bodyofanamerican
Member
Game of Thrones: Infinite. Sansa is secretly Elizabeth, Little Finger is Booker.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 5 - Sundays on HBO
- Thread starter Steelyuhas
- Start date
- Status
ToyMachine228
Member
You know why D&D are proving they made great decisions with Sansa's storyline? We've all been talking about it for weeks.
From Sansa's perspective the other option was to turn around and not marry Ramsay. I have no idea if Littlefinger was genuine in his offer, but I doubt Sansa thought he was being dishonest. I think she was convinced by the idea of taking her future into her own hands for once and trying to get revenge, so that's what she decided. Which is what's important.
She steeled herself and decided to do it. She put her best fake face on when greeting the Boltons, she's attended meals and been relatively polite, with a hint of sarcasm where appropriate. I mean, she's had only like 4 scenes since they arrived at Winterfell. There's still half a season of story left. The revenge plot IS a long con.
I also think it's important to note that the worst thing to happen to her so far under care of the Boltons is Ramsay parading Reek in front of her with a mock (unbeknownst to her) apology for killing her brothers. Which is in fairly stark (heh) contrast to her treatment under Joffrey, where she sees her father beheaded, is forced to look upon his head on a spike, is beaten and mocked and despised regularly and then forced to marry Tyrion. She was much more a political prisoner and greeted the situation with hopelessness, and was literally a helpless victim the whole time.
In this Bolton scenario, it started with her making a decision, she has willingly gone into this dangerous situation, and she has so far been more calculating in her behavior. It's a far cry from the Sansa who was in King's Landing.
The Battle of Meereen comes after the Dragon Pit.
I still think it could be in the plans and want it to happen next season.
(Of course I'm also waiting for Stoneheart at the end of this season)
PhoenixDark
Banned
What if she's Helena Reed, wife of Howland.
The kid who got stabbed by Arya in S1 was terribad.
But yeah, pretty much everyone else has been spot on.
cartoon_soldier
Member
The wolves now are all CGI so not surprised we don't really see much of them.
bodyofanamerican
Member
Can't stop laughing at this.
Liquidsnake
Banned
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
I don't think Ghost really likes Jon.
I guess we'll have to wait and see? But acting as a beacon for the North to rally around while simultaneously causing trouble for the Bolton family from the inside doesn't seem a stretch.
No they're not. They're filmed against a green screen and then enlarged and inserted in post.
TheNamesPlissken
Neo Member
There will be no battle for mereen - there's no point to it in the tv universe. No Yunkai and Astapor uprisings, no army on their way, they already have the mereneese navy, no sell sword companies, etc.
Dany will have her fuck this moment since they are gonna try and kill her in Daznaks pit despite her re opening the pits and marrying their noble man. She's gonna get on drogon and then will be into westeros soon. The only thing that might happen would be her returning to mereen on drogon and uniting with the other dragons and burning everyone who opposes her before hopping on those ships.
Dany will have her fuck this moment since they are gonna try and kill her in Daznaks pit despite her re opening the pits and marrying their noble man. She's gonna get on drogon and then will be into westeros soon. The only thing that might happen would be her returning to mereen on drogon and uniting with the other dragons and burning everyone who opposes her before hopping on those ships.
The 3 second cameo in episode 1 wasn't enough for you?
It's not like he's supposed to be Jon's shadow, loyal companion, and staunch defender
on that subject, where the hell is Mormont's bird
They said that they wanted to give Sansa another character's story. Which was Jeyne's. They did not want to her to stay in the Vale because her story line was not shocking (she's not in immediate danger! Oh no!)
It was clear in the dinner scene that Sansa was displeased at her situation that she was forced into against her will. Again. Sansa was humiliated. Again. She smiled when Roose smacked Ramsay down? That's character development?
Oh come on. It was poor writing. She had no choice. It's like saying she had a choice to not marry Tyrion (technically she did in the books, would have married one of the cousins instead). Littlefinger took her to North, whilst not telling her where they were going or what he had intended until they reached Moat Cailin. She was not active in the plotting, she did not even want to do it. The only decision she has made all season was rejecting Brienne's offer and even then, as a survivor, it made little sense for her to choose Brienne's protection over Littlefinger's.
She did not have a choice. She was not looped in on a plan to destroy the Bolton's. She did not magically inherit the army of White Harbor. She was shipped off by Littlefinger, despite how moronic the idea is, because the producers thought it was interesting. I don't even know how you can deny that when D&D are clear about it.
She has not done a single calculating thing in 5 episodes. Last episode she was told to light a candle if she's frightened, she was terrified by Ramsay's girlfriend and then humiliated at dinner. Next episode, per the preview,
she'll be forced to marry a monster and then be raped by him in front of Theon.
So yeah, it seems to be Sansa reliving her story all over again (including a forced marriage and an uncomfortable sex scene!) as opposed to real progress in her character.
Well, the Boltons have an army. The only person with enough power to completely displace them is Littlefinger.
Conceivably Theon or Sansa could kill Ramsay given the right cirumstances though.
I'm either too cynical or the "candle in the broken tower" is the most obvious Ramsay trick ever. This guy did the same thing to Theon. He's trying to break Sansa's will.
Letting Sansa know that you plan to kill their army is a bad idea when you're marrying her off to a family known for cutting the skin off fingers to obtain information.
Littlefinger's advice to Sansa was to manipulate Ramsay, not kill him. That (I hope) is his own plan.
Also, Jeyne Poole would make for a dumb television storyline.
Littlefinger's advice to Sansa was to manipulate Ramsay, not kill him. That (I hope) is his own plan.
Also, Jeyne Poole would make for a dumb television storyline.
That's just a completely gross over-simplification of the situation and her character at this point in the story. But whatever. It's pointless even debating with some people in this thread.
Liquidsnake
Banned
Yeah Im going to agree with that,
Munch Poke
Member
The one thing I'm not getting is how she's just walking around as Sansa Stark. In the books the fake identity served a real purpose. Keeping her hidden from those who would do her harm.
But here in the show we have her here with the Boltons who are "loyal" to the Lannisters. Has Cersei been so caught up in finding Tyrion she's completely forgotten about Sansa? I'd imagine she would still want her back. So with Littlefinger going to see Cersei how does he play off delivering a player in Joffreys death to the Boltons and not taking her straight to Cersei?
But here in the show we have her here with the Boltons who are "loyal" to the Lannisters. Has Cersei been so caught up in finding Tyrion she's completely forgotten about Sansa? I'd imagine she would still want her back. So with Littlefinger going to see Cersei how does he play off delivering a player in Joffreys death to the Boltons and not taking her straight to Cersei?
BobTheFork
Member
I don't think Cersei knows LF had Sansa or took her to the Boltons. From the Boltons end, I don't think they consider the Lanisters to be much support at all so they don't have a reason to tell her. The Boltons are much better off with a real Stark child to make their claim solid.
But why would he do it? There's no reason, Sansa is getting into the marriage by her own accord, there's no will that needs to be broken.
Cersei doesn't have Varys around at the moment to confirm things, she might have heard rumors of Sansa in the Vale and Winter fell but Little finger can just make something up and the Bolton's don't really have a connection with her it was only to Tywin so they have no need to be honest with her either.
Munch Poke
Member
I suppose, but it just seems so odd for a Stark to be able to just walk around after all she's been accused of. And sure for right now Cersei is clearly too busy to worry about hunting her down but you'd think if the Boltons/Lannisters survived all this and were still the ruling class that would be one hell of a talking point.
"Oh the girl that helped my brother murder my son the king has now married your bastard no biggie" doesn't seem like Cerseis way.
The North remains as vast and as impregnable as it ever was. Cersei doesn't have any military force at her disposal which is why she armed The Faith. The Tyrell's were aware of the plot to give Sansa to Littlefinger, Roose Bolton and presumable his buddy Walder Frey are on board too. The Iron Islanders just got their asses kicked at Winterfell and are in opening rebellion to the crown. So who is she hiding from? Kevan Lannister? Is he going to march a force through the neck just to execute Sansa with Winter Coming.
What will be interesting is if Cersei knows about the plot with LF in the city next week. However she is about to be out manoeuvred by Olenna and Baelish so it doesn't really matter.
Victarian and the Ironborn are coming to take the dragons. We just don't know it because it's behind the scenes.
D & D can not be dumb enough to think Daznaks pit would be a good closure for her Meereen story. It certainly wasn't in the books. That's why they were so many complaints about the climax being cut out.
