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[Dahbomb]

Um.

Marvel: We'd like for him to pretty powerful.
Capcom: Okay.

That's all I'm saying. For some reason you and Dahbomb are mixing in actual game mechanics, which is kind of missing the point.

It doesn't matter anyways, it's a fun debate topic, but I want you to understand what exactly I'm saying and not to confuse it with actual nitty gritty design specs.


Yes, that's all I'm saying .

I get what you are saying. Here is how the Marvel and Capcom meeting would go about in this scenario:

Marvel: Here are the list of characters we want in UMVC3.

Capcom: OK. Do you want anything particular to be done with the characters?

Marvel: Just make sure Dr Strange has all the spell names and hand motions right. Also make sure these few characters are really good in the game because we want more people playing them. Shuma can be ass we don't want to promote him much at all at this point. Also nerf Magneto we are tired of him and that silly Yipes guy taking up all the Marvel spotlight. Nerf Jean too she isn't relevant anymore.

Capcom: Ah ok...


I just don't think it's plausible. For once Seth has specifically said that he made sure that Dr Strange didn't get an air dash because it would be OP on him (and he's right).

 

[Banana Kid]

The thing about Nova that nobody's considering is his kickass music.

It sounds like the theme to an awesome Genesis sidescroller. It's my second favorite theme in Ultimate.

 

[~Devil Trigger~]

What's hard to understand?
Phoenix Wright doesn't even fight.
Have you seen Dr. Strange's normals? Remember how people cried out Magneto clone when they saw them cause they looked so familiar? His specials are just colorful fireballs.
What is unique about Firebrand's moves? Can you tell me? It's claw slashes and fireballs. We already have 5 characters that do slashing with claws.
Hawkeye? Come on, he just shoots arrows. Nothing unique about that.
Vergil - just another sword user, please. Strider, same deal.
Iron Fist? Generic Kung Fu character. What's creative about his moves? He punches and kicks. Wow.
Ghost Rider? He uses a whip, oh and look at that, fire. How imaginative, really.

Can we now move on and stop calling Nova's moves generic and unimaginative? Thank you.

And don't come up with any special mechanics, because Nova is called uninspired because of his moveset.

WTF, I didnt say Nova is generic.. wat are talking about, literally bolded the word Hypers...

and none of these examples you posted are "generic". Capcom captured the characters' essence very well. Calm down dude

 

[enzo_gt]

The thing about Nova that nobody's considering is his kickass music.

It sounds like the theme to an awesome Genesis sidescroller. It's my second favorite theme in Ultimate.

If you dont like Nova's theme you have no soul.

Or you have bad taste and prob thought Spiderman's theme was good or something inexcusable of the sort.

 

[IntelliHeath]

Marvel doesn't know how to design a fighting game. They don't know how to balance things or design moves that aren't broken. Most they're doing is dictating aesthetics of moves like names, gestures, and poses. Marvel is art, Capcom is code. Marvel gives them go ahead on look and Capcom handles the rest. If the theory of no laughingstock characters were true then the Marvel cast would be far better than the Capcom side. For example Thor would've been WAAAY better in Vanilla considering the movie if this had been true.

Marvel ignores the bigger picture because they don't want to ruin it. They know where their specialties lay and its not in balancing a game. Since better balance equates to better sales its in their best interest to stay outta character balancing debates. THAT is the bigger picture.

Correct.

I hope that they are going to pick more interesting marvel characters for next iteration. I can see some of characters that have a lot of potential movesets. Those 6 new Marvel characters are just great.

I know I already judged Rocket Raccoon even I haven't seen him in action yet but you can't really beat BEARCLAW TRAP!

 

[Bizazedo]

What's the difference between the nitty gritty and making someone powerful? Capcom translates that into make him have a lot of tools, but they still balance him at the end of day.

Good question. I guess the answer is kind of a half-question.

Do you believe Capcom has an idea of how powerful characters are when they design them?

It's why I said they're human, they make mistakes. Sometimes they miss characters and sometimes they overrate characters, but lets be honest, they're pretty good at their jobs and most of the time they know what they're doing when they make a character.

