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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 6

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Jayof9s

Member
I think it's weird people WANT to see people be murdered and act like it's writing 101 or something. Hope ya'll never watch a Hitchcock movie... or this show which has killed several people off camera already and paid it off to great effect w The Hound.

I think the point is that the show has made so many fake-outs (and George did too in the books) that no one really 'trusts' a death unless they see it. If there's a fake out maybe once or twice over the course of a long series it is effective. If you do it every other episode (okay, slight exaggeration - it felt like George did it just about every 3 chapters in the last 2 books though) it just becomes corny and stupid. It ruined Jon's death in the books for me because he'd fake killed off Arya, Tyrion at least three times each by then and multiple other characters (Davos, Bran/Rickon, Benjen, etc.) at least once.

The point is, unless you see them actually dead there's no point in believing it in the show or the books and it's stupid and leads to questions about every off-screen death.
 
We keep mention how Tyrion was wasted this season...but what about Varys? With a lack of acrid and meaty dialogue/conversations to have, plus little to do beyond boring bureaucracy, we feels really...well, neutered (you're welcome, D&D) compared to past seasons. Or just not as interesting.
 

SpaceWolf

Banned
We keep mention how Tyrion was wasted this season...but what about Varys? With a lack of acrid and meaty dialogue/conversations to have, plus little to do beyond boring bureaucracy, we feels really...well, neutered (you're welcome, D&D) compared to past seasons. Or just not as interesting.

I feel literally all of Varys screen-time this season has been in the service of Tyrion making dick jokes at his expense. His one scene with the new red priestess was fairly interesting, but that's been about it. Even his abrupt departure from Mereen felt flat. It's kind of astonishing, really.

He's been doing better than Arya at least.
 
Some people are predicting that ep 9 and 10 will be the great cull to accommodate for the shorter season 7 and 8.

I'd love to see them try and pull that off haha
I don't see the King's Landing plots having sufficiently strong momentum to make it happen by season's end, but I think basic plot necessity calls for Tommen dying really soon.

Maybe Varys shows up and just crossbows every single person except for Cersei and Margaery, lol.
 

CassSept

Member
We keep mention how Tyrion was wasted this season...but what about Varys? With a lack of acrid and meaty dialogue/conversations to have, plus little to do beyond boring bureaucracy, we feels really...well, neutered (you're welcome, D&D) compared to past seasons. Or just not as interesting.

Well, Varys was always a background character. A fascinating, brilliantly-played background character, but still.

Tyrion is one of the core characters of the series, a character beloved by the audience and Dinklage won two Emmys for his performance.

Different expectations, really. He was wasted, as had been the case for many supporting actors, so this will likely get less responses than Tyrion being wasted.
 

Jayof9s

Member
I feel literally all of Varys screen-time this season has been in the service of Tyrion making dick jokes at his expense. His one scene with the new red priestess was fairly interesting, but that's been about it. Even his abrupt departure from Mereen felt flat. It's kind of astonishing, really.

He's been doing better than Arya at least.

I do suspect he'll show up in Westeros in episode 10 to do something, even if it isn't assassinate Kevan like he did in the books. So hopefully he'll get some good dialog at that point.
 

mantidor

Member
Something I see frequently is that when the show omits something people assume it "leads anywhere" in the books, and this is simply not true. Take Arya and her warging for instance, in the books is pretty important for her training, in the show is just not there. Since the beginning the show has tried to tone down the more "magical" aspects, probably to distance itself from the genre perhaps? anyway, that's why LSH and warging are out, stuff like Jon resurrection, white walkers or the dragons have to be there, but the rest tries to be as far from fantasy as possible
 

duckroll

Member
In the books, Hardhome happens "offscreen", with only rumours and reports coming back to the Wall of what happened there. This plays into the strengths of the written medium, and especially so since we're learning of the events from an introvert and thinker like Jon. The books have the benefit of using mounting paranoia and fear of the unknown, because we have a direct link go the character's thoughts.

In the show, we don't have that luxury. What they did was twofold. Firstly, they focussed in on some of Jon's other qualities - his desire to do the right thing, and his leadership. Secondly, they used the strengths of the visual medium to translate something which had been communicated in a very "booky" language.

In short, they translated something which had relied on the facets of the written medium into something that effectively used the facets of the visual medium. It's quite literally an adaptation.

