Will Hermen Hulst get the axe for Concord?

will he?

  • yes, and he should

    Votes: 150 29.4%

  • yes, but he shouldn't

    Votes: 1 0.2%

  • no, but he should

    Votes: 274 53.7%

  • no, and he shouldn't

    Votes: 85 16.7%
  • Total voters
    510
Kacho said:
I'm not arguing against you. Just stating that the last 'good' thing she was involved with creatively was Splinter Cell Blacklist, a decade ago.
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For sure. But at that level youre not really a creative anyway. You just have to have some sense of what's going on, how to spot good projects and people. I'm just saying its honestly a very, very short list of candidates which is why Hulst is even still there.
 
Punished Miku said:
Yeah but at that level you're managing studios, recruiting top people and trying to greenlight franchises. She has experience in all that even with some missteps. And she does great PR.
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If Fairgames bombs —and that's 120% certain— it would be hilariously crazy to promote her to PS CEO. I can see her surviving that debacle for obvious reasons (the same why she was hired and given a studio) but that kind of promotion after a failure... sheesh. I don't put it past Sony, since they are in full clown mode, but that's not what should happen.
 
Punished Miku said:
For sure. But at that level youre not really a creative anyway. You just have to have some sense of what's going on, how to spot good projects and people. I'm just saying its honestly a very, very short list of candidates which is why Hulst is even still there.
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Yeah I hear ya. I'm just skeptical of her ability to know what the market wants if Fairgame$ is anything to go by.
 
Angry_Megalodon said:
If Fairgames bombs —and that's 120% certain— it would be hilariously crazy to promote her to PS CEO. I can see her surviving that debacle for obvious reasons (the same why she was hired and given a studio) but that kind of promotion after a failure... sheesh. I don't put it past Sony, since they are in full clown mode, but that's not what should happen.
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Well we dont know how the game is yet. Maybe she had to pitch a GAAS to get funding for a studio and get bought if thats all investors wanted. She had something else canned at Google. Guess we'll see. 🤷‍♂️
 
It was a new IP in a competitive segment. Flopping was always a potential outcome.

Sorry, but is anyone arguing with a straight-face that every time historically Sony have tried a genre they are inexperienced with that it turns out to be a huge success?

The funny part for me is that the only reason why Sony would pull it from sale so fast is so they can remodel and re-rerelease down the line. Its not going anywhere in its current form, but I highly doubt we've seen the last of it.
 
I'm actually trying to imagine this scenario.

Imagine what's bouncing around Sony japan's heads, and how uncomfortable it must be between Hulst and Japan now.

I can only imagine what these western employees have been spouting to the heads in Japan for years. Hurst will have probably been pitching concord as this huge franchise, westerners will love it, it's inclusive, all the full marketing shebang.

What they witness is the biggest flop in gaming history. They're probably sat there like what the fuck are these Gaijin smoking.
 
He won't. Should he? Without knowing more of what all took place behind the scenes I just don't know. Making people lose their jobs is always a shitty thing imo especially when it's being weaponized to punish people by those with an axe to grind. It does make me incredibly nervous on his decisions going forward unless there's oversight by a larger group to rein in any possible bad decisions like this. This is a monumental fuck up that someone in his position should have never made.
 
My biggest issue with Hulst isn't the Concord failure but rather his soft spot or bias for Horizon.

I like Horizon quite a bit but the reality is, no matter how much he pushes it or how much money he spends on it, Aloy will never be a Kratos level character for PlayStation. Horizon feels like a perfect property to wrap up as a trilogy and then let Guerrilla Games move on to something new.

With two mainline games, a PSVR2 spin off, a Lego spin off, a failed TV show, rumors of a remaster, a Horizon themed GaaS in development, and the third mainline game in development, it's already dangerously close to an oversaturation point.
 
Everyone responsible for PlayStation losing focus mid-late PS4 needs a kick up the arse to refocus on what made them a successful console and first party game developer.
 
Nydius said:
My biggest issue with Hulst isn't the Concord failure but rather his soft spot or bias for Horizon.

I like Horizon quite a bit but the reality is, no matter how much he pushes it or how much money he spends on it, Aloy will never be a Kratos level character for PlayStation. Horizon feels like a perfect property to wrap up as a trilogy and then let Guerrilla Games move on to something new.

With two mainline games, a PSVR2 spin off, a Lego spin off, a failed TV show, rumors of a remaster, a Horizon themed GaaS in development, and the third mainline game in development, it's already dangerously close to an oversaturation point.
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Fundamentally, Aloy lacks the charisma to push the character into that level.
 
Nydius said:
My biggest issue with Hulst isn't the Concord failure but rather his soft spot or bias for Horizon.

I like Horizon quite a bit but the reality is, no matter how much he pushes it or how much money he spends on it, Aloy will never be a Kratos level character for PlayStation. Horizon feels like a perfect property to wrap up as a trilogy and then let Guerrilla Games move on to something new.

