Wii U Speculation Thread of Brains Beware: Wii U Re-Unveiling At E3 2012
- Thread starter bgassassin
- Start date
- Status
Graphics Horse
Member
onQ123 said:
Dragon Quest X was announced but that's about it I think. I'm not sure they'd wait for E3 to show it again, there should be at least something said in one of the upcoming investor meetings.
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
BurntPork said:
Except when you edit your post in question in a manner so you don't have to admit you were wrong.
BurntPork said:
But your definition of 'proof' is so absurd that you never come to admit it. On this very page you've been presented with some of your past predictions and shown how you were wrong/will be wrong, yet you still find a way to evade the fact that you ballsed up!
BurntPork said:
Well that's kind of you, at least you can have a laugh about it!
ANYWAY, back on topic...
WiiU pricing? I'm guessing £299 tops. Also, will Nintendo go back on their previous comments about one controller per system? I certainly hope so, but I imagine it would only come about with a bit of a redesign. Something that looks decidedly unlikely at this point.
Eteric Rice
Member
Gravijah said:
I'm pretty sure Nintendo has a big say in what they do, though.
bgassassin
Member
ShockingAlberto said:
Not only that, but tessellation also. I look forward to many eyeballs popping out when Nintendo starts showing things.
With SSB, I would like to see another reveal trailer like this one that shows the old models get overlayed by the new ones to show the difference. Kirby's "wtf" reaction still makes me laugh.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbetJKOQB7k
Thunder Monkey said:
I found something of yours laying around the interweb.
http://forum.teamxbox.com/showpost.php?p=3261933&postcount=6
Your current avatar is definitely sexier. It's like a fine wine.
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
Ubermatik said:
I will agree with BP in that Nintendo really should contemplate changing Wii U after the 3DS reception. Making it as powerful as the 360 or even a tad more will not work. It just won't. This isn't Pachter's Wii HD. This is Nintendo's next generation console that they're expecting to carry them for 5 or 6 years. More and more it seems that both the PS4 and next Box will be pretty powerful machines. Nintendo cannot have a redo of the Wii while expecting to get 3rd party support in 3 years.
BurntPork said:
And you still refuse to admit you were wrong. Instead you blame it on others for quoting your irrational statement. Thanks for proving the point.
OrangeGrayBlue
Member
bgassassin said:
Excuse my ignorance, but what do you mean by tesselation?
ClovingSteam said:
Ah yes, definitely - if it's 360 power, it simply won't do, no matter how amazing the online/controller setup turns out to be.
If they want to pose themselves as significant competition to Sony and Microsoft, they'll have to up the ante in terms of power - else we might see another Wii situation.
Dear God, don't make it another Wii situation
I think they're ready to calm it down a bit on the graphics front, and focus on other things.
If the case, hopefully we'll see a closer battle between the next gen consoles this time around. More of a Gamecube situation.
disap.ed said:
They've already commented on they're reaction to the early dev kits - and they're happy.
OrangeGrayBlue said:
In simple terms, the ability to change the number of polygons in a model when the camera zooms in closer.
Allows for better detail/performance -
Further away = lower amount of polygons, less RAM heavy.
Closer up = higher poly count - better looking models/more realism.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
About the graphics hardware and all that, is anything finalized? I enjoy complaining about the Wii-U but I can't say I follow the up to the minute news. Is there a possibility that it could be better, or will it stay at a level they've already decided upon (and shown) at E3.
And people need to stop quoting developers when it's launch time. They all say shit. Who remembers all these wonderful and amazing developers saying how interesting the Wii was and all the things they're gonna do with it. Even Kojima was one of those, he didn't do shit, lol.
And people need to stop quoting developers when it's launch time. They all say shit. Who remembers all these wonderful and amazing developers saying how interesting the Wii was and all the things they're gonna do with it. Even Kojima was one of those, he didn't do shit, lol.
OrangeGrayBlue
Member
disap.ed said:
I don't even expect that. I think Wii U will be to PS4 and 720 as PS2 is to GCN and xbox. For all intents and purposes, multiplatform games will look identical. Especially when you consider that extra power last gen was the difference between having a block for a hand or indiviual fingers, while next gen it will be the difference between obscure lighting techniques that only become readily apparent in side-by-side comparisons.
