You get it! And just like many other long running series, don't expect any of the conclusions you want because Ash is never going to be a champion unless it's a filler arc like Orange Islands.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Why is the Pokemon anime dumbed down outside Japan?
- Thread starter BodiesWithoutOrgans
- Start date
You get it! And just like many other long running series, don't expect any of the conclusions you want because Ash is never going to be a champion unless it's a filler arc like Orange Islands.
Weeaboosuke
Member
The japanese version of the Korrina fight is godlike.
AnkiRendan
Member
Actually, he is at Professor Oak's now, ever since the end of the Black/White anime.
Also, despite how much I didn't like 4kids, they did a good job with Pokemon. And if you watched Pokemon the First Movie subbed, well... Mew gives a Hitler like speech. The dub handled that and the characters much better.
Except Tracy, they dumbed him down a lot, in the sub he's incredibly smart.
Except Tracy, they dumbed him down a lot, in the sub he's incredibly smart.
Mr. Nice_Guy
Member
Preach. But honestly some of the orchestral tracks Saban (? I forget who) did are actually pretty great, especially the one played during digivolutions. Too bad they never released them as far as I know.
DirgeExtinction
Member
Yesss. So much emotion. And the music.
The voice acting is poor directing and production work. I think they also hired cheap in order to keep profits higher. Changing music may be a licensing issue that would result in more money being shoved out, so it may be chraper the hire in-house musician or contract one. Also note that they have to worry about distributing to more than just English and the US in some cases, so instead of worrying about just Japanese music licenses from that orchestra for Japanese consumption, the other countries and dubs probably get abother licensing nightmare that asks for more money and time. If you're on a schedule to distribute widely in a small amount of time, cuts have to be made.
The Last One
Member
What are you talking about? Ash has been leveling up Pikachu for less than a year.
He's pretty dumb in all seasons. He can never seem to use the right Pokemon for a battle. He doesn't seem to ever know what type is weak against another.
Not to mention he's always pretty oblivious to the female travelling with him, especially if that female has feelings for him (i.e. Misty and now Serena).
I just want to see him finally wake up and notice the female travelling with him has feelings for him. It almost feels like they may head that way with Serena. She's more open about her feelings (to the viewers anyway) than Misty was.
BoosterDuck
Banned
Hey Digimon, hey Digimon
Monster friends to the boys and girls
Hey Digimon, hey Digimon
Champions of the digital world
Mr. Nice_Guy
Member
I said SOME.
Tivor Tontomo
Member
First of all you dont seem to realize pokemon is dumbed down in general.
2. the voice acting is atrocious in japanaese, those who think Jp VA is better only do so because they dont understand it so its less cringe, Ive seen Japanese complain about voice acting and weird odd music choices during pokemon and Yu Gi Oh. Japanaese yu Gi Oh is just pure nonsense with some of the script and music choices during certain events, U.s. yu Gi Oh is known for making the series seem more serious than it is despite one of the reasons being an edit, which would be the shadow realm.
2. the voice acting is atrocious in japanaese, those who think Jp VA is better only do so because they dont understand it so its less cringe, Ive seen Japanese complain about voice acting and weird odd music choices during pokemon and Yu Gi Oh. Japanaese yu Gi Oh is just pure nonsense with some of the script and music choices during certain events, U.s. yu Gi Oh is known for making the series seem more serious than it is despite one of the reasons being an edit, which would be the shadow realm.
Alex_Mexico
Member
Do many grown adults here on NeoGAF still follow the Pokemon anime? I was a huuuuge fan during the first three seasons but around the time of the 3rd gen (Advanced) I dropped it like a bad habit. Now? I can't even begin to ponder following this garbled mess.
And after all these years, generations, ever revolving door of supporting characters, and 500 Pokemon the worst trainer in the world (Ash) is somehow still 10.
Meh.
And after all these years, generations, ever revolving door of supporting characters, and 500 Pokemon the worst trainer in the world (Ash) is somehow still 10.
Meh.
BodiesWithoutOrgans
Member
I do I've watched the anime since day 1 season 1-8 in English and season 9 to present (season 19) in Japanese subbed English.
The plot at the moment is Team Flare hunting Zyarde is really good at the moment and so dramatic in Japanese it really hooks you.
I do but it's harder for me now since I don't have cable anymore. I watched the dub.
SoundPulse
Banned
Even as a kid, I lost interest when this bullshit happened.
I don't follow it per say, but I do watch it every now and then. I'd be happy if they gave Ash an ending and went to using the game characters. Hell, adapt Special if you have to.
whiteninja
Member
I still remember watching the opening for the first pokemon movie from a leaked crappy rmbv video from the Japanese version. When I finally saw it in the theater i was so disappointed they took the song out and put some generic music in there, totally killed the mood.
mikefrails
Banned
I'd love to see an honest approach to Ash in the anime. He doesn't even appear in the games so it confuses me why they seem so overprotective of how he's portrayed in the cartoon.
