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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 6
- Thread starter Steelyuhas
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DKehoe
Member
Yeh, Bran is fully aware of how horrific it is for Hodor when he wargs into him but keeps doing it anyway. Doing it because it's a life or death situation and there's no other option is one thing but he's done it before just because he's bored and wants to go explore the cave he's in.
Steelyuhas
Member
Essentially he was brainwashed for this moment, he knows what he had to do at that moment, even if he doesn't understand why.
CornBurrito
Member
To be fair, Bran is like 10-12 in the books. I don't think he really understands why what he's doing is wrong.
Agree on the wolf, disagree completely on Hodor. Bran will learn a terribly valuable lesson from that.
On the wolf, it wasn't just pointless, it was contrary to the nature of a wolf. To run into a mob like that. Silly.
As I saw it and from the interviews he didn't even manage to warg into Hodor completely, it was merely a mental slap of sorts to get him out of his "rocking in a corner" state so he could help with the sledge. Everything afterwards is Hodor by himself. Bran "in-vision" isn't warged, his consciousness is still in the past.
Of course I could be completely wrong and Bran did it all
but even if that was the case Bran didn't do anything on purpose, both the three eyed raven and Meera gave him orders and he followed them.cartoon_soldier
Member
Pretty sure that was also GRRM
Oldest Snake
Member
They didn't really spend enough time on it (seriously, Hodor's hodor-ing got more of a setup & dramatic payoff than the WW origin) but I think it fits in with GRRM's writing. The WW's are basicaly a runaway bio/nuclear weapon that was created as the ultimate answer to their problems.
Whether it 'worked' or has significance in the show given the difference in tone we'll have to see. I wouldn't be surprised if the show never addresses this again.
DKehoe
Member
Yeh, I didn't expect the series to give any sort of origin for the White Walkers but that one seems like something GRRM would give as one. They are an example of how conflict just leads to more conflict and isn't really a long term solution. That fits in with the themes he is writing about.
Cesare Borgia
Banned
The children creating the Others is not new or surprising
https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/4klqi7/spoilers_extended_the_books_already_told_us_who/
I'd imagine the way it's fully revealed in the book will be different. This also explains Martin's comment that the Others don't really have a culture. It makes sense that if they were created they'd simply mimick some of the behavior of their creators (the weird symbol they use in the show multiple times), as well as their origin race (they laugh in the book prologue).
I'm curious what their language is though. Language is culture...perhaps they don't have an original language and just speak a corrupted form of the old tongue?
https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/4klqi7/spoilers_extended_the_books_already_told_us_who/
I'd imagine the way it's fully revealed in the book will be different. This also explains Martin's comment that the Others don't really have a culture. It makes sense that if they were created they'd simply mimick some of the behavior of their creators (the weird symbol they use in the show multiple times), as well as their origin race (they laugh in the book prologue).
I'm curious what their language is though. Language is culture...perhaps they don't have an original language and just speak a corrupted form of the old tongue?
I really hope they don't fucking have Bran traveling back in time to make stuff that already happened, happen.
Bran becoming a character solely dedicated to orchestrating events that have already happened would be so fucking stupid. It would be a bunch of filler bullshit that serves no purpose.
I REALLY hope that time travel causal-loop for Hodor was a one time thing.
Pretty sure it's also a gross-over simplification of that story beat. It will probably be more involved in the books. They dedicated like 10 seconds to the origin of the white walkers in the show. wut
They're cutting story threads and characters at a breakneck pace, probably killed Summer in a quick and stupid manner to free up some CG budget.
Yea it's basically the Leviathan story from Mass Effect.
Cesare Borgia
Banned
Martin's hatred of Lost's last two seasons convinces me he will not make time travel the central factor of his end game. I'm sure Bran will see the past and perhaps influence something but I refuse to believe that he will be the catalyst for [insert multiple historical events] happening.
Still waiting for the books to finally get to the point where Bran travels far North into the origin point of the White Walkers, and they see a great ruined city with crumbing spires caked in ice... until they realize it isn't a city... but some sort of gigantic spaceship that crashed thousands of years ago. Do it GRRM.
WrenchNinja
Member
Duckroll is preston Jacobs huh
It all makes sense
It all makes sense
hydrophilic attack
Member
Yeah, it would just be really bad storytelling. I can't believe this is a popular theory.
Doing it this once with Hodor is a great character moment for Hodor and Bran. Doing it over and over again to explain major historic events would just be cheap
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
I thought it was fine. On the surface, it's similar to a lot of other bad guy race origins, but that's all we've seen so far.
Gabriel_Logan
Member
Buddy do I have a YouTube channel for you.
bodyofanamerican
Member
To be clear XAL, I'm in no way bagging on your opinion of the concept at all. But man, I think another layer of the quagmire GRRM finds himself in is having people's opinions on a likely streamlined version of this story floating out there now.
I hope he can keep plugging along with whatever he has planned.
