14%	86%	Assassin’s Creed Syndicate (27% women)
Turn-based strategy	11%	89%
MOBA	10%	90%
Grand strategy	7%	93%
First-person shooter	7%	93%
Racing	6%	94%	Mario Kart Tour (40% women)
Tactical shooter	4%	96%
Sports	2%	98%

Every single major console and PC game genre is still overwhelmingly played by men. Intergalactic likely comes under the action adventure genre. 82% male audience.

 

[shubik]

I will never understand people with that mindset. You consume media solely based on the looks of the protagonist? Who cares about the looks of a fictional character? Are books, movies, and music only enjoyable if you are attracted to the person performing? This is such a crazy mindset.

 

[Dr.Morris79]

Off my Facebook feed this morning

They really are going full force to get people to accept ugly shite eh.

You're not getting my money Neil

 

[Lokaum D+]

Off my Facebook feed this morning

They really are going full force to get people to accept ugly shite eh.

You're not getting my money Neil

If anyone say Nadine is ugly they need to go to the purple fórum asap.

 

[Dr.Morris79]

I watched the video in full last night, he's not wrong is he

 

[onQ123]

Please do find and quote statistics that back this up. Remember, you have to find ones that break down what platforms people play games on, and what kind sof games they are playing.

Because:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_and_video_games



Every single major console and PC game genre is still overwhelmingly played by men. Intergalactic likely comes under the action adventure genre. 82% male audience.

I said the biggest games , Fortnite, Roblox, Minecraft, Candy Crush, GTA , Call of Duty , Hogwart Legacy & so on are played by everyone.

 

[Dr.Morris79]

If anyone say Nadine is ugly they need to go to the purple fórum asap.

It's subjective. I actually knew a girl who looked exactly like her in real life, she tried to split up my girlfriend (Who is now my wife) through a load of lies

So whenever I see Nadine, I instantly think of that twat

 

[Von Hugh]

Well Japan doesn't have this issue. Its definitely a western thing. Acting like admiring beauty is a negative.

Nobody wants to play as someone for hours on end that is an eye sore.

Sure. But how long until Japan will follow along?

 

[GymWolf]

The worst part is I'm genuinely not sure how many of these are real and how many are photoshop altered memes. Not even joking either.

 

[MasterDerico]

Absolute fucking bollocks

Studios recruiting blue whales and green goblin blm lgbtq activist know it alls who then plant agenda/political choices into their games and pander to their very very very vocal minority ilk is what's killing gaming.

Studios are full of devs who are in the gaming industry because "it's a job" and is an easy target for nutballs to get a job in where they fit in, Not because they love games and have passion.

It doesn't help that these studios are owned by greedy publishers who are not gamers they're businessmen and women who are thinking of new ways to promote dlc gaas and many other shitty practices to "farm" money out of customers, They also actively allow studios to destroy their own successful IP into absolute gay as fuck tripe like Dragon Age for example.

If I was EA I wouldn't have allowed it to happen in the first place but I would have fired them all and closed Bioware for good to even pitch a game like that.

But no it's people like Asmongold according to Rofif

 

[DinoD]

Trend is soo clear.

TLOU2
Forbidden West
Returnal
Ghost Of Yotei
Intergalactic

 

[rofif]

Trend is soo clear.

TLOU2
Forbidden West
Returnal
Ghost Of Yotei
Intergalactic

Returnal?!
What are you people smoking. She is wearing a helmet. It’s a serious sad game. You wouldn’t want super model running around in high heels knowing what the game is about. Cmon people… RETURNAL?!!!!

 

[midnightAI]

Returnal?!
What are you people smoking. She is wearing a helmet. It’s a serious sad game. You wouldn’t want super model running around in high heels knowing what the game is about. Cmon people… RETURNAL?!!!!

People calling Aloy 'fat' and 'ugly' are crazy also in my opinion (fat? hah, she's skinny if anything)
TLOU2 also has characters of all types of looks,, it adds to the realism (especially in a post apocalyptic world, but I guess the women should wear makeup there also right?)
Ghost of Yotei protag just looks like a standard asian female set in the early 1600's (I dont care either way, could be male or female, its a Ghost of Tsushima follow up, i'm so in)
And Intergalactic shes a bounty hunter in space that looks identical to the voice actress, some may not like her look or find her attractive but to garner this much hate is insane (three threads about it and counting for a single protag)

(also, isn't it a bit sexist to say women must be a certain way? must have hair, must not be muscular, must be pretty, must wear makeup (I mean, I could be wrong but it sounds that way to me, I was brought up to not call people ugly also (when in relation to looks that is), not saying I was brought up any different to others, just saying that's the way 'I' was brought up)

 

[Salty Pickle]

It’s a game. If anyone wants porn there are bettet sources for that.

