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Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3 |OT2| New Age of Zeroes

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Just like no one is going to roast you for saying Wolverine is low tier in Ultimate. Different builds, not enough play time etc.
BS. I roasted people for saying this, and I still will. Anyone who makes any claim about tier placement early on deserves shame when he/she is wrong. It just shows how thoughtless of a person you are. Especially Wolverine. Anyone who understood Wolverine knew that he would just be less ridiculous in Ultimate, but he'd still be a contender. IIRC, you and I were on the same side in that battle.
 

Dahbomb

Member
No because the DT activation has some invulnerability. When you do it right it looks like Thors hand going through Vergil but he doesn't grab him and no hyper animation is initiated. ShadyK did this against Abegen first time in a live match.
 
No because the DT activation has some invulnerability. When you do it right it looks like Thors hand going through Vergil but he doesn't grab him and no hyper animation is initiated. ShadyK did this against Abegen first time in a live match.

You can do Spiral Swords then Devil Trigger immediately in the DHC mambo?
 

Dahbomb

Member
BS. I roasted people for saying this, and I still will. Anyone who makes any claim about tier placement early on deserves shame when he/she is wrong. It just shows how thoughtless of a person you are. Especially Wolverine. Anyone who understood Wolverine knew that he would just be less ridiculous in Ultimate, but he'd still be a contender. IIRC, you and I were on the same side in that battle.
IIRC GB said that Wolverines B Slash was slower and was actually reactable to in that build. Also the patch changes listed nerf to his j.L which most people took it as him not having an instant overhead anymore. Also he posted the list and basically implied that it was to be taken with a grain of salt.

Roasting should be saved for when people actually get the game and then have knee jerk reactions like Vanilla Sentinel.

You can do Spiral Swords then Devil Trigger immediately in the DHC mambo?
That's not what is happening here. Basically Vergil activate Spiral Swords then starts pressuring Thor. When Vergil is close enough Thor then activates XF during a Vergil normal into a command throw hyper. Vergil reacts to his by Devil Triggering to make the MP whiff. Thor can't risk trying to command throw Vergil on his activation because he might not be close enough for it.
 

A Pretty Panda

fuckin' called it, man
Roasting should be saved for when people actually get the game and then have knee jerk reactions like Vanilla Sentinel.

I'm reading this right now. It's pretty good!

halolz-dot-com-marvelvscapcom3-sentineledition.jpg

halolz-dot-com-marvelvscapcom3-phoenixedition.jpg
 
IIRC GB said that Wolverines B Slash was slower and was actually reactable to in that build. Also the patch changes listed nerf to his j.L which most people took it as him not having an instant overhead anymore. Also he posted the list and basically implied that it was to be taken with a grain of salt.

Roasting should be saved for when people actually get the game and then have knee jerk reactions like Vanilla Sentinel.
A lot of things seemed slower or faster in earlier builds, and we'll never know if they actually were.

Personally, I find that when I watch a game, everything is slower than when I play it. I look at Rapid Slash in a tournament game and think "that's so easy to grab, I could do that." Then I play and Vergil is treating me like the center piece in a merry-go-round.

I'm talking about the people who thought Wolverine would be trash simply because Berserker Slash wasn't invincible anymore, though.

I'm sorry.
I'm glad I never say anything stupid. :-D

Also Dahbomb didn't really say anything dumb about Iron Man pre release. At least nothing that I saw. Though I didn't check every single post I searched.
I found an old post on GFAQs where I was raging a bit about Dr. Strange being a better Dormammu because I didn't know he couldn't air dash yet.

I also remember getting into an argument with Haunts about whether Dormammu can rushdown, and he just wouldn't believe me when I said that Dormammu is better at rushdown than keepaway. A lot of people called me stupid for saying Dormammu's keepaway sucks in Vanilla...
 

Dahbomb

Member
I never really said anything about character "tier" in pre-Vanilla. I made comments about who looks good and who doesn't.

