Well, shit, this would be very convenient. Thanks and forgive my ignorance. I know jack about networking. I'll give it a try when I have time.
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Uncharted 4: A Thief's End Multiplayer |OT| Swinging To Victory
- Thread starter BaraSailey
- Start date
Negotiator
Member
NP, you're welcome. 
The bars that are next to the players names are their connection to you, not to the host. If you're getting white plugs, you're experiencing fluctuations in your internet connection. If you have low bars to everyone in, your internet is taking a shit and you will experience the white plug.
And I hate these vague ass bars. Give me actual ms.
Negotiator
Member
From BG's POV everyone had full (4) bars, even though not all of us were from the same region.
Milliseconds or bust.
inb4 "it's too hard to program for", even though netcode internally measures latency in ms
Hmm, does distance have anything to do with this? For instance, when I play with a friend who is also from Malaysia, his connection to me is consistently three or full bars.
test_account
XP-39C²
I see, thanks for the info. Kinda disappointing to hear that solo performance has zero impact on the leveling system. I could understand it a bit, in case people "steal" your kills and such, then it might be hard to rack up a certain amount of points, but still. I also got a message saying something like "your team is in disfavor of winning", so i thought this also was a variable in the scoring system.
I did get the 4 points for being within the top players some times, but that didnt help much when i also got -12 points. I wont be playing much of Ranked TDM further on then, but maybe i'll revisit it if they add a no-party ranked TDM mode.
Negotiator
Member
Distance = latency
Whelp, really hoping ND will ditch the SSBM and pair players up with other players who are closer to them.
Stallion Dan
Member
If only there was a way to filter online opponents, through regions or something. It could be called a 'region filter'. Perhaps one day in the far future someone will invent such a thing.
RyanardoDaVinci
Member
Hahaha, if I only had other stuff to play/do to offset my boredom.
But alas, I do not. I must endure and survive.
Chalupa Batman
Member
Haha I was going from 8 p.m. forward to 11 a.m., not backwards. Typical American.
Yep, Powerline adapters are legit. You get full Ethernet speeds and everything (assuming your wiring can handle it). Totally worth it. Make sure you get Gigabit-compatible ones if you have a fast connection. They're not much more expensive than 10/100 adapters (if at all) but you can only get full speeds with them because the 10/100 rating is theoretical and you'll never actually get that in real-world usage.
Are you still in college or something? Did you move yet or are we still gonna see you Werking It like an asshole during half the matches?
RyanardoDaVinci
Member
No college, just a shitty part-time job and many, many hours of free time.
I have moved, only not to any permanent place; I'm staying in the guest room at a friend's.
And even though he's a tech guy with killer internet, his house isn't completely wired and I'm the farthest I can be from the router -- so that, coupled with this new matchmaking... yeah. I'm gonna look into a powerline adapter, see if that'll help out.
I've upgraded from Werkin' It, now it's Sexy Jig time or whatever it's called.
Chalupa Batman
Member
No college, just a shitty part-time job and many, many hours of free time.
I have moved, only not to any permanent place; I'm staying in the guest room at a friend's.
And even though he's a tech guy with killer internet, his house isn't completely wired and I'm the farthest I can be from the router -- so that, coupled with this new matchmaking... yeah. I'm gonna look into a powerline adapter, see if that'll help out.
I've upgraded from Werkin' It, now it's Sexy Jig time or whatever it's called.
Powerline adapters will save your life and KD/R all in one fell swoop!
Haha is that from the DLC? I did the math and we need something like 150,000 relics to open all the DLC chests. Basically impossible and once the second/third DLC drops forget about ever unlocking everything.
Chronospherics
Member
Obviously a powerline adaptor is better than no connection but for gaming there are a lot of reports of them being worse than wifi.
https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/445640-the-powerline-is-low-latency-myth/
Still, probably a better option if you can't get anything better than wifi with a poor signal, but at the same time it's not exactly ideal...
Negotiator
Member
It's not a matter of latency, but more a matter of reducing packet loss. ND netcode does not penalize jitter (deviating ping). A 10-20ms difference (rare latency spikes) is nothing in the grand scheme of things (i.e. if you're playing against 300-400ms opponents, like BRA ones).
