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[R00bot]

So out of the 3 only Nintendo thought of making a system where software will be compatible with all future hardware devices? Thank you, Nintendo.

Well Nintendo has always been the backwards compatible guy of the bunch.

 

[Rödskägg]

Well Nintendo did spend $100 million on a mystery tech aquisition back in early 2014. We still don't know what it was.

nvm

 

[Stilton Disco]

Reading through this leaves me jittery.

The unified OS thing, that's great, but this continued fantasy of creating something completely new and unique, that's a huge risk and means either trying to reinvent enthusiast gaming to get back customers from the other consoles and PC, or trying to make a gaming environment that will appeal to the casual majority more than mobile, and let's face it, both those options will almost certainly blow up in their faces.

I mean this isn't the same barely tech literate world the Wii was born into. Technology and gaming is woven into the very fabric of every advanced society. Most phones offer a more powerful gaming handheld and convenient, easy to use and understand interface than any dedicated hardware could ever hope to achieve.

Maybe I'm just being paranoid, but if they're going to try and reinvent the wheel, they're just going to lose even more customers.

Unless they really have thought up a new, better way of playing games that has never occurred to anyone else in the gaming, computer or mobile industry of course. I mean it's possible I guess.

 

[Toadthemushroom]

I thought it might be worth reposting a post I made a few months ago on this:

Iwata expressed three concerns last year about Nintendo's current way of doing things:

1) The cyclical nature of a console generation means the tide can easily turn in favour of a competitor or different platform holder when a new generation rolls around.
2) Every new generation begins with an effective software library of zero, making it very risky to launch brand new hardware
3) Software shortages when Nintendo and other developers try to juggle developing for 3DS and Wii U. It's one or the other, one tends to cannibalise the other too.

Based on comments from Iwata from both this year and last, the NX platform is aimed at tackling these issues by giving developers a way program for all NX hardware at once -- Iwata cited iOS and the iPhone/iPad/iPod Touch as examples. That solves 3) as developers can target either an NX handheld or NX console or larger iPad like NX handheld or whatever the form factors are, and optimise quickly and cheaply for each configuration. Like you mention, it also makes "cross-buy" work for more widely like it does on iOS and Android. By making it low-cost to target each system, cross-buy can become prevalent and sustainable across the entire platform, not just for independent games and the odd first party offering.

This will be a scalable platform that will retain its software library over generations, much like iOS software or PC software does (Valve is in a position to benefit from that). That solves problems 1 and 2. Indeed, Valve is exposed to little risk at the moment, having built up an extensive library of software and contracts in the long term. Any new competitor hoping to do battle with them in the PC space will need to start from zero, much like Microsoft will be with the Windows 10 storefront.

Nintendo's thus exposed to less risk the longer the platform keeps going for. In the short-term, 3DS, Wii U and Amiibo for those platforms shields them from risk. In the long term, even if NX has a tiny software library at launch, the platform will continue to develop and evolve over time that there will be a point at which it eventually becomes "good enough".

Nintendo can also release new hardware or form factors without having to start from scratch; they can fend off competitors much more easily as well. If Sony actually does end up making another handheld, Nintendo can release a "New NX handheld" while still allowing developers to maintain compatibility with the older handheld.

This is doable in the long run. iOS Devices from 2011 with the Apple A5 SoC still receive regular updates from Apple and support from developers, and they are approaching 5 years old now. The iPad 2 launched on the same day as the 3DS in some countries -- by the time developers and Apple stop supporting it it'll be at least as long as a standard console generation. Furthermore, the iPod Touch has been cannibalised sales-wise by the iPad, yet developing across all the various iOS hardware configurations is low-cost enough that Apple can continue supporting it, and developers continue to targeting it with their software.

So Iwata's comments about not knowing whether only one device may be needed in the future suggests Nintendo will test the waters with several form factors at first, and is unafraid to let one rule over the other. For example, an NX Handheld XL with a higher screen resolution and more real estate that developers can actually use (versus the 3DS XL which developers cannot target specifically) might cannibalise NX Handheld sales. It won't be the end for anyone buying or supporting the original NX Handheld though, and Nintendo would have been able to take the platform in a new direction with the theoretical NX Handheld XL.

