dragonelite
Member
Ooh advchina I have been following them for a couple of weeks, they show China in a positive and negative light from a outsider perspective.
Because I would like to do some traveling in Asia in the future.
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Why Anyone Can Be Chinese - WSJ
- Thread starter ponpo
- Start date
Ooh advchina I have been following them for a couple of weeks, they show China in a positive and negative light from a outsider perspective.
Because I would like to do some traveling in Asia in the future.
I mean apparently I'm not even black enough to be considered African American unless I'm out of the country. So maybe that's why the "you'll always be an outsider to some degree" thing never really bothers me anymore.
I never knew this. I thought 中国人 was used for both until now. Thanks for the clarification. My teacher would only talk about Nationality when we brought stuff up like this and I never thought to ask anyone about race specifically for some reason.
You haven't been looking that hard then, "I hate China" expat testimonials are a dime a dozen.
Curious as to why you're so eager to jump from "some Chinese people on bilibili" to "Chinese people kind of suck"
lightskintwin
Banned
You mean generalizing over 1 billion Chinese as kinda sucking is racist because a number of Chinese people attacked a person's YouTube channel and tried reporting him to the police for spying? Surely that's enough of a sample size to make that generalization. LOL
You're right in how causal it was said.
cubicle47b
Member
So you have to do better than be a dean at a Chinese university? Do you have to be an astronaut or something?
Gully State
Member
Chinese of Canadian descent. I'm equally confused here..
Widdle Puppy
Banned
Being American and being Chinese are two different identities that occupy two different spheres of interpretation.
The basis of American identity is that people are unified not by their ethnic background but by a secular state which promises everyone is equal in the eyes of the law along with ensuring these rights and liberties etc.
Being Chinese means that you belong to some ethnic group that originates from China.
Identity and ethnicity are often viewed differently depending on who the viewer is and changes depending on the context of who is interpreting the identity.
He is not Chinese and will never be Chinese.
The basis of American identity is that people are unified not by their ethnic background but by a secular state which promises everyone is equal in the eyes of the law along with ensuring these rights and liberties etc.
Being Chinese means that you belong to some ethnic group that originates from China.
Identity and ethnicity are often viewed differently depending on who the viewer is and changes depending on the context of who is interpreting the identity.
He is not Chinese and will never be Chinese.
cubicle47b
Member
Caucasian-Chinese?
He is 中国人 (nationality) but not 华人 (ethnicity)
The current issue with English language is they call both ethnicity and nationality the same thing: "Chinese", which is causing some weird projections in our discussions.
lightskintwin
Banned
I'm light as fuck and have always been considered African American. Do you look like Logic? LOL
lightskintwin
Banned
You're saying my afro features, right? I assume you have a lack of them?
I'm light as fuck too. If you look at me you'd probably know I was black haha
I mean culturally. Like people are always telling me I don't like enough black stuff or dont sound black enough (whatever that means) or don't count when someone's talking about black ppl things . Atleast the always happened when I was growing up in Georgia.
When I travel every other black person I see is all friendly like "AYYYYY BRO!!" and just excited to see another person who looks like them
I'm just invoking that hilariously bad Splatoon thread.
but pretty much I got the hair and the rest makes me ambiguous af
davidwhangchoi
Member
hahahaha
This is unfortunately normal.
My nieces who are a shade lighter were still told that they weren't "black enough"... Like, smh, they're like 4 years old. What do you want them to do?
l2ounD
Member
What about those French Canadians, I hear they like to always put French infront of Canadian.
You know maybe we should start calling white americans, caucasian-american
Mr. Mister
Member
When you travel outside of the country people call you African-American? I feel like outside of our country people just say American.
This topic is interesting because it's impossible to wrap our countrys specific terminology and views on a global level so we end up in odd situations that we don't have proper language to describe.
DOWN
Banned
Thats to specify ethnic background usually. Those people still get called just American in many cases.
HAHAHA
lightskintwin
Banned
Oh yeah, I've seen that happen. I grew up in Georgia too and didn't have those issues. At worst, I might be called "lite brite" or "white boy" but usually it was all in jest.
You're right it's just American outside the country. My ethnic background can come into question depending upon where I'm at too even in America.
It's not generalising enough. It should be European-American -- and when they correct you (South Europe, Scandinavia etc.) just roll your eyes. It's only fair.
It certainly isnt any lack of commitment on my part to American culture. Ive been working on Enlightenment philosophy for many years, and it inspires the way I lead my life. Im told over and over that my commitment to American culture is more American than that of many American people. At conferences in the US, I often find myself the only person wearing colonial style clothing.
