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[IrishNinja]

I agree with a lot of what is said in this thread, and think that TPAB should have gotten the Album award, but going off about how he 'got nothing, business as usual' is just bullshit. He came away with multiple awards and put on what was easily the most impactful performance of the show.

And as I have said earlier, trying to solely narrow this down to a problem with Hip Hop just seems short-sighted. Plenty of other genres suffer just as much or even more when it comes to representation.

I really just don't see it as some evil bias against Hip Hop, but a heavy bias FOR pop.
There is a difference there, even if the results are the same. At least in my opinion.

It takes genres a long time to get acceptance into the Grammy's. At least Rap music has a variety of categories and has always gone to legitimate Rap Artists for the most part. Compare that to Metal\Hard Rock--which has always been a crapshoot. Jethro Tull won (because they had a flute) the first Metal Grammy, beating out ...And Justice For All by Metallica, which is considered one of the greatest Metal Albums ever.

On top of that there was the Best Hard Rock/Metal Performance Category that fucking Foo Fighters won over Dream Theater, Mastodon, and Megadeth--also hilariously Sum 41. Granted the second time they did it the next year it was actually given to a Metal Band (Halestorm).

There is still the Best Metal Performance Category that basically is the Metallica Category after the aforementioned 1989 nonsense. Look at the list and you'll notice Metallica basically wins whenever they are nominated, and for the other years it's usually a Hard Rock band beating out a few Metal bands. My favorite is the year a Live version of a 29 year old song beat out 4 Industrial artists (2000). Oh, and last year Tenacious D won, they might as well have been nominating Deathklok at that point...

to the former post: yeah, kdot tore it down with his performance; that's what he does. a few throaway awards don't change the narrative.

but you both make solid points that this isn't limited to hip hop alone - as a big fan of the genre, i acknowledge this (though the 2nd post had so me great examples), in my mind it's all the worse since, again, literally the biggest names on most top 10 lists never saw a nomination, much less winning. i'm perfectly okay with them being a joke in other genres.

 

[leatherhat]

Fans of every other genre (besides pop) are wondering how they can have the same "problem" that hip hop does of multiple performances and awards and actual research into the genre during the nominating process.

 

[BudokaiMR2]

to the former post: yeah, kdot tore it down with his performance; that's what he does. a few throaway awards don't change the narrative.

but you both make solid points that this isn't limited to hip hop alone - as a big fan of the genre, i acknowledge this (though the 2nd post had so me great examples), in my mind it's all the worse since, again, literally the biggest names on most top 10 lists never saw a nomination, much less winning. i'm perfectly okay with them being a joke in other genres.

Yeah, I totally understand. I listened to some Heavy Metal when I lived in Illinois for a couple of years because the people around me did, but I really know little about most genres outside of Rap/Hip Hop. Rap has always been my go-to genre for music. So just like you those slights catch my attention all the more.

I just feel like limiting the discussions without looking at the overall picture will diminish the overall discussion, which is important.

It is easy to just write the grammys off as a joke, but they are still relevant for the people trying to make a living in the music industry.

 

[Protome]

I was a rock head before I even gave Hiphop a shot.

Drones is garbage compared to what Kendrick put out. Same retread of what Muse has been doing for a decade

I really enjoyed Drones because it felt like a return to form after how bad/forgettable every song in 2nd Law was except for Panic Station but I can also understand that stand.

THE REAL ISSUE HERE was Halestorm not even getting mentioned in any of the Rock categories. Into The Wild Life is crazy good, removing the Hard Rock categories means bands like them get completely ignored now.

At least Wolf Alice got a nod though. Saw them live last year and they were crazy good.

 

[IrishNinja]

It is easy to just write the grammys off as a joke, but they are still relevant for the people trying to make a living in the music industry.

likewise, i can appreciate this too - i'm using it only as a metric for quality as an end user, you know? like, the oscars have their problems, but i can't lie when i say directors/films/actors & actresses winning might cause me to look at something i might not've otherwise; grammy's simply don't give such call for me.

