TheExplodingHead
Banned
Best post in the thread.
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Wii U Community Thread
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Best post in the thread.
Haemi
Member
Hi everyone! Junior Member just after 2 Weeks.
P-100 looks absolutely ok. Small characters that are always in motion don't need to be very detailed. Even the shadows are not as detailed as the ones of the big objects.
But why aren't they using tessellation for wheels or other round objects? Wouldn't be too hard to implement. Is there some proof that Wii U has a tessellation unit?
P-100 looks absolutely ok. Small characters that are always in motion don't need to be very detailed. Even the shadows are not as detailed as the ones of the big objects.
But why aren't they using tessellation for wheels or other round objects? Wouldn't be too hard to implement. Is there some proof that Wii U has a tessellation unit?
JoshuaJSlone
Member
In what way? It doesn't deviate much from being 3DS-but-bigger, doesn't add any of the GamePad's features 3DS didn't have, doesn't do something like putting the d-pad/buttons on the same level.BlackJace said:
Well sure, Reggie, but we've known about these games for what, 1-3 years at this point? We were hoping to get an idea of a new thing to want to see.Reggie said:
Chittagong
Gold Member
It was not a good trailer. Especially this eyesore:
.
N64 = 2 Wii Us duct taped together
Some people really should realise that tiny models like that are never complex or detailed. Often they're made to look like they are using a LOD system (as the camera zooms in resources previously used to show the surrounding area are used to progressively increase the detail of the characters). It seems Platinum Games aren't implementing that kind of system, you'd have to imagine that must be because you almost never get close to the character models. Unless of course they just haven't implemented it yet.
Of course a lot of people who're whining about that shot probably already know this and just choose to ignore it.
Of course a lot of people who're whining about that shot probably already know this and just choose to ignore it.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
gamergirly
Member
Humm. That Reggie thread is full of people who were not going to buy any Nintendo products in the first place but still want to complain about them. Way too much focus on NSMBWii U. I also find it funny how some have ignored the games that were announced on Nintendo Direct. Double standard
Also, some are still not taking that "6 month game window" too well. If you are going to go so far as to say that 2D Mario is not Mario(LOL,as if Mario 64 was the first game), than you definitely have too much frustration and overemphasis of specific titles n the Wii U launch. It might be time to go play some video games for a while and get off GAF
Also, some are still not taking that "6 month game window" too well. If you are going to go so far as to say that 2D Mario is not Mario(LOL,as if Mario 64 was the first game), than you definitely have too much frustration and overemphasis of specific titles n the Wii U launch. It might be time to go play some video games for a while and get off GAF
Those certainly aren't COD level graphics, they're also cut scenes rather than zoomed in gameplay (every level starts with that kind of cut scene doesn't it?). Not arguing that its not possible for Platinum Games to implement a LOD system that smooths out those characters ect because of course it is. Just commenting on the images.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
I was being a smart arse 
. And no, that should be in-engine graphics as high LOD models are loaded into the memory when zooming in. The advantages of building a PC-first game.
For its time, the original Company of Heroes was also very impressive in regards to the level of detail it achieved in a strategy game when zoomed in.
Is this the "six months = launch window" thing? Because nobody should take that well. It's bullshit, plain and simple.
It's like how stores seem to have Christmas/Easter propaganda installed earlier and earlier each year, months before the actual event. Six months after launch is not a reasonable 'launch window' no matter how much Reggie and co might believe it to be.
. And no, that should be in-engine graphics as high LOD models are loaded into the memory when zooming in. The advantages of building a PC-first game.For its time, the original Company of Heroes was also very impressive in regards to the level of detail it achieved in a strategy game when zoomed in.
Is this the "six months = launch window" thing? Because nobody should take that well. It's bullshit, plain and simple.
It's like how stores seem to have Christmas/Easter propaganda installed earlier and earlier each year, months before the actual event. Six months after launch is not a reasonable 'launch window' no matter how much Reggie and co might believe it to be.
I was being a smart arse
For its time, the original Company of Heroes was also very impressive in regards to the level of detail it achieved in a strategy game when zoomed in.