Ethernet always has the lowest latency (<1ms). The problem with WiFi is that it uses an overcrowded band (2.4 GHz), which means more chances of interference from other wireless devices/microwave ovens/neighbors and thus more packet loss. 5 GHz is less crowded, but Sony consoles do not support that. Electrical wiring is not ideal (it was not designed for broadband communication, same for telephone wiring aka xDSL), but it's still better than 2.4 GHz wireless in terms of packet loss (aka white plugs in ND games), especially in densely populated urban environments.
If powerlines don't work in someone's house (because it has 100-year old wiring or whatever), he can return the product to the store and ask for a refund. It doesn't hurt to give it a try.
TL;DR: Ethernet > Powerline > WiFi
ps: According to ND, 60% of their player base uses WiFi. If that could be reduced to 10-20%, everyone would have a better experience and there would be less complaints about white plugs...
RyanardoDaVinci
Member
Yeah, one of the new taunts -- but I was mistaken, I use the Shimmy now!
I actually had leftover money in my PSN wallet that's been there for months, so I used that to buy some NDbucks (*cringe*) just to get the two weapons I needed and a few vanity items.
Chalupa Batman
Member
That's a crazy number. Where/when did they say that? I wonder what the breakdown is for other MP games like COD, etc. I would think it would be very difficult to consistently have a good time over Wifi.
Yeah, one of the new taunts -- but I was mistaken, I use the Shimmy now!
I actually had leftover money in my PSN wallet that's been there for months, so I used that to buy some NDbucks (*cringe*) just to get the two weapons I needed and a few vanity items.
You're part of the problem!
Chronospherics
Member
It's not a matter of latency, but more a matter of reducing packet loss. ND netcode does not penalize jitter (deviating ping). A 10-20ms difference (rare latency spikes) is nothing in the grand scheme of things (i.e. if you're playing against 300-400ms opponents, like BRA ones).
Ethernet always has the lowest latency (<1ms). The problem with WiFi is that it uses an overcrowded band (2.4 GHz), which means more chances of interference from other wireless devices/microwave ovens/neighbors and thus more packet loss. 5 GHz is less crowded, but Sony consoles do not support that. Electrical wiring is not ideal (it was not designed for broadband communication, same for telephone wiring aka xDSL), but it's still better than 2.4 GHz wireless in terms of packet loss (aka white plugs in ND games), especially in densely populated urban environments.
If powerlines don't work in someone's house (because it has 100-year old wiring or whatever), he can return the product to the store and ask for a refund. It doesn't hurt to give it a try.
TL;DR: Ethernet > Powerline > WiFi
ps: According to ND, 60% of their player base uses WiFi. If that could be reduced to 10-20%, everyone would have a better experience and there would be less complaints about white plugs...
Yeah I guess it's not so big of a deal on games like this, but I know for fighting games people really complain about them.
I think Ethernet > Powerline > WiFi is true, but only if you have tried Wifi already were observing issues with it. In ideal circumstances (rare interference) then Ethernet > WiFi > Powerline seems likely to be true.
I imagine it's accurate across a lot of games, for a lot of people it's just easier, and they don't take the game that seriously. I imagine the ratio of wired / wireless favours wired more in games where minute differences in latency can have a larger influence (i.e fighting games). Even in my own household, one of our consoles is on wired, and the other is on wireless, because otherwise we encounter obscure networking issues (PS4 1 disconnects PS4 2 from matches, etc). Haven't been able to resolve that, despite having assigned them static ips, and messed with port forwarding and DMZ settings. Router might be crap, but for us it's just easier to keep one of them wireless.
For what it's worth though, when I play games like Rocket League and Rainbow Six with the two PS4s, they both ping within a 2 milisecond range of one another, despite one being wireless, and one being wired. So in terms of latency, it's not that big of a deal.
Negotiator
Member
It's written somewhere in their forums by a ND dev I think. TBH, I'm surprised it's not higher than that. CoD might be though.
~
Btw, I was wondering if perhaps ND could implement a hybrid/asymmetric tickrate/player update system. I'm really tired of getting killed behind walls, especially in Ranked with SBMM.