Nintendo just needs to make sure the first set of hardware is future proof so they can ensure developers are able to support it for a long period of time. That way they can release new form factors and hardware without peeving off owners of early gen hardware who might not upgrade immediately. They should also encourage developers to adopt a "bottom-up" approach for some of their games, so that they still work great on older hardware before its lifecycle is up. That goes hand in hand with ensuring the first set of NX hardware is futureproof at the time when it launches.

Investing in DeNA for services and to build a new cloud based platform is smart -- Nintendo will likely want things to be as seamless as possible when switching between hardware on the NX platform.

Last edited by Toadthemushroom; 07-28-2015 at 10:06 PM.

As for concerns about software targeting a lowest common denominator. A lot of Android tablet software appear as giant phone apps due to both market fragmentation (the majority of Android tablets sold are 7" devices which aren't substantial enough in terms of screen real estate, so why bother making a good tablet app?) and a lack of good developer human interface guidelines which Google themselves don't even follow!

With NX, the idea is likely to make it easy to have the game running on both formats, which gives developers more time to focus on optimising the user experience and interface for those formats, rather than spend that time porting the raw game over.

This should hopefully make for some good reading:
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/11/what-makes-a-good-tablet-app/
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014...pop-and-the-problem-with-big-android-tablets/

NX will be a tightly controlled set of hardware, probably two product lines like iPhone and iPad, or iPad and Apple TV, updated every few years with a minimum of 5-6 years' support for each one (the iPad 2 was released at the same period as the 3DS, and is still being supported, for example). So there shouldn't be any worry about fragmentation, though if one product line doesn't sell particularly well (let's say, the console), then we might see developers not optimise the software well for the bigger screen.

Nintendo needs to set a good example for developers. While there are iOS apps which only play on the Apple TV or iPad (like strategy games), some developers take the lazy route out. Dragon Quest VIII on iPad, for example, makes no use of the different user experience one gets on an iPad, and retains the controls designed for one-handed operation. But it's unlikely AAA support will take such a lazy route out when players on the NX will likely have different expectations as to how games should scale from one format to the other. But we'll have to see.

I think he said he made it up before he announced it, there doesn't seem to be much reasoning behind it.

Aw, I was hoping it stood for Nintendo Cross, as in Cross Platform and Cross Development.

 

[Terrell]

I feel like all of this information about a unified platform is pretty boring and way too unimaginative. The way it's described just sounds like the cross buy and/or remote play Sony already has. So how is this news really? Sure it will be a nice addition to Nintendo platforms, but nothing to set the world on fire. There is no way this is Nintendo's big move.

Add cartridges into the mix. Cross buy can now exist in physical media without any internet reliance and is more likely to be something forward-compatible with consoles after it.

BOOM.

 

[orioto]

Yeah the truth is that none of the informations and estimations we have about the NX is fresh and innovative enough to be what they seem to see as a market changer that will put them back on the path of infinite money printing.

 

[Peru]

Yeah the truth is that none of the informations and estimations we have about the NX is fresh and innovative enough to be what they seem to see as a market changer that will put them back on the path of infinite money printing.

They don't need a market changer. It's ludicrous to expect or want one. As toadthemushroom points out right above you they need a way to ensure the availability of their total games output to a wide enough audience, which is what their new strategy aims at.

 

[beril]

Isn't there like a decade between the 750 and bobcat? And well... Everything else? And is bobcat really getting beaten in floating point by grandpa or is that some weird bench quirk?

remember that the number is /clock per core. 750CL was single core and capped at 1GHz. So yes the average bobcat chip will beat a 750CL in actual performance, but probably not the Wii U CPU which was the only multi core 7xx chip and with the highest clockspeed, in this particular benchmark at least

 

[blu]

Isn't there like a decade between the 750 and bobcat? And well... Everything else? And is bobcat really getting beaten in floating point by grandpa or is that some weird bench quirk?

Yes, Bobcat gets beaten by a decade-older CPU at dense matrix multiplication. The SIMD ISA of the Bobcat was designed back in 2001, and even then it was not particularly advanced. To get good performance in this test an SSE2 contender needs good OoO and multiple mul/add engines. Bobcat has neither, or at least not more than what the 750CL has.

