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[Erethian]

No. Wii proved that developers were afraid to make games for the weird under-powered console with a strange control scheme.

While those are/were definite problems with the Wii, there's no arguing that support for the system suffered because its architecture wasn't similar to the 360 or PS3. Not even in terms of raw specs; having weaker hardware that supported programmable pixel and vertex shaders would have made a big difference.

I don't think the ease of development is an issue with the 3DS though, nor do I think anyone should rely on ports as a replacement for a software strategy. It's a huge mistake Sony has made with the Vita, in my view, even if it is a situation they were largely forced into.

Same goes for the Wii-U. If the extent of Nintendo's strategy is ports, well... I'm not going to say the system will be a failure, but it certainly won't be a success. Compelling exclusive software still has a big part to play in defining how well a system does, especially a Nintendo system.

 

[herzogzwei1989]

As far as Wii and 3DS, sure the 3DS has fixed function shaders that Wii lacks but 3DS also has much lower raw performance compared to the Wii as far as geometry/polygon performance and pixel fillrate. 3DS is closer to PSP & PS2 than Wii or Xbox1. The Pica200 in 3DS just cannot compare to Flipper and especially Hollywood in raw power. Don't forget Nintendo probably used the lowest performance Pica200 that they could get for 3DS. It doesn't matter though, I'm happy with 3DS' graphical output, it's somewhat better than PSP in geometry and much better in texture mapping and shaders.

 

[TheExplodingHead]

While those are/were definite problems with the Wii, there's no arguing that support for the system suffered because its architecture wasn't similar to the 360 or PS3. Not even in terms of raw specs; having weaker hardware that supported programmable pixel and vertex shaders would have made a big difference.

I don't think the ease of development is an issue with the 3DS though, nor do I think anyone should rely on ports as a replacement for a software strategy. It's a huge mistake Sony has made with the Vita, in my view, even if it is a situation they were largely forced into.

Same goes for the Wii-U. If the extent of Nintendo's strategy is ports, well... I'm not going to say the system will be a failure, but it certainly won't be a success. Compelling exclusive software still has a big part to play in defining how well a system does, especially a Nintendo system.

I very much agree with this. But where I disagree somewhat, is that over the course of this generation third-party multiplats have been selling hand over fist (and moving systems) over exclusive software. So I agree Nintendo needs compelling exclusives (and brand new core IP's as well), but they simply have to get a piece of that big money pie in multiplats too. On a very heavy level. Otherwise we could see a repeat of the Wii/GC library.

Personally, I buy Nintendo consoles for Nintendo games and exclusive experiences. But to be a success in this era, means Nintendo needs the exact same third-party support as Sony and Microsoft. Ironically the only games that could stand up to CoD/Guitar Hero in sales were Nintendo titles like Wii Play/Wii Fit/NSMBW/Mario Kart/etc.

 

[Erethian]

I very much agree with this. But where I disagree somewhat, is that over the course of this generation third-party multiplats have been selling hand over fist (and moving systems) over exclusive software. So I agree Nintendo needs compelling exclusives (and brand new core IP's as well), but they simply have to get a piece of that big money pie in multiplats too. On a very heavy level. Otherwise we could see a repeat of the Wii/GC library.

Personally, I buy Nintendo consoles for Nintendo games and exclusive experiences. But to be a success in this era, means Nintendo needs the exact same third-party support as Sony and Microsoft. Ironically the only games that could stand up to CoD/Guitar Hero in sales were Nintendo titles like Wii Play/Wii Fit/NSMBW/Mario Kart/etc.

Oh yeah, Nintendo definitely needs both. I probably didn't make that clear enough in my post.

At this point I'd say the 3DS is getting a reasonable level of support; maybe slightly more than the DS did out of the gate. But what it lacks, excluding other factors, is a compelling first-party offering. Maybe Mario Kart will be that title, maybe something else.

 

[MDX]

Acer says in talks to work with Nintendo after iGware deal

(Reuters) - Acer Inc , the world's No.2 PC maker, said on Thursday it will talk to Japanese game firm Nintendo over potential cooperation after acquiring U.S. based cloud computing firm iGware Inc.

Acer Chairman J.T. Wang told reporters that Nintendo, a major client of iGware, is supportive of the deal and will pay Acer a $20-30 million service fee every year after the acquisition.

The Taiwanese company said earlier on Thursday it would buy iGware for $320 million, looking to move into the potentially lucrative cloud market and add value to its main hardware business.