I thought IM looked good in Vanilla, so did Chun Li, Storm and Sentinel. I thought Phoenix was going to be a high risk/high reward type character in Vanilla, she ended up being low risk/high reward and only now in Ultimate is she is what I thought she would be in the beginning. I thought Wolverine wasn't going to be all that in Vanilla though I never really talked about it or posted about it (really though didn't even know that B Slash was invincible or that he could combo after it with BC, I don't think anyone really knew).

I was SURE Vergil was going to be a top character in Ultimate that's why I got into heated discussions about him. Even back then I could not comprehend when people and even top players labelled him as upper mid.

Tronn Bonne and Zero but no Mega Man? I am calling bull shit on this right now.
That IS bull shit. To this day this is one of the biggest BSs in the game.
 
Here's a good one by Dahbomb. This is a response to me posting the fatal claw loop video.

Ok I saw that. Nothing special. Loop has been known for quite some time and has a bit of strict timing. If you do any BnB into Weapon X, it will kill most characters in the game and it's WAY easier to do. You don't even need the loop because if you find yourself just short of killing an opponent after a Fatal Claw/Berserker Barrage and got meter to spare, you can DHC to finish him off.

This technology may be fearsome to those who don't use Wolverine often but it really isn't if you actually play Wolverine yourself. You have some chance of actually dropping that loop x3 as compared to just doing Weapon X which should kill the character. Wolverine is all about practicality, you wanna dumb it down as much as you can while killing characters. Plus you want to save meter with Wolverine as much as you can for Berserker Charge shenanigans.
 

Dahbomb

Member
There's nothing wrong with that post.

In Vanilla there really was 0 reason to go for it thanks to DHC glitch. A lot of regular DHCs from Wolverine to another character gets the job done the same as the Fatal Claw loop even without glitching. In Vanilla you had a ton of meter anyway and there was RARELY a situation where you had to do 3 loops of Fatal Claw vs Weapon X to kill a character.

In Ultimate it's more useful to use it as you may not always have the meter for a LVL3 and Fatal Claw does more damage than before due to mashing. Also in Ultimate people can't do LVL1XF Wolverine and then run through 2 characters so they actually have to learn a combo.

So yeah I still stand by that post 100%. I don't think that's a particularly terrifying tech or something that needs nerfed. In reality it just highlights how dumb the whole mashing thing was in Ultimate that it inflated damage in the game even more. Any character who can loop mashable hypers suddenly is able to kill characters easily.
 
There's nothing wrong with that post.

In Vanilla there really was 0 reason to go for it thanks to DHC glitch. A lot of regular DHCs from Wolverine to another character gets the job done the same as the Fatal Claw loop even without glitching. In Vanilla you had a ton of meter anyway and there was RARELY a situation where you had to do 3 loops of Fatal Claw vs Weapon X to kill a character.

In Ultimate it's more useful to use it as you may not always have the meter for a LVL3 and Fatal Claw does more damage than before due to mashing. Also in Ultimate people can't do LVL1XF Wolverine and then run through 2 characters so they actually have to learn a combo.

So yeah I still stand by that post 100%. I don't think that's a particularly terrifying tech or something that needs nerfed. In reality it just highlights how dumb the whole mashing thing was in Ultimate that it inflated damage in the game even more. Any character who can loop mashable hypers suddenly is able to kill characters easily.
Wolverine can't start the DHC glitch, though.
 

Dahbomb

Member
Wolverine can't start the DHC glitch, though.
Compared to other characters is what I meant to say there. Like what difference did it really make that Wolverine could loop 2 Fatal Claws to do a million damage when someone like Magneto could DHC glitch into Wesker for easy kills. It's the same meter usage in both examples, one does more damage for less effort hence why the Fatal Claw loop is like "ok that's cool but I am not really terrified of it as compared to the other stuff in the game".
 
Compared to other characters is what I meant to say there. Like what difference did it really make that Wolverine could loop 2 Fatal Claws to do a million damage when someone like Magneto could DHC glitch into Wesker for easy kills. It's the same meter usage in both examples, one does more damage for less effort hence why the Fatal Claw loop is like "ok that's cool but I am not really terrified of it as compared to the other stuff in the game".
Because a lot of people use Wolverine on point, and not Magneto? I think you're just being stubborn now.
 
