Ah ha, but then people will forget about Ideaman, and other sites will stop quoting him...
Wii U Speculation Thread The Third: Casting Dreams in The Castle of Miyamoto
- Thread starter AceBandage
- Start date
Ah ha, but then people will forget about Ideaman, and other sites will stop quoting him...
For the wall of text, it was possible explanations of the Vigil comment from yesterday.
For the power, i wrote 50 clear 1-liners with bold and underlined texts stating that the Wii U will not be on par neither a large jump in specs from xbox360, you aren't fair or you don't remember them or you didn't read them
I think next time i'll spare myself the trouble, this thread is crazy in a way, it's a illogical rollercoaster, one time per week, 30 or 40% of the posters are back to the "Wii U = Xbox 360" thing like they didn't read the 156 elements that prove the contrary. I understand why community managers of some mmo just stop posting, there is no end
There are a lot of emotionally unstable people. If you can get worked up so much about how much more powerful a console is compared to another
From a marketing standpoint Nintendo has to remove doubts from the 'core' gamers though. Wonder if they can manage that at E3.
JoshuaJSlone
Member
We didn't realize they were just hitting the Turbo button on GameCube. If they didn't have the GameCube to build on, the Wii would not have been the Wii we know. There's no way they would've purposefully made something that archaic.
Sorry if my previous post may sound bitter-sweet, it wasn't against you my buddy little cute bad boy cat
It's just that it's really crazy that just a comment from a studio can have such instant consequences and craziness to some, without analyzing the context, comparing it to the previous info, etc.
It's kind of amusing that an architecture designed at the end of the last century is being used in a console still on shelves in 2012.
AceBandage
Banned
Wait...
How is the 3DS the "Worst from Nintendo"?
And that it was in the most successful console of the generation.
Though, the GC was quite the little beast, so it was only right that it got to live so long.
How is the 3DS the "Worst from Nintendo"?
And that it was in the most successful console of the generation.
Though, the GC was quite the little beast, so it was only right that it got to live so long.
Sorry if my previous post may sound bitter-sweet, it wasn't against you my buddy little cute bad boy cat
It's just that it's really crazy that just a comment from a developer can have such instant consequences and craziness to some, without analyzing the context, comparing it to the previous info, etc.
Yeah I wouldn't worry about it. This thread can be quite the rollercoaster.
You actually make this thread a lot of fun for us, and a lot of us do appreciate having you here to keep this thread interesting.
I'm a little curious, and I'm far from an expert, but the 3DS, in terms of raw power is, if I'm remembering correctly, significantly below the Gamecube for example, but because of it's modern parts, it makes up for it and in some areas surpasses it. Will the WiiU be similar? As in, even if WiiU was roughly 'on-par' in raw power to the 360 (speaking purely hypothetical here), would the more modern tech show some significant improvements in areas, making it look noticeably better anyway?
It's just that it's really crazy that just a comment from a studio can have such instant consequences and craziness to some, without analyzing the context, comparing it to the previous info, etc.
Welcome to the world of fan-boyizm on a gaming website. I don't think its too surprising. People from both sides will twist words to their liking.
lol, i don't care, it's not like i'll profit of this "virtual pseudo fame" by presenting me by the ideaman nickname to employers. I'm on the web since the beginning, people, communities, websites, are forgotten very quickly, chasing a status in this media is a fruitless and pointless intent with a lot of short-lived and fleetingly results.
So Pokemon Tretta is the next Snap, it's settled huh ?
Sorry if my previous post may sound bitter-sweet, it wasn't against you my buddy little cute bad boy cat
It's just that it's really crazy that just a comment from a studio can have such instant consequences and craziness to some, without analyzing the context, comparing it to the previous info, etc.
We appreciate your information and time you've put into this thread. It's not your fault some distort your words or overhype themselves with unrealistic expectations.
AceBandage
Banned
It's complicated with the 3DS.
It can do (theoretically) more polygons, but not as good of textures, and has more modern shaders that can be used easily for games.