According to Acer, the companies have agreed to a selling price of $320 million. In addition, iGware can earn $75 million if it hits certain performance-based milestones. With iGware's technology, Acer says that it will deliver a new service, called Acer Cloud, "to serve and benefit Acer customers, and enhance brand value."

iGware has largely been under the radar in the cloud space, but the company has achieved some success. According to Acer, iGware's cloud software and infrastructure tools are available on over 100 million devices around the world. The company's most notable customer is Nintendo, which it partners with to power online services for the hardware maker's Wii, DS, and 3DS. Acer says that iGware has also inked a deal with Nintendo that will see it support the company's Wii U.

For Acer, its decision to acquire iGware underscores the company's desire to be more than just a PC maker. In a statement today, Acer said that it expects Acer Cloud will be integrated into "all Acer products, including PCs, tablets, and smart handheld devices." The company said that its Cloud feature will be "built on an open platform."

Although its simple website doesn't reveal anything about what goes on under its roof, iGware provides cloud software and infrastructure tools that support more than 100 million consumer devices worldwide, including Nintendo game consoles. Acer is expected to integrate iGware into its cloud software and platform as Acer Cloud Technology Co. after completion of the deal by late September. An actual Acer Cloud product is slated to launch sometime during 2012.

But because Nintendo is one of iGware's major clients, both parties are supposedly in talks over a potential cooperation after the acquisition. Nintendo is supposedly in favor of the deal and plans to shell out a $20-30 million service fee to Acer every year after the deal is signed. Yet some analysts aren't thrilled with the acquisition or Acer's potential involvement with the Japanese gaming company.

"Acer is wasting its money. It's spending almost $400 million on a small software company," said Vincent Chen of Yuanta Securities. "Why does it need a client like Nintendo, which doesn't have a cloud or data center? Acer has been wanting to do online gaming and server business, but it doesn't have a clear vision in the cloud business."

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/cl...ong-Nintendo-Acer-Cloud-Technology,13112.html
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13506_3-20081409-17/acer-to-acquire-cloud-service-provider-igware/
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/21/acer-nintendo-idUST8E7I600P20110721

 

[DaSorcerer7]

Acer says in talks to work with Nintendo after iGware deal








http://www.tomshardware.com/news/cl...ong-Nintendo-Acer-Cloud-Technology,13112.html
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13506_3-20081409-17/acer-to-acquire-cloud-service-provider-igware/
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/21/acer-nintendo-idUST8E7I600P20110721

Nice find

 

[bgassassin]

^^^Nice find. That makes me wonder about Iwata's past comment. Did they use IGware's tech only and did the rest themselves when it came to Wii and DS? Kinda sounds like it.

Part of that analyst's comment stuck out to me.

"Why does it need a client like Nintendo, which doesn't have a cloud or data center? Acer has been wanting to do online gaming and server business, but it doesn't have a clear vision in the cloud business."

This might be the hole that Nintendo is trying to fill through a third party. Someone who specializes in that area who can perform it on a large scale. Maybe Acer is the one since they apparently have wanted to get into that type of business. Too early to say still, but this news helps us gain a little more perspective.

And what about other options like, Displaylink? Who actually tweeted:
Why would they do that?

http://www.gizmag.com/displaylink-wireless-usb-monitors/8492/

Displayport? Who is backed by AMD.



http://zerias.blogspot.com/2009/09/nintendo-prepping-displayport-wii-for.html
http://www.dailytech.com/Specificat...layPort+Coming+in+Early+2011/article20062.htm

Nice information. Nothing wrong with options since we're attempting to make educated guesses on some of these things and the one I mentioned was just a suggestion based on what it did. I focused on it because that was the one I was familiar with. But that one is very reasonable as well due to the royalty-free aspect. Whatever the means, in the end Nintendo will most likely do the streaming in an affordable manner. Both methods only require a simple wireless adapter for receiving the stream, and sending the stream seems pretty affordable for both as well.

 

[walking fiend]

they also have very informative website:
http://www.igware.com/

Spoiler

sarcasm

 

[DaSorcerer7]

they also have very informative website:
http://www.igware.com/

Spoiler

sarcasm

lol

 

[blu]

Displayport? Who is backed by AMD.

http://zerias.blogspot.com/2009/09/nintendo-prepping-displayport-wii-for.html
http://www.dailytech.com/Specificat...layPort+Coming+in+Early+2011/article20062.htm

WiiU as currently known has an HDMI port.

 

[M3d10n]

If Wii proved anything, it's that third-parties love shortcuts. This is especially true of western devs who don't take handhelds seriously at all, and don't want to bother making games that actually take real time to develop. You'll likely see what I mean with Vita.

Nintendo could fix this by trying to get some middleware made just for 3DS, though.

A few years ago I worked on a DS game, and they offered entirely pre-made rendering framework, with model exporters and importers, UI solutions and a particle engine with an WYSIWYG editor.