They didn't even nominate Run The Jewels 2 for a single award, it's one of the most critically acclaimed albums of 2014 (and it was in the voting timeframe for this years grammys).

easily my 2014 AOTY, yeah - but i just don't know the extent that they were even aware of it. same feeling when macklemore won over GKMC....TPAB at least raised waves in enough circles that they had to consider it, i figure

 

[BudokaiMR2]

likewise, i can appreciate this too - i'm using it only as a metric for quality as an end user, you know? like, the oscars have their problems, but i can't lie when i say directors/films/actors & actresses winning might cause me to look at something i might not've otherwise; grammy's simply don't give such call for me.

Yeah, this is why I hold out some naive hope that nowadays something might actually change. However, it really is just like the Oscars. The issues with the awards are just a symptom of a much larger problem with the industry as a whole.

 

[Glass Rebel]

The Grammys are irrelevant to hip-hop culture anyway. I mean, it's nice to have some form of acknowledgment from the most prestigious (lol) music awards but it's not gonna affect anyone's tastes or anything within the genre to any meaningful degree because by now everybody knows that they're just getting bones thrown by people who don't listen to the music.

 

[Catvoca]

easily my 2014 AOTY, yeah - but i just don't know the extent that they were even aware of it. same feeling when macklemore won over GKMC....TPAB at least raised waves in enough circles that they had to consider it, i figure

Yeah, I was just replying to the guy saying their nominations were pretty terrible and agreeing with him. I mean for some people this was Future's year and not seeming him get a rap album nomination is crazy, RTJ2 was literally the third best reviewed album that year, Summertime 06 was the second best reviewed hip-hop album this year (this is from albumoftheyear.org btw.). It just shows how out of touch the Grammy's really are with not just the mainstream listening audience, but also critics.

 

[Affeinvasion]

Yeah, I was just replying to the guy saying their nominations were pretty terrible and agreeing with him. I mean for some people this was Future's year and not seeming him get a rap album nomination is crazy, RTJ2 was literally the third best reviewed album that year, Summertime 06 was the second best reviewed hip-hop album this year (this is from albumoftheyear.org btw.). It just shows how out of touch the Grammy's really are with not just the mainstream listening audience, but also critics.

Honestly the grammy's are probably more in line with mainstream listening audiences than critics are.

 

[Catvoca]

Honestly the grammy's are probably more in line with mainstream listening audiences than critics are.

You'd think that but then Beck wins over Beyonce and you're like "What are these awards supposed to be?"

 

[Carcetti]

1989 wouldn't even make a top 20 list for me and I'm not afraid to put pop in among the Father John Mistys and Sufjan Stevens. Grimes' Art Angels and Carly Rae Jepsen's EMOTION are both worthy pop albums that are comfortably better than 1989.

As for TPAB? I mean it's absolute brilliance. Artistry. Losing to 1989 doesn't mean shit, and the Grammys are a joke anyway.

Yes, this. So much this.

 

[DontBeThatGuy]

Not winning a shitty Grammy should be a cause of celebration for any artist of worth. *sips latte*.

 

[Diprosalic]

1989 is a good album. TPAB is better but it wasn't a robbery. TSwizzle also sells like crazy, the music industry needs her.

 

[Affeinvasion]

You'd think that but then Beck wins over Beyonce and you're like "What are these awards supposed to be?"

Something weird happening every once in a while doesn't eliminate the overall trend.

 

[kitchenmotors]

1989 is a good album. TPAB is better but it wasn't a robbery. TSwizzle also sells like crazy, the music industry needs her.

1989 is decent at best. Art Angels and E•MO•TION are the better pop albums of 2015. But it's fucking Taylor Swift, so it's basically a popularity contest.

I know, I know... the Grammys are a joke. But for an awards show that wants people to take them seriously, especially with their bullshit anti-streaming service PSA, they should look at the way they award some of these artists.

Out of everyone for AOTY, Kendrick should have won, hands down. And I didn't even enjoy the album that much.

 

[FUBAR McDangles]

The grammys arevvery specific and skewed toward mainstream pop.

How often are country albums nominated for album of the year? How often is a country song nominated for record of the year? Almost guarantee it is at par with hip hop or less than that. And no, Taylor Swift hasn't counted as a country artist since her second or third album.

Rock hardly gets a mention anymore either.