The Wii U, however, should be more powerful in every way than the PS3/360 regardless of what it has, simply because it's using a card and parts that are designed with 2010 or later tech.
I also find it bloody frustrating from our perspective, because we saw the bird demo, we can tell that it is a step up from what the PS360 can do, no one believes that it is a giant leap, but we know some things, like you can basically drag and drop 360 code into the original under clocked devkits and the games would run, which means that it has to be more powerful, because writing that close to the hardware, means you are tailoring the game to run on that hardware, it's just not possible for Nintendo's console to only be on par...
Wii U's Hardware that we actually know and how it compares to 360:
Wii U:
Processing node: 32nm (for those who think the box is too small)
Ram: 1GB+
Edram on GPU: 32MB
Shader model:4.1+
GPU processing:1000+ GFlops
CPU: 3 cores, ppc7 based @ ~3ghz
360:
Processing node: 90nm (for comparing sizes of the box to their power potential)
Ram: 512MB
Edram on GPU: 10MB
Shader model: 3.0+
GPU Processing power: 240 Gflops
CPU: 3 cores, ppe based @ 3.2ghz (3 slightly modified cell processors)
We don't know everything, like the clocks for the GPU, or how much over 1GB ram the system has, but we know that the GPU is very custom and that early dev kits used R700 series GPUs, the parts in the Wii U is many years ahead of the current consoles, it isn't going to be a huge leap over what the current consoles can do, but there will be clear differences:
Better lighting: The bird demo has some amazing examples, just watch the bird's underbelly as he flies over the water. (just make sure you are watching the floor version, and not the conference version) The Zelda demo and just what we know about how newer GPUs work, they will show off lighting that is natural that was done only prebaked before, and really is not possible on the current consoles.
Higher res textures: More ram means higher textures, also the large amount of edram on the GPU is very capable of producing higher resolutions than what we saw with the sub hd (in a lot of games) from the current gen.
Newer shader models: This improves a lot of effects, such as shadows.
Tessellation units: We know that the devkit's GPU had a Tessellation unit, but the custom one would likely have a more up to date unit.
I list all this stuff, because everyone coming into this thread to post the doom and gloom just don't know or understand what we have found out in the past 3 threads, Wii U won't be the jump that the industry is looking for, but the likely hood of the PS4 and Xbox3 to hit those goals if launched before the end of 2014, is very small, there is just not a radical change in performance on the horizon, so in the very worst case scenario, Wii U is a little less than half as powerful as the other consoles, that would allow it to still get down ports of every game on those consoles, likely lowering the resolution to 720p from 1080p would be enough to hit it.
I appreciate people want Wii U to be powerful but at this point all I want is full BC and VC transfers, HDMI and 1080p. If its on par or slighlty more than ps360, either is fine by me so long as multiplat ports are feasible.
Beyond that, whatever. I'd much rather see new ideas too.
Beyond that, whatever. I'd much rather see new ideas too.
I didn't say that. I was simply saying it's safer to expect the worst and avoid disappointment than to have sky high hopes and watch them come crashing down.
The 3DS ended up being at the low end of expectations. Many were disappointed.
You and me, both. Heh, if games look as cool as the Zelda demo, I'm happy. Just do some cool stuff with the controller and remote and nunchuck and I'm golden. Anything more is gravy.
AceBandage
Banned
Spieler Eins
Member
This Eternal Darkness talk brings my hype up to levels that are usually only reached a week or two before E3.
God, I will be so disappointed now when it happens to be Too Human 2 trolling.
God, I will be so disappointed now when it happens to be Too Human 2 trolling.
AceBandage
Banned
I don't know why they would even bother with TH2.
The first one nearly destroyed the company and drove Dyack insane...
Many had unrealistic hopes brought on by the kind of leap we saw between GBA and PSP, even though today's Nintendo simply doesn't do things like that. These people seemingly never learn.