Since the 3DS offers built-in hardware support for shadow-mapping and per-pixel lighting, devs don't need to code those from scratch. The results are already paying off: I truly doubt low budget games like the Lego Pirates of the Caribbean port would waste time on such effects if they weren't already laying there.

People also conveniently forget Super Street Fighter IV in these threads. ScaleForm already works on 3DS, so AAA-grade UI is there already.

The only thing the 3DS doesn't do is (supposedly) run UE3. The problem with UE3 is that it uses far too much CPU (Epic reports this as the major bottleneck even in the iPhone 4) due to the overbloated visibility/sorting/batching code plus UnrealScript. RAM is a non-issue: Infinity Blade uses ~80MBs of RAM on the iPhone.

The 3DS really does have a slower CPU than the Wii (733MHz versus 266MHz) and the GPU is probably clocked at 133MHz, which impacts the amount of polygons it can push (it still does do a darn good job having to render everything twice, I'd say). It's possible Nintendo can pull a PSP and increase the GPU clock via software on later games, however, when they get better batteries going on.

 

[bgassassin]

WiiU as currently known has an HDMI port.

He was presenting another option that could do the streaming to the controller since they are making a wireless displayport.

 

[sfried]

The 3DS really does have a slower CPU than the Wii (733MHz versus 266MHz) and the GPU is probably clocked at 133MHz, which impacts the amount of polygons it can push (it still does do a darn good job having to render everything twice, I'd say). It's possible Nintendo can pull a PSP and increase the GPU clock via software on later games, however, when they get better batteries going on.

Could be a good reason why they opted for user-replacable batteries.

That said, this is slightly going off tangent, but the prospects of using a 3DS as an alternate controller from the one Wii U already has brings up interesting ideas. Since the Wii U is able to render twice (with different viewpoints of course), and each 3DS "eye" is technically SD, does that mean the Wii U can just render for the 3DS both viewpoints, or whould that take up too much signal bandwidth/crosstalk?

 

[M3d10n]

Could be a good reason why they opted for user-replacable batteries.

I'm not sure they can make higher capacity batteries with the same size with current tech. Maybe it's a safeguard measure in case something better becomes available on the market. I'm actually thinking about a revision which either uses less power (more efficient screens , more efficient wireless chip and a die shrink) or one which can fit a larger battery (maybe slightly larger or by moving some components into the upper-screen).

That said, this is slightly going off tangent, but the prospects of using a 3DS as an alternate controller from the one Wii U already has brings up interesting ideas. Since the Wii U is able to render twice (with different viewpoints of course), and each 3DS "eye" is technically SD, does that mean the Wii U can just render for the 3DS both viewpoints, or whould that take up too much signal bandwidth/crosstalk?

For 3D all it needs is to render 800x240 image (two 400x240 images side-by-side). That's still less than half the amount of pixels on the Wii U controller screen (which should be close to 840x480).

 

[blu]

He was presenting another option that could do the streaming to the controller since they are making a wireless displayport.

Perhaps I misread it, now that you mention it. But the speculation in the blog post from 2009 has been proven wrong - WiiU has been show to host an HDMI port. Whether it uses the wireless DisplayPort standard for controller streaming - it is quite possible.

 

[mAcOdIn]

The controller streaming can be anything, literally. It can be any proprietary method they want, they don't need to use any defined standard because the Wii-U tablet doesn't need to work with anything but the Wii-U.

 

[DaSorcerer7]

Nintendo's duty to create new ways to play
With the Wii U poised to setting a new paradigm in the way a controller is related to its console, Nintendo is clearly keen on setting itself apart from its competitors once again.
In an interview conducted by French newspaper Libération, Shigeru Miyamoto explained that if a generation of consoles are indistinguishable from each other, the industry would end up with games that are alike. Noting that it is the job of hardware makers to invent
"new systems of play," Miyamoto described Nintendo's vision of providing new ways to play by suggesting that new gaming machines will in turn inspire new concepts.
With the uniqueness of the Wii U, Miyamoto was asked whether software development would be more difficult or complex than usual, to which he replied:
It will not be difficult. In a way, it will be even easier because I think the machine is more responsive to the aspirations of developers, and offers more creative freedom than traditional systems available. The latest technology, graphics capabilities and new possibilities of the Wii U create an attractive and welcoming [environment] to the game-designers.
When asked whether any difficulty would manifest itself in a conceptual or technological capacity, Miyamoto elaborated on the freedom the console will offer to developers:
It is a machine that defies the imagination and creativity [of people]. But that means more fun for developers. There are many ways for the player to control the image [on-screen]. This may be confusing at first, but I think it will be easy to adopt because it [pools together] the freedom demanded by developers themselves. And it offers lots of new expression to their imagination

Source:Nintendolife

 

[Freezie KO]

Third-parties don't want differences between the systems.

And remember when Wii was attractive to developers because it'd be so much cheaper to develop for?

There's one thing that makes a system attractive to publishers (those guys that tell the devs where to put their games), and that's money. Money through sales and money through hats.

 

[civilstrife]

I actually think this is going to be massively successful.

I'm thinking DS levels. Same degree of innovation is at play. Possibly more.

 

[DaSorcerer7]

Third-parties don't want differences between the systems.

And remember when Wii was attractive to developers because it'd be so much cheaper to develop for?

There's one thing that makes a system attractive to publishers (those guys that tell the devs where to put their games), and that's money. Money through sales and money through hats.

Iwata: Nintendo Willing to Invest to Get Third Party Support on Wii U/3DS

 

[abstract alien]

Third-parties don't want differences between the systems.

And remember when Wii was attractive to developers because it'd be so much cheaper to develop for?

There's one thing that makes a system attractive to publishers (those guys that tell the devs where to put their games), and that's money. Money through sales and money through hats.

I think the difference this time is that it can run ports without much of a problem at all. The controls and power are a non-issue, as far as we know. They just have MORE options on the wii-u, if they choose to utilize them.

Dat online though...yikes! I fear for it lol

 

[DaSorcerer7]

I think the difference this time is that it can run ports without much of a problem at all. The controls and power are a non-issue, as far as we know. They just have MORE options on the wii-u, if they choose to utilize them.

Dat online though...yikes! I fear for it lol

fear of the unknown

 

[Freezie KO]

Iwata: Nintendo Willing to Invest to Get Third Party Support on Wii U/3DS

It's hard to be optimistic about this when the 3DS is out there seeing continual game cancellations and delays. And in the midst of this drought, Nintendo couldn't even see fit to release a VC title this week.

And then on console, we've seen promising "partnership" games like Disaster, Reginleiv, Pandora's Tower, and some RPGs, but they don't get released in America anyway.

I think the difference this time is that it can run ports without much of a problem at all. The controls and power are a non-issue, as far as we know. They just have MORE options on the wii-u, if they choose to utilize them.

Dat online though...yikes! I fear for it lol

You're right that the controls shouldn't be an impediment this time. But I just think it's funny that we're still getting the line from Miyamoto or Iwata or Reggie that third-parties are excited to work on a different interface. It's laughable. Their "creativity" is putting their games on every platform they can. Plus, this identical interface has existed for 7 years on DS (touchscreen + buttons on lower part; screen up top), and it's been largely ignored by Western third-parties.

And online? Yeah. Fucked.

 

[ShineALight]

And then on console, we've seen promising "partnership" games like Disaster, Reginleiv, Pandora's Tower, and some RPGs, but they don't get released in America anyway.

This is pedantic but it's going to be pointed out sooner or later that Disaster is a completely first-party title, not a partnership.

 

[abstract alien]

fear of the unknown

Partly unknown I suppose. What we have known of Nintendo on this front has been near horrifying in comparison to what is asked of them. They said we would get it remedied starting with the Wii, then the 3DS. Yeah...shit still ain't up to par mate, and that's after an update on the latter.

Its wait and see of course, but when it comes to nintendo and robust online, I'm not "waiting" on much. I don't really care anyway, as I don't utilize online like that outside of street fighter.

You're right that the controls shouldn't be an impediment this time. But I just think it's funny that we're still getting the line from Miyamoto or Iwata or Reggie that third-parties are excited to work on a different interface. It's laughable. Their "creativity" is putting their games on every platform they can. Plus, this identical interface has existed for 7 years on DS (touchscreen + buttons on lower part; screen up top), and it's been largely ignored by Western third-parties.

And online? Yeah. Fucked.

Yep, third parties aren't interested in making creative software in most cases. It doesn't seem like it anyway, judging by past experiences. Maybe we will get a new leaf turned...

Nah.

 

[TheExplodingHead]

Partly unknown I suppose. What we have known of Nintendo on this front has been near horrifying in comparison to what is asked of them. They said we would get it remedied starting with the Wii, then the 3DS. Yeah...shit still ain't up to par mate, and that's after an update on the latter.

Its wait and see of course, but when it comes to nintendo and robust online, I'm not "waiting" on much. I don't really care anyway, as I don't utilize online like that outside of street fighter.

In all honestly I don't see Nintendo delivering a competent online service without a huge partnership with Steam/EA/Battle.net/etc. For one reason or another they still seem to think it shouldn't be a major pillar of their business.

