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What do you consider Nintendo's most illogical or baffling decision?
- Thread starter Version 3.0
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socksfelloff
Member
Component cables and stopping production of the nes classic didn't lose nintendo any money. In fact I would say they probably MADE more money by removing the digital port. With virtual console coming to Switch it doesn't make sense for them to sell a $60 box that comes with 30 games.
The biggest single, major, mistake they made is actually a double whammy. The surprising way in which they terminated their partnership with Sony is easily their biggest mistake. They did it in such a way that it pissed Sony off to the point of creating the console line that has undeniably DESTROYED Nintendo ever since. Combine the launch of the playstation with the fact that Nintendo decided to stick with expensive, proprietary, cartridges and you have Nintendo's single biggest mistake in history.
Lets be honest, N64 vs saturn wasn't even a competition. If Nintendo had partnered with Sony, as they had agreed upon, they would have DOMINATED the 5th generation the same way they did the 8 bit era.
The biggest single, major, mistake they made is actually a double whammy. The surprising way in which they terminated their partnership with Sony is easily their biggest mistake. They did it in such a way that it pissed Sony off to the point of creating the console line that has undeniably DESTROYED Nintendo ever since. Combine the launch of the playstation with the fact that Nintendo decided to stick with expensive, proprietary, cartridges and you have Nintendo's single biggest mistake in history.
Lets be honest, N64 vs saturn wasn't even a competition. If Nintendo had partnered with Sony, as they had agreed upon, they would have DOMINATED the 5th generation the same way they did the 8 bit era.
spazchicken
Member
How much time we got? Cause it all started going downhill with the N64 and they have consistently make horrible, stubborn decisions for each console after that.
And they would earn less because the deal was in Sony's favor.
-shadow-
Member
Well we know it was happening for Europe at one point but was canned for unknown reasons. Many assume due to the game crashing bugs which were never fixed. And I can understand that honestly.
Version 3.0
Member
I've mentioned this one many times. But it's more baffling than just "ignoring" it. They actively bashed online, and put forth GBA connectivity as a better alternative. That's some serious "what kind of drugs are you smoking" shit right there.
And yet, at the same time, they had network hardware for the Gamecube, and even one popular network game (Phantasy Star Online) on the system. They even made 3 games of their own that used the broadband adapter, although not well.
Which reminds me of another one. It's minor and long forgotten, but absolutely bonkers and indefensible: in the LAN mode of Mario Kart: Double Dash, you don't get to select your character.
The reluctance (or poor business decision not) to go balls-to-the-wall online. Better digital support (Virtual Console's sorry-ass state), friends/matchmaking (why are we still using fucking FRIEND CODES), an achievement system (adding even more replayability to their classics), and bizarre subscription plans (the hilarious rent-1-VC-game-a-month garbage). I also don't know why key franchises like Pokemon haven't had many more major online entries.
Basically, I don't get their aversion to new gameplay models, OS features and software delivery platforms that came with the advent of the PS3/360 gen and their connections to the online/digital world.
Basically, I don't get their aversion to new gameplay models, OS features and software delivery platforms that came with the advent of the PS3/360 gen and their connections to the online/digital world.
it started before then with their ridiculous restrictions on third parties and ironfisted censorship rules
i mean, we didn't even get devil world.
nintendo has always been weird and baffling, it's half the charm.
This. Leaving money on the table is one of the most direct crazy decisions they've made.
... I still think they don't want the NES Classic to outsell their newer systems and prove the old ways were better. Though Breath of the Wild is doing a good job of showing that too.
Polygonal_Sprite
Member
Sticking with cartridges for N64 and at the same time fucking over Sony and thus creating a product line which would ultimately dominate the industry.
I love Nintendo but they make some of the strangest decisions in the history of business.
I'm sitting here with $200 to spend on Virtual Console roms for Switch and they won't take my money...
I love Nintendo but they make some of the strangest decisions in the history of business.
I'm sitting here with $200 to spend on Virtual Console roms for Switch and they won't take my money...
I think Nintendo just assumed they had it figured out as they had been doing dual screen game design for years on the DS family of systems. NSMB Wii U did not have anything useful or compelling on offer for the gamepad. It was their flagship title at launch.