 

[yanhash]

Bro in the video calling people ugly is crazy, talk about throwing stones, i bet thats what the majority of neogaf looks like

 

[WhamBamThankYouMaam]

Say I wanted to jerk off looking at games, or thought the characters were real - then it would matter.

But it doesn’t.

 

[GymWolf]

Imagine having the tech to finally make women look like goddesses, and yet you make them as bland and plain as possible.

The tech was already there during the ps3 era

We are literally 2 generation after beyond 2 souls.

 

[Brazen]

Returnal?!
What are you people smoking. She is wearing a helmet. It’s a serious sad game. You wouldn’t want super model running around in high heels knowing what the game is about. Cmon people… RETURNAL?!!!!

Hey, super models in high heels have feelings to!
We should all be extra concerned!

 

[Hugare]

I don't really care about this topic, but this is one element that I think is a pretty clear trend unique to video games. Good or bad I'll leave to you. A lot of times, the actresses whose likenesses are used are clearly actresses for a reason, however, in the video game industry, the developers quite deliberately alter their appearance, and it is always seemingly to decrease their physical attractiveness. A practice that they don't implement for their actors. Idris Elba in Cyberpunk is allowed to keep his leading man good looks, but actresses have to have their good looks turned down. The whys of it all are whatever, but it's a pretty undeniable trend across the medium.

I don't really care about this topic, but this is one element that I think is a pretty clear trend unique to video games. Good or bad I'll leave to you. A lot of times, the actresses whose likenesses are used are clearly actresses for a reason, however, in the video game industry, the developers quite deliberately alter their appearance, and it is always seemingly to decrease their physical attractiveness. A practice that they don't implement for their actors. Idris Elba in Cyberpunk is allowed to keep his leading man good looks, but actresses have to have their good looks turned down. The whys of it all are whatever, but it's a pretty undeniable trend across the medium.

Funny that you've mentioned Cyberpunk, 'cause it has a lot of babes. Songbird, also from Phantom Liberty, looks even better than her real actress.

 

[captainnapalm]

People calling Aloy 'fat' and 'ugly' are crazy also in my opinion (fat? hah, she's skinny if anything)
TLOU2 also has characters of all types of looks,, it adds to the realism (especially in a post apocalyptic world, but I guess the women should wear makeup there also right?)
Ghost of Yotei protag just looks like a standard asian female set in the early 1600's (I dont care either way, could be male or female, its a Ghost of Tsushima follow up, i'm so in)
And Intergalactic shes a bounty hunter in space that looks identical to the voice actress, some may not like her look or find her attractive but to garner this much hate is insane (three threads about it and counting for a single protag)

(also, isn't it a bit sexist to say women must be a certain way? must have hair, must not be muscular, must be pretty, must wear makeup (I mean, I could be wrong but it sounds that way to me, I was brought up to not call people ugly also (when in relation to looks that is), not saying I was brought up any different to others, just saying that's the way 'I' was brought up)

No one should harass women for what they look like in real life - but we're talking about videogame characters. And in many cases they are purposefully making the characters look uglier than their real-life model lol. Videogame characters aren't even allowed to look as good as women look in real life! Never mind the idealized representations of old.

 

[Allandor]

I really don't get why people have problems with this. When I started playing video games, characters consisted of a few pixels.
As far as the character doesn't have some weird animation problem or distracting graphical glitches, it is ok for me. For me it is more important that the character fits into the games world.

 

[midnightAI]

No one should harass women for what they look like in real life - but we're talking about videogame characters. And in many cases they are purposefully making the characters look uglier than their real-life model lol. Videogame characters aren't even allowed to look as good as women look in real life! Never mind the idealized representations of old.

I think my (personal) issue is that people are calling the Intergalactic character, Jordan ugly (which, lets face it, is what this whole thread is about), yet, that is a near as dammit 1:1 replication of Tati Gabrielle, isn't that at a point where if you call that character ugly you are also calling her ugly? (I don't think she is, at all by the way, I find her very pretty, she's a badass in Uncharted). Rendering is getting extremely good now as you can see by Intergalactic and The Matrix Awakens, don't you think it now getting close enough that people should refrain from calling characters ugly if they are based on real people and the model is VERY close to the actor/voice actor? Isn't it going to be similar to calling actors in movies ugly? (which I would think would still be deemed harassment if that character wasn't deliberately made to be a certain way via prosthetics/makeup?)

 

[midnightAI]

I really don't get why people have problems with this. When I started playing video games, characters consisted of a few pixels.
As far as the character doesn't have some weird animation problem or distracting graphical glitches, it is ok for me. For me it is more important that the character fits into the games world.