I think the 3DS specs are just fine and the leap is definitely significant enough. It's all about perspective.
And yet Dyack wants to do another...
lol yeah there's no way it's Too Human 2. That would just be business suicide.
You can add surely better/more optimized/easier/less resources taxing ways of applying AA, texture filtering, etc, than on Xbox360 thanks to more modern gpu/more memory/buffer, etc.
Spieler Eins
Member
CoffeeJanitor
Member
Summary post was very helpful thanks!
AceBandage
Banned
Because the people in this thread don't have a vendetta against Nintendo and actually have been keeping up on the news.
I was with you until this point. This quote from Epic's CEO was brought to my attention by Cerebral Assassin in the Vigil thread, and I think it gives a more realistic idea of what to expect.
Mike Capps said:
AceBandage
Banned
If it has a free mode where you can basically just run around and destroy things with no consequences, then it is so bought.
lol, Well I'm glad you enjoyed it, I just want people to understand that the console won't be a waste of money from a hardware perspective, there is value in the tech and we will all enjoy new experiences that just weren't possible on the 360 and PS3, and the industry should be saying this, but they were expecting a larger jump for next generation consoles, even though PCs still haven't reached that jump except for the very highest end.
Summary: The HD twins spoiled the industry in 2005/2006, and the industry on a whole will be disappoint by this next generation's power level, like your favorite Non Goku DBZ character after the hyperbolic time chamber.
That would be poetic after the collective groan of the internet when it was announced last E3.
That's what happens when developers make comments like that and get taken out of context. I have hope for WiiU but made it clear if the hardware sucks not down for another generation of hardware that 3rd parties can't get in to or be happy about being onboard with. This is legit issue that if nintendo can't show me they are interested doing decent hardware I have no interest in their systems as I'm well beyond just only wanting to play their titles mostly and handful of 3rd party titles.
Because it was not as innovative as the DS or the Wii? Nowhere close, in fact. It was a typical system upgrade and nothing more. I don't care how many polygons it pushes or what sort of glitter effects or superMAX-splosion particles it can shit out. It was not a proper successor to a system as innovative as the DS or the Wii. In that context, I would consider it the 'worst from Nintendo.'
That's simply my opinion, of course. People are free to disagree with me.
Nah it's Ok, I have seen worse several years ago.
I just can't wait for this year's E3. Either way, someone will go crazy.
The funny thing is that no one cared about the power level when Nintendo had the technologically superior N64 and Gamecube. Now everyone's trumpeting the fact that every console must be at least 10x more powerful than the next.
Seriously, some people are expecting a 7970 card or even Kepler in the next Xbox. It's like people want to be disappointed.
That quote says "a couple of years down the road" like I said, in 2014 it's possible that the consoles could be 4x the Wii U, but if those consoles release in 2014, Wii U will be on the market for 2 full years without competition, Wii U will become the base platform of the generation just like 360 did, and all games will simply get up ports to those other two consoles, thanks to 30million+ Wii U consoles vs less than 5million combined, from the other two after their opening holiday season.
Seriously if PS4 and Xbox3 launch with cutting edge tech, the difference won't be much greater than Xbox vs PS2 comparisons, and that was with the xbox being able to do stuff that the ps2 could not, which is NOT actually possible if the Wii U has modern hardware.
ahhhh yes, and here we are again. June 2011, post-E3. all the female like, insecure fans questioning every quote from any news article down to the sentence, word and letter. all the fake Nintendo fans/critics/haters that point the finger when said articles are discussed.
i tell it's like the critics hide in the ground for a little and some even pretend that they're interested in the Wii U. then when an article like this comes out RAAAAWWWWRRR!!!! lol nothings changed.
but another thing that's interesting to me is this supposed great incompetency Nintendo has by what tech they choose for their consoles. people are willing to erase 3 whole gens of superior HW, for just 1 gen of HW that was behind the others. that logic makes about as much sense as Florida's laws.
i tell it's like the critics hide in the ground for a little and some even pretend that they're interested in the Wii U. then when an article like this comes out RAAAAWWWWRRR!!!! lol nothings changed.
but another thing that's interesting to me is this supposed great incompetency Nintendo has by what tech they choose for their consoles. people are willing to erase 3 whole gens of superior HW, for just 1 gen of HW that was behind the others. that logic makes about as much sense as Florida's laws.