Dreamwriter
Member
Here's the problem with this idea - it doesn't matter how much more powerful the systems are, their graphics aren't going to get noticeably much better than what we are currently getting. We've already hit the point where it costs over $10 million to make a game that starts to use the power modern consoles and PC's allow. It just takes a lot of time and money for 3D artists to make assets and effects detailed enough to need that power. And only a very small percentage of games have those kind of budgets.ClovingSteam said:
If the Wii-U is powerful enough to do XBox 360/PS3 quality graphics at 1080p at 60fps, that's all they need, consumers aren't going to think those games will look bad. I mean do you really think Nintendo will lose the next-gen battle purely because the system is "only" capable of making games look like Uncharted 3 at 1080p/60fps?
-Pyromaniac- said:
It will almost certainly get better. 2nd generation dev kits are available now, as far as I know, but they're not the final builds. Hardware manufacturers usually use off the shelf parts, but with a similar build to the final version so developers can get used to the tech before working on the final dev kits.
disap.ed said:
Ah! My bad, thought you were saying that Crytek won't be happy with the performance of the system if it's not very powerful - but we already know they're happy, so...
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
Dreamwriter said:
This is what happens with every generation though. We think 'OH MAN, THIS LOOKS AMAAAAAAAZING!!!!' and then next gen proves, no, it can be better. I thought RE4 look fantastic on the GC and it did but guess what games out this gen have gone even further. The first year or two of the Wii U's life it will match up fairly well with the PS4/Next Box but as devs are able to get more out of those two, the Wii U will show its age like the Wii.
BF3 on the PC is noticeably better than the 360/PS3. If we're looking at next gen consoles being able to closely replicate what PC's today are able to do and the Wii is closer to the 360? Yes, it will be noticeable.
Also as someone else suggested, Crytek isn't going to badmouth Nintendo's hardware since Crytek would be offering software for it. It's also possible that they're happy not because it fulfills their requests for next gen hardware wise but rather it allows them to easily port over their current software.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
Ah, I'm just not familiar with how Dev Kits work. I always assumed that each iteration was just a more refined version of the same foundation. But each iteration can actually contain different specs you're saying?Ubermatik said:
Zoramon089
Banned
ClovingSteam said:
This makes no sense and this argument seems to ONLY be used when talking about Nintendo consoles. Do I have to bring up all the articles where Gabe Newell dumps on the PS3 despite Valve having games on it? Do I have to pull up articles where Crytek complains about consoles not being powerful enough?
OrangeGrayBlue
Member
disap.ed said:
I'm glad someone agrees with me. It's common sense that as small details improve, the ability to notice them decreases. The further our ability to render detail goes, the more significant an increase in power is needed for all those improvements to amount to anything noteworthy. As we're already seeing now, great art style will trump things like "realism" next gen and, in that regard, Nintendo is no slouch.
Dreamwriter
Member
It doesn't happen every generation, the XBox 360/PS3 generation was the first one to reach enough power where development costs became the #1 factor limiting graphical quality. Yes, BF3 looks pretty good, but that's because it's one of those super-high-budget games. Most games aren't going to look like BF3 even if we had a game system capable of rendering modern Pixar movies in realtime. We've hit the point where making systems more powerful only benefits developers willing to put serious development money into the games, and there are less and less developers willing to do that.ClovingSteam said:
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
Zoramon089 said:
Valve games this gen have been more about artistry than graphical power. So yes, they wouldn't even need a console that is graphically powerful. Crytek? The same Crytek that said Crysis 1 would never make it to the 360 or PS3 since it wouldn't even resemble the original product? And then go on to offer just that? Yea. But hey, if you want to take Crytek at its word more power to you.
Dreamwriter said:
So what you're arguing is that the next gen Xbox and PS4 will not be significantly more powerful than this gen? That was the common belief but it seems with more and more info being let out from developers that we will have another bump in graphical output and not a minor one either. If we receive a similar difference from PS2 to PS3 and Xbox to Xbox 360 for next gen then yes, the Wii U will face a similar situation as the Wii. Nintendo is betting that its competitors will not have a noticeable increase but I'm guessing they're going to be wrong.
Zoramon089
Banned
ClovingSteam said:
But you proved my point! They bashed consoles they developed for! So there's no reason to think they're lying by saying the Wii U is powerful
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
Zoramon089 said:
Please define 'powerful'. The 360 is POWERFUL, just not as powerful as the Next Box and PS4 will be. The GC was POWERFUL just not as powerful as the 360 is. Power is relative. Will the Wii U be 'powerful'? Sure, in comparison to this generation.