BobTheFork
Member
Again, I don't think she knows and LF and the Boltons have a reason not to tell her. Now, if the Boltons were aware of this and waiting until they think Cersei falls apart or waiting until she leaves the Capital to make the wedding known then I think there should have been a small piece of Dialog. You are correct in that regard; It does feel like Sansa being wanted for Regicide was swept aside.
I'm not saying that they needed to include Manderly. I'm not even saying they should not have changed Sansa's story. There were a lot of things they could have done with Sansa that I would have found more interesting and show her gaining some form of agency as opposed to being victimized yet again in a retread of her story.
They've established Rickon is with the Umbers in the show. She could have gone there and GreatJon could have taken the role of Manderly, working with Sansa and Littlefinger to retake Winterfell for Rickon/Sansa. We end up in the same place with one additional character and an even more condensed story.
Agree to disagree then.
Munch Poke
Member
Yeah I understand the effort needed to get her wouldn't be worth it, but it does seem as if everyone has just forgotten what put her on the run to begin with.
I suppose it doesn't matter much considering what's coming for Cersei anyways. But I do hope it's somewhat addressed when Littlefinger gets to Kings landing.
BobTheFork
Member
I'm expecting her to mention a rumor of some kind and hopefully the fact that he now has a niece that has never once come up before. I think we get the usual 'Cersei thinks she's smarter than she is' kind of scene.
Probably at Daenerys's side when Jorah & Tyrion reach her.
Munch Poke
Member
Ooohh. Can you imagine how pissed Tyrion would look after walking that far all because of Jorah?
This is a little bit of a stretch on my end, but imagine a conversation wherein Roose warns Ramsay that the northerners might want to kidnap Sansa, or she might be amenable to taking up the northern cause.
Now Ramsay has a cause to test her loyalty.
Killing Pycelle and Kevan Lannister in Episode 10
BobTheFork
Member
Kind of hope Kevan doesn't just walk into the room and see Pycelle dead. I want to SEE that bearded prick die on camera.
I think the Rickon and the Umbers stuff is just coming later. Sophie mentioned the idea of Sansa trying to find her brothers in interviews, so I think something will come of that. Umber may be organizing the resistance from behind the scenes, and we'll get him revealed later, assuming the whole Northern resistance isn't some Ramsay mind game. I miss the Manderly scenes, but they've done a decent enough job of establishing that the Northerners aren't happy about the Bolton situation through the Lyanna Mormont's letter and Ramsay's story about Lord Cerwyn's resistance.
Overall, I think the Sansa in Winterfell stuff worked well. The scene where she finds Theon in the kennels even did a good job of bringing the horror elements of the Winterfell book plot forward, which I thought would be lost completely in the shuffle.
bengraven
Member
How do you think Myranda is going to bite it?
And wasn't she someone else in the books? The kennel master's daughter that Theon used to fuck who later was raped and then killed by Ramsay?
Hopefully with a crossbow in his hand at the end of this season.
And wasn't she someone else in the books? The kennel master's daughter that Theon used to fuck who later was raped and then killed by Ramsay?
Hopefully with a crossbow in his hand at the end of this season.
TheNamesPlissken
Neo Member
The main purpose Victarion is gonna serve is supplying the ships to Dany to take her to westeros. It's not a coincidence that the show dropped the line last season with Daario saying they had he exact same number of ships as Victarion has in the books (72 or something).
Her last scene won't be Daznaks in episode nine. It will either be her controlling drogon taking a new army/khalesar, or they may even have her get on a Drogon and start heading west to Westeros.
The combination of Daznaks pit (will be a HUGE set piece on tv) and her finally deciding enough is enough, embrace the Targ mentality of Fire and Blood and let's go home is a no brainer in terms of season ending points.
Wasn't the last shot of the entire season in season three just her being raiser up by the slaves of Yunkai? This would blow that out of the water.
bodyofanamerican
Member
Kyra, with her keys.
Is he a prick because he's bearded or is he bearded because he's a prick?
You're making good points, unfortunately. (I want to see a big battle in Essos with pirates and dragons more than I want to see a Hardhome or Winterfell battle)
However if she goes to Westeros in this season while in book 6 she's still in Meereen the whole time, what will she do in Season 6 waiting for the Westeros plots to catch up? (All the book material in book 6 that doesn't involve Dany)
- Status