I'm hoping for the best though. I hope Nintendo delivers it's own type of achievement system, online on par with PSN or better, and even a few more things like Steamworks. But Nintendo as of now hasn't shown neither the ambition or ability to deliver that. So I'm not holding my breath.

 

[Freezie KO]

Yep, third parties aren't interested in making creative software in most cases. It doesn't seem like it anyway, judging by past experiences. Maybe we will get a new leaf turned...

Nah.

This is a little harsher than I'm willing to go. I think third-parties can be as entrenched as "hardcore" players in their old habits, hence why Nintendo reverted to a giant dual analog controller. I think some third-parties want to be creative, but only within certain specifications (gotta be dual analog, gotta be one of a few genres, etc.)

I'm very skeptical of any claims that third-parties care about interface. I still see so much untapped potential in the Wiimote and Move, so I'm doubting third-parties use this new controller for much more than a map. Although, I'd argue that it's significantly less innovative than the Wiimote was, so maybe they couldn't figure out something new even if they tried.

 

[mAcOdIn]

It's hard to be optimistic about this when the 3DS is out there seeing continual game cancellations and delays. And in the midst of this drought, Nintendo couldn't even see fit to release a VC title this week.

What has been cancelled on the 3DS? Megaman Legends, which honestly I feel for fans of that series but lets be serious here it looked like crap and wasn't going to sell and an Assassin's Creed game which had really been cancelled way back we just didn't hear about it. Then on the delay side you have a PSP port of Crushed and Shinobi, two other games that aren't really that big of deals.

However, I do think Nintendo has been incredibly stingy with their VC releases, I'd love to say I believe it'll change but years of watching it on the Wii tells me otherwise. I really wish Nintendo'd just pony up the cash for ratings and shit now and at least get more of their own first party shit out there on the service as by the time the Vita launches it's going to be a year behind the 3DS and the PSone classics and PSP games will still fucking rape Nintendo's VC service on the 3DS. But this time I'm getting both so I don't care if Nintendo wants to be seen as a leader or merely checking the box, but damn Nintendo, it'd be nice to have some shit to buy, I'm sitting here bored looking to part with 5 bucks but nothing to do with it, oh well.

Drought wise though, I'm hesitant to really call it that for a new system. I'll admit that for me it's been boring but, we did get a real Dead or Alive, Zedla: OoT was released which I think is only half fair as it's a port but then next month has Devil Summoner Overclocked, which is also a port so granted I'll give it half credit, then we get Solatorobo or whatever, I know it's a DS game but we can play it, Star Fox, which is yet another port, I admit it's not like the greatest, unique line-up ever as it consists of a lot of remakes and ports but it's far from the worst drought I've been through either and there's a real quality title or two coming out every month and the thing's still barely started. I just don't think it's that dire.

Also though, with the DS and PS3(Well I do because I have the Phat one) this generation my perception has shifted, no longer do I look at a console or portable as a single closed platform but as a continuation as the one before it, now that the games from our previous generation continue to work I'm much more open to the concept of picking up a PS2 game like Persona 4 after I have sold my PS2 and purchased my PS3 or a DSi game like Solatorobo after I have sold my DSi and purchased my 3DS. So I'm not so much worried about specifically justifying the usage of the 3d screen so much as the hardware platform as a whole and for that on the 3DS I still feel like there's enough stuff I've yet to buy that already makes it more than worthwhile.

 

[Freezie KO]

^
Wasn't Saint's Row cancelled? And another I'm forgetting? And wasn't RE: Revelations supposed to be this Xmas but delayed?

Also, I agree that I'll pick up games for DS, but as DS was my favorite platform ever, I pretty much got everything I wanted on it. Same problem that I can't be excited about SF64. I have it on cart.

Don't get me wrong; I'm looking forward to Kirby Mass Attack for the regular DS. But even a DS game like a localized Fire Emblem DS 2 would be nice. For my tastes, this is a pretty bad drought.

Edit: Which is a complete derail from the Wii U and also to be expected from a launch. So I don't want to complain too hard. I'm very much looking forward to Kid Icarus, Mario Kart, and Mario 3DS.

I'm just saying that, in terms of third-parties, the 3DS drought doesn't have me convinced that Nintendo's got this figured out.

 

[Instro]

^
Wasn't Saint's Row cancelled? And another I'm forgetting? And wasn't RE: Revelations supposed to be this Xmas but delayed?

Also, I agree that I'll pick up games for DS, but as DS was my favorite platform ever, I pretty much got everything I wanted on it. Same problem that I can't be excited about SF64. I have it on cart.