For example, there could be an option where I could change the tickrate for myself only (to 30 or 60 Hz) at the expense of using more upload bandwidth (for my connection only). Other players would still use the legacy (15 Hz) tickrate, so their upload bandwidth usage would remain the same. Download bandwidth usage would increase though (since they would have to receive more packets from me), but I think that everyone has at least 2 Mbps of downstream these days, so it shouldn't be an issue. Maybe this could only apply to opponents, since I don't expect to get killed by teammates.
This way, players with high speed upload would be rewarded by dying behind walls/cover less often and low upload speed players would still be able to play the game with no increase in white plugs (that's what happened in the experimental TLOU weekend) and without splitting the pool into 15-30-60 Hz playlists. I think it's a compromising solution. Universally increasing the tickrate for everyone will have negative repercussions to low upload players.
Thoughts? Am I the only one who wants this option?
I'd seriously buy 10000 Uncharted Points in a heartbeat if Erin Daly responded here and gave us some hope.
ps: I've noticed that laggers with the FAL seem to be deadlier than other players, but I'm not going to blame weapons for being "OP" (that's what destroyed the UC2 FAL & UC3 G-MAL). I fully realize that it's the netcode design (15 Hz tickrate) that allows these players to kill me behind walls. It's not their fault either. They see my player avatar before taking cover, therefore they kill me (as expected).
Chronospherics
Member
I'd seriously buy 10000 Uncharted Points in a heartbeat if Erin Daly responded here and gave us some hope.
I've sent some messages out, but we best see some evidence if this happening if Erin Daly does ever respond to you.
Negotiator
Member
No problem, I'll post a screenshot from my PSN account transaction history, if they're willing to take the offer and implement this in a patch. It's a small price to pay for the betterment of the game.I've sent some messages out, but we best see some evidence if this happening if Erin Daly does ever respond to you.
I doubt that they'll do anything about it, but who knows, maybe they'll prove me wrong...
Chronospherics
Member
Well, all you said was for them to respond and 'give us hope'. I'm not saying there's a decent chance they'll actually do anything, but I think just looking into implementing another test or something like that would be really promising...
Negotiator
Member
I don't think there's any point in having another experimental 30 Hz weekend and then reverting back to 15 Hz. I certainly wouldn't pay 49,99 for that. It would be a waste of time & money for everyone involved.
I'd prefer a permanent solution that would suit everyone's needs, like the asymmetric tickrate slider I suggested. ND needs to dispel the "catering to laggers at the expense of people who have good connections" notion if they want my (and other like-minded people's) money. This and a ms/bar toggle would satisfy a lot of people.
ps: I'm not sure if Eric Daly has a GAF account. I've only seen Arne and QTrain here.
Chronospherics
Member
Probably better if it just evaluated their bandwidth and then decided what position on the slider they should have, no? Maybe allow them to move it themselves if it isn't working out, but otherwise I doubt most people would touch it.
I'd assume it'd be quite complicated to implement a dynamic system like that too, much more so than increasing or decreasing it, at least. Something they'd need to develop, etc. but I think adding the tickrate options for private games would be the best step in the right direction for now. That would serve as a permanent benefit, but also as a more extensive test for a potential larger roll out, later.
Negotiator
Member
They could do it automatically based on the initial speedtest (it does this every time you boot up the MP), but a manual slider could also work. In UC3 MP they had added a voting option for intros and no intros (less upload bandwidth needed).
ND knows what percentage of their player base has sub-1 Mbps upload speeds and I reckon it's pretty high due to ADSL being the most common broadband option all over the world.
Based on my router bandwidth measurements, 30 Hz should require ~1000 Kbps of upload and 60 Hz should require ~2000 Kbps. I have 9999 Kbps currently, so there's plenty of headroom to spare. Most VDSL/Cable users should be able to handle a higher tickrate easily.
I'm trying to get better with the FAL too, the only mod that looks really useful to attach it with is the recoil mod (but even then the recoil of the FAL is really manageable without it). If you like to go stealthy, then add the silencer.
