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US House votes to adopt AHCA (Republican health care); bill moves to Senate

This is really quite terrifying to read.

From a personal side, this could also impact my own mother who suffers from secondary progressive multiple sclerosis. Really worried about that.

What enrages me here is that people are so caught up in the notion of repealing "Obamacare" that they don't really seem to give a shit how it's done. Trump said it was bad so we want it gone - no matter what that means. It's just stupid.

They should be working to improve the ACA - try to work on its problems rather than presenting this piece of trash that's taking so many steps back. It's ludicrous.

Having listened to people that want to get rid of the ACA, it seems to always come back to money - they do not feel that they should have to give a cent to anyone else. The idea of subsidizing healthcare for others makes them so angry. In turn, they are quick to vilify those in need and come up with reasons why they don't deserve help. This thought pattern is really disturbing.

Well, let's be fair here, this is not just a Trump thing. The GOP, in general, has been pounding their chests for repealing Obamacare pretty much since it came into existence. Even if there was another GOP in the White House, we would still be here.
 
Having listened to people that want to get rid of the ACA, it seems to always come back to money - they do not feel that they should have to give a cent to anyone else. The idea of subsidizing healthcare for others makes them so angry. In turn, they are quick to vilify those in need and come up with reasons why they don't deserve help. This thought pattern is really disturbing.
I asked my dad if he realized that he hurt his own children by voting republican. He didnt and wont; see, repealing Obamacare means lower taxes (so we dont have to support illegals) so the government will take less of our money thus it's all good for us.
 

Foffy

Banned
This is really quite terrifying to read.

From a personal side, this could also impact my own mother who suffers from secondary progressive multiple sclerosis. Really worried about that.

What enrages me here is that people are so caught up in the notion of repealing "Obamacare" that they don't really seem to give a shit how it's done. Trump said it was bad so we want it gone - no matter what that means. It's just stupid.

They should be working to improve the ACA - try to work on its problems rather than presenting this piece of trash that's taking so many steps back. It's ludicrous.

Having listened to people that want to get rid of the ACA, it seems to always come back to money - they do not feel that they should have to give a cent to anyone else. The idea of subsidizing healthcare for others makes them so angry. In turn, they are quick to vilify those in need and come up with reasons why they don't deserve help. This thought pattern is really disturbing.

This pattern of American thought is the highlight of dualism.

What beliefs do the average person get indoctrinated with that assert divisions, and thus use those divisions to normalize the suffering of others? One's theology and the other economic, and I promise you that the sociopaths you speak of believe in both souls and neoliberal commodification to some deep level. These beliefs, or moral and social, are really the bedrock to the problems of this line of thought almost in full.

A just God and a just market -- both abstractions of thought and too pigshitted to really be legit -- fix all ills. This is how you see literal parasites in office claim that if you simply live a "good way of life" you'll never get a preexisting condition. They're literally applying bootstrapping, free will logic to getting tinnitus or cancer.

There is always a way of finding a way to normalize the suffering of the other when caught in dualistic thinking, because it normalizes the fact that divisions themselves create the arena where conflict, and thus suffering, occur. It constantly spirals itself into deeper and deeper claims of isolationism, to justify the divisions. People really double down on violent thinking and normalize it as just, and for any person to do this, they are likely a threat to others. The GOP is this as a political body: they are, simply put, a greater threat to the American people than ISIS, and there is no hyperbole in my claims here.

ISIS mostly strikes fear into the hearts of Americans, with their claims of a state of oppression and violence. The GOP actually enacts policies that create oppression and violence.
 

blackflag

Member
fuck this shit is really going to pass tomorrow. i know it wont pass senate but still it will look like a win for Dumpster regardless.
 

Pyrokai

Member
I'm calling my rep guest thing in the morning.


I'm so afraid. Terrified. So many loved ones with pre-existing conditions :(
 

digdug2k

Member
This is really quite terrifying to read.

From a personal side, this could also impact my own mother who suffers from secondary progressive multiple sclerosis. Really worried about that.