Yeah it would be very poetic. The screenshots do give a good idea of what the gameplay might be like too.
The people having those expectations for next Xbox are delusional most have already leaked what amd is using as a basis.
N64 power was ignored because of the media that developers had to use. The same was for GC and the ram pool due how it was split which made it even less attractive. Even if the gpu and cpu are good nintendo has show since their first 3d system they can't balance a lot of issues right to get 3rd parties involved. That's a fact with all 4 of their consoles and it's worrying me in a legit way.
I'm personally thinking Nintendo's hardware will be competent enough for 3rd party ports for at least 2 years after it releases. Basically until devs can fully exploit the power of the most likely stronger PS4/Nextbox, the Wii U will receive downports from them. I also think UE4 games won't run unless with huge concessions like BF3/Witcher 2 on PS360. and I don't think devs will put enough effort into doing such ports unless the Wii U has a massive userbase.
I'm keeping my expectations low. If you overhype yourself, you're just setting yourself up for disappointement.
Going to be my first E3 on GAF. Gonna be hella exciting.
That's true. Well, Nintendo reportedly asked for dev impressions from several devs like EA, Vigil and Team Ninja. Who knows what kind of impressions they gave though.
From that perspective, I understand what you're saying. The 3DS feels more like an 'evolution' than a revolution. But I'm ok with that because it seems like pretty much everything has 'evolved'. Not just the graphics and 3D, but the circle pad, the online capabilities and eshop, the AR stuff, the OS, even the third party support.
One thing I really like about it is that it seems like a system that doesn't revolve around one central gimmick that is constantly in your face (like motion with Wii and Touch in the early part of the DS's life). I mean, the 3D is/was the headline feature, but it's kind of just 'there', and it's nice to have it, but it doesn't really affect gameplay all that much, just makes it a bit more immersive. There's still a whole host of great improvements though that make it a worthwhile upgrade from the DS, and that's what I'm hoping the WiiU will be like.
ColdBlooder
Banned
But it will ne a very fun time in neogaf when trhe nextbox turns out to be just a little faster than the wiiu
Cerebral Assassin
Member
I think that's slightly harsh, they had been looking at 3D output for decades, & the 3DS was the first realistic product from them that could do that.
Heh, nothing you can say will stop people from being overhyped. E3 is gonna be crazy as hell. Actually, I think it's gonna get crazy well before then, because leaks are going to happen as we get closer to E3. Still, I have no idea what the future is gonna hold, but based on what we've seen so far, I'm sure I'll be more than satisfied.
That's good I have my hopes because they gotten better just I know how 3rd parties get these days if the tech isn't what they want.
As for this being your first E3 with gaf make sure you're here early. Even if E3 sucks usually forum activity alone makes it worthwhile especially depending on which of the big 3 goes first.
I'm well aware that Miyamoto and Co. have had a hard-on for 3D for decades. That doesn't somehow make using it a fantastic idea that will be praised by one and all. The Wii was designed to address what the consumer wanted, or at least remove obstacles from their enjoyment of gaming. The DS was similar.
3D, near as I can tell, was a focal point for Nintendo's internal dreams and fantasies alone - not something that customers wanted, nor something that removes obstacles.
It feels like a very selfish system, in a sense. "This is what we've been wanting to do for forever. We're less concerned with what you guys might want or need." And then they put that ridiculous price-tag on it, as if they'd somehow unearthed the Holy Grail and marketed it.
ooh, thanks for the advice. I'll be sure to watch all 3 events and their respective threads.
JoshuaJSlone
Member
WhaaaaVAPitts said: