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[Deleted member 12837]

There are so many factors that could influence any given bodily function or action that there's no way you could ever get a consistent result to be able to say that, for example, 10 forward punch motions by a 43 year old male who weighs 200 lbs demands X calories/joules of energy. Even if you did find that out, how exactly do you measure the precise amount of macronutrients that are being oxidized specifically to fuel that motion?

I would imagine that measuring the energy expended during activity to a precise value is much more complicated than measuring the amount of energy in food. I could be wrong; I haven't really looked into it.

My guess is that there are devices that can be hooked up to individuals while performing physical activity that can measure metabolic rates, etc and get a rough estimate of how much energy is expended.

There's no way there is 100% efficiency. So even if the calories measured in a piece of food could be directly translated over to the fuel for bodily functions, there's no way that 300 calories from food equates 300 calories of kinetic energy, for example. Maybe I'm wrong, but the whole thing seems absolutely ridiculous and based on way too many assumptions to be taken seriously.

Agreed (except for the last part).

These "assumptions" that we all make are enough to help probably 95% of people lose weight. Of course it isn't the most optimal method possible. We simply don't have enough data or a great enough understanding of every process within the body to be able to easily perform a few tests on an individual and know exactly what they should eat, when, in what quantities, and with how much exercise supplementing it all.

The "rough guidelines" that we use with calories has been very effective for those who spend some time educating themselves on nutrition and fitness and are dedicated enough to make these dietary and activity-related decisions into part of their lifestyle and not just a temporary diet/exercise "plan".

If we were to just scrap the entire concept of calories as we know them today, what would you propose we do instead?

 

[Deleted member 17706]

If we were to just scrap the entire concept of calories as we know them today, what would you propose we do instead?

It may be a bit idealistic, but I would propose the identification and elimination (or drastic reduction in consumption) of foods that are prone to increasing a person's adipose tissue.

I can only speak from my experience and that of people I know, but I think the whole calories in/calories out theory has done far more harm than good. Not only does it make overweight sound like a character defect ("you eat too much and move too little!"), but it brings in all sorts of problems of people doing simplistic math when making important decisions about their health. "Oh, this Big Mac is only 500 calories! My iPhone app tells me that if I run a few miles, I can completely negate the fact that I ate the Big Mac!" or "Look, honey! These doughnuts are only 50 calories each! Healthy doughnuts!"

When people are told to focus on the numbers in an equation that is most likely not even correct rather than learn about what kinds of foods are good and what kinds are not, then I think they end up doing more harm to themselves than good.

Hell, just look at that recent Cracked article that got thrown around a bunch. It was something like over 95% of people who get fat once never get and remain slim again. When most people approach weight loss as an energy imbalance problem, it's not difficult to see why.

 

[Deadly Cyclone]

No kidding. The hospital I work at has a health finder type website, suggesting that my ideal weight would be 165-180 at 6'0. 165?! I'd be a damn skeleton!
I have a bigger frame and at 207 I'm the thinnest I've been in about 8-10 years (thanks much in part to this thread).
I'll go a bit lower, but I don't want to lose too much muscle mass.

Same here. I'll admit my perfect weight is probably 185-190 but I don't look bad at 205. At 165 I'd be dead.

 

[jeremy70583]

Same here. I'll admit my perfect weight is probably 185-190 but I don't look bad at 205. At 165 I'd be dead.

Has to largely depend on your build. When I was over 200, I thought 190 would be enough. I'm approaching 170 now, and still have a tiny bit of flab on my midsection that I'm trying to get rid of, and I'm 6'4. I'm not sure if it is mostly skin or just fat, as I started at 300lbs

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I think a lot of people really overestimate what their ideal weight is. Unless you plan on doing some serious weight training, you could easily still have some flab on you at 160 lbs and 6'0".

 

[maxxpower]

So I'm trying to reduce my carb intake(I've been eating too much french bread). I always exercise in the evening, when should I eat the most carbs, as I'm a bit confused about this. Should I eat more carbs after I exercise(so basically at night), or early in the day?

 

[vatstep]

I don't know if anyone watches Extreme Makeover Weight Loss Edition (I normally hate shows like this, especially The Biggest Loser, but this one is surprisingly tolerable), but the guy on tonight's episode went from 543 pounds to 277 in one year. He literally almost cut his weight in half (lost 266 pounds). Crazy shit.

 

[Witchfinder General]

Sweet, down from 82.5kg to 81.5kg since Thursday. It doesn't sound like much but I had been stuck at 82.5kg for the past fortnight so it's nice to progress again. Now to hit my next milestone of 78kg before my three-day training camp at the end of this month.