That may be the problem though, as we approach realism maybe people are then finding more fault with the characters because they are so life-like? but then I see the problem is then when is it then a slight against the actor? (as I posted above)

 

[captainnapalm]

I think my (personal) issue is that people are calling the Intergalactic character, Jordan ugly, yet, that is a near as dammit 1:1 replication of Tati Gabrielle, isn't that at a point where if you call that character ugly you are also calling her ugly? (I don't think she is, at all by the way, I find her very pretty, she's a badass in Uncharted). Rendering is getting extremely good now as you can see by Intergalactic and The Matrix Awakens, don't you think it now getting close enough that people should refrain from calling characters ugly if they are based on real people and the model is VERY close to the actor/voice actor? Isn't it going to be similar to calling actors in movies ugly? (which I would think would still be deemed harassment if that character wasn't deliberately made to be a certain way via prosthetics/makeup?)

Like I said - they are purposefully making these women look worse than the actual actresses - there are countless examples of this - so your argument doesn't hold water.

Also please find one image of that Intergalactic actress where she allows herself to look as bad as she does in the game. I've seen posts of black people on social media who are upset that they did that girl wrong. She looks really bad.

 

[RJMacready73]

I just find it amusing that these Devs are so afraid of making either a buff dude or attractive female protagonist and the only reason I can think for this is DEI mandates, there is no other reason, Hollywood uses attractive male and female to headline their AAA movies so why in the hell does the gaming industry go against this perfectly normal and acceptable practice?

 

[GymWolf]

I think they aged her at an "Indiana Jones" level
Indy never had super cute young girls at his side, Karen Allen, Cate Capshaw and Alison Doody were mature and strong companions.

She looks alright to me

It's literally a different face and the real life actress is 38, no need to make her older and uglier

 

[midnightAI]

Like I said - they are purposefully making these women look worse than the actual actresses - there are countless examples of this - so your argument doesn't hold water.

Also please find one image of that Intergalactic actress where she allows herself to look as bad as she does in the game. I've seen posts of black people on social media who are upset that they did that girl wrong. She looks really bad.

Sure...



The first 12 or so seconds she is shaving her head without makeup on, looks pretty darn accurate to me, so, like I said, is it acceptable to call the in game character ugly IF it is VERY similar or even exactly like the actor?

And sure, I'm sure there are many out there who dont find Tati Gabrielle attractive, and thats fine, but personally, even if I didnt find her attractive, I'd never call her ugly.

 

[Firestartah]

I really don't get why people have problems with this. When I started playing video games, characters consisted of a few pixels.
As far as the character doesn't have some weird animation problem or distracting graphical glitches, it is ok for me. For me it is more important that the character fits into the games world.

Because a good portion of us identify with the character that we're playing, we dont see it as a movie, watching someone else going on that adventure, we like to imagine that in another universe we're the hero of the story doing those deeds. And not only is it harder as a guy playing a woman to do that, but even worse when the character is ugly or manly woman, ruins the immersion and takes you out of the experience. There is a term, the experience gets "current day'ed", and it is no longer about this wonderous new universe, it gets anchored in modern day problems and social commentary.

I play games for entertainment and escapism, not to checkmark the developer's diversity and inclusion boxes.

 

[Firestartah]

is it acceptable to call the in game character ugly IF it is VERY similar or even exactly like the actor?

Yes, bitch is ugly both in-game and real life.

 

[midnightAI]

Yes, bitch is ugly both in-game and real life.

Yeh, this is exactly what I am talking about, thank you for that

 

[CompleteGlobalSaturation]

Off my Facebook feed this morning

They really are going full force to get people to accept ugly shite eh.

You're not getting my money Neil

Naughty Dog fell off the wagon with TLOU2. It appears the 'epitome' of peak female design is to have women in wife beaters(!)

Nadine's design is good, and she actually looks like a female (shock, horror!). Nevertheless, I did find it quite dumb how she simultaneously beat up two men in Uncharted 4.

 

[Lambogenie]

Nothing necessarily wrong with it but it almost always seems like a way to teach audiences a lesson rather than being an interesting, fun and entertaining proposition (Returnal, Horizon 1). There's always this air that a girl boss with more manly tendencies and individual fashion sense is meant to be cool and exciting but it rarely ever is, even to women! Even women like seeing Zelda, Chun-Li and Samus being strong and what not but they remain with female tendencies or traits and look nice to boot.

There is space to have these characters, for sure. But to think that's what is popular with mass audiences as leads is false.

I'd happily play an old hag, the lady with eyepatch has more intrigued than Jordan, which is hilarious (and no, not because she's white), but the way these devs develop and write and build these worlds and characters so far has been quite shit and condescending.