Zombie U implemented almost all of Wii Us new features including touchscreen, camera, gyro controls, Miiverse, online and asymmetrical multiplayer into a pretty compelling and cohesive package. Not just the touchscreen, every feature.
Just like DS, the second screen became most useful for maps/inventory type data screens. For me, that's functionality that made the Wii U versions of 3rd party games edge out the competition. Mass Effect 3 with maps and inventory on a touch screen. Batman Arkham City, Monster Hunter 3, Splatoon. Nintendo didn't do enough to show why these games were different with the Gamepad. And they were different, and they were better! I think third parties delivered great uses for the Gamepad and Nintendo did not market them as a core part of the Wii U experience.
To this day I wish there was a version of the Witcher 3 that used the Gamepad for inventory and maps.
It's not really about them being right or wrong from their end though, they didn't want to do it for their reasons and I personally don't respect them for it. Especially when a fan patch fixed almost all the issues.
Off-TV play was a fantastic addition too-- look how many play their switches on their couch in handheld mode! But they couldn't advertise that in certain markets since not every game had it, so they didn't bother advertising it at all.
But it's not baffling or illogical. They didn't think they'd make money on it. I'd love to play a localized version of Mother 3 and Captain Rainbow (for the bonkersness of it all) but I get why they didn't release them. I can still be mad that they won't release them while knowing that it isn't illogical for them not to spend cash on localization for a niche product.
boyshine
Member
Wii - basically a GameCube redesign with new controllers, turning out to be one of the most successful consoles of all time, while everyone else was focusing on the shift to HD.
Also, having the balls to kill the Game Boy line and go for "DS".
Both crazy, illogical, baffling at the time, but turned out to be extremely important for the entire industry.
Also, having the balls to kill the Game Boy line and go for "DS".
Both crazy, illogical, baffling at the time, but turned out to be extremely important for the entire industry.
TreasureHunterG
Banned
Iwata's economic austerity business policy prevented that from happening. Nintendo had the tools to make that investment, the reasons made to avoid were dumb and unacceptable. GCN was built with online in mind, as there was a broadband adapter slot, they had the franchises (Melee, MK
D, Metroid Prime, F-Zero GX, Mario Parties, Mario Sports, etc, those games would have fared better with online options), it was very short-sighted from Nintendo to avoid it. They were still demonstrating resistance to online during Wii and Wii U, supported by (some) it's fanboys. Not only this decision was a huge waste of opportunity as, like I said before, allowed the competition to build ground and establish the online market for themselves, something Nintendo took too long (very long) to finally realize it was the way to go.
Maps/inventory management were obviously suited to it, and yeah it's an improvement. But it can be replicated on a single screen without too much bother, and when rival systems have much more obvious advantages such as power that was never going to cut it.
At the heart of the Wii U was a massive contradiction, off-TV play versus dual-screen play. If one was a game-changer why did the other exist? And it's the off-TV play that was the compelling one, even with its limitations. The Wii U basically shot itself in the foot by design.
A good product doesn't need to be explained it sells itself, and with the Switch they've got it right. Aside from Zelda I think its positive reception is because they've got a clear idea that's easy to understand and works.
Stone Ocean
Member
Nintendo 64 cartridges
Where to begin? Online infrastructure in 2017 being behind the OG xbox and PS2, insistence on gimmick controllers, and lack of system power to more properly appeal to third party developers. Nintendo should be ruling the fucking console market imo, but they'd rather do their own thing I guess. I figure the Switch will sort out if that pays off or not so it will be an interesting few years to watch unfold.
Version 3.0
Member
Wii - agreed. It was baffling, but it paid off. Total faceplant on the follow through, though, and that started before the cluster fuck that was the Wii U.
DS - eh, not so much. There's no mystery there; they were scared of the PSP and wanted new hardware for visibility. And they hedged their bets pretty hard with the GBA and the whole "3rd pillar" stuff. The DS, outside of Japan, didn't really catch fire until the Lite, and the GBA picked up the slack during that time.
-shadow-
Member
That patch fixed nothing however, it only translated the game. I had run into a bunch game crashes while playing it (with the fan translation) that resulted in lost progress and once even hard locking the Wii completely requiring me to unplug it. I ended up looking how I could avoid these crashes in order to finish the game.