Also, what do you guys think of the following cookie recipe?

http://www.kmdi.com.au/healthy-snacks-on-the-go/

My wife and I made these over the weekend with added raw pistachios and 85% dark chocolate. Not only are they delicious but they're very filling.

 

[Wafflecakes]

I think a lot of people really overestimate what their ideal weight is. Unless you plan on doing some serious weight training, you could easily still have some flab on you at 160 lbs and 6'0".

I don't know. I am 6'5 270 lbs (started 330) and supposedly my ideal weight is 190. I have a brother an inch or two shorter than me who is thin and active...always has been...who weighs more than that. My father is 6 even and is extremely active (part of his job) and while not thin no one would call him fat and he is 20-30 lbs over what my "ideal" weight is. Insanity imo.

Plus I think some people kill themselves over the last 10-20 lbs when really it accomplishes nothing at all health wise it purely for vanity points and if they fail at reaching perfect they get discouraged and fall into their old ways.

Just my thoughts.

 

[Wafflecakes]

I don't know if anyone watches Extreme Makeover Weight Loss Edition (I normally hate shows like this, especially The Biggest Loser, but this one is surprisingly tolerable), but the guy on tonight's episode went from 543 pounds to 277 in one year. He literally almost cut his weight in half (lost 266 pounds). Crazy shit.

Doesn't that show also use plastic surgery and lipo? The old version use too.

 

[Tashi]

I don't know if anyone watches Extreme Makeover Weight Loss Edition (I normally hate shows like this, especially The Biggest Loser, but this one is surprisingly tolerable), but the guy on tonight's episode went from 543 pounds to 277 in one year. He literally almost cut his weight in half (lost 266 pounds). Crazy shit.

That's insane.

The only weight loss show I watch like that is "I used to be fat" on MTV. Shows kids graduating high school get trained and taught to eat correctly before going away to college. Most of them lose close to 100 pounds. Sometimes there can be too much drama but for the most part it's a solid show.

 

[vatstep]

Doesn't that show also use plastic surgery and lipo? The old version use too.

I think that was just the standard Extreme Makeover version. The people in this one usually get surgery to remove all of the excess skin after losing, like, 200 pounds, but that's it. No liposuction or gastric bypass stuff or anything like that.

 

[zam]

So a couple weeks ago at a party a couple of friends and I made a drunken pact to run a 10k next summer (more exactly it's a 11.6km run they have here each summer).

I've been doing low-carb and Starting Strength for a while now, would a program like Couch to 5k be a good way to train for a 10k and be compatible with low-carb and lifting weights 3 times a week? Obviously I'll do the running on days that I don't lift.

 

[SeanR1221]

None. Which do you recommend?

I'm honestly not too familiar with journal names, but I know I typed "Calories weight loss" into google scholar and hundreds of articles I have access to came up.

---

My body is nuts. After my low of 179 on Thursday. I gained 1 pound every day and now Im 184. I really don't get it. It's like my body wanted to troll with me. I expected to get back to 181 at some points, but yeah.

So, after 2 months of cutting, I've lost 2 pounds. Pretty pathetic.

 

[OG Kush]

So, after 2 months of cutting, I've lost 2 pounds. Pretty pathetic.

What are you doing about this though? obviously what you were doing isn't working and need to switch it up. unless you're putting on muscle aswell as losing fat which could mean why you've only lost 2 pounds.

 

[SeanR1221]

I started at 1700 calories, moved it down to 1500. I literally can't get any lower than that if I want to hit. 180g of protein a day.

I'd say my lifts went up 5% these past two months.

I was doing 3 days of cardio (running for 30 minutes) which I've recently replaced with HIIT, but I've only done that twice so far.

 

[OG Kush]

yeah don't go to low. Also is that 1700 calories net? As in you're eating 1700 after you subtract how many calories you burn working out?

 

[SeanR1221]

yeah don't go to low. Also is that 1700 calories net? As in you're eating 1700 after you subtract how many calories you burn working out?

No, I don't factor in workout calories burned at all. Ive posted it before, but here is my typical day.

Breakfast (at 7:30-8AM)
- Always 2 eggs, 1 egg white, 2 pieces of bacon (Although I recently bought canadian bacon and can substitute with 3 pieces of that)

Lunch (At 12:30-1PM)
- Either a can of tuna or 6oz of chicken.
- Either broccoli or cottage cheese
- Either 2 eggs or 2oz of cheese
- If I have a salad mix, I make it all into a big salad.