If they know Marvel is okay with how the balance is on most of their characters, but is really zeroed in on a few (like Nova or Strange lets say as an example), they're not going to make them low tier.

Again, not saying it's auto S or whatever....but, they're going to be at a bare minimum in the upper percentile.

Like i said before Marvel has influence on representation as a whole, not the nitty gritty stuff which is exactly what discerns powerful from not powerful.

Shao's point about Thor says it all really. Marvel is pretty involved and influential in the entire process, but the actual gameplay specifics are what they are most hands off on.

@Shaowebb, ah you made it sound like you were already "in" somewhere. My bad. Best of luck to you and your Iron Fist Dating Sim.

Thor doesn't need pushing. Neither does Cap, Iron Man, Spider Man, Storm, Sentinel, Wolverine, etc.

I'm not saying every Marvel character needs to be godlike (poor Shuma ).

But, there's definite interest in making sure certain ones don't suck.

I just don't think it's plausible. For once Seth has specifically said that he made sure that Dr Strange didn't get an air dash because it would be OP on him (and he's right).

You're confusing me saying that Marvel's interest = making them the best in the game, though, still.

 

[IntelliHeath]

If you dont like Nova's theme you have no soul.

Or you have bad taste and prob thought Spiderman's theme was good or something inexcusable of the sort.

or Deaf?

Spoiler

me sad that thor died in comic in fear itself arc

 

[Red Arremer]

It sounds like the theme to an awesome Genesis sidescroller. It's my second favorite theme in Ultimate.

Second to Rocket Raccoon's, obviously? 8D

Or you have bad taste and prob thought Spiderman's theme was good or something inexcusable of the sort.

But Spider-Man's theme IS good.

 

[Mit-]

You guys know this is up, right?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7_YLA8m-Xo

Just finished watching it Another great video Max

 

[enzo_gt]

Good question. I guess the answer is kind of a half-question.

Do you believe Capcom has an idea of how powerful characters are when they design them?

It's why I said they're human, they make mistakes. Sometimes they miss characters and sometimes they overrate characters, but lets be honest, they're pretty good at their jobs and most of the time they know what they're doing when they make a character.

If they know Marvel is okay with how the balance is on most of their characters, but is really zeroed in on a few (like Nova or Strange lets say as an example), they're not going to make them low tier.

Again, not saying it's auto S or whatever....but, they're going to be at a bare minimum in the upper percentile.


Thor doesn't need pushing. Neither does Cap, Iron Man, Spider Man, Storm, Sentinel, Wolverine, etc.

I'm not saying every Marvel character needs to be godlike (poor Shuma ).

But, there's definite interest in making sure certain ones don't suck.


You're confusing me saying that Marvel's interest = making them the best in the game, though, still.

See what I'm not understanding here is this recurring internal distinction your implying where Capcom is making some characters better than others, or giving some more stuffing than others. I have a hard time believing that, this isn't Ono's team. I think whatever criterion you apply to a character, power, aesthetics, ease of use, whatever, Capcom tries to balance them all equally. I don't see this "hey beef up Strange a bit" from Marvel that Capcom reads and goes "oh okay but only a little bit!"

They're job before appeasing Marvel is to make sure EVERY character doesn't suck overall, because they're making a game not a main show and a bunch of sideshow acts.

 

[Bizazedo]

See what I'm not understanding here is this recurring internal distinction your implying where Capcom is making some characters better than others, or giving some more stuffing than others. I have a hard time believing that, this isn't Ono's team. I think whatever criterion you apply to a character, power, aesthetics, ease of use, whatever, Capcom tries to balance them all equally. I don't see this "hey beef up Strange a bit" from Marvel that Capcom reads and goes "oh okay but only a little bit!"

They're job before appeasing Marvel is to make sure EVERY character doesn't suck overall, because they're making a game not a main show and a bunch of sideshow acts.

It's mainly because my friend was at Evo and stalked Seth and friends for a bit. He's a huge MODOK fan and he was asking about the character and any possible buffs.