This benchmark—like most—has to be read with caution. The fact that the SIMD blocks in those processors have different widths has dramatic consequences for this specific benchmark, but does not reflect the general performance of a CPU architecture.

While I agree with you that every benchmark has to be taken in its context (something people often forget), this particular benchmark is not as synthetic as some others - it actually measures the multiplicative and additive performance of a ISA + uarch combo when applied to the poster task of multiplication & addition - matrix multiplication. And the benchmark has not been "just run" on those CPUs - it has been tuned to each contender, e.g. the Intel Core numbers are actually better than most results out there due to uarch micro-optimisations.

remember that the number is /clock per core. 750CL was single core and capped at 1GHz. So yes the average bobcat chip will beat a 750CL in actual performance, but probably not the Wii U CPU which was the only multi core 7xx chip and with the highest clockspeed, in this particular benchmark at least

My gut tells me tri-core Espresso would beat many non-top-clock (< 1.6GHz) dual-core Bobcat configs in more than a few fp32-centric tasks.

15% increase in IPC is what I remember the big pitch being about.

Jaguar also doubles the SIMD ALUs to 4-way.

 

[Father_Brain]

Wii U suffers on lack of support that could satisfy any form of demand. If Nintendo can get the usual Japanese handheld support, now with the added bonus of making it an easy sell on console internationally, the NX home console will get more support through that. And Nintendo's repeating issue in the past has been ensuring a steady stream of software on all their platforms.

On this topic there's this fitting quote by Iwata (Source):

Well, getting better Japanese third party support than Wii U isn't exactly a high bar to clear. I don't think it'll translate to a large increase in sales in any region, though, especially if those titles are also available on the NX handheld.

 

[Neoxon]

Well, getting better Japanese third party support than Wii U isn't exactly a high bar to clear. I don't think it'll translate to a large increase in sales in any region, though, especially if those titles are also available on the NX handheld.

That's the thing. As long as one of the form factors succeeds & the other does at least okay, the platform as a whole will be fine. Most of the profits will come from the software that Nintendo doesn't have to make two of.

 

[Dr. Buni]

Yeah the truth is that none of the informations and estimations we have about the NX is fresh and innovative enough to be what they seem to see as a market changer that will put them back on the path of infinite money printing.

Don't worry, they have amiibos for that. Plus, they will make Nintendo animes!!

 

[Tatsumi Oga]

So chances of the Pro Controller and Gamepad working on the new system are very slim, right? And it seems Nintendo is probably coming with something touch related for the controller. As long as it's not fully touch in terms of buttons and sticks because that shit doesn't work, it's all good. If they do come with it, they better bring us a controller similar to Pro Controller as well.

 

[Neoxon]

So chances of the Pro Controller and Gamepad working on the new system are very slim, right? And it seems Nintendo is probably coming with something touch related for the controller. As long as it's not fully touch in terms of buttons and sticks because that shit doesn't work, it's all good. If they do come with it, they better bring us a controller similar to Pro Controller as well.

The only controller I could see being carried over to the NX Console is the GameCube Controller via the GameCube Adapter, & even then it'd only be used for Smash games (like how it is for the Wii U & Smash 4). If there's no backwards compatibility (which, if they go with ARM across the board, is likely something that Nintendo will forego on the console side of things anyway), there's next to no point in using older controllers besides the GameCube Controller for Smash purposes.

 

[BY2K]

Add cartridges into the mix. Cross buy can now exist in physical media without any internet reliance and is more likely to be something forward-compatible with consoles after it.

BOOM.

Oh my God...

 

[Datschge]

Well, getting better Japanese third party support than Wii U isn't exactly a high bar to clear.

That's what you may think. I look at how much Wii U is currently getting (the clear current gen console market leader in Japan), how much PS4 is getting (essentially all of it multiplatform with PS3 and/or Vita, in a market that traditionally avoided doing multiplatform releases to a fault). No Japanese third party developer is doing current gen home console releases on its own anymore anywhere.

So chances of the Pro Controller and Gamepad working on the new system are very slim, right?

Isn't the pro controller essentially a bluetooth device like all Wii controllers? I think all bluetooth devices have varying chances of seeing support on various levels. The gamepad is a different story as it uses 5ghz wireless instead and needs additional hardware on console side.