Don't get me wrong; I'm looking forward to Kirby Mass Attack for the regular DS. But even a DS game like a localized Fire Emblem DS 2 would be nice. For my tastes, this is a pretty bad drought.

Edit: Which is a complete derail from the Wii U and also to be expected from a launch. So I don't want to complain too hard. I'm very much looking forward to Kid Icarus, Mario Kart, and Mario 3DS.

I'm just saying that, in terms of third-parties, the 3DS drought doesn't have me convinced that Nintendo's got this figured out.

As I recall Saint's Row never even got off the ground, and was planned to also be dl title for PSN and XBL anyway. As for RE, I'm not aware that it was ever given a date.

Speaking of droughts though, dont consoles usually have that issue during the first year? I mean I remember it being a problem for most of the consoles/handhelds this gen.

 

[mAcOdIn]

^
Wasn't Saint's Row cancelled? And another I'm forgetting? And wasn't RE: Revelations supposed to be this Xmas but delayed?

Also, I agree that I'll pick up games for DS, but as DS was my favorite platform ever, I pretty much got everything I wanted on it. Same problem that I can't be excited about SF64. I have it on cart.

Don't get me wrong; I'm looking forward to Kirby Mass Attack for the regular DS. But even a DS game like a localized Fire Emblem DS 2 would be nice. For my tastes, this is a pretty bad drought.

Edit: Which is a complete derail from the Wii U and also to be expected from a launch. So I don't want to complain too hard. I'm very much looking forward to Kid Icarus, Mario Kart, and Mario 3DS.

I'm just saying that, in terms of third-parties, the 3DS drought doesn't have me convinced that Nintendo's got this figured out.

I'm not entirely sure about a Saint's Row 3DS game, never heard of that, but again, is that really something we were anticipating? To me that's like someone telling me a Ubisoft Petz game got canned, it almost brings a smile to my face. Not that I think Saint's Row is shit but that I doubt they'd pull off a good portable game of it.

But anyways, I'm right there with you on not wanting to give full credit for remakes and ports, I mean, in all honesty come December as far as my gaming tastes go my top games will be one new DS game(Solatorobo(spelling?), two N64 ports(Starfox and Zelda: OoT) and a DS(Devil Survivor) port along with hopefully two unique 3DS games(Kid Icarus and Dead or Alive), I think that's weak frankly. But I also don't think it's historically weak as many times during a console launch there really isn't much shit to play but enhanced ports of older titles until things start rolling and it looks attractive enough to really dig into. It's not even 4 months into the 3DS's life, if they didn't essentially use Zelda: TP as a Wii game then the Wii's best game until April the next year when Paper Mario hit would have been Excite Truck or, umm, Trauma Center, lol. It's just how hardware launches roll. It's been a while since we've had to go through one so I guess we're just out of form and not used to them.

Also, since each new Nintendo portable since the GBA has essentially been an upgrade to the old one and they have been received in kind I'm kind of surprised that the 3DS is getting more flack. I look at the 3DS like I do the DSi was to the DS, the DSi had a faster CPU and more RAM than the DS and yet was anyone clamoring for their DSi enhanced carts? Where was the outrage? Everyone just kept buying DS games and startech checking the shitty DSiWare store and didn't worry about the DSi enhanced idea. Frankly that's about how I came into the 3DS.

Now, I don't want Nintendo to repeat this for the Wii-U, sure the Wii does have some good software that's perfectly playable on the Wii-U but I'd much rather them be aggressive and really try and push the system to everyone instead of being more low key and going at their own pace. Like I said earlier in regards to the 3DS versus Vita, I don't care if Nintendo's first or third myself I'll just end up buying what I buy but it'd be nice if it felt like they were trying. And as far as the Wii-U goes this will be the first Nintendo system that Nintendo has to sell me on, my days of just buying the next Nintendo system died with Xenoblade and their shit VC service.

Speaking of droughts though, dont consoles usually have that issue during the first year? I mean I remember it being a problem for most of the consoles/handhelds this gen.

Yeah, that's what I'm trying to say, look back at the first month of the Wii, PS3 and 360's life and it isn't pretty either.

 

[bgassassin]

The controller streaming can be anything, literally. It can be any proprietary method they want, they don't need to use any defined standard because the Wii-U tablet doesn't need to work with anything but the Wii-U.

True, but I doubt it will be something complex and expensive. The Wiimote was designed only for the Wii, but look how many different, alternate uses people created with the Wiimote in the first couple of years. I can see the same thing happening with the Upad.

Partly unknown I suppose. What we have known of Nintendo on this front has been near horrifying in comparison to what is asked of them. They said we would get it remedied starting with the Wii, then the 3DS. Yeah...shit still ain't up to par mate, and that's after an update on the latter.