He was pretty much told point blank that the goal was to not make him as someone who you'd see in a lot of tournaments / be smashing newbies. The reasoning why was related to popularity.

 

[SolarPowered]

See what I'm not understanding here is this recurring internal distinction your implying where Capcom is making some characters better than others, or giving some more stuffing than others. I have a hard time believing that, this isn't Ono's team. I think whatever criterion you apply to a character, power, aesthetics, ease of use, whatever, Capcom tries to balance them all equally. I don't see this "hey beef up Strange a bit" from Marvel that Capcom reads and goes "oh okay but only a little bit!"

They're job before appeasing Marvel is to make sure EVERY character doesn't suck overall, because they're making a game not a main show and a bunch of sideshow acts.

This is where you lose me. I'm willing to accept this if you are talking specifically about the Marvel cast and not the Capcom characters.

Favoritism clearly plays a role in how the Capcom characters have turned out.

 

[Dahbomb]

I really think that Capcom TRIES to make every character good in their own right but when actual balance comes into play they over estimate some tools and underestimate some and by default under/overestimate characters. Like they clearly underestimated someone like Wesker in MVC3, they thought he was like going to get zoned out because he didn't have a dash so they gave him high health. They have recognized that Wesker being a high health character makes no fucking sense anymore so they have dropped his health down.

Same with Phoenix, they underestimated the ease with which players could accumulate 5 bars on a team to activate DP. Now they have nerfed the getting to the 5 bars part.

The best way to avoid making new characters automatically ass or less popular starting out is giving them obviously good tools. Like if Strange didn't have a teleport/flight mode he would not nearly be this good, he would be like a really tall Arthur. Now they have a better idea of how certain characters work and what certain archetypes need as well as what tools are good and what aren't. So that's why the new characters are going to look powerful starting off.

It's mainly because my friend was at Evo and stalked Seth and friends for a bit. He's a huge MODOK fan and he was asking about the character and any possible buffs.

He was pretty much told point blank that the goal was to not make him as someone who you'd see in a lot of tournaments / be smashing newbies. The reasoning why was related to popularity.

If you replace your friend with SolarPowered and MODOK with Hsien Ko... this post is HILARIOUS to read.

Favoritism is obvious especially when Capcom admitted to "giving the DMC characters some extra love".

 

[IntelliHeath]

This is where you lose me. I'm willing to accept this if you are talking specifically about the Marvel cast and not the Capcom characters.

Favoritism clearly plays a role in how the Capcom characters have turned out.

*cough* Dante, Vergil and Trish *cough*

I fully understand why they can't buff arthur and hsien-ko much because they would be very strong if they buff them wrong.

 

[Red Arremer]

It's mainly because my friend was at Evo and stalked Seth and friends for a bit. He's a huge MODOK fan and he was asking about the character and any possible buffs.

He was pretty much told point blank that the goal was to not make him as someone who you'd see in a lot of tournaments / be smashing newbies. The reasoning why was related to popularity.

I wouldn't see MODOK smashing noobs or being in a lot of tournaments in general given how weird his playstyle is. Even if he was undoubtedly the best character in the game (and I still think that he's at the very least high tier in vanilla), his weird move properties and abilities make him a character who's so far out there, and has high execution to boot.

Just look at Viper, arguably one of the best characters in the game, but you rarely see her because she is so execution heavy.

 

[Bizazedo]

This is where you lose me. I'm willing to accept this if you are talking specifically about the Marvel cast and not the Capcom characters.

Favoritism clearly plays a role in how the Capcom characters have turned out.

Yeah. For all the jokes at your expense (and, full disclosure, I laugh every time), you're clearly getting screwed by Capcom's views .

I really think that Capcom TRIES to make every character good in their own right but when actual balance comes into play they over estimate some tools and underestimate some and by default under/overestimate characters. Like they clearly underestimated someone like Wesker in MVC3, they thought he was like going to get zoned out because he didn't have a dash so they gave him high health. They have recognized that Wesker being a high health character makes no fucking sense anymore so they have dropped his health down.

Same with Phoenix, they underestimated the ease with which players could accumulate 5 bars on a team to activate DP. Now they have nerfed the getting to the 5 bars part.