I think this is a fair viewpoint on a thematic level, and it's certainly somewhat true, but as far as the specific subject matter goes though, I disagree. Hardhome is not a cinematic adaptation of something that was alluded to in the books because it's either a completely different situation and context, or it simply hasn't happened yet.

In the books, the stories told of Hardhome are not about some huge battle between Wildlings and White Walkers, but rather about survival in the harsh wastes, clinging to hope of a prophecy, and people descending into madness. Cannibalism, looting, slavery, etc. It's about opportunists taking advantage of a broken people, and how Jon's goodwill mission found only the heart of darkness instead. It's not even remotely the same. It isn't something that just happened "off screen", it's something completely different.

Now it's possible that Tormund's mission to Hardhome in the books might be closer to what happened on the show, but that hasn't happened yet, so we have no idea!
 

Lonestar

I joined for Erin Brockovich discussion
at this rate, anyone think we see any more of Sam and Gilly this year? If so, is it just something to set up their storyline next season?
 
at this rate, anyone think we see any more of Sam and Gilly this year? If so, is it just something to set up their storyline next season?

Doubt we will this episode.

I bet we'll find out where he's headed in ep 10 to set up whatever is happening next season.

It's a shame, because the dinner scene was a highlight of the season and the characters/storyline finally got interesting.
 
All I know is that bran not giving a fuck that summer and hodor sacrificed themselves for him makes me sad. He was likely still in shock and we haven't seen him since besides that scene with butter fingers
 

Gigglepoo

Member
A magazine confirmed that in episode 9 (SPOILERS)
Yara/Theon make it to Mereen.

Yeah, that's pretty obvious. Are they really going to
wrap up the Siege of Meereen in 15 minutes, though? Or will it spill into next season? I assume the former which is crazy considering how much space that takes up in the books. Of course, when you remove Selmy and the POVs in the mercenary squads, there's no much chance to expand on what's happening.
 

Lonestar

I joined for Erin Brockovich discussion
You know, as soon as the ships showed up in Mereen, I fully expected D&D made Euron's brand new fleet (made out of the Iron Island's 3 trees) show up, for "reasons."
 

Gigglepoo

Member
For the people who think characters on the show won't matter in the books, do you think Selmy's storyline isn't important? He organizes a coup, imprisons the king, and is leading the Meereen forces against the besiegers.
 
So a friend just posted a crackpot theory on Facebook that's getting a lot of buzz.

Since we probably aren't getting Lady Stoneheart proper, she suggests that maybe they could be setting Sansa up to be a stand-in. After trusting Littlefinger to save the day he betrays her and she dies. Thoros and Beric and The Hound are all conveniently headed that way so maybe they stumble upon her corpse and Beric gives his light to her.

Doubt it happens but I wouldn't mind Lady Sansaheart.
 

Speevy

Banned
So a friend just posted a crackpot theory on Facebook that's getting a lot of buzz.

Since we probably aren't getting Lady Stoneheart proper, she suggests that maybe they could be setting Sansa up to be a stand-in. After trusting Littlefinger to save the day he betrays her and she dies. Thoros and Beric and The Hound are all conveniently headed that way so maybe they stumble upon her corpse and Beric gives his light to her.

Doubt it happens but I wouldn't mind Lady Sansaheart.

Who the hell is left to betray Sansa to?
 

Gigglepoo

Member
Sansa ain't dying!

She said as much in an interview before the season aired. Something to the extent of "I flipped through the script and was happy I survived. Of course, I do think she likes messing with us... but I honestly think she and Jon are safe. Everyone else up North is going to die.
 
For the people who think characters on the show won't matter in the books, do you think Selmy's storyline isn't important? He organizes a coup, imprisons the king, and is leading the Meereen forces against the besiegers.

My guess that in the books he will get betrayed and die during the battle at the beginning of TWoW, basically completely ensuring Mereen will be in total chaos whenever Dany gerts back.
 

Freshmaker

I am Korean.
My guess that in the books he will get betrayed and die during the battle at the beginning of TWoW, basically completely ensuring Mereen will be in total chaos whenever Dany gerts back.

I wonder. Selmy is the one guy who could lend Dany a real air of legitimacy to Westeros. Her other Westeros connections are rather sketchy in terms of rallying public support. Him dying wouldn't accomplish much relative to the overall story.
 