Obviously you can factor in racism and classism and whatever other ism you want for hip hop, but it is pretty obvious whoever decides nominations just doesn't give a fuck about anything that isn't pop.

 

[LionPride]

I really enjoyed Drones because it felt like a return to form after how bad/forgettable every song in 2nd Law was except for Panic Station but I can also understand that stand.

THE REAL ISSUE HERE was Halestorm not even getting mentioned in any of the Rock categories. Into The Wild Life is crazy good, removing the Hard Rock categories means bands like them get completely ignored now.

At least Wolf Alice got a nod though. Saw them live last year and they were crazy good.

I did not enjoy Into the Wild Life as much as I enjoyed their previous albums for some reason. Maybe it's just me

 

[PillarEN]

The Grammy's have always been a joke for any pop culture relevant category for as long as I can remember. Doesn't even mean anything when an artist I do like wins something there. They seem to only give proper thought to stuff like "Music for Visual Media" or "Package" or "Producer". The stuff that won't ever be seen online or twitter. The popular awards are just popularity contests and nothing more. I mean just looking at the Rock category this year... it's a label war, not a quality war.

 

[SomTervo]

1989 wouldn't even make a top 20 list for me and I'm not afraid to put pop in among the Father John Mistys and Sufjan Stevens. Grimes' Art Angels and Carly Rae Jepsen's EMOTION are both worthy pop albums that are comfortably better than 1989.

As for TPAB? I mean it's absolute brilliance. Artistry. Losing to 1989 doesn't mean shit, and the Grammys are a joke anyway.

Well said.

All of the records in this thread are good records, but TPAB is something special. It's a cut above.

 

[Cesare Borgia]

The Grammy's are important for the artist's career, even though I personally do not see it as a measure of quality, winning (especially in a major category) has the potential to be significant for their career and even the genre overall (as is the case here).

And yet hip hop is one of the most dominant and influential genres of music despite not winning any major Grammy awards. No one is being persecuted or hurt here, I really don't see why there is confusion over old people not giving the genre awards.

Hip hop doesn't need validation from the Grammys.

 

[Gattsu25]

Newsflash. The Grammy's are garbage and it has nothing to do with race or genre. It is about being part of the established music industry machine.

In 1991, The Grammy for Album of the Year went to "Back on the Block," a compilation album by producer Quincy Jones.

In 1991, The Song of the Year was "From a Distance," sung by Bette Midler.

In 1991, Nirvana released "Nevermind." With the song "Smells Like Teen Spirit" as the biggest single.

In 1992, the year the Grammys "discovered" Nirvana, they awarded Album of the Year to Natalie Cole's "Unforgettable... with Love" ("Nevermind wasn't nominated for this category,) and when the finally got around to "Smells Like Teen Spirit" in 1993, they gave the Song of the Year Award to Eric Clapton for "Tears in Heaven." ("Teen Spirit" wasn't even nominatated for this category.) In the category of Rock Song, where "Teen Spirit" was on the list, they gave the Grammy to Eric Clapton for the "Unplugged" version of his 1970 song "Layla."

You want to win a Grammy in the major categories? Try being either insanely, undeniably successful at moving millions of copies of pop records for a major label, or better yet, be old.

Understood. Which is why the status quo should change.

Just because something has been a joke doesn't mean that it should always remain a joke.

 

[teruterubozu]

Only hip-hop problem? More like jazz, metal, country, reggae, blues, folk, punk, etc. problem.

 

[masud]

Alright and blacker the berry are great great songs but other than those Tpab is just not that good. I had gkmc on repeat for months, I think I've gotten though tpab maybe twice.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

Alright and blacker the berry are great great songs but other than those Tpab is just not that good. I had gkmc on repeat for months, I think I've gotten though tpab maybe twice.

Originally was was how I felt except replace blacker the berry with king kunta. But the album has some ballin as beats and flows. Still think GKMC is better but TPAB still kicks so much ass. Its like Food & Liquor -> The Cool for me. Prefer the first but the second does a bunch of cool shit that is really enjoyable.

 

[PeskyToaster]

I'm glad Carly Rae's album is getting some love here. It rocked.