To an extent, sure. Phoenix especially is a fuck-up in terms of them overestimating players abilities to stop her from transforming.

Wesker, though? I'll say that was intentional. They wanted him to be that powerful and, even though I agree with you on the health nerf being appropriate, I can't believe they're that stupid to see him for what he'd become.

That's the problem with a lot of the critiques and assuming every balance error was a mess-up as it'd imply they're huge morons.

I wouldn't see MODOK smashing noobs or being in a lot of tournaments in general given how weird his playstyle is. Even if he was undoubtedly the best character in the game (and I still think that he's at the very least high tier in vanilla), his weird move properties and abilities make him a character who's so far out there, and has high execution to boot.

Just look at Viper, arguably one of the best characters in the game, but you rarely see her because she is so execution heavy.

Exactly, he has to work a lot harder than other characters to get the same results. That was by design, it wasn't an accident.

 

[Dahbomb]

I honestly would stop playing MVC3 if a character who did nothing but spam projectiles from across the screen be top tier in the game. This is also what Seth said early on where they have to carefully balance certain character types because if they are too powerful it causes more rage. Even in vanilla MVC3, people rage over basic zoning that gets shutdown easily. Can you imagine if zoning was top tier... like the Wolverine/Akuma version of zoning where Arthur was this beastly zoning character no one could touch and he would just chip you from full screen with his invincible Hsien Ko assist that basically made it so that if you just made it in she would make sure you would go all the way back. Would pretty much kill the competitive scene worse than JJJJJJJJEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAANNNNNN.

Exactly, he has to work a lot harder than other characters to get the same results. That was by design, it wasn't an accident.

This is a slippery slope you are walking here. High execution characters have been in games for a long time now it's nothing new. Viper is used as an example, she has a tough time getting results than say Wolverine but if played like a robot she is better than almost the entire cast. MODOK is about the same only we don't have a game play or enough technology developed on him yet to know where his max potential is, right now he is Mid tier but with execution and team synergy he breaks into high tier and even gives tough match ups against some of the top.

Wesker, though? I'll say that was intentional. They wanted him to be that powerful and, even though I agree with you on the health nerf being appropriate, I can't believe they're that stupid to see him for what he'd become.

That's the problem with a lot of the critiques and assuming every balance error was a mess-up as it'd imply they're huge morons.

If certain characters were to remain powerful by design there wouldn't be nerfs/buffs. That pretty much goes against what you are saying. It's easy to sit back and say Capcom messed up the balance because that's what they intended but the truth is that balancing MVC3 is hard... especially when even the community doesn't even have a solid tier list after 9 months.

If it's their intention to make Wolverine godlike they wouldn't nerf all his tools in UMVC3. Wolverine I can TOTALLY see how they fucked that up... early location tests people said Wolverine was ass especially after learning his dive kick was overhead.

 

[Red Arremer]

Exactly, he has to work a lot harder than other characters to get the same results. That was by design, it wasn't an accident.

Of course it was by design. Every fighting game has more straight-forward characters that are easy to play (o hai shotos) and characters that are difficult to master, but can pay off really well if you do so. MvC is no exception to this. Yet you see the high-execution characters being on the rise slowly. I've seen far more Felicias, Skrulls, Vipers or Lauras since the game came out, and if there was another year or so, I'm sure the last few sleeper high tiers would become more and more popular in tournament play.

That's what you call a metagame. The characters that are easy to be successful with always will be dominant when the game comes out.

 

[Bizazedo]

I honestly would stop playing MVC3 if a character who did nothing but spam projectiles from across the screen be top tier in the game. This is also what Seth said early on where they have to carefully balance certain character types because if they are too powerful it causes more range. Even in vanilla MVC3, people rage over basic zoning that gets shutdown easily. Can you imagine if zoning was top tier... like the Wolverine/Akuma version of zoning where Arthur was this beastly zoning character no one could touch and he would just chip you from full screen with his invincible Hsien Ko assist that basically made it so that if you just made it in she would make sure you would go all the way back. Would pretty much kill the competitive scene worse than JJJJJJJJEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAANNNNNN.