Logan still has that beginning of the match BS going for. Didn't say he was low tier IIRC but said he wasn't nearly as fucking stupid.

I think it is cause we are all kinda a little arrogant and stubborn. But hey, what can you do?
 

Dahbomb

Member
Because a lot of people use Wolverine on point, and not Magneto? I think you're just being stubborn now.
A lot of people used Magneto and Dante on point mainly for Dhc glitch. Wolverine was used at point too but remember the context that Wolverine was used in Vanilla as a point.. He got the first hit/grab xf killed that character usually meterless then mixed up the incoming character with enough time on xf. Last character usually just died from a lvl3 from all that meter that xf built up. In that meta game there was rarely a time where Fatal Claw loop would've been a superior option.
 

enzo_gt

tagged by Blackace
Okay so my MvC: The Complete Works art book just came in the mail and I cannot describe to you guys how awesome it is.

Far more new and unseen (maybe just super obscure) artwork from the series and new artwork than they seem to list. There's everything in here. So much avatar material as well.

I'm in tears from how beautiful it is, seriously.

I honestly don't know who Dahbomb stans for harder: Vergil or Iron Man.
Vergil easily.
 
This last page of blowups is great. I feel likee reliving more old Marvel posts now. :lol

On another note, two new videos from me:

Team Spy May Stride - "Fire & Ice" Dante Starter - 835K
Team Spy May Stride - Current Viper BnB - 935K

One day, I'll make a tech video I swear. All I do is combos nowadays.
"BnB" should mean "might actually be seen in a match". When your Viper combo is too hard for MarlinPie to do regularly, you know it's just not a good idea to label as a bnb.

Also, why do you hate Morrigan? :-(

Okay so my MvC: The Complete Works art book just came in the mail and I cannot describe to you guys how awesome it is.

Far more new and unseen (maybe just super obscure) artwork from the series and new artwork than they seem to list. There's everything in here. So much avatar material as well.

I'm in tears from how beautiful it is, seriously.


Vergil easily.
Is there new Dormammu artwork in it?

Reposting from FGC thread:
http://www.brokentier.com/blogs/new...lbag-zero-structure-and-dreams-of-celine-dion
 

Dahbomb

Member
I honestly don't know who Dahbomb stans for harder: Vergil or Iron Man.
What does stans mean?

Vergil is my favorite Capcom character from my favorite game series, IM is my favorite from Marvel with Logan being a close 2nd. Vergil and Wolverine already have gotten enough attention in the community so I work harder with trying to share IM stuff and this I now play him more (plus it's a personal challenge). Between the two it's Vergil that I prefer.
 

Infinite

Member
Trying to take playing this game on a competitive level a lot more serious now and I realized a huge glaring flaw in my play. I don't know Marvel fundamentals. I understand how to build to and that movement is defense but I really have a hard time with approaching some one or landing that hit rather. Like I really don't know how to punish teleports, air dashes and dash up low and these are the fundamentals of this game, I feel. Sometimes I'm really passive and try to sit and block expecting to punish them because they did something unsafe but that isn't gonna cut it. What is the rock paper trinity in marve if there is one? Any advice?
 

Azure J

Member
"BnB" should mean "might actually be seen in a match". When your Viper combo is too hard for MarlinPie to do regularly, you know it's just not a good idea to label as a bnb.

Also, why do you hate Morrigan? :-(

That Viper combo is really weird for me. Nothing about it is really hard, it's just that I frequently have to remind myself midmatch that I can do more when I get a confirm with a j.H, s.M or c.M a la that stuff.

Basic Viper combos are still whoa for me in the damage department.

As for the last question, are you kidding? I love Mistress SouSou. I just set that team up a lot when I want to mess around with playing Legends of The Hidden Temple some. Problem comes when I forget that's why that group is like that.
 