What enrages me here is that people are so caught up in the notion of repealing "Obamacare" that they don't really seem to gilegiti said it was bad so we want it gone - no matter what that means. It's just stupid.

They should be working to improve the ACA - try to work on its problems rather than presenting this piece of trash that's taking so many steps back. It's ludicrous.

Having listened to people that want to get rid of the ACA, it seems to always come back to money - they do not feel that they should have to give a cent to anyone else. The idea of subsidizing healthcare for others makes them so angry. In turn, they are quick to vilify those in need and come up with reasons why they don't deserve help. This thought pattern is really disturbing.
Trump said that he'd ensure pre-existing conditions were covered and that everyone had new even better insurance afterward. People believe the shit that came and still comes out of his mouth. Seriously, they do. It makes no sense, but they do. They still believe it even after it's proven a lie. He's still touring the press saying the same things this week. But thank God we didn't elect a liar.
 

digdug2k

Member
Has a Republican ever lost their seat due to facts? They're been screwing the common voter for decades, and they're still in power. You really think a few million people going bankrupt from healthcare costs is going to matter? Fox News has programmed these people to blame themselves.
I think this will hit home for them more. I've seen a lot more "my kid with down syndrome depends on this" posts in the last few days. Unfortunately they'll probably just "fix" the bill by adding some child friendly language rather than actually fixing it. The real goal here is to fuck over minorities and non conservative women (you know the lazy people who we all know it's their own fault for all their problems) not white folks.
 
I don't give a shit if your Uncle Joe is a decent guy, aside from the voting for a lunatic racist birther who wants to strip me of my health coverage so the richest people in this country can buy a 10th vacation home.

I've already let my own mother have it for hopping on board with it and thinking it's okay to do this to me, or even worse so to my low functioning autistic younger brother who relies on these kind of programs to be able to survive.

I'm so sorry for you and your brother.

My 3 year old son is autistic, and I am agonizing about the slightest prospect of this passing in any way that makes it closer to a reality.

These people are scum. If they make my son and millions of other Americans suffer, they will reap the fucking hell they deserve.
 
I asked my dad if he realized that he hurt his own children by voting republican. He didnt and wont; see, repealing Obamacare means lower taxes (so we dont have to support illegals) so the government will take less of our money thus it's all good for us.

How old is your father? Because the real way to get through to him is to mention that his premium is going to skyrocket. If he pays for insurance privately, he's screwed. This risk pool idea is fucking terrible.
 

Maiden Voyage

Gold™ Member
This is really quite terrifying to read.

From a personal side, this could also impact my own mother who suffers from secondary progressive multiple sclerosis. Really worried about that.

What enrages me here is that people are so caught up in the notion of repealing "Obamacare" that they don't really seem to give a shit how it's done. Trump said it was bad so we want it gone - no matter what that means. It's just stupid.

They should be working to improve the ACA - try to work on its problems rather than presenting this piece of trash that's taking so many steps back. It's ludicrous.

Having listened to people that want to get rid of the ACA, it seems to always come back to money - they do not feel that they should have to give a cent to anyone else. The idea of subsidizing healthcare for others makes them so angry. In turn, they are quick to vilify those in need and come up with reasons why they don't deserve help. This thought pattern is really disturbing.

My own mother's health is failing. She's on disability and can no longer work. She has no way of ever paying off the medical help she is getting. It's ridiculous that the most prosperous nation in the history of human kind can't take care of our sick. I can't even begin to fathom how terrible people's lives will be if this bill passes.
 

FyreWulff

Member
This is really quite terrifying to read.

From a personal side, this could also impact my own mother who suffers from secondary progressive multiple sclerosis. Really worried about that.

What enrages me here is that people are so caught up in the notion of repealing "Obamacare" that they don't really seem to give a shit how it's done. Trump said it was bad so we want it gone - no matter what that means. It's just stupid.

They should be working to improve the ACA - try to work on its problems rather than presenting this piece of trash that's taking so many steps back. It's ludicrous.

Having listened to people that want to get rid of the ACA, it seems to always come back to money - they do not feel that they should have to give a cent to anyone else. The idea of subsidizing healthcare for others makes them so angry. In turn, they are quick to vilify those in need and come up with reasons why they don't deserve help. This thought pattern is really disturbing.

it's so stupid because people forget how powerful taxes are. when everyone splits the money then helping someone get a surgery costs you like 0.00000003 cents.
 

FStubbs

Member
This is really quite terrifying to read.

From a personal side, this could also impact my own mother who suffers from secondary progressive multiple sclerosis. Really worried about that.

What enrages me here is that people are so caught up in the notion of repealing "Obamacare" that they don't really seem to give a shit how it's done. Trump said it was bad so we want it gone - no matter what that means. It's just stupid.

They should be working to improve the ACA - try to work on its problems rather than presenting this piece of trash that's taking so many steps back. It's ludicrous.

Having listened to people that want to get rid of the ACA, it seems to always come back to money - they do not feel that they should have to give a cent to anyone else. The idea of subsidizing healthcare for others makes them so angry. In turn, they are quick to vilify those in need and come up with reasons why they don't deserve help. This thought pattern is really disturbing.

Because they feel those in need might be black.
 
I wish I had time to protest my congressman's office this morning. It would be cathartic, my anger needs a release. Hopefully it will be for nothing and they'll pull the vote again.
 

Maiden Voyage

Gold™ Member
I wish I had time to protest my congressman's office this morning. It would be cathartic, my anger needs a release. Hopefully it will be for nothing and they'll pull the vote again.

Every elected official in my state is a Republican. Even if I called, they're so far right it wouldn't register. I am hopeful that by the time die, the state might turn purple since the rural areas are dwindling and the more populated areas are "liberal". Center-right is probably a more apt description, but here, anything less than Hannity-level conservative is considered liberal.
 
Every elected official in my state is a Republican. Even if I called, they're so far right it wouldn't register. I am hopeful that by the time die, the state might turn purple since the rural areas are dwindling and the more populated areas are "liberal". Center-right is probably a more apt description, but here, anything less than Hannity-level conservative is considered liberal.

I'm in the same situation, but I still called. It doesn't really help in the grand scheme of things, but I don't know, makes you feel better for about 2 seconds.
 

robochimp

Member
it's so stupid because people forget how powerful taxes are. when everyone splits the money then helping someone get a surgery costs you like 0.00000003 cents.

Taxes don't even pay for anything, they're a means of controlling economic activity. Every time someone says "but we need to find a way to pay for it" should be asked why the country hasn't fallen apart with 20 trillion in "debt".
 
Taxes don't even pay for anything, they're a means of controlling economic activity. Every time someone says "but we need to find a way to pay for it" should be asked why the country hasn't fallen apart with 20 trillion in "debt".

Come again? Are you a MMT proponent by any means?
 

Diablos

Member
This is really quite terrifying to read.

From a personal side, this could also impact my own mother who suffers from secondary progressive multiple sclerosis. Really worried about that.

What enrages me here is that people are so caught up in the notion of repealing "Obamacare" that they don't really seem to give a shit how it's done. Trump said it was bad so we want it gone - no matter what that means. It's just stupid.

They should be working to improve the ACA - try to work on its problems rather than presenting this piece of trash that's taking so many steps back. It's ludicrous.

Having listened to people that want to get rid of the ACA, it seems to always come back to money - they do not feel that they should have to give a cent to anyone else. The idea of subsidizing healthcare for others makes them so angry. In turn, they are quick to vilify those in need and come up with reasons why they don't deserve help. This thought pattern is really disturbing.
Well stated. The most disturbing thing to me is they are operating under the guise of not repealing but replacing. This talking point puts many people at ease but then they don't realize it's actually worse than outright repeal. On top of that they want to kick the can down the road until 2020. Americans have short memories and the GOP are masters of propaganda. Gives them plenty of time to deflect blame from themselves for trashing the health care industry and ruining the quality of life for so many Americans.