It's important to me that this meal fills me up. I can't eat at work, and need to be satiated until I can eat again around 7pm or so

Dinner
- Either 6oz of chicken, 4 chicken sausages, 2 turkey burgers
- Steamed green beans or broccoli
- Sometimes an ounce of cheddar on the cheese or turkey burgers

Snacks
- Whey mixed in water and creatine
- Cottage cheese and berries (Either strawberries or blue berries)

I mean, I'm never starving, and none of my compound lifts have suffered (like I said, I've gone up about 5% in everything except overhead press). I do 3x5 on the heavy lifts.

 

[OG Kush]

hmm try cutting dairy and replacing it something else or reduce fat intake a bit an up the carbs. As you said you're not getting the results you want so just got to switch it up and see what works for you. also if you're working out everyday you must be burning atleast 200-300 calories on that a day. Up the calories, maybe add some milk to your shake to add some easy calories?

 

[SeanR1221]

hmm try cutting dairy and replacing it something else or reduce fat intake a bit an up the carbs. As you said you're not getting the results you want so just got to switch it up and see what works for you. also if you're working out everyday you must be burning atleast 200-300 calories on that a day. Up the calories, maybe add some milk to your shake to add some easy calories?

Wait, cut down on dairy and add milk?

I'd be willing to increase the amount of food Im eating, but if I'm barely losing on this amount of food, is that the best idea?

 

[grumble]

I think a lot of people really overestimate what their ideal weight is. Unless you plan on doing some serious weight training, you could easily still have some flab on you at 160 lbs and 6'0".

If you're even moderately active, 160 at 6ft is probably on the skinny side for a male. Maybe 175 or so would be a pretty lean ideal, assuming people are exercising moderately.

 

[OG Kush]

Wait, cut down on dairy and add milk?

I'd be willing to increase the amount of food Im eating, but if I'm barely losing on this amount of food, is that the best idea?

haha i meant cut down on dairy and continue your same diet or up calories/carbs

 

[SeanR1221]

Yeah I could cut out cheese first if all else fails.

About to go to the gym now. I'll take a picture in Body Shot and post up my results and see what people here think.

I feel like I see a difference in Body Shot but maybe I'm just seeing things. A fresh, honest set of eyes can help.

 

[Zoe]

Are you keeping track of your fat and water percentages?

 

[Seth C]

If you're even moderately active, 160 at 6ft is probably on the skinny side for a male. Maybe 175 or so would be a pretty lean ideal, assuming people are exercising moderately.

I'm 6' and 160 and definitely could stand to lose some weight. I have boobs and love handles.

 

[CrankyJay]

I'm 6' and 160 and definitely could stand to lose some weight. I have boobs and love handles.

In your position I would start adding some mass through weight lifting THEN worry about a cut. As you pack on some muscle you might actually lose that fat anyway (if you do a clean bulk).

 

[SeanR1221]

Are you keeping track of your fat and water percentages?

Fat is usually around 50-65G a day. Most comes from eggs I'd imagine.

Water I drink a gallon a day.

 

[Zoe]

Fat is usually around 50-65G a day. Most comes from eggs I'd imagine.

Water I drink a gallon a day.

I meant your body composition.

 

[LaneDS]

So a couple weeks ago at a party a couple of friends and I made a drunken pact to run a 10k next summer (more exactly it's a 11.6km run they have here each summer).

I've been doing low-carb and Starting Strength for a while now, would a program like Couch to 5k be a good way to train for a 10k and be compatible with low-carb and lifting weights 3 times a week? Obviously I'll do the running on days that I don't lift.

Couch to 5K is very manageable for most people and I'd say if you're not running at all it's a good starting point. Once you can do a 5k, you can build on that bit by bit. Assuming you work at it year round I imagine you could very easily train for a 10k in a year's time.

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

Starting a regime. Im 6'3, what weight should i be targeting? Im 235 last time i checked.

Any input on a good healthy weight for my height would be appreciated.

22, smoker, fairly heavy drinker.

 

[hwalker84]

I'm probably 300+ in all these pictures. That's why these "Oh you're 6 ft tall you should weigh 165-170 lists" are bullshit to me. At my peek when I was playing football i was around 235-240 and shredded. I'll never see under 200 unless i'm dead or extremely ill.

I'm trying to work my way back down to that 240-250 mark.

 

[CrankyJay]

My boss just gave me one of these...beef and ostrich meat stick. Gonna try it out in a bit.