Yeah it sucks growing up. Like you're always kinda an outsider. Even if they're just joking it's pretty bad when 8/10 people are joking about that same thing.
But at the same time I think that helped me be more comfortable in different countries. Which is weird lol
I'd become your friend just because this would be funny
It might be because I was considered "white washed" since I didn't really grow up around many black people until like 10th grade.
Aaronology
Member
Thanks for the giggle before bed.
I'm frankly baffled by it. Yes, I get that he comes across as weird when he comments on his being the only one in traditional dress (take the hint?), but that shouldn't make it impossible to comprehend the argument he's trying to make. And I don't understand the appeal of becoming Chinese, myself, but China should be working at figuring out how to make that case and how to successfully integrate immigrants:
There are many expats in Mexico who say "I'm Mexican now!" and we actually have no problem with that. There's even the saying "los mexicanos nacemos donde se nos pega la gana" (we Mexicans are born wherever we feel like). Heck one of my friends here in Japan is a Korean guy who used to live in Mexico and calls himself a "chilango" (someone from Mexico City). He can dance traditional Mexican dances that I definitely can't lol. So, I don't know, I see the cringey aspect of this (and my friend doesn't wear a poncho and a sombrero), but if someone feels strongly about a culture that they weren't born in, that's not so terrible. Personally I'd never do that, actually living outside of Mexico made me appreciate and love my country even more.
Zoe
Member
Nationality, ethnicity, and race are all different things.
Perhaps its the typical 'who the fuck would want to be Asian' thing. This thread is sad.
Gully State
Member
Author wrote this article because he was tired of being asked "where are you really from?" by random Chinese people..
If this dude isn't answering where he was born he's being difficult.
But I hate that question.
That's a common thing? Wow
lightskintwin
Banned
Yeah, that's probably it. I grew up in a predominately middle class Black neighborhood in Stone Mountain and went to a predominately Black High School at Redan. Despite how I look and carry myself, I can tell how surprised some Black people are, particularly Black women, with how "Black" I am and sound because they expect me to be act and sound "White washed". Obviously the ability to adjust it at certain ranges is invaluable depending upon the type of social group i'm encountering.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
In Mexicos case, they're definitely more open to the idea of immigrants than China. Watching the ADVChina video posted earlier, it seems that foreigners are restricted heavily in what they can do, no matter how much they live there or adopt to the culture.
So it's not a matter of seeing a Canadian as Chinese-It's that not even China will see them as Chinese.
You're baffled that a country closed off for much of modern history and without a global colonial reach might not be conceived of in terms of ethnicity and nationality the same way that some Western countries are? France didn't become ~postracial~ overnight.
excelsiorlef
Member
It's some damn near Rachel Dolezal shit
I don't think it includes any caveats.
There are plenty of non-Han citizens to begin with in Mainland China, and there are plenty of foreigners that have obtained Chinese citizenship (especially in Hong Kong). In fact, if a foreigner has a child with a Chinese national, the child has Chinese citizenship and the parents need to actively apply to renounce the citizenship.
Well, here's the deal.
He can be Chinese, but first, China gets to pass laws banning certain nationalities from entering the country. Then, they can make a gentleman's agreement to de facto ban entire ethnicities. Soon after, China will allow lynchings of members of those groups to go unpunished. (Maybe they already do this.) Those immigrants aren't allowed to own property, or marry Chinese people. Then when China decides it needs to go to war against a certain country, they ask a neighboring country for help to fight them, in exchange for lifting the immigration ban, in that they allow 15 people from that nationality to enter per year. Then just in case, they should round up all the people of the nationality they are at war with, regardless of if they were born in China or not, and feel like they are all Chinese and throw them in a detainment camp and take all their property. And if people are mad about it, make them take a loyalty test. Those that fail get sent to a different camp. Oh, all these camps are ridiculously remote and far from where they originally settled and built lives. OK, once the war is over, wait a while to let them out the camps. Because reasons. Then, for the next several decades, all their children will be subjected to being treated like foreigners, regardless of their Chinese fluency or how little connection they may feel to their country of ancestral origin. This should allow time for Chinese culture to develop two sets of stereotypes, one set is patently demeaning and offensive. The other will be patronizing and offensive, but the Chinese will tell their children that they are good stereotypes, and they have it much better than say, oh, the Uighurs. Then China will use them as a wedge/tool against other ethnic groups. And the whole time, China will assume everyone that looks like them is from like 3 places, US, Canada and...Belgium.