 

[Neoxon]

Oh my God...

But seriously, we should keep this thread from getting locked. It'd be nice to have one thread that gets continually updated with new tidbits of info when they become available.

 

[Übermatik]

Though a drought in Wii U titles might demonstrate otherwise, I'm actually keen on the idea that the NX releases not this year but next. I have no issues in waiting for a system if more time is needed to deliver on a quality experience. Let them get it right rather than rush a release.

 

[SpaceBridge]

One thing that always confused me was: will Nintendo not make a new handheld? Or is the NX a handheld that you can take with you but also plug into a "cradle" at home to turn into a home console?

I ask purely from selfish reasons as I've become more of a portable gamer in the past 3-4 years.

 

[Hermii]

One thing that always confused me was: will Nintendo not make a new handheld? Or is the NX a handheld that you can take with you but also plug into a "cradle" at home to turn into a home console?

I ask purely from selfish reasons as I've become more of a portable gamer in the past 3-4 years.

The NX (we think) is a family of systems running the same OS and are easy to port between (like IOS devices). It will launch with a handheld and a home console edition.

 

[Neoxon]

Though a drought in Wii U titles might demonstrate otherwise, I'm actually keen on the idea that the NX releases not this year but next. I have no issues in waiting for a system if more time is needed to deliver on a quality experience. Let them get it right rather than rush a release.

Considering that the 3DS is on its last legs & the Wii U is barely clinging to life, it'd be toxic to leave both on the market for much longer. We don't need a repeat of what happened with the Wii in 2011 & 2012. And if Square Enix showing their support this early & the NX Platform dev kits already going out is any indication (see Facts 8 & 9 respectively), we'll get an NX device this year.

Also, Hero of Legend, you missed a spot in Fact 9. Though to be fair, the rest of the article is locked behind a subscription, so I don't blame you.

The exact shape of the NX hardware isn't yet clear. People familiar with the development plans said Nintendo would likely include both a console and at least one mobile unit that could either be used in conjunction with the console or taken on the road for separate use. They also said Nintendo would aim to put industry-leading chips in the NX devices, after criticism that the Wii U's capabilities didn't match those of competitors.

UPDATE: Nevermind, it's in the original quote you put in the OP. My mistake.

One thing that always confused me was: will Nintendo not make a new handheld? Or is the NX a handheld that you can take with you but also plug into a "cradle" at home to turn into a home console?

I ask purely from selfish reasons as I've become more of a portable gamer in the past 3-4 years.

As you can see in Fact 2, it won't be a single device you can dock. What it will most likely be, or at least what we're speculating based on the bits & pieces of info that we have to work with, is what Hermii said.

The NX (we think) is a family of systems running the same OS and are easy to port between (like IOS devices). It will launch with a handheld and a home console edition.

 

[SpaceBridge]

The NX (we think) is a family of systems running the same OS and are easy to port between (like IOS devices). It will launch with a handheld and a home console edition.

So two different hardwares but can both run the same software?

 

[Neoxon]

So two different hardwares but can both run the same software?

At least.....that's what we're speculating based on the info we have.

 

[BY2K]

But seriously, we should keep this thread from getting locked. It'd be nice to have one thread that gets continually updated with new tidbits of info when they become available.

It just makes so much sense. If both systems share the same library what's the point of having them in 2 different formats.

The problem is... will the handheld be super powerful or will the home console be gimped?

 

[Slaythe]

Well Nintendo has always been the backwards compatible guy of the bunch.

Too bad shit region locking and selling 50hz pal games kind of kills all of that good will.

 

[Dreamwriter]

They already have a problem with spreading themselves too thin & having software droughts. Your interpretation would exacerbate the issue.

Iwata actually talks about that specific issue. Nintendo's next generation systems are all going to be based around the same architecture to make it easy to make a game for one platform and then easily port it to the other platforms without much effort. Iwata says this is so that there will be no software droughts, if they make a Mario 3D World for a console, they can then easily port the exact same game to handheld and then phone and then tablet and then TV. They may have to lower graphic quality and stuff, but no more need to start over almost from scratch like they had to do for Smash Bros. when writing it for both 3DS and Wii U. That's why Iwata said that they may have even more than two platforms in the future, because the shared development architecture solves the problem of needing more software for those other platforms.