The English openings are fine. Quite good in fact.
But the background music changes are unnecessary and don't help the English dubbed version.
That said, it's a kids show, so you can't expect too much out of it. But, this has been a general trend with kids anime. When it gets dubbed into English, it's made even more simplistic and juvenile than the original Japanese version was. I don't know why, considering that a lot of American kids shows, like Adventure Time, do have more mature themes. For some reason those same standards don't seem to get applied to English dubbed kids anime. It is curious.
But the background music changes are unnecessary and don't help the English dubbed version.
That said, it's a kids show, so you can't expect too much out of it. But, this has been a general trend with kids anime. When it gets dubbed into English, it's made even more simplistic and juvenile than the original Japanese version was. I don't know why, considering that a lot of American kids shows, like Adventure Time, do have more mature themes. For some reason those same standards don't seem to get applied to English dubbed kids anime. It is curious.
This is something I've been curious about too. Why does this happen? Steven Universe even has some very heavy things in the show and it's aimed at kids primarily, but when anime aimed at kids come over, it's reduced to something more simplistic.
papertoonz
Member
some people in the pokemon Communtiy thread still follow it, most of the stick with the SUB just because its better
as the quality you droped off when the sries was starting to get better, Advanced has it's problem but the whole battle frontier is great and the DP series is also great if not for some bad spots
BW is shit but XY is really good, battles are the best the series has ever had and ash is back to being his self from DP and not his dumb self from BW
petran79
Banned
Aaron Strife
Banned
The music replacement is ass. It was ass during 4Kids too but they kept most of it until the middle of Johto when everyone tuned out. Watch a random episode of Advanced Generation dubbed by them and pay attention to the music, you'll see what I mean.
If a company is going to Americanize an anime they should look at Yo-Kai Watch as an example. The only real problem with it is they don't really try to match the dialogue to the mouth movements but aside from that it's pretty solid for a children's anime dub. The dub version of Gera Po is pretty great.
If a company is going to Americanize an anime they should look at Yo-Kai Watch as an example. The only real problem with it is they don't really try to match the dialogue to the mouth movements but aside from that it's pretty solid for a children's anime dub. The dub version of Gera Po is pretty great.
Acerac
Banned
Rising_Hei
Member
4kids does this thing to every anime they broadcast as well, it's a real shame.
Cartoons are also for children in Japan, at least anime like Pokemon. That has nothing to do with the quality of the product though, being for children.
I remember how I didn't like the Kirby anime's score when it played on TV. When I later found out that not only did the original have the themes from the game but that practically all of the music was replaced in the American version, I was pretty pissed. There was absolutely no reason to replace the Checker Knights music that was used in the Japanese version of the show.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
5Ds was dumb as shit though, even for a Yu Gi Oh anime.
It's a different audience, probably a much smaller audience and used to different production values, and a completely different industry. Dubs have always sucked that's why people move on to subs. Till they notice filler in anime suck and the adaptations are mostly promotional material for the manga and read that. Till they realize that as well is often, though to a much lesser degree than anime, just promotional material for LNs and read that. Till they realize 90% of them are shit and almost identical and stop reading.
I love this song so much. German VO in general makes animation seem more "sophisticated" in a way.
Now I know you don't watch the animé otherwise you would have known that that level don't exist in the animé universe.
Have you watched the latest season? Because Ash rarely use Pikachu. Plus Pikachu is the series mascot they aren't going to get rid of him.
They weren't that great, Red was a lot dumber than Ash.
You should have seen how long it took Ash to get his final Sinnoh Gym Badge...it took a year. ¬_¬;
So long as the Pokémon series keep going Ash's Journey will not end either.
I still watch it, though I haven't kept up with gen 6 as Ash's team is just boring.
Why do people keep going on about this minor and pointless fact?
Yeah Ash is Ten so what? You're watching a show that has a yellow electric mouse shooting a bolt of lighting from his cheek, reality clearly does not apply to what is a children show.
Basically Ash is Ten so he can appeal to the children that watch the show no matter what generation Ash is in.
RecRoulette
Member
Sounds a bit different but not THAT much different. Kinda wish they made they made an anime adaptation of the Pokemon Adventures series. Giovanni was straight up murdering Pokemon in that. His Cloyster freezes a Magmar and breaks it into pieces!
Chiramii
Member
That anime music rendition of Oldale Town is such a magnificent and soothing song.