Republicans are evil. Literally evil when I see the tactics and policies they are pushing here. What they're doing and HOW they are doing it is some extremely disturbing next level type of legislating here. This isn't a Republican Party. They're fascists waging war on anyone who is sick, injured or born with any kind of condition.

That we even have representatives like Chaffetz getting surgery for a pre-existing condition and then rushing back to the capitol to take away having that kind of security for most other Americans is so perverse I can't find the right words to express it. They're predators. They're putting the language right in the bill that they want the ACA's protections for themselves but no one else. They're basically fucking people while they're awake and they're going to pass that through the House at the very least.
 

Measley

Junior Member
Not to mention this thing gives tax cuts to millionaires and congress is exempt from this.

That's really the only reason this is getting pushed through. Trump's tax reform doesn't work with those Obamacare taxes on wealthier Americans in place.
 
https://www.majorityleader.gov/daily-schedule/

You'll have to click on the calendar for today, the 4th, to see. It looks like it is on the top of the agenda.

Edit: Top of the agenda after they make themselves exempt, of course because fuck everyone that's not in the House or Senate.

Ridiculous. There should be a public mandate that they need to pass something that they are willing to take part in. How anyone is a Republican is beyond me...
 

Blackage

Member
I feel like it's inevitable that they're gonna pass something on Healthcare.

The last bill they tried to pass literally failed because you had Republicans who are awful trying to pass an awful bill, and then it failed not because it was bad, but because even worse awful Republicans wanted an even worse and more conservative bill.

Their entire process has been trying to convince shitty human beings that their shitty bill can be shittier, but they have to play ball with the shitty shit they already have.

Democrats are a non-factor until 2018, and even that's up in the air from everything I keep hearing. So you basically have to hope/pray that the shitty humans and the ultra shitty humans keep bickering about how much they want to fuck everyone untilt hen.
 

RPGCrazied

Member
No Congressional Budget Score
No reading of bill
No public comment
Healthcare affects 1/6 of economy
Exemptions for Congress


Sounds like something Republicans would do.
 
Urgh, and when it does pass there's going to be so much gloating from those who said it was going to pass the multiple times, but whatever, that's not the important part of this anyway, but it's going to be annoying. Something to wait for.
 

RPGCrazied

Member
Urgh, and when it does pass there's going to be so much gloating from those who said it was going to pass the multiple times, but whatever, that's not the important part of this anyway, but it's going to be annoying. Something to wait for.

Yep. So not waiting on that Trump tweet storm about this win. I get mildly nauseous thinking about it.
 

Steejee

Member
If you have any sort of chronic condition I recommend moving ASAP to a state that actually gives a shit about your well being, eg MA, CA, etc.

This has a hard path to get anywhere in the Senate, but never underestimate the ability of the GOP to do the shittiest thing possible for everyone.
 

ahoyhoy

Unconfirmed Member
Urgh, and when it does pass there's going to be so much gloating from those who said it was going to pass the multiple times, but whatever, that's not the important part of this anyway, but it's going to be annoying. Something to wait for.

Well they've changed it so much in the last few weeks that the original point of the law, to save money, hardly seems to apply any more. I don't think we need the GSO score to see that their cost saving measures have been annihilated by ammendments.
 

Vlaphor

Member
Called my local representative, Lynn Jenkins (Kansas representative) and the mailbox was full. Couldn't leave a message, but maybe this is a good sign. It's still Kansas, so I'm not getting my hopes up though.
 

Steejee

Member
Why does everyone think moving is just so easy? Its really not.

It's a lot easier than losing your insurance.

I've moved cross country twice, both times on my own, and live an 8 hour drive from most of my family. It wasn't easy either time, and after the first time I had all of $14 to my name at one point, but I've done far harder things. Most of the states that will preserve healthcare have good job markets - up here in MA, particularly in the Boston area, companies are basically begging for workers. Cost of living is high, but you get a lot in return.
 

Krakatoa

Member
Called my local representative, Lynn Jenkins (Kansas representative) and the mailbox was full. Couldn't leave a message, but maybe this is a good sign. It's still Kansas, so I'm not getting my hopes up though.

