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UK PoliGAF: General election thread of LibCon Coalitionage
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FabCam said:
funny given how their manifesto is the most comprehensively costed of the three and without illusory efficiency savings.
FabCam said:
they don't plan to give all students that. they plan to pump £2.5 billion into the education budget for each school to balance between cutting class sizes and giving 1-1 tuition for struggling students. they have costed this through loads of stuff from cutting trident to reforming public sector pensions.
avaya said:
Well you can blame Brown's incredible education system for teaching me about economics. The Lib Dem manifesto is NOT fully costed. Just because you say X amount will be cut from the Y department makes it neither feasible nor true.
And oh yes I forgot. Encouraging people to work for their money is totally unacceptable. You should never be driven by success or monetary gain. Instead, the people who do work hard should be taxed and pay for people living off welfare.
Dark Machine
Member
Lucius86 said:
Fair enough mate, that's the point of FPTP system after all, voting for the local MP rather than the leaders.
I personally think local issues should be handled by councils. You can communicate with them more easily I think.
Dark Machine said:
Indeed, saying fewer will turn out to the polls?
And i definitely believe there are major differences in their immigration policies. The only obvious similarity being that they all know there needs to be a cap.
Though is true they can't control immigrants from within the EU and that's up to the EU itself?
Not in particular, the specific question was along the lines of: "irrespective or party or voting preferences..."Lucius86 said:
So a lot of those people could have already decided. The more interesting ones are where they ask who they "trusted most on xxx". Clegg seems to have a lead of about 35-37% on those, and that's big.
FabCam said:
The irony is incredible.
:lol :lol :lol
Cutting taxes does not create more revenue for the government to pay for necessary social services like I don't know the NHS and Education and Pensions. You know little things like that. Supply-side economics has no empirical data to back up the claims it makes. It is pure fantasy economics which do not work, have not worked and will not work in the future. Money does not come out of thin air.
Dark Machine
Member
Nigel Farage coming over all Dave Cameron now...
"YOU want Turkey to join the EU! This will open the doors to 75million people!"
Yes, because the whole population of Turkey has manned the planes, trains and boats and is waiting just off Gibraltar for us to give the word!
"YOU want Turkey to join the EU! This will open the doors to 75million people!"
Yes, because the whole population of Turkey has manned the planes, trains and boats and is waiting just off Gibraltar for us to give the word!
Mama Robotnik
Member
I just want to say that I'm with Nick.
avaya said:
No evidence?! Reaganomics, and to a lesser extent the whole American situation, proves otherwise. You're ill-informed about what supply side is. It does not mean that suddenly education and health lose funding. It means that privatization replaces clunky, inefficient government controlled foundations. It means that people are encouraged to work instead of living off welfare. It means taxes can be cut, allowing more people to spend their own damn money. Surely you cannot deny that you know how best to spend your own money?!
Mama Robotnik
Member
radioheadrule83
Banned
Sky's TV poll results are nonsense for many reasons. The first of which is that you had to be a regular reader of sky's online website to register and get your registration text... and of course, their parent company News International are backing the tories, and they are a right leaning station anyway. Even ITVs closed poll of 4000 seemed less authoritative than their free online poll, live chat, facebook applet and twitter sentiment tracker -- great online presence from ITV there!
Clegg did well. He has the evidence of his convictions and judgement thanks to Labour now appropriating the Lib Dem stance on electoral reform and reform of the House of Lords. He is bang on about Trident. We do not need to mutually assure the destruction of our enemies at this time, our allies stand to do that for us. Does anyone seriously think we stand any chance of coming under nuclear attack in the next 25 years? He is also right that the other two are getting caught up in arguments about what they'll cut and when, but neither of them are actually willing to be forthcoming about the fine detail until they actually win the general election. He avoided confrontation unless it was to point out the hypocrisy of his opponents in now talking up good ideas but never implementing them.
Cameron tried to bring it back to the NI rise debate too often, and used too many rehearsed slogans. Why do 100 businessmen not want the NI rise? Because they don't want to have to contribute to it, isn't that obvious? "We're in this together" -- we know David, spare us the superficial PR/sound bites -- people don't want another Tony Blair, they don't want promises of Change followed by regression, they want REAL change.