Dahbomb

Member
I am a stans of Vergil. I know just about everything about him but don't know that much about IM especially the 80s IM which had an awful design.

Trying to take playing this game on a competitive level a lot more serious now and I realized a huge glaring flaw in my play. I don't know Marvel fundamentals. I understand how to build to and that movement is defense but I really have a hard time with approaching some one or landing that hit rather. Like I really don't know how to punish teleports, air dashes and dash up low and these are the fundamentals of this game, I feel. Sometimes I'm really passive and try to sit and block expecting to punish them because they did something unsafe but that isn't gonna cut it. What is the rock paper trinity in marve if there is one? Any advice?
You can't be too passive in Marvel, if you are blocking then somewhere in the game you messed up and are now in a bad situation. You either need to be filling up the screen with hit boxes (projectiles/assists/high priority normal moves), rushing them down/mixing them up or staying on your toes in spaces where they have a hard time reaching you. Don't wait for them to do something unsafe and punish, there aren't that many unsafe moves in the game and even low level players are aware of most of them by now. Most of the time if you block something then you need to advance guard immediately, you should never let someone pressure you. You can't AG assists which puts a further emphasis on keeping on your toes because the last thing you want is to be pinned down by an assist or be put into a cross up situation.

As far as rock paper scissors go I think the best fundamentals to learn in Marvel are chicken guarding, advance guarding (when to AG and when not to) and air throw/teching. You should be on the ground as minimum as possible and you should always block attacks while in mid air which makes you immune to high/low mix ups. You can still be left/right mixed up but being at a particular height will at least eliminate beam/projectile assist cross ups. In the air most players will then try to air throw you or just try to dash in/use normals which is where you need to be throwing. ALWAYS look for opportunities to air throw no matter the character you are playing. The best players in Marvel are godly air throwers. Option select air throw with a move like Wolverine Dive Kick (d/f+H) for even better results and you can use this to mix up people as well. This will help your tech game too. You will learn that throwing is in a lot of cases a better punish than just using normals because it's 1 frame.

Advance guarding all you need to know is that you want to advance guard when you anticipate a pressure string or even a mix up attempt (some mix ups are negated or lessened with advance guard while others are amplified) and you want to NOT AG when you anticipate an unsafe move/string. Advance guarding essentially takes you out of the game for a few frames which can also negate some chip or get you out of a tight situation but be wary as a lot of players have anti-AG tech now and can negate it or bait it out. Always advance guard to reduce chip damage from hypers/specials.

Chicken blocking (blocking at normal jump height usually low to the ground) allows you to punish moves that would otherwise be unpunishable like a Wolverine dive kick. It also allows you to defend reasonably well against a character who is just going ham with high/lows. Be warned that characters with fast lows can catch you on your pre-jump frames meaning chicken blocking can be countered that way if you are not careful (this is how people get hit by lows in Marvel most of the time, they are trying to chicken block but they got clipped while trying to jump). Also chicken blocking can be countered by air throws.
 
Trying to take playing this game on a competitive level a lot more serious now and I realized a huge glaring flaw in my play. I don't know Marvel fundamentals. I understand how to build to and that movement is defense but I really have a hard time with approaching some one or landing that hit rather. Like I really don't know how to punish teleports, air dashes and dash up low and these are the fundamentals of this game, I feel. Sometimes I'm really passive and try to sit and block expecting to punish them because they did something unsafe but that isn't gonna cut it. What is the rock paper trinity in marve if there is one? Any advice?
What system do you play on? It's easier to give advice after playing or watching someone play. What team do you run? Who are you fighting against? These are all big factors in giving you a good answer.

For example, my Dormammu is extremely offensive...unless I'm fighting another Dormammu. Then I crouching block, because 90% of Dormammu players get bored (or something?) and go for a Mass Change H after a few Purifications, and then I air throw and kill them. Same with Dante players. All about those random teleports...