The main side arm I use is the Fossa (I think I use sully's fossa with increased reload speed and blind fire) and this is useful for guys who try to rush me as I can compete with the likes of the P90 and the pistole. I also pair it up with gunslinger so that I switch up guns on the fly quicker.
My personal preferences for boosters (across all my loadouts) are explosive awareness 2, ghost 1, and stealth 1.
Chronospherics
Member
I've been using the FAL since beta, it's my main weapon. I switch between strafe speed and recoil, but honestly I mostly use strafe speed. Subtle increases in strafe speed are often enough to cause someone to miss a few bullets, especially at long range against FAL or Metler users.
Recoil can be good because while the recoil between bursts is manageable it tightens the spread of each individual burst thereby translating to an increase in accuracy. The tighter spread can help get those one-burst downs against mid ranged targets.
Thanks for these inputs, I was going to mention strafe speed, but don't actually use it so can't comment on it. But will give it a try.
False Witness
Member
Raffica with Clip Capacity- 2 LP
Grenade- 4 LP
Staff of Ayar Manco- 2 LP
Mark on Damage 3- 5 LP
Farmer 3- 5 LP
Scavenger 3- 4 LP
Helping Hand 3- 4 LP
or you can go with a Cintamani with larger AoE - 5 LP instead of the staff and scavenger 1 instead of 3.
(The Raffica is a better FAL. Plus it's cheaper.)
Chronospherics
Member
This isn't true. It's considerably worse in every way. Well, aside being cheaper.
No zoom, increased spread, lower damage, lower DPS, no one-burst down potential etc.
Chalupa Batman
Member
Your dumb ass?
I'm of the opinion that the pistol version of every weapon is considerably superior to every long gun.
Chalupa Batman
Member
WTF is wrong with you? How many 10k points have you bought? Your last two gave you 20k points each, so congrats on at least "saving" money.
Chronospherics
Member
What makes you say that? Aside the Para 45 and its twin (forget the name) they're invariably less accurate, and kill slower than their long-gun counterparts.
It could very well be a perception thing, I suppose. I just feel like everything goes much faster with a pistol. I also do 85% of my shooting at mid to close range. Quick aiming, reloading, shooting, and wobble recovery. They just seem to work with my movement oriented playstyle.
Speaking of, the Agarwal is the true star of the DLC weapons.
Speaking of, the Agarwal is the true star of the DLC weapons.
Couldn't get into the Agarwal. Prefer the Enforcer. It suits my quick trigger finger better. The Agarwal is nice if you can get consistent head shots I guess.
Rewrite
Not as deep as he thinks
IMO it's the best pistol in the game (argawal). It's a pocket Mettler.
I actually hated it the first few times I tried it because I came into it thinking I had to fire it like the Jackal because it does the same damage. NOPE! You can go buck wild with it and rapid tap that fire button.
It is best going for those double headshots though. Perfect precision pistol.
Grinchy
Banned
It's really damn good. I've been using it in my pistol-only loadout recently. You have to aim every shot properly while everyone else sprays, but if you can manage to do it, it just shreds through people.
Chalupa Batman
Member
It's not a perception thing. You move faster and quicker with pistols than you do with long guns.
It has no zoom so it can't be a pocket Mettler.
Negotiator
Member
AK is subsidizing the cost of the free DLC maps for all of us... all those vanity items are overpriced for a reason.
Stallion Dan
Member
Use a silencer.
Chalupa Batman
Member
Did you know that Naughty Dog counts any match as a full match for the Leaderboards? I just had a match end 7-1 after the other team quit and my stats went down because I only got 3 downs/KOs lol. What a joke.
xenorevlis
Member
Mobbin' Online #7 is up! Close to 4 minutes, all my character, with appearances by several real life friends, and several GAF members (bam, Somnium, baird, Broken, Ryanardo, Shackelford, etc.) as well as a weird glitch at the end where the capture point remained "contested" with no enemies around.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hz91U2z_aY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hz91U2z_aY
HAHAHAHA, this is fantastic. What a whiney loser.
Rewrite
Not as deep as he thinks
I should have said, it's like a pocket Mettler. Is that better? It totally is btw, even without the zoom. Best pistol in the game. <3