 

[SpaceBridge]

At least.....that's what we're speculating based on the info we have.

So in theory; a Nintendo fan wouldn't miss out on great games whether they had the home console or the portable. That's pretty sweet if true. I just wonder if it would negatively effect the home console hardware if more customers bought the portable.

 

[Hero of Legend]

Also, Hero of Legend, you missed a spot in Fact 9. Though to be fair, the rest of the article is locked behind a subscription, so I don't blame you.

Oh, did I? Look again!

 

[Datschge]

The problem is... will the handheld be super powerful or will the home console be gimped?

In the ideal case the software freely scales based on the available hardware, making older games profit from running on newer hardware. Imagine it could start at 480i/60hz on NX handheld, newNX handheld gives 480p/60hz, NX console 720/60hz, NXHD console 1080/60hz, NX4K console etc. pp.

 

[Neoxon]

It just makes so much sense. If both systems share the same library what's the point of having them in 2 different formats.

The problem is... will the handheld be super powerful or will the home console be gimped?

What we've been speculating it for a while, mainly scaling the software to use bigger or smaller assets depending on the device being used. It would help alleviate the issues of having to keep the console & handheld close to one another in power.

Iwata actually talks about that specific issue. Nintendo's next generation systems are all going to be based around the same architecture to make it easy to make a game for one platform and then easily port it to the other platforms without much effort. Iwata says this is so that there will be no software droughts, if they make a Mario 3D World for a console, they can then easily port the exact same game to handheld and then phone and then tablet and then TV. They may have to lower graphic quality and stuff, but no more need to start over almost from scratch like they had to do for Smash Bros. when writing it for both 3DS and Wii U.

That's pretty much what the shared platform is, right down to the scaling of the game between multiple devices.

 

[ElTorro]

While I agree with you that every benchmark has to be taken in its context (something people often forget), this particular benchmark is not as synthetic as some others - it actually measures the multiplicative and additive performance of a ISA + uarch combo when applied to the poster task of multiplication & addition - matrix multiplication. And the benchmark has not been "just run" on those CPUs - it has been tuned to each contender, e.g. the Intel Core numbers are actually better than most results out there due to uarch micro-optimisations.

My point was that that is not representative of an architectures performance, especially because it heavily depends on the width of the SIMD block. For instance, a 4-way 128bit-wide SIMD unit will add/mult four 32bit floats in only one cycle while a 2-way SIMD unit will need two cycles. So the benchmark is heavily biased towards the width of the SIMD unit and virtually ignores things like branch prediction, cache performance, etc. It does not really represent the total performance of an architecture well.

 

[Neoxon]

Oh, did I? Look again!

Well then, my apologies. Usually you bold important details like that or note them in the summary.

 

[The Giant]

Well Nintendo did spend $100 million on a mystery tech aquisition back in early 2014. We still don't know what it was.

I'd say it's highly likely to be part of what makes the NX special. It could be something to do with streaming...or anything else to be honest.

Hopefully we find out this year, who this mysteries non japanese tech company nintendo bought out.

 

[Neoxon]

So in theory; a Nintendo fan wouldn't miss out on great games whether they had the home console or the portable. That's pretty sweet if true. I just wonder if it would negatively effect the home console hardware if more customers bought the portable.

If the console lags behind in sales, then it's likely that more developers will target the handheld. Same for if the handheld lags behind in sales (which could honestly go either way, given Japan's love of handhelds & the rise of mobile gaming). Though considering Nintendo's current situation, the former seems like the more likely scenario of the two.

 

[Bluth54]

So two different hardwares but can both run the same software?

Yeah it seems likely it will be like how a PC version of a game has different settings, the handheld would be the game on low and the console on high. Who knows if that's what we'll actually get though.

 

[SpaceBridge]

If the console lags behind in sales, then it's likely that more developers will target the handheld. Same for if the handheld lags behind in sales (which could honestly go either way, given Japan's love of handhelds & the rise of mobile gaming). Though considering Nintendo's current situation, the former seems like the more likely scenario of the two.

But wouldn't that defeat the purpose? If both devices play the same software then wouldn't developers just make two versions of the same game despite which hardware sells better? I certainly would expect Nintendo developed titles to have two versions.