People can say what they want about 4Kids, and I'll admit some of their editing was complete non-sense. But TPCi completely butchered the english dub with their choice of voice actors and music selection.
I watched season 1-8 in english, then made the switch to japanese with english subs from season 9-present. I wouldn't touch the current dub with a ten foot pole.
People can say what they want about 4Kids, and I'll admit some of their editing was complete non-sense. But TPCi completely butchered the english dub with their choice of voice actors and music selection.
I watched season 1-8 in english, then made the switch to japanese with english subs from season 9-present. I wouldn't touch the current dub with a ten foot pole.
Sounds a bit different but not THAT much different. Kinda wish they made they made an anime adaptation of the Pokemon Adventures series. Giovanni was straight up murdering Pokemon in that. His Cloyster freezes a Magmar and breaks it into pieces!
Yeah, I liked the brutality of that manga. I mean this is what I call a fucking "Slash":
Don't think we'd ever see the games get this edgy, but I'd love to see it. I always considered my Pokemon dead when they fainted anyway, lol. Nurse Joy is in the resurrection business.
Baron von Loathsome
Member
I wish there was a better Pokemon cartoon than the anime we're stuck with.
Ignoring the irrelevance of the bolded, people generally like to see characters they have grown to like progress. Whether through personal growth as a character or the accomplishment of their goals.
Now I haven't kept up with the show as much as I used to, and I heard the most recent season has actually been improving things, but Ash has achieved neither of these based on what I know (at least not in any substantial ways that holds throughout the series). Everything has always reverted back to the status quo with the only changes being who he travels with and what he wears. Occasionally Ash will fight someone who uses a move he had to deal with before and he pulls a fast one, but that's about it.
His story doesn't seem to be getting anywhere and it is disheartening.
One of the main reasons why I rarely watch dubs. A lot of the times, the VA is inconsistent especially if it's a massive series.
Ranma 1/2 was an example where Ranma's English voice got changed multiple times.
I'd imagine it'd be much worse for Children's anime where they episode count is usually in the hundreds.
Ranma 1/2 was an example where Ranma's English voice got changed multiple times.
I'd imagine it'd be much worse for Children's anime where they episode count is usually in the hundreds.
This. They actually keep the music (and it's from the game which is a plus) and they retain the tone and feel of the original. Well some people are annoyed they change human names, it's a necessary evil.
Not a fan of the other theme song they use, I wish they stuck with English Gera Gera Po and didn't alternate.
Aaron Strife
Banned
Yeah the other song is kind of meh, I'm guessing there's some obligation to play it. But you know if 4Kids or Saban were dubbing it they would have just thrown out the Japanese song (and music) wholesale and their new song would probably be even worse. It's an ok compromise.
Did you guys see that Pretty Cure is on Netflix now? Except it's Glitter Force and it's dubbed about as well as the 90s Sailor Moon/Cardcaptors dubs. Like who's watching this? My understanding is these kids' anime dubbing practices is pretty much a thing of the past except for long-running like Pokemon and Yugioh (which is still dubbed by 4Kids, they're just owned by Konami and go under a different name).
Dimentionalist
Member
These are more or less my thoughts on the current state of the dub, but the lousy script adaptation is also a pretty big factor in its (lack of) quality. I found the 4Kids dub to be fairly enjoyable, dumb edits aside ("NOTHING BEATS A JELLY-FILLED DONUT!"). A lot of that had to do with the dialogue. The 4Kids actually had some genuinely funny moments, even when it wasn't being true to the original script.
James Carter Cathcart, the script writer under TPCi (and the current voice for James and Meowth), can't write with a darn. He seems to think constant alliteration is a substitute for actual humor. As much as I don't like the voice acting, it's hard to really blame the talent when they're tasked with making stuff like "it's amazing that science is so amazing" sound believable.
MillionVolts
Member
In this day when the vast majority of anime dubs are quite good and taken seriously, it is indeed a shame to see Pokémon still in many ways stuck in 1998.
At the very least, the scripts are more faithful nowadays. But the music is just tragic; I could at least stomach the dub if they just kept the original BGM (like they did in movies 4 through 16).
At the very least, the scripts are more faithful nowadays. But the music is just tragic; I could at least stomach the dub if they just kept the original BGM (like they did in movies 4 through 16).
I've heard bad things about "Glitter Force". Saban is stuck in the 90's when it comes to anime. It's the same thing with Digimon Xros Wars (called Fusion in the dub), lull destruction, music changes, names changes (the weirdest being Lillithmon to Laylamon since Lillithmon had already been used in the DS games), just downright unwatchable.
Hell, it took four terrible seasons of Power Rangers to knock some sense into Saban, which had a similar "stuck in the 90's" thought process.