With two mainline games, a PSVR2 spin off, a Lego spin off, a failed TV show, rumors of a remaster, a Horizon themed GaaS in development, and the third mainline game in development, it's already dangerously close to an oversaturation point.
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I think they could have gotten there, but Forbidden West was bad and they don't even realize it. I think FW killed the momentum for it actually.
 
This guy needs to be kicked out immediately. Look at the past with Yoshida and compare it to the years with Hermen Hulst.

I remember back when Yoshida was in charge, even though I wasn't a member, I'd check the PlayStation studios thread on NeoGAF almost every day, hoping someone would drop a hint about a game in development. I used to live in a constant state of hype; now it's a state of uncertainty.
 
Windom Earle said:
Yeah losing $400m just happens. For Sony it was Tuesday.
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They probably broke even with HD2, or close to it.

HD2 sold 12+M back in may, which should be $480+M in revenue (from the game alone, then there's warbonds as well and sales since may).
 
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Cyberpunkd said:
You lose 400mln and "it just happens"?
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Making a bad call? Yes, it happens.

And because it reportedly cost em $400M, the game got canned, everybody got refunded, that ceo of whatever stepped down, the studio got closed and Sony is likely reassessing their Gaas-strategy.

At no point did I imply there are no consequences.
 
we'd need to know how much concord played a role in his plans before deciding that. i mean if his strategy also greenlit Helldivers 2 and astrobot for example then that's 2 of 3 successes and one mega failure.

I imagine execs wanna see his portfolio release first before giving him the boot. plus they are seeing how he handles pressure and bounces back, an important quality in a leader. Unlike a creative lead/Director, Herman has more than just concord under his belt at Sony.
 
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BennyBlanco said:
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Who's that guy?
 
diffusionx said:
I think they could have gotten there, but Forbidden West was bad and they don't even realize it. I think FW killed the momentum for it actually.
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Kinda veering off topic a but personally I felt the gameplay was a significant step up from Zero Dawn but, narratively, the game was a mess. It's the epitome of a game that was trying to do too much. They wanted to recapture some of the discovery magic from the first game when we learned what Zero Dawn was and how much of an ass Faro was but they went completely overboard.

"How can we give them some jaw dropping plot twists?"

Old world humans return!
Faro worshippers!
Sentient deep space AI human-consciousness collective!
Another clone!
Make Aloy queer!

"Great, do all of it!"

End result was a story that I ended up checking out from around the time I was introduced to the Quen. The whole thing would have been better served just being a story of Regalla and the Tenakh, Sylens, Hades remnants, and Hephaestus. So now
I'm not even really that invested in how the story wraps up because it's just become too fantastical.
 
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I voted no and no.

It's like the 2 letters story. Guy wins office, predecessor left him 2 letters that say open in case of emergency. Opens letter 1, it says "blame me" he blames him, it works. Time passes, another emergency pops up. Opens letter 2, it says "write 2 letters"

Basically, Concord 1, he gets a pass, Concord 2? Write 2 letters.
 
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I never understood how he got that job in the first place, or the promotion before that. He'll probably blame some other guy because he didn't greenlight the game himself. If he was a Hollywood exec, he'd be working back in the mail room now.
 
I remember the hate KZ2 got because of the input lag and the weighted feel of the gunplay. It didn't feel like CoD so a vocal group pressured the team to change the feel. So they reduced the weight of aiming along with the input lag. The input lag was a problem. KZ3 came out and those vocal people left for some other CoD then Shadowfall released and look what happened. Dude bent the knee and for what? KZ:SF lost what made it KZ.

Now the PS5 has enough juice to fulfill GGs vision as to what KZ2 strived to be.. and they ignore the IP.

Do I think he should be fired? I would say no but I'm not in a position to say. I do hope he learns from this and makes the necessary changes.
 
Zacfoldor said:
I voted no and no.

It's like the 2 letters story. Guy wins office, predecessor left him 2 letters that say open in case of emergency. Opens letter 1, it says "blame me" he blames him, it works. Time passes, another emergency pops up. Opens letter 2, it says "write 2 letters"

Basically, Concord 1, he gets a pass, Concord 2? Write 2 letters.
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I thought of that as well 😂 The story was from "Traffic", right? Terrific movie.
 
If Hernan had direct input from the project/studio conception to release, then yes he should be fired. However, he came in late (remember 8 years in development, which is probably around 10 years full realization).
He should take this as a bow shot to change course of all remaining projects and organizational culture. Otherwise his time in C-Suite will be as long as Concords online status
 
Hulst is a clown.

A typical case of someone that takes an upper management position because he looks/talk like a pro, write the best emails or is the favourite of the correct people (for all the wrong reasons).

He is extremely incompetent and software wise has made Sony a joke.
4 years in the gen ffs. Their output is disastrous.

And the very first sign of things to come was their idiotic PC strategy that happened at the beginning of the gen. It was clear from this day what would follow.