Of yeah its in engine, I just meant that those graphics are rendered from that perspective from the beginning as they're opening level cut scenes. Its hard to imagine that they could zoom in that close during game play and increase detail to that degree without making the detail changes extremely obvious.
Who knows, maybe they have a fantastic LOD system and I'm no expert on it. I did play the first Company of Heroes, but I can't remember that first game being able to zoom in that close and see models that detailed during game play.
Not that it matters, there's a huge difference between those close ups and the one from P-100 and obviously Platinum Games should be able to do much better with a little bit of effort.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
The Total War series is also an excellent example of good scaling LOD that allows for pretty incredible detail when zoomed in. And this is a game that can push 1000+ units in a single scene.
But, again, PC technology from the ground up. Rome 2 will probably look even better.
EDIT: For what it's worth, I think P-100 has an excellent style and I don't really see why anybody would have a problem with it.
But, again, PC technology from the ground up. Rome 2 will probably look even better.
EDIT: For what it's worth, I think P-100 has an excellent style and I don't really see why anybody would have a problem with it.
The Total War series is also an excellent example of good scaling LOD that allows for pretty incredible detail when zoomed in. And this is a game that can push 1000+ units in a single scene.
But, again, PC technology from the ground up. Rome 2 will probably look even better.
How is Total War btw? I got Shogun 2 free with my gpu, and still haven't installed it after 6 months
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
How is Total War btw? I got Shogun 2 free with my gpu, and still haven't installed it after 6 months
Shogun 2 is excellent. Rights a lot of Empire's wrongs, thanks to downscaling the campaign size. Still has a few of the typical Total War quirks, but works a lot better than the last two iterations. A return to form for the franchise, in my opinion.
Rome 2 is getting announced next month, and I will keep longing for Medieval 3.
Ah thanks. Medieval sounds like I would enjoy the units more, but I'll give Shogun a try today.
All the gameplay footage I've seen of P-100 either had the camera far away from the action or up close to detailed hero characters. The only time I noticed low-poly NPCs was during the opening of that one trailer. On that same note, the only time we see noticeably low-res ground textures in Pikmin is when the camera is up close to new Pikmin that are being introduced. In both cases, we have people taking selective screen grabs of these scenes as if they are representative of the games as a whole, followed by hyperbole-laden posts about how they are so disappointed with or 'worried' about the Wii U.
I imagine people at the main board are in the usual Nintendo hysterics over what Reggie said (I'm not going to bother to read it). He's half right and half wrong.
By any reasonable standards, the Wii U's lineup for launch and the following months is really solid. There are plenty of games that are guaranteed to sell, a Platinum games exclusive, a new FPS IP (and unlike Red Steel it actually looks good) a new Pikmin, etc. Also, people say "Wii had Twilight Princess at launch and Wii U needs a system seller as big" - but that was basically an early port and the Gamecube version was out a month later, and of course 2D Mario sells more than Zelda (why do people always forget what a huge seller NSMB is?).
Reggie is correct that some gamers tend to assume that because a new concept doesn't excite them it's going to flop. And there's a general tendency to always assume the worst about what we don't know regarding the system and interpret everything Nintendo says in the most uncharitable way possible.
But the conference was really bad, and Nintendo can blame themselves for the bad reception of Nintendoland when they presented so badly. And their secrecy policy doesn't do them any favors. I will probably buy one eventually, but at this point they haven't quite convinced me to - I need to know what's coming in the future! Just a couple of brief trailers for mid-late 2013 games would make people feel much better about the Wii U. Nintendo can blame the gamers for expecting too much and always being blind to what the broader market likes and they're partly right, but when they hide everything (maybe even some third-party launch games!) under NDAs it's only natural that people are going to assume the worst.
By any reasonable standards, the Wii U's lineup for launch and the following months is really solid. There are plenty of games that are guaranteed to sell, a Platinum games exclusive, a new FPS IP (and unlike Red Steel it actually looks good) a new Pikmin, etc. Also, people say "Wii had Twilight Princess at launch and Wii U needs a system seller as big" - but that was basically an early port and the Gamecube version was out a month later, and of course 2D Mario sells more than Zelda (why do people always forget what a huge seller NSMB is?).