 

[CompleteGlobalSaturation]

Nothing necessarily wrong with it but it almost always seems like a way to teach audiences a lesson rather than being an interesting, fun and entertaining proposition (Returnal, Horizon 1). There's always this air that a girl boss with more manly tendencies and individual fashion sense is meant to be cool and exciting but it rarely ever is, even to women! Even women like seeing Zelda, Chun-Li and Samus being strong and what not but they remain with female tendencies or traits and look nice to boot.

There is space to have these characters, for sure. But to think that's what is popular with mass audiences as leads is false.

I'd happily play an old hag, the lady with eyepatch has more intrigued than Jordan, which is hilarious (and no, not because she's white), but the way these devs develop and write and build these worlds and characters so far has been quite shit and condescending.

Same.

 

[EviLore]

Naughty Dog fell off the wagon with TLOU2. It appears the 'epitome' of peak female design is to have women in wife beaters(!)

Nadine's design is good, and she actually looks like a female (shock, horror!). Nevertheless, I did find it quite dumb how she simultaneously beat up two men in Uncharted 4.

Didn't play Uncharted 4, but I just watched the Nadine vs Nate + Sam fight.

What kind of super soldier serum is she using?

 

[Banjo64]

2024 the year the male gaze was defeated once and for all

The Matt Damon chick makes me laugh every time

 

[CompleteGlobalSaturation]

Didn't play Uncharted 4, but I just watched the Nadine vs Nate + Sam fight.

What kind of super soldier serum is she using?

Girl Power (TM)

She's manhandling Drake and Sam like ragdolls in this scene lol.

 

[Thief1987]

Off my Facebook feed this morning

They really are going full force to get people to accept ugly shite eh.

You're not getting my money Neil

The most important thing for a "girl" - ability to kick ass. Degenerates.

 

[Banjo64]

Didn't play Uncharted 4, but I just watched the Nadine vs Nate + Sam fight.

What kind of super soldier serum is she using?

I had a goofball last week telling me it was easy to suspend belief for this certified ass whooping

 

[ArtHands]

Western devs excuse is that the tech is not there yet to accurately depict the likeness of the actress but then you see games like Wukong having zero problem with it.

Everytime I see this, I am reminded of that screenrant review where they criticize the game for not having female representatives, when in fact they appear in the middle of the game.

 

[CompleteGlobalSaturation]

Everytime I see this, I am reminded of that screenrant review where they criticize the game for not having female representatives, when in fact they appear in the middle of the game.

 

[EviLore]

Girl Power (TM)

It does seem like they're holding back and trying not to hurt her, but the way she outright manhandles Nathan and pummels him with body shots is hilarious. You don't even see Hollywood go that far.

 

[GymWolf]

Didn't play Uncharted 4, but I just watched the Nadine vs Nate + Sam fight.

What kind of super soldier serum is she using?

Dr uckmann serum of course

 

[GymWolf]

Everytime I see this, I am reminded of that screenrant review where they criticize the game for not having female representatives, when in fact they appear in the middle of the game.

They were mad because the game doesn't have ugly females representation most probably.

 

[Vlodril]

Didn't play Uncharted 4, but I just watched the Nadine vs Nate + Sam fight.

What kind of super soldier serum is she using?

I mean it's entertaining it's not supposed to be realistic. Drake kills hundreds of dudes, climbs like spider-man and gets hits by bullets or stabbed and just shrugs it off.

I don't see a problem with this in particular at least.

 

[CashPrizes]

I don't mind Last of Us 2 characters at all. Abby is a good foil for Ellie, and her physique (and it's ruination) is handled well as part of the plot.

The one that bothers me is Aloy in Horizon. The real life actress they modeled Aloy on is straight up gorgeous, and they gave her fat cheeks and a weaker chin and a bad complexion. In the lore of Horizon, Aloy is a genetically perfect version of her super scientist creator, so she should be a total babe. But they obviously hit her with the ugly stick to cater to the .001% of gamers who complain about unreal beauty standards in games.

Also main character in Star Wars Outlaws could have been made better, original actress is much cuter. But I don't really care in that case because there is no plot reason why she should be smoking, just dumb they took an attractive actress and uglified her.

 

[EviLore]

I mean it's entertaining it's not supposed to be realistic. Drake kills hundreds of dudes, climbs like spider-man and gets hits by bullets or stabbed and just shrugs it off.

I don't see a problem with this in particular at least.

Suspension of disbelief isn't broken by Drake overcoming small groups of enemies through the player's own stealth, skill, and outmaneuvering, sequentially, many times over the course of a game. Each individual scenario is relatively plausible.

Suspension of disbelief is immediately broken by a tiny lady overpowering and manhandling two hardened male killers in a hand to hand brawl (unless she has superpowers or a cyborg body). It's also in an interactive cutscene which will be extra frustrating to the player.