Cromwell

Banned
Assuming Jon wins the battle this Sunday, I'm curious how much different it all plays out in the books. I can definitely see a situation where Stannis wins against Ramsay, takes Winterfell, but then through circumstances Jon ends up in Winterfell with Stannis dead through some other means. It could all go very very differently and that has me excited.
 

Moff

Member
Assuming Jon wins the battle this Sunday, I'm curious how much different it all plays out in the books. I can definitely see a situation where Stannis wins against Ramsay, takes Winterfell, but then through circumstances Jon ends up in Winterfell with Stannis dead through some other means. It could all go very very differently and that has me excited.

I don't see how jon is revived with stannis still being alive, I think it's kind of crucial that jon is the new and real chosen of R'hllor
 

Gigglepoo

Member
I wonder. Selmy is the one guy who could lend Dany a real air of legitimacy to Westeros. Her other Westeros connections are rather sketchy in terms of rallying public support. Him dying wouldn't accomplish much relative to the overall story.

Is Dany going to be seen as legitimate? I thought that's where Aegon came in. He's the kingly one, the legitimate ruler of Westeros, whereas Dany will be seen as an evil conqueror. That's my guess anyway. Who knows?
 

LAUGHTREY

Modesty becomes a woman
I don't see how jon is revived with stannis still being alive, I think it's kind of crucial that jon is the new and real chosen of R'hllor

I think it's more important that Jon is released from his nights watch vows than whatever reason he is revived.
 

Massa

Member
Assuming Jon wins the battle this Sunday, I'm curious how much different it all plays out in the books. I can definitely see a situation where Stannis wins against Ramsay, takes Winterfell, but then through circumstances Jon ends up in Winterfell with Stannis dead through some other means. It could all go very very differently and that has me excited.

If Stannis succeeds there's no reason for Jon to leave the Night's Watch and go south. Stannis will definitely die in the books.
 

John Dunbar

correct about everything
I think it's more important that Jon is released from his nights watch vows than whatever reason he is revived.

i've always thought that jon snow pulling a jesus just to get out of a vow is stupid. if he thinks that getting out of the watch through a technicality is cool then the vow wasn't all that important to begin with.
 

Moff

Member
i've always thought that jon snow pulling a jesus just to get out of a vow is stupid. if he thinks that getting out of the watch through a technicality is cool then the vow wasn't all that important to begin with.

I think it's more important that Jon is released from his nights watch vows than whatever reason he is revived.

what you are both forgetting is that it's not jons decision he is being revived, it's melisandre. and she needs to realize or be shown that stannis is dead and not the chosen one to revive jon
 
If Stannis succeeds there's no reason for Jon to leave the Night's Watch and go south. Stannis will definitely die in the books.

He was just killed by the NW. I doubt he gets revived and says "I'm going to stay here at the Wall fellas." He'll go to Winterfell for some reason or another. Perhaps to visit the crypt, perhaps to lead an army.
 

Violater

Member
i've always thought that jon snow pulling a jesus just to get out of a vow is stupid. if he thinks that getting out of the watch through a technicality is cool then the vow wasn't all that important to begin with.

They killed him, that seemed to be a good enough reason.
 

John Dunbar

correct about everything
what you are both forgetting is that it's not jons decision he is being revived, it's melisandre. and she needs to realize or be shown that stannis is dead and not the chosen one to revive jon

based on what i remember, even without stannis dying mel seems to think jon snow is important. and if the pink letter is fake then she might think stannis is dead even if he is not.

They killed him, that seemed to be a good enough reason.

sure, but i'm saying that the vow itself should not have been affected.

"hey, aren't you supposed to be at the wall?"
"no, i died and came back, so it's cool."

i feel that the night's watch ending is the only legit way jon snow gets out of his vows.
 

Cromwell

Banned
If Stannis succeeds there's no reason for Jon to leave the Night's Watch and go south. Stannis will definitely die in the books.

I'm not saying Stannis won't die, just that it wouldn't be at the hands of Ramsay. Stannis losing that battle just doesn't make sense to me given what we know about him as a commander, it makes more sense that he beats the Bolton's and then dies after for some other reason. Jon was already preparing to go south before he got backstabbed, but the letter that prompted that might have been bullshit.
 
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