Reggie is correct that some gamers tend to assume that because a new concept doesn't excite them it's going to flop. And there's a general tendency to always assume the worst about what we don't know regarding the system and interpret everything Nintendo says in the most uncharitable way possible.
But the conference was really bad, and Nintendo can blame themselves for the bad reception of Nintendoland when they presented so badly. And their secrecy policy doesn't do them any favors. I will probably buy one eventually, but at this point they haven't quite convinced me to - I need to know what's coming in the future! Just a couple of brief trailers for mid-late 2013 games would make people feel much better about the Wii U. Nintendo can blame the gamers for expecting too much and always being blind to what the broader market likes and they're partly right, but when they hide everything (maybe even some third-party launch games!) under NDAs it's only natural that people are going to assume the worst.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
Does anyone else really love the new timed collecting of the green coins/leaves? Seems like a great way to have people get to difficult spots in the level while keeping the player on their toes and allowing the designer to use more of the level. Seems like a big upgrade over the red coins.
Pretty much this. I agree with Reggie that the hardcore fan base is never satisfied, but that conference showed almost nothing new outside of Nintendo Land. One little glimpse of Retro's game, or EAD Tokyo's or ANY major AAA game would have shut everyone up.
Or, if they were hellbent on only showing launch window stuff, Nintendo should have made that absolutely clear in the weeks leading up to the conference.
Nintendo was virtually silent for an entire year, and its stock response was always "Wait until E3". It was not unreasonable to expect much more than what was unveiled.
I'm sorry, I guess I must be out of the loop or something, but how is it different than the red coins?
That wouldn't have helped, because we didnt know what surprises were going to be ready for launch. Could have been a Retro title for all we know. Could have been GTAV announced for the WiiU, etc.
Hindsight they say is 20/20.
It's not as if P-100 has poor LOD scaling, it appears to have none at all going on. This actually suggests a deliberate aesthetic choice. It wouldn't work everywhere, but I think in this case it has some value because it establishes level of detail as a cue for scale.
My original comment:
While owning all 3 systems this gen, I'd consider myself a Nintendo fan. So I'm in no way bitter. I guess I should have made that clear, sorry for the misunderstanding Alistair, or anyone else.
It seems I caused a bit of confusion, so let me clarify some more.
I opened my post referring to some Nintendo fans, not all, or even most. Just some! The only reason I said "presumably Nintendo fans" was the fact that I(or anyone else) don't know people's hearts or state of mind. But based on their posts, oppenly stated perferences, and/or anticipation for Nintendo products, it's fair to say they are. I've seen the negative reactions such people had(whether initially or ongoing) to PP-100's visuals. That pic played a big roll, which was quite silly since it was being isolated from the rest of the beautifully stylized game. I didn't make that up, imagine it, nor am I referring to folk who could care less about Nintendo. I also didn't say all Nintendo fans, in regards to that specific matter.
In any event, it appears that it's my last comment that caused a bit of a stir. While the whole PP-100 thing was just one example, that comment It was more of an attack to the overall knee-jerk reactions that often come from Nintendo fans during these information-explosions times. I'm well aware of others "parties" involved, but that was my current focus. If anyone took in a manner that was overly offensive, then my appologies for that.
Being that I consider myself a Nintendo fan, I obviously wouldn't want my comment to be taken as: "Hey, every Nintendo fan is guilty of doing this and that"
Rather, I was thinking more along the lines of: "Yup, it's this easy for others to have this perception of Nintendo fans."
My fault for putting that line of frustration so bluntly out there with little explanation.
I hope I clarified enough, I don't want to reply again... I'm over my daily typing budget.
While owning all 3 systems this gen, I'd consider myself a Nintendo fan. So I'm in no way bitter. I guess I should have made that clear, sorry for the misunderstanding Alistair, or anyone else.
It seems I caused a bit of confusion, so let me clarify some more.