Yeah. I am really wondering how zoning will work in UMVC3. It'll be interesting to say the least.

I still think damage is too high for zoning to really trump in the end, but then you get individual player skill involved and blah blah blah..

This is a slippery slope you are walking here. High execution characters have been in games for a long time now it's nothing new. Viper is used as an example, she has a tough time getting results than say Wolverine but if played like a robot she is better than almost the entire cast. MODOK is about the same only we don't have a game play or enough technology developed on him yet to know where his max potential is, right now he is Mid tier but with execution and team synergy he breaks into high tier and even gives tough match ups against some of the top.

Yes, but we're not robots. If character A and B can have the exact same end results, but it's a lot harder to do B's than it is A's....A is better.

Of course it was by design. Every fighting game has more straight-forward characters that are easy to play (o hai shotos) and characters that are difficult to master, but can pay off really well if you do so. MvC is no exception to this. Yet you see the high-execution characters being on the rise slowly. I've seen far more Felicias, Skrulls, Vipers or Lauras since the game came out, and if there was another year or so, I'm sure the last few sleeper high tiers would become more and more popular in tournament play.

That's what you call a metagame. The characters that are easy to be successful with always will be dominant when the game comes out.

Can't really argue that as you're straying from MODOK and getting subjective, but I'd agree with you for what you actually posted here.

 

[Dahbomb]

Yes, but we're not robots. If character A and B can have the exact same end results, but it's a lot harder to do B's than it is A's....A is better.

That's not what I said. Let's say Character A is Wolverine and Character B is Viper. Barrier of entry for Wolverine is much less than Viper to achieve the same result to win. If you put in less time initially with Wolverine you are more likely to win with him. With practice and execution your effectiveness with Viper will rise. With Wolverine there is no rise, he plateaus rather quickly. Viper's peak surpasses that of Wolverine and with proper technique gives you an advantage over him... greatly increasing your chances of winning.

For some player that's a great reward for their work for others it's not worth the time and would rather just wing it on fundamentals.

Now if let's say Viper's peak was the same as Wolverine's peak... then Viper would be worse obviously as there is no excuse for her barrier of entry.

 

[enzo_gt]

Top thing people are sleeping on for UMvC3 is the airdash change.

The thing that has the potential to make or break the game is how they tweak zoning. Said this before too, it's a really big fear of mine deep down, an MvC where zoning dominates. Aggression is what keeps any game entertaining and hype, as soon as this goes away, it's lamer than DP mirrors. I'm sure Seth is aware of this, this is why comers, and more specifically their damage output is relatively low compared to the rest of the cast.

 

[Bizazedo]

Fair enough on that point, Dahbomb. That's not a subject I'd dare debate with you .

Top thing people are sleeping on for UMvC3 is the airdash change.

The thing that has the potential to make or break the game is how they tweak zoning. Said this before too, it's a really big fear of mine deep down, an MvC where zoning dominates. Aggression is what keeps any game entertaining and hype, as soon as this goes away, it's lamer than DP mirrors. I'm sure Seth is aware of this, this is why comers, and more specifically their damage output is relatively low compared to the rest of the cast.

I share your fears deep down .

I'm sure there are some people who'd love zoning to be best, though.

 

[Dahbomb]

Yeah. I am really wondering how zoning will work in UMVC3. It'll be interesting to say the least.

It's definitely buffed that's for sure. Every system change and just about every character change is based around improving the zoning meta game.

Top thing people are sleeping on for UMvC3 is the airdash change.

Again... you forget that there are teleporters in the game. Many of the characters who can air dash are zoners themselves or have some capability to zone themselves.

I still don't see zoning being the more preferred style in UMVC3. More viable? Of course. The East Coast in particular is all about the rushdown. They love their Weskers, Magnetos and Akumas.

 

[Tobe]

Top thing people are sleeping on for UMvC3 is the airdash change.