80 cal, 14g protein, 1.5g fat total.

edit: is good...tastes like a summer sausage but leaner. slightly on the salty side.

 

[LosDaddie]

Managed to eat pretty well this weekend despite having family & friends over for my daughter's b-day party. Felt great to have my sister-in-law say to me "Are you still losing weight and hitting the gym? You look like you did in college."...as I was stuffing my face with food. :|

The scale told me I gained 2 lbs since Friday morning, but that's about normal for me after a weekend. Going to hit the diet & gym hard this week, as this weekend will be another party at my house.

Not skinny at all, even when I was at 120. I want to get rid of my love handles and stubborn belly fat before I bulk up. Which I know will be hard but I'm set on doing it. Even when I do my builk I'm only going to aim for .5lb to 1lb a week. Trying to stay lean all year long.

Not meaning to offend, but 120 lbs is like girl-weight to me. What's your end goal? If you're ultimately trying to attract a lady, then having a little chub on you is more preferrable than being a skinny stick figure. If you're at 125 lbs now, then I'd focus on bulking up right now, and not even worry about losing weight.

 

[TheCrow]

Not meaning to offend, but 120 lbs is like girl-weight to me. What's your end goal? If you're ultimately trying to attract a lady, then having a little chub on you is more preferrable than being a skinny stick figure. If you're at 125 lbs now, then I'd focus on bulking up right now, and not even worry about losing weight.

No offense taken. I might just post some pictures and if everyone here thinks I'm a stick figure then maybe I do have issues with how I see my body. My current goal is to get to somewhere around 8% body fat then go on a lean bulk to minimize fat gain.

 

[alekth]

You shoud start bulking now. 125 lbs @ 5'5" sounds incredibly skinny to me

It doesn't sound that skinny really. E.g. from the Olympics this guy according to wikipedia is 5'3.5" at ~121lb and is hardly skinny.

 

[harSon]

I'm probably 300+ in all these pictures. That's why these "Oh you're 6 ft tall you should weigh 165-170 lists" are bullshit to me. At my peek when I was playing football i was around 235-240 and shredded. I'll never see under 200 unless i'm dead or extremely ill.

I'm trying to work my way back down to that 240-250 mark.

Eh, I'm 6'2" and I'm 190-200 and have been lifting heavy for roughly 6 months now with great results, and I'm pretty sure this is the weight my body is supposed to be at...

 

[Petrie]

I'm probably 300+ in all these pictures. That's why these "Oh you're 6 ft tall you should weigh 165-170 lists" are bullshit to me. At my peek when I was playing football i was around 235-240 and shredded. I'll never see under 200 unless i'm dead or extremely ill.

I'm trying to work my way back down to that 240-250 mark.

Perhaps your idea of shredded is just much different. At 6' tall and 240, you'd need more muscle than most people could ever achieve to be what I'd consider shredded.

 

[CrankyJay]

I'm 6'2 190 and still have a decent amount of fat. Don't want to share pictures until at least 180-185...pretty sure 180 will be my absolute bottom before I do a bulk.

 

[oxrock]

Eh, I'm 6'2" and I'm 190-200 and have been lifting heavy for roughly 6 months now with great results, and I'm pretty sure this is the weight my body is supposed to be at...

Some people are just built more solidly than others. There's more to someone than just their height in terms of dimensions. As an example, I'm 6'2" 285 lbs. My ideal weight is the 250 range. But this is because I have a massive amount of muscle attached my my above average sized frame. I can do unassisted pullups/dips, do sets of 50 pushups and bike 15+ miles a day. Certainly not in horrible shape. Most definitely not 100lbs overweight assuming someone my height is supposed to be <200. There are exceptions to weight charts which is a problem. A lot of people delude themselves into wrongfully thinking they're an exception while others refer to these numbers as law.

 

[hwalker84]

Eh, I'm 6'2" and I'm 190-200 and have been lifting heavy for roughly 6 months now with great results, and I'm pretty sure this is the weight my body is supposed to be at...

I'm not saying you personally. I'm saying people have different frames and body types. I'm not saying under 200 for YOU isn't your ideal weight I'm saying for me and my body type it's not (and not possible).

Ray Lewis 6'1 250

 

[LosDaddie]

No offense taken. I might just post some pictures and if everyone here thinks I'm a stick figure then maybe I do have issues with how I see my body. My current goal is to get to somewhere around 8% body fat then go on a lean bulk to minimize fat gain.