Full mailbox is bullshit. I know I used to do at work when I never wanted to get hassled :) Do these idiots have emails?
 
If you have any sort of chronic condition I recommend moving ASAP to a state that actually gives a shit about your well being, eg MA, CA, etc.

Definitely. Starting tomorrow my fiancee goes on short term disability and we're using that time to explore living arrangements. She's only 30 but is post bi-lat lung transplant and her cocktail of drugs have proven ruinous to her kidneys and are causing debilitating headaches. Have explored CA and her hopping on Medicaid but if this manages to get past the Senate then we're screwed there too, unless of course CA can fill the gap that AHCA would blow in Medicaid funding. MA would be the last, best hope. Or overseas.

So fucking irate.
 

tbm24

Member
I asked my dad if he realized that he hurt his own children by voting republican. He didnt and wont; see, repealing Obamacare means lower taxes (so we dont have to support illegals) so the government will take less of our money thus it's all good for us.
My friend's brother had a tumor removed thanks to the ACA and his father still stumps around saying Obamacare was the worse thing to happen to him.
 

ahoyhoy

Unconfirmed Member
I asked my dad if he realized that he hurt his own children by voting republican. He didnt and wont; see, repealing Obamacare means lower taxes (so we dont have to support illegals) so the government will take less of our money thus it's all good for us.

Seems like the thought process is "if I get more money it must be good for everyone else too" and their brains won't accept anything that contradicts that.
 
Well they've changed it so much in the last few weeks that the original point of the law, to save money, hardly seems to apply any more. I don't think we need the GSO score to see that their cost saving measures have been annihilated by ammendments.

I realize that, I was just saying, I'm not looking forward to the smugness and extreme pessimism that's bound to follow more than anything, but it is what it is.
 

ahoyhoy

Unconfirmed Member
I realize that, I was just saying, I'm not looking forward to the smugness and extreme pessimism that's bound to follow more than anything, but it is what it is.

Eh. It's a shit Win. And once the GSO comes out and people realized that their rep voted for a bill that will cost millions insurance it might turn out to be a poisoned chalice too.
 

BriGuy

Member
So this $8 billion pool... is that per state or per year, because there's no chance in hell of making that stretch to cover the entire country for five or ten years. It would be hard pressed to cover the first 12 months.
 

Steejee

Member
Eh. It's a shit Win. And once the GSO comes out and people realized that their rep voted for a bill that will cost millions insurance it might turn out to be a poisoned chalice too.

My hope is that this dies in the senate, and then in midterms this nightmare of a bill gets hung on the neck of everyone who voted for it.

So this $8 billion pool... is that per state or per year, because there's no chance in hell of making that stretch to cover the entire country for five or ten years. It would be hard pressed to cover the first 12 months.

It's countrywide over 5 years, so $1.65 billion/yr or so. That's on top of the existing pool that was in the bill ($100 billion? I don't recall over how many years). That part has already been slammed pretty thoroughly as a garbage addition, and fuck knows why such a trivial amount would have flipped any votes when no policy changes occurred. I think the people that flipped from that just wanted to say they negotiated in a better deal.
 

McBryBry

Member
If you have any sort of chronic condition I recommend moving ASAP to a state that actually gives a shit about your well being, eg MA, CA, etc.

This has a hard path to get anywhere in the Senate, but never underestimate the ability of the GOP to do the shittiest thing possible for everyone.

Live in Illinois, work in Missouri. Girlfriend works in Illinois. I feel like I never know how this state is gonna go. I have rare spurts of asthma but her Crohn's is what has me worried.
 
Eh. It's a shit Win. And once the GSO comes out and people realized that their rep voted for a bill that will cost millions insurance it might turn out to be a poisoned chalice too.

We can hope. I'm not going to lie, I'm still super nervous about the Senate. Most except it won't go through, but McConnell really seems like he has a much firmer grip on the Senate and I can see it going through potentially since this reconciliation period is so close to have a 'win.'
 
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