The thing that has the potential to make or break the game is how they tweak zoning. Said this before too, it's a really big fear of mine deep down, an MvC where zoning dominates. Aggression is what keeps any game entertaining and hype, as soon as this goes away, it's lamer than DP mirrors. I'm sure Seth is aware of this, this is why comers, and more specifically their damage output is relatively low compared to the rest of the cast.

im fucking sure that nerfing airdashes is to help scubs throw random beam supers and make them feel like they rock.

 

[Red Arremer]

Can't really argue that as you're straying from MODOK and getting subjective, but I'd agree with you for what you actually posted here.

Eh, I'm not being really subjective aside from the "I think MODOK is high tier" thing. It's a natural development for every fighting game, I just was listing high tiers that aren't being used much, but have been growing in terms of user base in the last 2 or so months.

In fact, a really good example is a character like Sentinel. He was literally on almost every fucking team you saw in tournament play. A LOT of people said he was really really good. However, the metagame expanded. The scrubs still said Sent was OP because they were stuck on that level where Sent is in fact stomping you into the ground, but the actually good players were able to find tactics against Sent. He's still around since he has a really good assist, but in comparison to the first like 3 months or so after the game come out, the use of Sentinel has declined IMMENSELY, and he is considered being a garbage character on point unless in XF3. And even then there's usually better choices for an anchor.

As mentioned, it is only a question of time. Leave the metagame out in the wild and it will develop. Of course, derp easy characters like Wolverine, Wesker, etc. will always be dominant in the game, because they're easy to be successful with. Esepcially if the game is fresh and there hasn't been stuff found for other characters. Higher execution characters always will follow and usually even surpass these easy execution characters because their tools are usually better. Unless of course, the character is generally broken, that's a whole different story.

 

[enzo_gt]

It's definitely buffed that's for sure. Every system change and just about every character change is based around improving the zoning meta game.


Again... you forget that there are teleporters in the game. Many of the characters who can air dash are zoners themselves or have some capability to zone themselves.

I still don't see zoning being the more preferred style in UMVC3. More viable? Of course. The East Coast in particular is all about the rushdown. They love their Weskers, Magnetos and Akumas.

Yeah so then teleporters are suddenly even more useful relative to the rest of the cast and then these airdash characters with zoning capabilities are weakened further because their zoning game isn't benefitting much in many situations and their rushdown is harder already from the airdash change. I'm not just talking about polar ends of the scale here, it's a change in the dynamics that will only resonate after it's available to the masses.

 

[Dahbomb]

im fucking sure that nerfing airdashes is to help scubs throw random beam supers and make them feel like they rock.

Beam hypers should be the least of your concerns. Hello omni-directional instant start up Golden arrows and Read a Book.

Although if you are getting hit by random hypers it means your method of air dashing in is brainless. You gotta think before you press those 2 buttons together.

Yeah so then teleporters are suddenly even more useful relative to the rest of the cast and then these airdash characters with zoning capabilities are weakened further because their zoning game isn't benefitting much in many situations and their rushdown is harder already from the airdash change.

The only character with a teleport that doesn't have ass health is Dormammu... who is also an air dash character as well as a zoner. But he has weaknesses of his own like slow normals and a big hit box.

Teleporters are a special breed of low health characters that still have to think before they get in or cover with an assist. Every teleport is punishable. They are great against brainless zoning but against someone who knows what they are doing they will try to bait out that raw teleport when he knows he has you pinned down (because you can't call assist when you are pinned down, it will lead into happy birthday).

Just like teleporters, air dashers will have to use assists to get in and zoners will have to use assists to keep characters out. That's how Marvel is supposed to be played. Characters who can do both are still going to be very good (like Doom, Dorm and Mag).

 

[Bizazedo]

As mentioned, it is only a question of time. Leave the metagame out in the wild and it will develop. Of course, derp easy characters like Wolverine, Wesker, etc. will always be dominant in the game, because they're easy to be successful with. Esepcially if the game is fresh and there hasn't been stuff found for other characters. Higher execution characters always will follow and usually even surpass these easy execution characters because their tools are usually better. Unless of course, the character is generally broken, that's a whole different story.

That's the subjective part.