 

[Hero of Legend]

Well then, my apologies. Usually you bold important details like that or note them in the summary.

Technically the console and handheld bit sounds more speculative though which is why I didn't include that in the summary. But looking at it again, it came from their sources (presumably developers) so I'll include that in the summary for now.

If anyone feels that it should be removed, feel free to suggest me doing so.

 

[Neoxon]

But wouldn't that defeat the purpose? If both devices play the same software then wouldn't developers just make two versions of the same game despite which hardware sells better?

Not exactly. The point of the shared platform, in theory, is to just make one game that scales. This would allow Nintendo to make just one Mario Kart or one Smash game & allow their developers to add more variety to the NX Platform's line-up. If the console ends up lagging behind, they just won't be as ambitious with their software in terms of how hard games push the devices (in the scenario that Nintendo's more willing to make NX Console-only games when necessary).

 

[Dreamwriter]

The problem is... will the handheld be super powerful or will the home console be gimped?

Neither. You aren't going to be running the exact same game between the two, you'll still be using the "Nintendo MegaBoy Plus" version of the game rather than the "Nintendo FunBox" version, it's just that developers will have a really easy time porting the game to all platforms. Otherwise it would be very unoptimal, people with the 6" handheld would be downloading/installing giant textures built to look good on 40" 4K UHD displays.

 

[SpaceBridge]

Not exactly. The point of the shared platform, in theory, is to just make one game that scales. This would allow Nintendo to make just one Mario Kart or one Smash game & allow their developers to add more variety to the NX Platform's line-up. If the console ends up lagging behind, they just won't be as ambitious with their software in terms of how hard games push the devices (in the scenario that Nintendo's more willing to make NX Console-only games when necessary).

Ok as long as there will still be a new Nintendo portable I will be happy.

 

[Neoxon]

Neither. You aren't going to be running the exact same game between the two, you'll still be using the "Nintendo MegaBoy Plus" version of the game rather than the "Nintendo FunBox" version, it's just that developers will have a really easy time porting the game to all platforms. Otherwise it would be very unoptimal, people with the 6" handheld would be downloading/installing giant textures built to look good on 40" 4K UHD displays.

Not necessarily. You can just download the higher-quality assets for the digital version whenever you install said game on the NX Console. As for the physical release, the 540p assets probably wouldn't take up that much space on a 32-64GB cartridge.

 

[Datschge]

@Hero of Legend: Mind adding the quote from http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=192322035&postcount=101 to the facts 2-4 block? I think "maintaining the active use rate of our platform" is one of the main catalyst behind all these moves.

But wouldn't that defeat the purpose? If both devices play the same software then wouldn't developers just make two versions of the same game despite which hardware sells better? I certainly would expect Nintendo developed titles to have two versions.

Currently the majority of Japanese third party software for Nintendo systems is made for the dominating handheld. Even the console getting exactly the same software would be an improvement for the console already.

 

[Dreamwriter]

Not necessarily. You can just download the higher-quality assets for the digital version whenever you install said game on the NX Console. As for the physical release, the 540p assets probably wouldn't take up that much space on a 32-64GB cartridge.

But it's more complicated than just that. I just finished porting a side scrolling game with lush 60fps graphics from PC to iPad/iPhone. The original game was written in Unity, so it could indeed just be recompiled for the other platform as if it were running the same game on both. But the PC game is so freaking resource-intensive, on iPad it would take 5 minutes to load a level, and then run at 10fps (and eventually crash due to running out of memory). We needed to lower the amount of things in the levels, less parallaxing, fewer giant full screen effects, use different texture compression, lower audio quality, even simplify the levels a bit. And more work had to be done after simplifying that stuff, for example after removing those giant full screen effects we had to replace them with completely different effects that used different code, that fit the platform better. The controls had to completely change too, from gamepad to touchscreen, so of course we also had to redo the menus and the tutorials.