Crytek has shown itself to not always be honest in what it says. When it comes to Crytek they're one of the last devs I trust, seeing how they handled Crysis 2 for the PC and now Crysis 1 for consoles.
IsntChrisL
Member
I'm not sure why people are so willing to believe that MS and Sony are eager to get a new console out there. AFAIK games are still selling well on the PS3/360. They both sunk a ton of money into this gen and I'm sure they'd like to make as much money off of it as possible. I think they will gauge consumer reaction to the Wii U before they feel the need to compete with another expensive system of their own.
I personally can't wait to see more Wii U games.
I personally can't wait to see more Wii U games.
Dreamwriter
Member
No, I'm arguing that it doesn't *matter* if they are. They could be powerful enough to render modern Pixar movies in realtime, but most games won't look like Battlefield 3. It takes a hell of a lot of money to develop a game that looks better than current consoles allow. More money than most publishers/developers are willing to spend, especially in this economy, where they've really cut down on the number of AAA titles. Yes, those 2 or 3 games a year will amaze people, but most games won't look any better than XBox 360 or PS3, except higher resolution and framerate.ClovingSteam said:
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
IsntChrisL said:
Rumors are out that Micro will reveal their next console in 2012. More and more developers are talking about next generation and even claiming to know what Micro and Sony will be doing. That doesn't mean they will stop selling their current consoles and software. Just as the PS2 sold buckets during the first couple years of the PS3's life, the same can happen this go around.
With Nintendo looking to release the Wii U in 2012 you'd be crazy to think Microsoft and Sony wouldn't be pushing their consoles out more than a year or so later. The wheels are in motion, whether folks like yourself are ready or not. I'm ready as are many others. We see the current consoles as ancient hardware which is what they are. We're getting nothing but sequels now. While I'm very excited for Skyrim, BF3, Uncharted 3, etc., I want new hardware and for developers to create new IP's.
Dreamwriter said:
Except its the AAA companies that have the most input with Sony and Microsoft. Look at how much say Epic had with pushing Microsoft to the 512mb of ram. Epic, Crytek, Naughty Dog, etc. have more say than smaller developers. These companies have communicated what they desire for next gen, as have Sony and Microsoft. It's heavy on pushing the graphics. While others want connectivity, digital downloads, etc., many also want increase in graphical performance.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
In reality every game will look like unreals new engine, except the odd studio like Square/sony's 1st parties who will have much better looking stuff for the console(s) that can handle it.
bgassassin
Member
Don't forget that Yerli not only said they were excited about Wii U, but was not big on Vita right now.
Ubermatik gave a better definition than I would have. Also you can look at that Crysis DX11 update to get an idea as well. However it won't be as noticeable compared to Nintendo-made games made for the out-dated capabilities of the Wii hardware.
Still nothing so far. The dev kits aren't even final yet. They are supposed to be getting the next version of the dev kits soon if they haven't already gotten them. I would believe they won't have final dev kits till next year.
OrangeGrayBlue said:
Ubermatik gave a better definition than I would have. Also you can look at that Crysis DX11 update to get an idea as well. However it won't be as noticeable compared to Nintendo-made games made for the out-dated capabilities of the Wii hardware.
-Pyromaniac- said:
Still nothing so far. The dev kits aren't even final yet. They are supposed to be getting the next version of the dev kits soon if they haven't already gotten them. I would believe they won't have final dev kits till next year.
-Pyromaniac- said:
It all depends really. New instalments of dev kits usually bring with them a more tweaked, improved element than the last one - say, a less power-consuming, slightly more powerful CPU.
It's worth noting, however that these changes aren't massive alterations to the performance of the machine - in many ways, yes, they keep the same foundation, and build/tweak it to the final specs.
However, the difference between a first generation developer kit and a second generation one is likely to be far greater than, say, 2 to 3.
Put simply, the difference between the first build and the final, production specifications end up being quite a bit different - it just comes in smaller steps.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
This is all too confusing. I wish Nintendo would just put on their nerd glasses and start breaking it down to people so we know what to expect with it.Ubermatik said:
IsntChrisL
Member
ClovingSteam said:
It has nothing to do with whether or not I'm ready. I even said in the post you quoted that I'm excited for the Wii U. I know Sony/MS are developing their next consoles, but I don't think we should assume that they are eager to get them out. They're not. As far as they are concerned, the longer they can profit on their current hardware, the better.
I personally hope that the Wii U gets enough attention where it does force Sony/MS to speed up the process. It really depends on Nintendo's success, I think.