Brown was far less dour and more comfortable than I expected. There were a couple of questions where he more than held his ground.
Hung parliament chances increasing... dare we even whisper of a crazy surge for the Lib Dems? I'd love to see them in power or opposition.
Clegg did well. He has the evidence of his convictions and judgement thanks to Labour now appropriating the Lib Dem stance on electoral reform and reform of the House of Lords. He is bang on about Trident. We do not need to mutually assure the destruction of our enemies at this time, our allies stand to do that for us. Does anyone seriously think we stand any chance of coming under nuclear attack in the next 25 years? He is also right that the other two are getting caught up in arguments about what they'll cut and when, but neither of them are actually willing to be forthcoming about the fine detail until they actually win the general election. He avoided confrontation unless it was to point out the hypocrisy of his opponents in now talking up good ideas but never implementing them.
Cameron tried to bring it back to the NI rise debate too often, and used too many rehearsed slogans. Why do 100 businessmen not want the NI rise? Because they don't want to have to contribute to it, isn't that obvious? "We're in this together" -- we know David, spare us the superficial PR/sound bites -- people don't want another Tony Blair, they don't want promises of Change followed by regression, they want REAL change.
Brown was far less dour and more comfortable than I expected. There were a couple of questions where he more than held his ground.
Hung parliament chances increasing... dare we even whisper of a crazy surge for the Lib Dems? I'd love to see them in power or opposition.
Dark Machine
Member
FabCam said:
So basically we should trust the private sector to have morality and justice for all and the market will take care of everything...I seem to remember that happening recently too, didn't go so well as I recall...
radioheadrule83
Banned
FabCam said:
Yeah I can't wait to have those things run by people with business and profit incentives... worked great for American healthcare, the American health insurance system and shitty overpriced British national rail!
FabCam said:
Yes because privatisation did so much good for our train network.
Lets privatise the NHS! Schools! Lets get in Xe to run the police force!
Fuck off, seriously. Replacing an institution whos main purpose is to serve the public with companies whos main purpose is profit ALWAYS reduces levels of service and ends up costing the taxpayer MORE with shit like PFI.
avaya said:Reagonomics
That's because he had to fix the broken public sector that he inherited. But yeah sure, ignore the fact that unemployment decreased, inflation decreased, interest rates declined, average income increased etc.
I also find it quite shocking that some people still believe the nanny government know best. Look how that turned out over the past 13 years!
Harry_Tequila
Member
Newsnight just going through some of the front pages tomorrow and I'm delighted to say that they are acknowledging Clegg as the clear winner. I was a bit worried that they might just concentrate on Brown vs Cameron but this is some really good coverage for the Lib Dems now.
Dark Machine
Member
QT Panel: "Everyone got the recession wrong!"
err...this man didn't
err...this man didn't
Tranced Shadow
Member
I felt that Clegg really shone (especially early on), but there were a couple of points were he stuttered a bit (economy). While I'm not a fan of the tories, I think Cameron came across pretty well at times.
Brown just seemed so ineffectual, and I swear he was arse-kissing throughout. There was one bit where Cameron was prepping a detailed, probing question to Clegg, and Brown completely cut him off.
So while in terms of party preference I'd describe myself as LD > Lab > C, I think it was LD > C >>>> Lab in that debate.
Also, did anyone get any GIFs? I'd love one of that facial expression Clegg shot at Cameron when he accused the LDs of expenses scandals
Brown just seemed so ineffectual, and I swear he was arse-kissing throughout. There was one bit where Cameron was prepping a detailed, probing question to Clegg, and Brown completely cut him off.
So while in terms of party preference I'd describe myself as LD > Lab > C, I think it was LD > C >>>> Lab in that debate.
Also, did anyone get any GIFs? I'd love one of that facial expression Clegg shot at Cameron when he accused the LDs of expenses scandals
Dark Machine
Member
WOW! The Labour contemplation suite! £3million room just to massage Ed Balls!
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