Vulcano's assistant
Banned
Pretty much forcing Square to say "No thank you, we'll make PlayStation games instead"
Version 3.0
Member
Maybe he's too young to have seen those. The DS and 3DS have covered a lot of years now of no TV solution like these. It's a pain point for me, too. I love those devices and want a DS/3DS equivalent.
Apologies should have said the later systems. I'm not aware of anyway to play those.
facetheslayer92
Member
N64 not having a CD-ROM drive when the entire computer industry had moved to optical media. Also nice OP, lol.
I guess that's fair. I wish that Nintendo had a better DS virtual console on Wii U.
It was baffling to me, it still is. I was ready to buy a wii to play it but ended up asking my aunt's that she bought for wii fit to play the game.
Version 3.0
Member
At least they did support progressive, though. I adored getting 480p out of all the consoles that gen. It's crazy that they would support that and simultaneously sabotage it. That's why it's my #1. All their other crazy stuff is just crazy, but maybe not inherently self-conflicting like this.
It never crashe on me bu w/e.
Council Pop
Member
Okay, I get that we don't have high expectations, but it's a bit unfair to knock the online infrastructure from the Switch when we don't even know what it is yet.
I mean, with voice chat people have already pointed out that the Switch headphone output also accepts mic input, so I could be that the app is just used for private matchmaking and connecting with friends.
Also, the "you only get to rent free games but Sony gives games away" etc- we've already been told that these games are being retooled to have online multiplayer features (which is a big deal IMO), plus we know that the yearly cost of Switch's online service is going to be (somewhere near) half of Sony or Microsoft's subscriptions. So it's fair enough, especially considering the very low quality of games on PS+ over the last year or so anyway. I think Nintendo's idea could be neat. Could be neat.
I mean, with voice chat people have already pointed out that the Switch headphone output also accepts mic input, so I could be that the app is just used for private matchmaking and connecting with friends.
Also, the "you only get to rent free games but Sony gives games away" etc- we've already been told that these games are being retooled to have online multiplayer features (which is a big deal IMO), plus we know that the yearly cost of Switch's online service is going to be (somewhere near) half of Sony or Microsoft's subscriptions. So it's fair enough, especially considering the very low quality of games on PS+ over the last year or so anyway. I think Nintendo's idea could be neat. Could be neat.
Version 3.0
Member
Ah, yes. "Project Rainfall", wasn't it, the petition to get these games released? I think the most bizarre detail of that whole mess was that NoA did the English translation of the games, which were then only released in Europe.
"Not releasing games that would make money" is a big category, for sure.
This is the biggest blunder, nothing else even comes close.
If Nintendo had stuck to their deal with Sony, they would not have awakened the sleeping giant and catapulted themselves into 3rd place. I realize that the deal was more in Sony's favor and that Nintendo were probably doing the "business savy" thing at the time...but it was the way they handled it that basically forced the Playstation into existence as a "fuck you." to Nintendo.
The wild part is there really is loads. Forgot all about the mini discs.
From the little I know of the deal between Nintendo and Sony, I think Sony was using Nintendo to dip their toes into the console market and regardless of the success of the Nintendo PlayStation, they would eventually have moved forward in the PS1/Saturn generation with their own machine. Correct me if this is not right, but Nintendo broke off the deal with Sony because they were essentially trying to retain rights to any disc-based games on the PlayStation collaboration among other stipulations Nintendo viewed as highly unfavorable. They bailed out from a bad position. Anyway I'll reiterate that it really did seem Sony was using Nintendo's decade-long experience in the console space to learn as much as possible before they went into it alone. I don't believe for a second that anything was going to stop the future we live in now.
As for Nintendo's biggest blunders:
Terrible treatment of third-party publishers during the NES/SNES generations combined with expensive cartridges with the N64, resulting in many of them bailing out to make games at lower costs on competing machines. If Saturn wasn't a mess or NEC/Hudson had come out with a PlayStation-tier follow-up console, all those publishers would have flocked to either one... anyone and anything to get away from Nintendo's restrictiveness and exorbitant costs. Sony happened to be the ones to do it right and appease them.