Dreamwriter
Member
Yeah, so? It doesn't matter one bit how powerful the systems end up. I'm not saying the systems aren't going to be powerful. That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm just saying it doesn't matter if they are. We've reached a point where making a system more powerful means very little to most games.ClovingSteam said:
-Pyromaniac- said:
Haha, okay - A dev kit is given to developers before the system is announced. Developers get used to the hardware etc. and start making games.
Then nintendo release a newer, updated version, which gives the developers a little bit more power, a little bit less consumption.
Overall, this happens about 4 times, up until the console launches.
Each new kit gives developers a better idea of what the production version will be like, whilst nintendo work on finalising the system specs.
This way, devs will be ready to release when the system finally arrives.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
yeah but not jumping into the next-generation soon enough might hurt profits in the long run. No company can afford to let another company have ALL the momentum hogged for themselves for a long period of time. Nintendo set the wheels, now all bets are off. Anything could come at any time. I don't expect Sony/MS to drop it in 2012 but I expect them to start announcing/dropping hints for a 2013 release, in order to get people to wait for them rather than make the plunge with Nintendo.IsntChrisL said:
so the final specs could be a lot different then what they've already shown? Or by the sounds of it, it will only be slightly better through the various tweaks from each iteration.Ubermatik said:
IsntChrisL
Member
-Pyromaniac- said:
2013, I could believe. My post was mostly driven by the people that seem to expect a late 2012 launch.
Dreamwriter
Member
Except the changes aren't always to "a little bit more power" - often the changes make the systems less powerful, to save money on manufacturing or fit the final hardware design better. XBox in particular had a huge power drop in the final iteration, and the PSP CPU speed got significantly capped (later on it was uncapped, though).Ubermatik said:
-Pyromaniac-
Member
Now I really don't know what to expect. I should just stop thinking about this. I'm going to go back to complaining about what I was complaining about before:Dreamwriter said:
ANALOGS AND TRIGGERS NINTENDO, DUH.
Chittagong
Gold Member
I think we won't see it again before E3 2012. We are pretty much at the same point now as in September 2005 - no games actually utilizing the hardware anywhere near its potential, instead last gen demos of new controller. The only difference is that Nintendo showed the bird demo and Zelda demo to give a feel of the performance. Similar to Spaceworld 2000.
History points to E3 2012 real reveal, Autumn release.
History points to E3 2012 real reveal, Autumn release.
Zoramon089
Banned
ClovingSteam said:
At the same type Crytek's the type of dev that prioritizes high spec machines. The fact that this wasn't in an interview setting and that out of the blue they made this comment is what surprises me
OrangeGrayBlue
Member
This may be a bit unrealistic but I could see a scenario where sony and MS make a sort of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" pact and both hold off on new consoles until 2014. This would make the Wii U look like it's not a real leap into next-gen, sort of like the dreamcast. I think both companies fear that Nintendo would gain too much momentum to let that happen, but it would be an interesting turn of events.
bgassassin
Member
^ They wouldn't do that. At least MS wouldn't. They want the "hardcore" market Sony had. This gen they were helped by Sony to split it with them.
Based on what we know Nintendo left "holes" in the final specs given to devs. That leads me to believe Nintendo has a range on what they want to target for the final numbers. It would be nice to see what kind of range they are setting. Clock speeds (CPU and GPU) and main memory amount seem to be two of the holes.
-Pyromaniac- said:
Based on what we know Nintendo left "holes" in the final specs given to devs. That leads me to believe Nintendo has a range on what they want to target for the final numbers. It would be nice to see what kind of range they are setting. Clock speeds (CPU and GPU) and main memory amount seem to be two of the holes.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
also I don't buy that bird demo for a second. I just don't see a fully populated game looking nearly as good as that.Chittagong said:
But here's the question: why would they bother saying that they're exited about the specs when they could just talk about the controller if they feel it's not powerful enough? Zoramon is right; if they were talking about Sony or MS hardware, you'd be saying that it means that whatever console they're talking about is quite powerful.ClovingSteam said:
And this is why I felt there was no need to make a tread for that news. So many people here who want Wii U to be weak.
Chittagong
Gold Member
OrangeGrayBlue said:
I think this is very likely - if not as explicit agreement, at least on an implicitlevel this is what they will try to do. The difference is that this time it might actually work - this time Nintendo does not have a brilliantly unique controller and a casual crowd pleaser to negate the technical difference - hence the Dreamcast analogy would be accurate if Sony and MS aligned.
- Status