 

[Tatsumi Oga]

To Pimp a Butterfly wasn't as good as Good Kid Maad City. Sorry everyone. Though GKMD was snubbed (had strong competition that year if I remember correctly).

Agreed. Especially musically wise and the way he raps i highly prefer Good Kid Maad City.

 

[Jakoo]

You'd think that but then Beck wins over Beyonce and you're like "What are these awards supposed to be?"

The only way I can see them trying to justify giving that award to Beck for that album was overlooking him for all of his past albums--as if they were trying to award his career up to that point instead of just Morning Phase alone.

But even still, Beyonce probably should have won. Morning Phase is one of Beck's worst albums easily and was such a disappointing and terrible return to form.

 

[Vicetrailia]

So the grammies are bought by the POP music industry?

 

[BudokaiMR2]

So the grammies are bought by the POP music industry?

If I remember the history correctly the Academy that runs the grammys exists solely because Hollywood needed help listing people on their Walk of Fame and asked a bunch of the biggest music executives in the country to help. And they decided to run with it and started their own committee and award show.

So no, not really. They've owned the damn things from the start. No need to even buy it out! ;p

Spoiler

I honestly don't know anything about how the committee picks members today and just assume the worst.

 

[Damerman]

Ahahaha the fact that GKMC lost to The Heist is a forever L that will never wash off. It's embarassing to an almost ridiculous degree when even the winner is all but outright apologizing.

This.

 

[Auctopus]

To Pimp a Butterfly wasn't as good as Good Kid Maad City. Sorry everyone. Though GKMD was snubbed (had strong competition that year if I remember correctly).

Agreed. Especially musically wise and the way he raps i highly prefer Good Kid Maad City.

 

[Valhelm]

Kendrick wins 5 Grammy's and people still pissed he didn't win AOTY?

Taylor Swift released an amazing pop album, one of the best in years. I'm not a huge fan of hers, but it's a very well made album of pop songs, literally just hit after hit after hit.

I thought TPAB was a good album, though I think it's a good step below on the whole than GKMC... A lot of TPAB I just skip through these days to get to the few tracks I still like.. I can put on GKMC and just start to finish it still to this day.

I thought the best hip-hop album of 2015 was I Don't Like Shit, I Don't Go Outside by Early Sweatshirt.

Just being nominated for a Grammy is a fucking victory, this whole focus on losing is just lame.

...and damn that's like the most Pitchforky list of albums ever by Valhelm with no theme at all to tie them together... it's like "hey look at me, I like cool music!!"

This is an embarrassing post. Taylor Swift did nothing new with 1989, and none of songs are better pop music than the stuff on Froot or Currents. She won because she's Taylor Swift.

The albums I posted are all soundly better because they're more innovative, well-developed, or complex than 1989. It's fine if you prefer 1989, but you can't pretend that it was really the best album of 2015.

 

[neurosisxeno]

Why is art being judged on commercial success? The fuck is this shit? You think Transformers movies are amazing because they put asses to the seats?

Transformers 3 was nominated for 3 Oscars. Let that sink in.

easily my 2014 AOTY, yeah - but i just don't know the extent that they were even aware of it. same feeling when macklemore won over GKMC....TPAB at least raised waves in enough circles that they had to consider it, i figure

RTJ2 got robbed. I think TPAB was considered because of the backlash they got for giving The Heist the win over GKMC.

You'd think that but then Beck wins over Beyonce and you're like "What are these awards supposed to be?"

As I said earlier, they favor older artists who are "owed" their due, and pop artists. Album of the Year might as well be the experimental category for the Grammy's, because they seem to just draw names out of a hat, or pick the most popular album of that year.

And yet hip hop is one of the most dominant and influential genres of music despite not winning any major Grammy awards.

Ehhhhh. Hip-Hop has always really thrived in the underground. It's usually the most talented and lesser known artists that are the lifeblood of the genre. My favorite rap group (Atmosphere) has never been nominated, and honestly I couldn't care less. The kinds of artists that get nominations are either well established mainstream successes (Jay-Z, Eminem) and\or very popular at the time (Lil Wayne, Drake).

 

[PillarEN]

Transformers 3 was nominated for 3 Oscars. Let that sink in.