Its wait and see of course, but when it comes to nintendo and robust online, I'm not "waiting" on much. I don't really care anyway, as I don't utilize online like that outside of street fighter.

Definitely a good reason to be concerned. I made a post in this thread that consolidated all the info we've heard about the online capabilities.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=29416808#post29416808

Although, I'd argue that it's significantly less innovative than the Wiimote was, so maybe they couldn't figure out something new even if they tried.

So far I feel Upad is a step backward. When we first hear the rumors I was hoping the screen would be like a shell that improved Wiimotes would connect into. Both would have 1:1 motion. And the layout for the two Wiimotes would have been similar to what we see with the Upad just with the home button being on the mote with the d-pad. Then tweak the underside some so it could have two buttons like the Nunchuk.

 

[TunaLover]

Kind of topic, but with a HDMI output, can I only have audio output through the TV? How can direct the audio to my Home Theather system?

Talking about Wii U setting.

 

[adroit]

Kind of topic, but with a HDMI output, can I only have audio output through the TV? How can direct the audio to my Home Theather system?

Connect the Wii U to the HT receiver with one HDMI cable and then connect the HT receiver to the TV with another HDMI cable.

 

[apana]

What I'm wondering about is what comes in the box. Just one Wii U tablet controller? How much would it cost to put a wiimote plus with nunchuk in every box in addition to the tablet controller. You would think the costs of creating wii motes and nunchuks would have gone down by now. They could get it to a really cheap price.

 

[Mithos]

Connect the Wii U to the HT receiver with one HDMI cable and then connect the HT receiver to the TV with another HDMI cable.

Sorry no HDMI on the receiver, then what stereo sound?

 

[Varjet]

What I'm wondering about is what comes in the box. Just one Wii U tablet controller? How much would it cost to put a wiimote plus with nunchuk in every box in addition to the tablet controller.

I think it would be kinda silly if they put a sensor bar in the box but not a Wiimote. And a Wiimote without a nunchuck doesn't make that much sense either.
So I think there will be just the tablet controller.

 

[TunaLover]

Sorry no HDMI on the receiver, then what stereo sound?

I think I have optical audio input in my HT, and optical output in my TV, that should make the trick, not sure about same quality...

 

[adroit]

Sorry no HDMI on the receiver, then what stereo sound?

Our TV has a standard analog stereo output and it works even with HDMI input. I.e., HDMI from Wii U to TV, analog stereo from TV to HT receiver. I don't know what kind of audio mix-down (if any) the TV does. But it works.

 

[walking fiend]

What I'm wondering about is what comes in the box. Just one Wii U tablet controller? How much would it cost to put a wiimote plus with nunchuk in every box in addition to the tablet controller. You would think the costs of creating wii motes and nunchuks would have gone down by now. They could get it to a really cheap price.

they won't, because most of people already have more than 1 Wiimote, many have several;

 

[Koren]

I think I have optical audio input in my HT, and optical output in my TV, that should make the trick, not sure about same quality...

Not sure... I currently use this on my TV (bravia) for PS3, but when I configure the HDMI output to auto, it only enable linear PCM 2 channels, IIRC. That's a pity, since I only want a decent 5.1 solution, which could be available over optical.

 

[Koren]

they won't, because most of people already have more than 1 Wiimote, many have several;

I've more than I can connect, and that include one used on HTPC.

But I disagree. Many have wiimotes, but how many have wiimote plus/motion plus? I think that at least wiimote+ has to be a given for any developper that want to develop for Wii U. I love the wiimote, and I fear that not including one may have bad consequences over wiimote support.

I doubt that Nintendo has already settled on the issue, though.

 

[walking fiend]

I've more than I can connect, and that include one used on HTPC.

But I disagree. Many have wiimotes, but how many have wiimote plus/motion plus? I think that at least wiimote+ has to be a given for any developper that want to develop for Wii U. I love the wiimote, and I fear that not including one may have bad consequences over wiimote support.

I doubt that Nintendo has already settled on the issue, though.

I dunno, but probably 45+, Wii Sports has sold almost 28 million by march 2010, all of the Wiis have been shipped either with remote plus or motion plus for a long time, I believe the overall number of people with motion+ will reach to at least 45 million by Wii U launch.

Anyhow, Nintendo won't add $30 to its console price (for a nunchuck + remote plus) when there are this many remote pluses in the wild, either stand alone or in some type of bundle. I think adding a bundle will be overkill.

I believe Nintendo Wii U games itself will require motion plus and the rest will be history, their biggest title Zelda: SS is doing now.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

It's hard to be optimistic about this when the 3DS is out there seeing continual game cancellations and delays. And in the midst of this drought, Nintendo couldn't even see fit to release a VC title this week.