That Viper combo is really weird for me. Nothing about it is really hard, it's just that I frequently have to remind myself midmatch that I can do more when I get a confirm with a j.H, s.M or c.M a la that stuff.

Basic Viper combos are still whoa for me in the damage department.

As for the last question, are you kidding? I love Mistress SouSou. I just set that team up a lot when I want to mess around with playing Legends of The Hidden Temple some. Problem comes when I forget that's why that group is like that.
Haha, Mistress SouSou. I like it. I never beat up on the characters I like. I would beat up on Frank West all the time, but his hitstun sound effect is really messed up. It always makes me think there's something wrong with my TV.

I usually Random All, and if a woman or small character is on the opposing team I snap someone else in. It's not nice to beat women.
 

Infinite

Member
What system do you play on? It's easier to give advice after playing or watching someone play. What team do you run? Who are you fighting against? These are all big factors in giving you a good answer.

For example, my Dormammu is extremely offensive...unless I'm fighting another Dormammu. Then I crouching block, because 90% of Dormammu players get bored (or something?) and go for a Mass Change H after a few Purifications, and then I air throw and kill them. Same with Dante players. All about those random teleports...

I train in PS3 but I play casuals on 360.

My team is firebrand Doom Ammy

I play against my friend Genius (a Big 2 monster) he runs Doom Strange Dorm but he can play every character in the game on a decent level and he typically uses top players teams so I can get the experience. Especially Wolverine Wesker Akuma. So I face a decent variety of rushdown teams and zoning teams though in casuals.
 

Dahbomb

Member
Good team, what's the assist for Doom?

A lot of powerful tech is available on that team. Firebrand + Cold Stars mix ups, Firebrand + Hidden Missiles "zoning" and general harassment, Doom + Ammy THCs, Firebrand into Doom TAC swag combos, Firebrand + Ammy THC.
 
I train in PS3 but I play casuals on 360.

My team is firebrand Doom Ammy

I play against my friend Genius (a Big 2 monster) he runs Doom Strange Dorm but he can play every character in the game on a decent level and he typically uses top players teams so I can get the experience. Especially Wolverine Wesker Akuma. So I face a decent variety of rushdown teams and zoning teams though in casuals.
Want to play on the PS3 sometime so I can offer feedback? Not that I'm saying you'll lose, but it helps to see what you're doing.

What are you having problems with? It's definitely not a team structure issue, since that is a good team. Any particular opponents?
 

Infinite

Member
Kinda switch the assist depending on the match. If I'm facing a Wolvie team I'll use missiles to cut his ground mobility. If I face another team that likes to sit behind missiles I'll use plasma beam to cut it off. Not sure how effective that is

Want to play on the PS3 sometime so I can offer feedback? Not that I'm saying you'll lose, but it helps to see what you're doing.

What are you having problems with? It's definitely not a team structure issue, since that is a good team. Any particular opponents?

Yeah but apparently my internet gets blown up A LOT. I can't hold a decent connection what so ever.

My biggest issue is opening people up, being too passive and punishing things one should know how to punish. I feel like people can do what they want to me especially teleport characters and dudes hounding me down with box/tri jumps.
 
Kinda switch the assist depending on the match. If I'm facing a Wolvie team I'll use missiles to cut his ground mobility. If I face another team that likes to sit behind missiles I'll use plasma beam to cut it off. Not sure how effective that is
IMO, you should stick with one assist combination on a team. In my experience, switching an assist messes with my gameplay mojo. Part of getting good with a team is knowing exactly how things will run in a given situation, and having multiple team formations will often make you do foolish things that don't make sense in the context of your current play.

I also think Hidden Missiles are way better for Firebrand than Plasma Beam. It's total death from above.
 

Dahbomb

Member
My biggest issue is opening people up, being too passive and punishing things one should know how to punish. I feel like people can do what they want to me especially teleport characters.
Firebrand is one of the easiest characters to open someone up with when he has Cold Shots backed up with him. Characters pinned down with Cold shots can be hit with FB's instant overhead into a full combo or even an unblockable if you set it up.