To do the port correctly needed more than just throwing in some lower-res textures and rendering at 720p, and even if we were able to use the same exact build between the two, we wouldn't have chosen to, it would have almost been like including two separate games in one, a real waste (especially when the PC game is 2GB, iOS game 800MB - that's a significant amount of extra downloading)

 

[Neoxon]

But it's more complicated than just that. I just finished porting a side scrolling game with lush 60fps graphics from PC to iPad/iPhone. The original game was written in Unity, so it could indeed just be recompiled for the other platform as if it were running the same game on both. But the PC game is so freaking resource-intensive, on iPad it would take 5 minutes to load a level, and then run at 10fps (and eventually crash due to running out of memory). We needed to lower the amount of things in the levels, less parallaxing, fewer giant full screen effects, use different texture compression, lower audio quality, even simplify the levels a bit. And more work had to be done after simplifying that stuff, for example after removing those giant full screen effects we had to replace them with completely different effects that used different code, that fit the platform better. The controls had to completely change too, from gamepad to touchscreen, so of course we also had to redo the menus and the tutorials.

To do the port correctly needed more than just throwing in some lower-res textures and rendering at 720p, and even if we were able to use the same exact build between the two, we wouldn't have chosen to, it would have almost been like including two separate games in one, a real waste (especially when the PC game is 2GB, iOS game 800MB - that's a significant amount of extra downloading)

Getting the digital version would likely mean just getting the handheld assets or the console assets. If you got the physical cartridge, you'd likely get both sets of assets in one cartridge. If I wasn't clear with this in the previous post, I apologize.

 

[Hero of Legend]

@Hero of Legend: Mind adding the quote from http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=192322035&postcount=101 to the facts 2-4 block? I think "maintaining the active use rate of our platform" is one of the main catalyst behind all these moves.


Currently the majority of Japanese third party software for Nintendo systems is made for the dominating handheld. Even the console getting exactly the same software would be an improvement for the console already.

Sounds good to me, added. Thanks!

 

[NeonZ]

It just makes so much sense. If both systems share the same library what's the point of having them in 2 different formats.

The problem is... will the handheld be super powerful or will the home console be gimped?

If they're really going for a shared library, rather than just two separate systems with ease of porting (that would likely be pointless in the long run), I fully expect the home console to be gimped in comparison to what one could expect otherwise.

It'd make no sense to have a large gap between them and expect developers, even Nintendo themselves considering their limited output, to basically make two very different versions of every game, since that'd be the only way the console's power would be actually shown. Also, power on par with the PS4 wouldn't really be a selling point anymore at this point, and Nintendo isn't going to make anything close to a PS5 at this point. So, I think power of the upcoming console could easily be sacrificed in order to make the shared library concept work.

 

[blu]

My point was that that is not representative of an architectures performance, especially because it heavily depends on the width of the SIMD block. For instance, a 4-way 128bit-wide SIMD unit will add/mult four 32bit floats in only one cycle while a 2-way SIMD unit will need two cycles. So the benchmark is heavily biased towards the width of the SIMD unit and virtually ignores things like branch prediction, cache performance, etc. It does not really represent the total performance of an architecture well.

It's not as simple. While SIMD width does matter, you've surely noticed that the widest ISA is not the best per-clock performer in this test. Actually, the second-widest is not the best performer either..

Last but not least, there's a notable variation in the 2-way bunch.

 

[ElTorro]

It's not as simple. While SIMD width does matter, you've surely noticed that the widest ISA is not the best per-clock performer in this test. Actually, the second-widest is not the best performer either..

Last but not least, there's a notable variation in the 2-way bunch.

That benchmark still ignores much/most of what determines the overall performance of an architecture. I am just saying that the meaningfulness of the benchmark is much lower than a casual reader of the thread might think.

 

[Hilarion]

The shared library leads to my big issue with the NX. I'm almost definitely going to get an NX, but it might end up just being the portable one. I'm not seeing an extensive reason to double-dip in this scenario.

If the console is just the NX Portable game in 1080p/60FPS with bells and whistles like antialiasing and anisotropic filtering and all that other good stuff, I think that the handheld-only route becomes very viable.

 

[blu]

That benchmark still ignores much/most of what determines the overall performance of an architecture. I am just saying that the meaningfulness of the benchmark is much lower than a casual reader of the thread might think.

Does it?

The best performer in the test is a very strong OoO uarch, with the 3rd widest SIMD.

Did you actually bother to read it? (yes, I did see your edit)