Just because they're higher execution doesn't make them, by default, better.

It does sometimes allow things that makes them better, sure. But, not always, and especially due to the high damage output of those easier characters (Derperine), it's hard to improve on it, especially with so many ways to kill people in one combo.

If damage were lower, maybe, but..otherwise it's very subjective.

 

[shaowebb]

@Shaowebb, ah you made it sound like you were already "in" somewhere. My bad. Best of luck to you and your Iron Fist Dating Sim.

 

[SolarPowered]

We are about forty hours away from the apocalypse itself and I'm going mad here. I need that goddamn Capcom changelog.

@_@

@Shaowebb, ah you made it sound like you were already "in" somewhere. My bad. Best of luck to you and your Iron Fist Dating Sim.

I didn't notice this until now haha.

I went on google just to find a large image using the words "what am I fighting for?"(it felt like the appropriate image lol) and I got AWESOME results.

 

[Professor Beef]

"It's not like I WANT to punch your lights out, baka!"

 

[Red Arremer]

I went on google just to find a large image using the words "what am I fighting for?"(it felt like the appropriate image lol) and I got AWESOME results.

I wish I could draw somewhat decently, I would take the "Zero holding Iris"-picture and do it so Nova is holding Hsien-Ko.

 

[enzo_gt]

I wish I could draw somewhat decently, I would take the "Zero holding Iris"-picture and do it so Nova is holding Hsien-Ko.

needs more E-cups

 

[Azure J]

I wish I could draw somewhat decently, I would take the "Zero holding Iris"-picture and do it so Nova is holding Hsien-Ko.

Nova's into dead/reanimated 16 year olds? :lol

 

[Htown]

Nova's into dead/reanimated 16 year olds? :lol

He did bring Namorita back.

 

[Red Arremer]

Nova's into dead/reanimated 16 year olds? :lol

More because SolarPowered is going to play him and you know, Hsien-Ko.

He did bring Namorita back.

I lol'd.

 

[SolarPowered]

Maybe Nova can bring their Mother back from the dark. Then the sisters will have no reason to fight and Capcom can stop doing indecent things with the corpse.

Nova's into dead/reanimated 16 year olds? :lol

That is Tony's department.

I guess you saw the image :lol.

 

[Karsticles]

Props to Max for the videos!

At 3:37 in Max's new video...

2 Flame Carpets on screen at once? :O

That's not new. Dormammu has always been able to have multiple Flame Carpets on the screen, but any beyond the first can only be created if he is canceling into them from an attack.

Dem Dorm buffs... nice. Too bad Max didn't check if cr.M has less hit stun or not. WTF @ 2 flame carpets at once... BUFF!!!!

c.M definitely has less hitstun.

I updated the changelog with some of the minor discoveries in Max's video. Stuff like increased hit stun on Doom's j.H, 3 hits of super armor on She Hulk's Chariot and 2 flame carpets at once.

Make sure to remove that last one.

Edited: Is c.M for Dorm nerfed? I am sick of my friends spamming that when I was in air.

c.M is nerfed, but now you can't chicken block on an air dash, so it's still going to be very strong, if not stronger.

Yea, but most of the moveset of, say, Firebrand isn't specifically imaginative either. Firebrand just swoops around and spits fire.

Maybe you mean they're not "flashy"? Nothing in any game ever plays like Firebrand. He's very unique and imaginative.

 

[Deleted member 13876]

Maybe Nova can bring their Mother back from the dark. Then the sisters will have no reason to fight and Capcom can stop doing indecent things with the corpse.

That is Tony's department.

I guess you saw the image :lol.

He can't revive people, it was a wacky time displacement thing.

 

[Red Arremer]

Maybe you mean they're not "flashy"? Nothing in any game ever plays like Firebrand. He's very unique and imaginative.

I wasn't talking about playstyle but moves. Firebrand's moves are not really exciting to look at as moves. He slashes and spits fire. His hypers are all copy-pasted from other already existing characters. The moveset itself is very uninspired. So essentially, he's an even worse offender than Nova who has new moves, for instance with that aegis reflector deal.