Look up Zak Bennet and observe his set ups. Watch the terror as someone gets pinned down with Cold Stars.

Against teleport characters you want to stay above their preferred assist (usually beams) and just fly around + use Bon Voyage and fish for the occasional dive kick. If both of you are in close proximity your fast normals will always beat out their so rush them down.
 
Firebrand is one of the easiest characters to open someone up with when he has Cold Shots backed up with him. Characters pinned down with Cold shots can be hit with FB's instant overhead into a full combo or even an unblockable if you set it up.

Look up Zak Bennet and observe his set ups. Watch the terror as someone gets pinned down with Cold Stars.
I second watching Bennet matches.
 
How much meter can you build with Dark Harmonizer during Ouroboros?
Ouroboros lasts a mere 420 frames.

Dark Harmonizer is 135 frames per call.

So, you build about 1 bar during that time.

You're better off picking Vergil and enjoying the 2/3 bar you get per Spiral Swords, or the 1.5 bars you get per Devil Trigger.
 

Infinite

Member
Firebrand is one of the easiest characters to open someone up with when he has Cold Shots backed up with him. Characters pinned down with Cold shots can be hit with FB's instant overhead into a full combo or even an unblockable if you set it up.

Look up Zak Bennet and observe his set ups. Watch the terror as someone gets pinned down with Cold Stars.

Against teleport characters you want to stay above their preferred assist (usually beams) and just fly around + use Bon Voyage and fish for the occasional dive kick. If both of you are in close proximity your fast normals will always beat out their so rush them down.

Makes complete sense. Is it risky to airthrow an air dasher?

Yeah imma be watching more Zak vids. I have a play list of his shit ready lol
 

Dahbomb

Member
Makes complete sense. Is it risky to airthrow an air dasher?

Yeah imma be watching more Zak vids. I have a play list of his shit ready lol
No it's not a risk in fact they can't block during an air dash. But air dashers can OS air throw so be ready for that.
 

enzo_gt

tagged by Blackace
One new piece as a part of a stencil at the beginning of the book. Artists like the other flamey head better.

And he's part of a counterpart to this image I haven't seem anywhere online but may've been put out:

8b712f453129f9a9dfcf17cb123fffce.jpg



JACKPOT
Well, the only other character I care about seeing cool art of is Morrigan. Any good surprises there?
 

enzo_gt

tagged by Blackace
Well, the only other character I care about seeing cool art of is Morrigan. Any good surprises there?
If artists loving drawing a half-naked succubus is a surprise then yes :p

A good amount of the new MvC3 artwork features Morrigan. There's one image of all the female characters in the game
and Rocket Raccoon
enjoying a meal in a living room type thing and Morrigan is hanging from the ceiling. Since she was in previous games, she has her share of move sketches and stuff.
 

Frantic

Member
There was a combo I learned when I was messing with that team. Did about 900k with only one assist, iirc.

It was: cr.MH, TK M, s.H, TK M, s.MH, Seismo L, super jump, adf, j.HS, s.H, Seismo L, super jump, adf, j.HS, s.MHS, j.MMH, double jump, j.MMHS. From there you can do either Jam Session + Seismo x2, Burning Kick, or Varja + Seismo L, TK H, Seismo L.

I'm sure there's a way to fit both assists in there, and get even more damage, but I suck with Viper.

Also going to mess around with the Dante combo when I get the chance, just to see if there's any way to fit more damage in there.
 
Have you tried deviantArt?
Morrigan fanart has 99% chance of being terrible. The more popular an anime girl is, the worse the average art for her is.

If artists loving drawing a half-naked succubus is a surprise then yes :p

A good amount of the new MvC3 artwork features Morrigan. There's one image of all the female characters in the game
and Rocket Raccoon
enjoying a meal in a living room type thing and Morrigan is hanging from the ceiling. Since she was in previous games, she has her share of move sketches and stuff.
I think I saw the living room picture before. It's some good art IIRC.

All artists are perverts. I refuse to believe otherwise. Blessings to them.
 
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