Out of the over 200 games so far announced 3DS games, these are the ones that've been canceled and why:

Saint Row Drive-By: Planned as a port of an XBLA project, development never even started as the XBLA original was killed and THQ folded it into SR The Third. This all happened before system launch.

Assassin's Creed: Lost Legacy Scale and scope of the project ballooned in the planning stages, and was eventually folded into Revelations instead. Ubisoft reps admitted it happened six months before 3DS launch.

DJ Hero II Canceled with the line wide scaling down of Activision's music franchises. Yet again, happened before system launch.

Mega Man Legends 3: Canceled recently, attributed to lack of fan interest (lol), reflects a company wide disinterest in the IP by Capcom management that happens to coincide with it's co-creator's controversial departure (hmm).

A Boy and His Blob: First assumed to be a port of the Wii version, when developer Wayforward stated they had no involvement then publisher Majesco admitted the game wasn't in active development. This happened pre-launch, project wasn't technically canceled though.

BloodRayne: The Shroud: Not officially canceled, when questioned about the game Majesco stated it was "on hold".

My Garden: Planned launch game, finished, EA shelved it for quality reasons.

Bomberman 3D, Bonk 3D, Kororinpa 3D and Omega Five: All canceled in the heartbreaking Konami takeover of Hudson Soft. Konami wants to restructure Hudson into a casual/social games developer, which has also resulted in a significant staff exodus.

As far as delays, there were a ton associated with the recent disaster in Japan, and few others for various reasons but the only ones associated with the health of the platform itself are Sega's Crush3d and Shinobi. It's also worth pointing out this strategy isn't being applied line wide by Sega since Sonic Generations and Mario & Sonic 3 aren't seeing any delay, so there's likely to be a consideration of franchise strength with the decision making here.

 

[BurntPork]

I dunno, but probably 45+, Wii Sports has sold almost 28 million by march 2010, all of the Wiis have been shipped either with remote plus or motion plus for a long time, I believe the overall number of people with motion+ will reach to at least 45 million by Wii U launch.

Anyhow, Nintendo won't add $30 to its console price (for a nunchuck + remote plus) when there are this many remote pluses in the wild, either stand alone or in some type of bundle. I think adding a bundle will be overkill.

I believe Nintendo Wii U games itself will require motion plus and the rest will be history, their biggest title Zelda: SS is doing now.

... $30? Try $10-12. The Remote+ costs only $6 dollars, and the Nunchuck likely costs even less.

 

[walking fiend]

... $30? Try $10-12. The Remote+ costs only $6 dollars, and the Nunchuck likely costs even less.

were did you get that? regardless, it won't have a good psychological effect, people don't know how it really costs, they think to themselves they are forced to pay for something they already own (even if they know it is only 12 dollar). I believe Nintendo giving away remote+ bundled with major games would be the best idea.

 

[beje]

Canned stuff

Thanks, that's a good insight. Put in perspective it's not really that heartbreaking seeing how lots and lots of stuff get lost before a platform launch and during its first year and the March disaster really hit hard. The only remarkable point would be Konami giving the kick to Hudson

Also, most third parties wouldn't want to compete with both Super Mario 3D and Mario Kart 3D during holiday season so they most likely decided to put their projects on hold for a little bit later.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

The bundled Wii U Wiimote+ setup will probably be improved somehow. Like rechargable batteries, wireless nunchuck or something. I also expect an improved Balance Board for Wii Fit U, though you'll still be able to use the old one if you want.

 

[bgassassin]

The bundled Wii U Wiimote+ setup will probably be improved somehow. Like rechargable batteries, wireless nunchuck or something. I also expect an improved Balance Board for Wii Fit U, though you'll still be able to use the old one if you want.

You're a good one because I'm expecting none of that.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

Thanks, that's a good insight. Put in perspective it's not really that heartbreaking seeing how lots and lots of stuff get lost before a platform launch and during its first year and the March disaster really hit hard. The only remarkable point would be Konami giving the kick to Hudson

Also, most third parties wouldn't want to compete with both Super Mario 3D and Mario Kart 3D during holiday season so they most likely decided to put their projects on hold for a little bit later.

Yeah, context helps here. Unlike the doom agenda the usual Nintendo naysayers keep pushing, basically none of the cancelations so far have been attributed to the health of the platform itself, and indeed the high profile western ones all even happened before it launched. The cancelations also represent less than 5% of the overall 3DS library, which puts some perspective on things.

The Hudson mess also resulted in several Wii and PS3 games getting axed, so even that wasn't 3DS specific.