I'm guessing it has nothing to do with script, acting, music, directing or editing so that doesn't mean anything. If that movie got a nomination for sound design or special effects it's not like I'm going to flip a table in disgust. The movie sucks but I can clearly see how it could be nominated for certain categories.

 

[Krappadizzle]

To Pimp a Butterfly wasn't as good as Good Kid Maad City. Sorry everyone. Though GKMD was snubbed (had strong competition that year if I remember correctly).

I agree. It's just not as catchy to me. The beats, and flows of a lot of the new stuff just doesn't work for me. I loved his other album though.

 

[Guevara]

I find Kendrick pretty hard to get into. I can tell he's talented and is pushing the genre forward, but I'm not surprised his music appears to be inaccessible to the Grammy voting public.

 

[dave is ok]

Grammy's have always overvalued pop acts and the occasional crossover

 

[lawnchair]

does anyone even care about granny awards

apparently so, which is weird

 

[andycapps]

Grammy's have always overvalued pop acts and the occasional crossover

This. Good luck to indie bands, metal bands (has one ever won?), hip hop, even rock. Is there bias? They like what they like for these categories and anything outside of a pretty narrow scope doesn't have much chance.

 

[fader]

.

it's ok. Opinions can be wrong.

I wonder if Taylore would have won this if Kanye West never interrupted her...

 

[Dabanton]

The real tragedy of this year's grammy's has nothing to do with hip hop. It's the fact that Kamasi Washington's The Epic wasn't even nominated for best jazz album

Spoiler

and Seth MacFarlane somehow was

Now that is a shambles as The Epic is a magnificent album.

But reading about the nomination and voting process I'm not surprised at what gets put forward. The Epic is an album you have to let pull you in. And it's very long. Perfect for me but some people's attention spans are non existent nowadays.

 

[Emarv]

Today I learned lots of GAF thinks TPAB is head and shoulders about GKMC. Weird. Is this one of those things where the newest one is just considered the better one?

Both albums are amazing to me, and TPAB is more ambitious, but I definitely wouldn't call them incomparable like some in this thread seem to be doing.

 

[theignoramus]

Ehhhhh. Hip-Hop has always really thrived in the underground. It's usually the most talented and lesser known artists that are the lifeblood of the genre. My favorite rap group (Atmosphere) has never been nominated, and honestly I couldn't care less. The kinds of artists that get nominations are either well established mainstream successes (Jay-Z, Eminem) and\or very popular at the time (Lil Wayne, Drake).

Nah, cream rises to the top in rap, like Eminem said. If you're good, put out mixtapes, get a buzz then a signing deal. This isnt the ring-tone era anymore, theres all kinds of topical breadth and range at the top levels of the game. Lot of the stuff thats underground is underground for a reason, it's garbage.

 

[OneEightZero]

Did you even read the full article?
SMH
Hip-hop is the most listened to genre in the world, according to Spotify analysis of 20 billion tracks

Hip-hop, not Beatles, had greatest influence on pop music, study says

You're pretty much mapping the voting lines for the Grammys.

Deep Hip Hop -> Mainstream Pop

The influenced works are being voted on more by Grammy voters.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

With the Grammys popularity always wins.

Disagrees.

But I guess she fits their occasional "indie" winner schtick.

Esperanza > Biebs!

 

[Tatsumi Oga]

It's called having an own opinion, surely you've heard of it? I simply do not enjoy a lot of the production on TPAB and I do on GKMC. It is what it is.

 

[Kaladin]

This is a problem across several genres, not just hip hop. It happens with country, folk, hard rock / metal...any genre that isn't considered top 40 mainstream.

You can issue the same complaint about Chris Stapleton, also nominated for AOTY:

You can perform and win your country awards, and maybe take home a music video award, but once it’s time for the main categories — Album of the Year, Record of the Year, Song of the Year, and Best New Artist — don’t expect a trophy.

 

[Servbot24]

You know what the real tragedy is?

The fact that 1989 won, yet the far superior E.MO.TION by Carly Rae wasn't even nominated! The Grammy Awards are a useless mess!

Now this is a good post.

 

[Angelus Errare]

If song popularity determined Grammy wins, Katy Perry is getting robbed.

 

[braves01]

TPAB changed rap, 1989 changed the world