I opened my post referring to some Nintendo fans, not all, or even most. Just some! The only reason I said "presumably Nintendo fans" was the fact that I(or anyone else) don't know people's hearts or state of mind. But based on their posts, oppenly stated perferences, and/or anticipation for Nintendo products, it's fair to say they are. I've seen the negative reactions such people had(whether initially or ongoing) to PP-100's visuals. That pic played a big roll, which was quite silly since it was being isolated from the rest of the beautifully stylized game. I didn't make that up, imagine it, nor am I referring to folk who could care less about Nintendo. I also didn't say all Nintendo fans, in regards to that specific matter.
In any event, it appears that it's my last comment that caused a bit of a stir. While the whole PP-100 thing was just one example, that comment It was more of an attack to the overall knee-jerk reactions that often come from Nintendo fans during these information-explosions times. I'm well aware of others "parties" involved, but that was my current focus. If anyone took in a manner that was overly offensive, then my appologies for that.
Being that I consider myself a Nintendo fan, I obviously wouldn't want my comment to be taken as: "Hey, every Nintendo fan is guilty of doing this and that"
Rather, I was thinking more along the lines of: "Yup, it's this easy for others to have this perception of Nintendo fans."
My fault for putting that line of frustration so bluntly out there with little explanation.
I hope I clarified enough, I don't want to reply again... I'm over my daily typing budget.
There is a philosophy of keeping your fans hungry. Too much info, they get bored and their attention will stray. Give them a taste, and they will hang on for more.
You know very well that Nintendo has had a policy of not revealing games that are
too far out from launch. They tend to reveal & focus on titles that are no more than 6 months from launch.
Nintendo has also shown us that they are interested in providing their own platform, called Nintendo Direct, to be a source of information. I suspect it is designed with the WiiU in mind. Getting these updates right on your gamepad.
Uhhhh..... OK, didn't expect a fan following to that post. Thanks.
Exactly. My little cousins laugh at nes and SNES games because they were only 6 when the PS3 and 360 came out. They have no appreciation for old school games And write them off right away because "lol the Grafix!". Most of the gamers here are old enough to remember the NES or played it at some time. The teenagers of today who buy the dudebro games have no appreciation for 2D games or sprite based games. Granted, this doesn't apply to all of them but still....sad to see.
It's like today's kids watching the original three star wars films and hating on them because of cheesy special effects, not knowing those effects changed the industry for their time.
Sigh....
If the tech and gamer world loves it while normal people are confused by it...it has a decent chance of bombing.
You have yourself and their parents to blame! My nephew watched the original Star Wars films early on and I introduced him to a lot of older games, with the help of Virtual Console on Wii actually. Hell we were playing River City Ransom last time he was over.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
The red coins spawn all at once and have a time limit to collect all 8, the green ones spawn one at a time and have a time limit for each.
A better comparison would probably be to Total War, or maybe StarCraft II.
ShockingAlberto
Member
It's never fun delivering bad news
So I'm going to make it fun
Guess what bad news about the Wii U I heard today and, provided you want it, you get a Steam code for Bastion! If you don't want it, it will go to the next person that guessed correctly, etc.
A big publisher cancelled an unannounced game for the Wii U. Guess the publisher and the reason and you win!
So I'm going to make it fun
Guess what bad news about the Wii U I heard today and, provided you want it, you get a Steam code for Bastion! If you don't want it, it will go to the next person that guessed correctly, etc.
A big publisher cancelled an unannounced game for the Wii U. Guess the publisher and the reason and you win!
Do you ever have any good Wii U news?
I was going to guess Sega cancelled a Sonic game, but I couldn't think of a good reason.
Edit- I think Firestorm is on to something. THQ cancelled Homefront 2 because Wii U is for kiddies.
Konami, because its Konami on a Nintendo console
Konami, because it wanted to create something "unique" that could take advantage of the Wii U, in other words they want to wait and see how it sells.
lordfroakie
Member
Sega cause they're going digital.
ShockingAlberto
Member
No one right on any count yet.
lordfroakie
Member
EA. They're making something for smartglass instead.
I'm really struggling with a good reason, given the system is 5 months away from even releasing. Makes it harder to find the justification.
Can we play 20 questions or something.
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