Wii as an SD console in an era of widespread HDTV/HDMI adoption. It put them years behind and forced them to play catch-up with the Wii U and video game development in the HD era. Even if the Wii wasn't as powerful as PS3 and Xbox 360, it should've been a competent 720p machine with clean digital output. Everyone had jumped onboard with cheap LCD TVs that sadly had terrible 480p upscaling, making Wii games look atrocious, much worse than when played on a nice 480p EDTV (which almost no one had).
Wii U: Name. Price. Marketing. Gamepad. Slow OS. Total lack of third parties and mid tier software. Almost everything about it.
SolidSnakex
Member
It's hard to beat their decision to ignore the transition to discs. The long lasting impact from that one decision really puts it over the top. But i'd say their decision to ignore online gaming for the entire generation following that is rather high up there as well. The decisions are actually kinda similar as in both situations everyone else in the industry had adopted discs and online gaming, yet Nintendo thought they knew better than everyone of those companies. And the reason this is notable is due to Nintendo going from being the kings of multiplayer gaming with the N64 due to them including 4 ports on the console, to completely ignoring where multiplayer gaming went the following generation. You have to wonder how different the GC may have been had they pushed Perfect Dark to the GC like they did with Dinosaur Planet/SFA and included online multiplayer.
Pancake Mix
Copied someone else's pancake recipe
I think you mean Phillips.
The Sony deal Nintendo backed out of was supposedly very favourable to the former, so I can understand Nintendo backing out.
Nintendo eventually teamed up with Panasonic later on for their three consoles with optical drives, but not in the early 1990's.
Most baffling and illogical decision? I dunno there have been a lot............
I guess it would have to be pretty much every decision involved with the design and marketing of the WiiU as a set. To me, it seemed like the design of the WiiU went against everything Nintendo had been preaching during the Wii/DS generation, as well as everything that seemed to make the Wii and DS successful.
I continue to maintain that had Nintendo simply released a system that was clearly named and marked (e.g. Wii 2, Wii HD, SuperWii) as an HD successor to the Wii with maybe improved motion controls and online functionality, they wouldn't have had near the sales disaster that they had with the WiiU. I doubt they would have completely replicated the sales of the Wii, but I'm pretty sure they would have sold more than whatever palty number the WiiU ended up selling.
The thing is, I think that Nintendo had a market with the Wii in terms casual/party gamers, but they just completely abandoned it. I don't think tablets and cell phones completely serve that market either.
To this day, I have no idea who the WiiU was designed or marked towards beyond super- hardcore gamers.
I guess it would have to be pretty much every decision involved with the design and marketing of the WiiU as a set. To me, it seemed like the design of the WiiU went against everything Nintendo had been preaching during the Wii/DS generation, as well as everything that seemed to make the Wii and DS successful.
I continue to maintain that had Nintendo simply released a system that was clearly named and marked (e.g. Wii 2, Wii HD, SuperWii) as an HD successor to the Wii with maybe improved motion controls and online functionality, they wouldn't have had near the sales disaster that they had with the WiiU. I doubt they would have completely replicated the sales of the Wii, but I'm pretty sure they would have sold more than whatever palty number the WiiU ended up selling.
The thing is, I think that Nintendo had a market with the Wii in terms casual/party gamers, but they just completely abandoned it. I don't think tablets and cell phones completely serve that market either.
To this day, I have no idea who the WiiU was designed or marked towards beyond super- hardcore gamers.
Selling their old games separately, instead of via a subscription service.
Imagine a netflix-like service for old nintendo games (say, NES to N64). Even if it was entirely filled with only games they had the complete rights to, many people would still be willing to pay 10-15$/month. They could be the netflix of gaming, but instead they're trying to nickel and dime for 20 year old games that people play for 10 minutes before the nostalgia wears off.
Imagine a netflix-like service for old nintendo games (say, NES to N64). Even if it was entirely filled with only games they had the complete rights to, many people would still be willing to pay 10-15$/month. They could be the netflix of gaming, but instead they're trying to nickel and dime for 20 year old games that people play for 10 minutes before the nostalgia wears off.
Jawmuncher
Member
Not bringing back snake in smash is by far the most baffling decision nintendo has ever made. I don't care what was going on at konami, they could have brought him back if they wanted. I want Cloud vs Ryu vs Snake.