Cornballer
Member
Onion A|V Club's Polite Fight video feature:
- Nitpicking that Hodor scene and getting weepy about it anyway
Also:
- WSJ: Inside Of Monsters and Mens Cameo on Game of Thrones
- Kimmel: Game of Thrones Producers Apologize for Hodor
- Nitpicking that Hodor scene and getting weepy about it anyway
Also:
- WSJ: Inside Of Monsters and Mens Cameo on Game of Thrones
- Kimmel: Game of Thrones Producers Apologize for Hodor
WaffleTaco
Wants to outlaw technological innovation.
Well it's a nuclear device gone wrong...with GRRM's current method twist of deconstructing tropes, it should be extremely interesting as to what happens.
Orochinagis
Member
Welcome to Mexico White walkers, literally
More deserts. So either Dany is still in Essos, or we're getting a lot of Dorne. Pick your poison.
Moff
Member
it's actually westeros, the others will freeze everything to death and the dragons will melt the ice and burn everything up, leaving only a desert
Cpt.Underpants
Member
I'd pluck my eyes out if we get the the-bad-pussay-brigade episodes
Cornballer
Member
- Watchers with a few pictures from the upcoming episode (please spoiler tag any discussion)
voko kord para-sites
End game is going to be at the Five Forts and the Grey Waste. Believe.
Those guys seem to have trouble following plot points.
The Three eyed raven told Bran that he could get lost in the visions. Cutting to "happy" Bran during the attack was evidence of him being stuck in the vision.
Preston Jacobs said White Walkers were biological weapons in his Big Picture series. It's excellent, as always.
CopperPuppy
Member
I'd love further exploration of this part of the world as much as anyone else, but is there a reason you suspect this?
It's GoT so given any crackpot theory, there's always a bunch of people who buy it.
Yeah people have talked about resurrection by Lord of Light actually being warging. Seems lame to me if all magic in this world comes back to either trees or to dragons.
Nah, Only wishful thinking. I've been enamored with the Far East ever since I read the World of Ice and Fire. I hope at least part of it is going to be part of the main story instead of only extremely good world building.
biosnake20
Member
Or maybe Bran has some visions of Valyria.
Show Valyria looked almost tropical though when Tyrion and Jorah sailed through it. Maybe Asshai? Asshai in my mind was always the sort of weird landscape you'd have to do through CG, but maybe that could work as a desert.
But really we're just theorizing to save ourselves from accepting the terrible truth that seasons 7 and 8 are going to be riddled with Dorne.
Maybe Dany starts her invasion from Dorne?
I would much prefer her to start from say Storms End/Kings Landing/The Eyrie, looking at the map. From those three, it should realistically be Storms End, which is also where Aegon starts his invasion so it would make sense to get back on track with the book there.
I think the Mereen story is rapidly finishing up, theres going to be one final battle and things will quickly wrap up. Admittedly I would like her to just go to Westeros now, like by next episode Euron/Theon (whoever arrives first) pretty much brings her the fleet, and we get to see Dany in westerns for the last 2 or 3 episodes this season.
I don't particularly like Dany though, in fact I hate her and I only want to see her in conflict with the characters I like, that itself would be fun to watch.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
The second mooooon!
biosnake20
Member
Finally we get to see Randyll Tarly. I wonder if he'll head to king's landing in the show as well.
Doom of Valyria.
Doom of Valyria.
pls no more dorne
PantherLotus
Professional Schmuck
Let me riff on this for a bit, and let's talk about the real endgame here and my (and many others', I suspect) theory that the the larger end-to-end theme of the futility of humanity.
-- People are freaking out about how often we might go to the Bran's time travels influencing past events thing, but what if that is itself the endgame? What if 'time is a flat circle' is the point here? It would certainly have a beautiful symmetry to it as we see that Bran's is the very first chapter of the series. Closing with a big Bran Was Behind It All And Can't Escape The Loop reveal/twist would be amazing!
-- Whether it's a spaceship, uncovering a Planet of the Apes-like scenario of an ancient, modern past, some of the whacker theories like this work all being in the mind of some delirious maester, whatever ... I think the key is that we're (through GRRM) actively unpacking fantasy tropes. To me I think that means whatever happens, we have to end up in a nihilistic sense of futility. Nothing matters because nothing exists.
-- (incoherent thought about the inside-out globe / clockwork map the show has chosen to use to represent the world and what that might mean for the endgame, if anything)
-- I dunno. I guess reject the anger with which people are approaching the Bran reveal because they're specifically falling into the fantasy tropes GRRM set out to destroy.
-- Also to another post above, I love the observation that the White Walkers are the unintended consequence of nuclear-type weapons. I love the symmetry of this with another similar observation, that Dany's dragons represent nuclear proliferation. What if the endgame is some endless back-and-forth existential ruinations upon this world? First dragons, then white walkers, then dragons, then something worse.. and an endless cycle of Atlantean falls from grace? (and letting Bran be the lens through which readers finally learn this?)
-- [Nuclear] Winter is coming, y'all.
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