Pictures might help. But are you doing any exercise right now? Simple stuff, like pull-ups/push-ups/planks/air squats/etc, that you can do at home can be really effective.

It doesn't sound that skinny really. E.g. from the Olympics this guy according to wikipedia is 5'3.5" at ~121lb and is hardly skinny.

eh, nobody should be comparing themselves to pro athletes' bodies. Completely unfair for normal people. But honestly, 5'3" @ 121 lbs is what I'd consider girl-dimensions, at least by USA standards. Sorry to our short(er) GAFers.

I'm 6'2 190 and still have a decent amount of fat. Don't want to share pictures until at least 180-185...pretty sure 180 will be my absolute bottom before I do a bulk.

~5'9" (on a good day) and 163 lbs as of this morning, and I think 150 lbs would be my absolute lowest without losing too much muscle mass. But my goal since the beginning was to hit 155 lbs.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Obviously there are different body types, but for people that can achieve that slim and muscular look, 150 lbs. or so at 5'10" - 6'0" isn't necessarily "skinny."

 

[SeanR1221]

As promised, a comparison from body shot. Left is right before I started my cut, right is today. I feel like I could still stand to lose a LOT of fat before even trying a bulk.

 

[mooooose]

As promised, a comparison from body shot. Left is right before I started my cut, right is today. I feel like I could still stand to lose a LOT of fat before even trying a bulk.

You lost a lot but I wouldn't bulk. Depends on your goals though. You look great dude. Keep going.

 

[alekth]

eh, nobody should be comparing themselves to pro athletes' bodies. Completely unfair for normal people. But honestly, 5'3" @ 121 lbs is what I'd consider girl-dimensions, at least by USA standards. Sorry to our short(er) GAFers.

Obviously the comparison is not to show how a non-athlete should look like, it's just to point out how weight can look on a lower height. One has to keep in mind that proportions matter more than absolutes in looks, and height and other bone dimensions really make a difference.
And well, 5'5" is statistically low for guys but there isn't much one can do for their height, a similar weight would still look vastly different on a typical woman build of that height.

 

[LaneDS]

As promised, a comparison from body shot. Left is right before I started my cut, right is today. I feel like I could still stand to lose a LOT of fat before even trying a bulk.

Good work! Do you have your before/after weights available for reference?

 

[Chris R]

As promised, a comparison from body shot. Left is right before I started my cut, right is today. I feel like I could still stand to lose a LOT of fat before even trying a bulk.

Left is how I look now... What exactly did you do exactly? I'd love to see results like yours

 

[SeanR1221]

You lost a lot but I wouldn't bulk. Depends on your goals though. You look great dude. Keep going.

Good work! Do you have your before/after weights available for reference?

Left is how I look now... What exactly did you do exactly? I'd love to see results like yours

Wow I really appreciate the positive comments guys, thank you. I honestly didn't feel there was much of a change with the cut. Would you believe on the left Im 185 and on the right 183?

RHFB, here is my workout schedule

Day A
Squat 3x5
Bench 3x5
Pendlay row 3x5

Day B
Overhead press 3x5
Deadlift 1x5

This doesn't count the warmup sets. For example, on deadlifts I do 135 1x10, 185 1x5, 225 1x3 then my weight set 255 1x5.

I also do different accessory work, somewhat for asthetics, somewhat to help with the main lifts. Dips, good mornings, hammer curls, incline dumbbell bench, etc. all 3x10.

Week 1 ABA, week 2 BAB, etc. at least one day of no lifting between them.

On off days I did cardio. 30 minutes of running at 6mph. This past week I've replaced that with HIIT.

For my diet, you can check out the last page, but basically 1500 calories, 50-60g of fat, 20g of carbs, 180g of protein.

 

[Revoh]

Hey, I'm starting the gym next wednesday, can I get recomendations on a good split routine? I'm a beginner and I know people will recommend SS for me, I even bought the book this year, the thing is my gym doesn't have the proper equipment to follow SS/SL.
Also, I don't give a crap about strength, I just want to look hot on my birthday in january

 

[TheCrow]

Pictures might help. But are you doing any exercise right now? Simple stuff, like pull-ups/push-ups/planks/air squats/etc, that you can do at home can be really effective.

Took some quick pics. Please ignore my dirty bathroom and surgical scar. As you can see I have a long way to go till I hit sub 10% body fat.

Relaxed
Flexed

btw I know my jeans are too big. They are a size 29 and it was only a month ago when I couldn't fit into them. Don't want to get new clothes since I'll be bulking in a couple of months. Hopefully.