Yeah. That sounds like a plan.
He can be Chinese, but first, China gets to pass laws banning certain nationalities from entering the country. Then, they can make a gentleman's agreement to de facto ban entire ethnicities. Soon after, China will allow lynchings of members of those groups to go unpunished. (Maybe they already do this.) Those immigrants aren't allowed to own property, or marry Chinese people. Then when China decides it needs to go to war against a certain country, they ask a neighboring country for help to fight them, in exchange for lifting the immigration ban, in that they allow 15 people from that nationality to enter per year. Then just in case, they should round up all the people of the nationality they are at war with, regardless of if they were born in China or not, and feel like they are all Chinese and throw them in a detainment camp and take all their property. And if people are mad about it, make them take a loyalty test. Those that fail get sent to a different camp. Oh, all these camps are ridiculously remote and far from where they originally settled and built lives. OK, once the war is over, wait a while to let them out the camps. Because reasons. Then, for the next several decades, all their children will be subjected to being treated like foreigners, regardless of their Chinese fluency or how little connection they may feel to their country of ancestral origin. This should allow time for Chinese culture to develop two sets of stereotypes, one set is patently demeaning and offensive. The other will be patronizing and offensive, but the Chinese will tell their children that they are good stereotypes, and they have it much better than say, oh, the Uighurs. Then China will use them as a wedge/tool against other ethnic groups. And the whole time, China will assume everyone that looks like them is from like 3 places, US, Canada and...Belgium.
Yeah. That sounds like a plan.
I hope they ask him which Canada he's from. North Canada or South Canada.
Oh yeah I grew up in Duluth. My school was most Hispanic , Korean,and Vietnamese. Most people who don't know where I'm from think I'm some surfer dude when they hear my voice lmao.
I always felt like I don't have a specific culture. Maybe just "melting pot " culture whatever that is.
But I I couldn't imagine how confusing it might be for someone who migrated to a country as a kid being told their not American enough but then they're told they're not whatever their home country is either. I got off SUPER easy haha
May I veto this?
I guess it's fine if he would like to be considered a Chinese national.
But I can sense a racial dynamic here with a non-Asian wanting to identify with a specific Asian culture/identity.
Like suppose if this guy were regarded as legitimate Chinese, would you think he'd be a proper representative on speaking behalf of issues and topics that have affected ethnic Chinese? Would he be willing to identify with the struggles that ethnic Chinese have faced in other countries? I'd assume Chinese heritage and identity have been sources of strength for Chinese living abroad, and many times Chinese probably have been targeted because of their heritage and identity (this could be applied to the experience of many Asians here). It would feel strange were a non-Chinese could just assume Chinese identity without the baggage of looking Chinese.
I guess as a person of Asian descent, I would have a problem if someone wants to join the Asian club but probably wouldn't have the experience of being on the receiving end of racial slurs and abuses that were assaults on our identities, heritage, and dignity.
But I can sense a racial dynamic here with a non-Asian wanting to identify with a specific Asian culture/identity.
Like suppose if this guy were regarded as legitimate Chinese, would you think he'd be a proper representative on speaking behalf of issues and topics that have affected ethnic Chinese? Would he be willing to identify with the struggles that ethnic Chinese have faced in other countries? I'd assume Chinese heritage and identity have been sources of strength for Chinese living abroad, and many times Chinese probably have been targeted because of their heritage and identity (this could be applied to the experience of many Asians here). It would feel strange were a non-Chinese could just assume Chinese identity without the baggage of looking Chinese.
I guess as a person of Asian descent, I would have a problem if someone wants to join the Asian club but probably wouldn't have the experience of being on the receiving end of racial slurs and abuses that were assaults on our identities, heritage, and dignity.
miller.skippins
Banned
Chinese can mean 2 things..
Nationality or Ethnicity.
I think the author meant Nationality or a sense of National identity and belonging?
If so, yes..i kinda agree.
If Ethnicity, then no. Sorry, you can't change your skin color or genes.
Nationality or Ethnicity.
I think the author meant Nationality or a sense of National identity and belonging?
If so, yes..i kinda agree.
If Ethnicity, then no. Sorry, you can't change your skin color or genes.
Sure, in whatever year is the equivalent of 1952 in my example.
Actually it came in three waves, voting rights were granted in 1943, 1946 and 1952, by nationality.
Underrated post 👍
Mr. Mister
Member
So a Canadian should use US history to determine if they feel like a citizen of another country? SMH at Americans.
Though to be fair I also get a slightly creepy vibe from article.