The playstyle is entirely new, though, that I agree with.

 

[SolarPowered]

He can't revive people, it was a wacky time displacement thing.

I know that. I was just joking around. GOD YOU GUYS JUST CAN'T LET ONE SLIP.

<_<

 

[enzo_gt]

I wasn't talking about playstyle but moves. Firebrand's moves are not really exciting to look at as moves. He slashes and spits fire. His hypers are all copy-pasted from other already existing characters. The moveset itself is very uninspired. So essentially, he's an even worse offender than Nova who has new moves, for instance with that aegis reflector deal.

The playstyle is entirely new, though, that I agree with.

hmmmmmm, something about this seems contradictory.

Plus Firebrand's command grab or whatever he can combo into is really exciting and looks awesome, not sure what your on about. And his level 3 is pretty awesome too, especially when it gets all hype and your juggling assists in the air. And all the negative stuff you've said about Firebrand applies in greater magnitudes than Nova, who got the most flak for copy pasted hypers that look very, very bland, especially compared to Firebrands.

This is just an argument of opinion of who you think looks cooler at this point really.

 

[QisTopTier]

I wasn't talking about playstyle but moves. Firebrand's moves are not really exciting to look at as moves. He slashes and spits fire. His hypers are all copy-pasted from other already existing characters. The moveset itself is very uninspired. So essentially, he's an even worse offender than Nova who has new moves, for instance with that aegis reflector deal.

The playstyle is entirely new, though, that I agree with.

Play style matters more than moves, also his level 3 works almost nothing like felicia's at all.

 

[Red Arremer]

This is just an argument of opinion of who you think looks cooler at this point really.

I'm just trying to explain why I'm pissed at the whole "Nova is sooooo booooring yawn"-deal, or rather, why I don't understand people saying that while there's characters who pretty much do pretty much exactly the same (i.e. having uninspired movesets), especially considering how true to character Nova is.

Though I thought we were over that already. <_<

Play style matters more than moves, also his level 3 works almost nothing like felicia's at all.

Just like how Nova's human rocket punch super doesn't work like Maximum Wesker. Surprise.

Also, what about Nova's playstyle is boring? He looks like a BLAST to play as.

 

[Deleted member 13876]

I know that. I was just joking around. GOD YOU GUYS JUST CAN'T LET ONE SLIP.

<_<

Wasn't trying to be anal, thought you might legitimately think that was somehow part of his powerset.

 

[Karsticles]

I wasn't talking about playstyle but moves. Firebrand's moves are not really exciting to look at as moves. He slashes and spits fire. His hypers are all copy-pasted from other already existing characters. The moveset itself is very uninspired. So essentially, he's an even worse offender than Nova who has new moves, for instance with that aegis reflector deal.

Okay, so you meant "flashy". Not everyone prefers flashy characters, though. I like how "basic" his moves are.

Firebrand has a nice assortment of new moves. Hell's Elevator and Bon Voyage are unlike anything else in this game.

 

[SolarPowered]

Playing with Nova is about as fun as giving your cat a bath.

so there

Wasn't trying to be anal, thought you might legitimately think that was somehow part of his powerset.

I was posting in an over the top manner just to make light of the situation.

Should have been clearer from the start...

 

[Red Arremer]

Playing with Nova is about as fun as giving your cat a shower.

so there

My old cat loved showers, lol.

Okay, so you meant "flashy". Not everyone prefers flashy characters, though. I like how "basic" his moves are.

Firebrand has a nice assortment of new moves. Hell's Elevator and Bon Voyage are unlike anything else in this game.

I don't care about how basic Nova's or Firebrand's moves are. In fact those 2 are so far my most favorite characters to be revealed alongside Strange. I'm just trying to find out how the "Nova so boring"-people can use that logic and get hyped for other characters whose movesets aren't flashy either.

 

[QisTopTier]

Because firebrands gameplay style itself is flashy. The basic moves don't have to be all fancy for a character to be a showcase style character.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Maybe you mean they're not "flashy"? Nothing in any game ever plays like Firebrand. He's very unique and imaginative.