Sony are lucky because their competitor was an even bigger clown.

Cerny is the only good thing they have.
 
This 400 million dollar price tag makes it not only the most expensive video game product of all time, but one of the biggest flops in entertainment media history.

He should've been gone the instant this game was pulled.

Then they should promote Neil Druckgod.
 
I don't know or care enough about the politics of this. I liked Killzone, I liked Horizon, I have no problem with Herman Hulst, I have no idea why the mob has wanted to string him up ever since he got his current job. Buncha drama queens.
 
Pray I Hope GIF

Nothing would make me happier. Sony has completely lost the plot. One good game every few years does not excuse the absolute shit shot this generation has been. It's simply unacceptable.
 
If he legit, honest to god thought this game was the next Playstation mega success that would elevate the brand into the stratosphere, then yes, he needs to go asap because he's poison for the brand.
 
The team actually has a lot of pedigree, and at the time he purchased the company, these types of games were all the rage. I don't think, given the information he had available when he took over, it would have been possible to foresee the game losing them 400m dollars, butterfly effect and "the professor" is late for the job interview or the DEI team miss the train, and this could have turned out very successful.

The other thing to consider is that they knew this game would flop weeks before release, they had the beta numbers, they had the pre-order numbers, they had mock-reviews written telling them what many of the final reviews said. Just because he was publicly supporting the game up until the moment it was pulled from sale, doesn't indicate he's an idiot, who was taken by surprise at this. Behind the scenes he could very well have seen this coming, even before the big reveal, and already prepared the exec team for the worst case scenario. I doubt he knew it would be worse than the worse case scenario, but I don't think he's stupid enough to have believe his own public rhetoric. I suspect the plan was to show support for the game and pray it's not a completely failure, as they had already spent what, 300+ million on it at that point? so what else can you do.

The only thing we can fairly judge him on is how he deals with this situation now, he should lay a lot of the team off, and course adjust on other titles in development to ensure they have appealing character designs (even if that means catering to the "male gaze") and put gameplay before politics and avoid any mention of genders or pronouns in reveals and previews.
 
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While I don't think highly of Hermen in is current position. He's not the only one making decisions. Firing him won't chance a thing.
 
He absolutely has to go.... the current Sony is horrible, No communication and remasters of remakes of remasters and shit games. Fuck off and bring back Shu to the front lines would be a good start.
 
Can't watch the video right now but that doesn't make sense to me.

What they are saying is that Sony financed the development of the game initially (way before purchasing them was on the table), when they were still part of Probably Monsters, they spent 200 million, then Sony decided to purchase the studio for an undisclosed amount and inyected another 200 million in the year between their purchase and the release of the game?

Not only would Hulst need to be retarded but on top of that all the chain of command and the board of Sony also thought that would be a good idea to finance a game and then purchase the studio for 400 million plus whatever they paid. It's the kind of decision making that could possible land someone in jail because it's just unbelievable that they could be so stupid without having some kind of interest (like getting a kick back).

That doesn't make sense to me. It really sounds to trashy and ignorant clickbait.
 
What's the justification for him NOT being fired?

This is maybe the McDonalds equivalent of the restaurant burning down on your watch… and during the investigation afterwards it's discovered you had an internal policy where nobody is allowed to talk about a fire while it's happening. He's the man at the top of the worst bone headed loss in company history. Fire him.

You'd have to be utterly insane to let him skate if this story is true.
 
Bring Shawn Layden before is to late, apologize and bring him back. Playstation is almost in a situation they will be fucked in 5-10 years.
Focus on what u do great(SP games) bring back ps3(2nd half ps4 era), put your few studios to make sp games a mix of short and long aaa games, try to have at least 3-4 games per year.
 
He won't be axed for it. They'll probably internally blame it on Jim Ryan and/or Connie Booth, roll senior heads at Firewalk, and try to forget it.
 
What worries me is that they thought a game like Concord was the future of PlayStation. Not sure if that was Hulst and other higher ups, but the future of PlayStation should not be games like Concord, but games like AstroBot. I'm hoping they reassess, whether it's Hermen or whoever, but a failure like this hopefully opened some eyes.
 
StueyDuck said:
we'd need to know how much concord played a role in his plans before deciding that. i mean if his strategy also greenlit Helldivers 2 and astrobot for example then that's 2 of 3 successes and one mega failure.

I imagine execs wanna see his portfolio release first before giving him the boot. plus they are seeing how he handles pressure and bounces back, an important quality in a leader. Unlike a creative lead/Director, Herman has more than just concord under his belt at Sony.
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Hermen wasn't only responsible for First Parties, right? I think the development of Second and Third Parties wasn't under his responsibility at the time of Helldivers 2. I know Yoshida is currently in charge of managing Sony's relationships with smaller developers and indies, so wasn't it him? In the case of Stellar Blade, I know Yoshida was involved in that project.

As for Astro Bot, it's basically what's left from what was PlayStation Japan, and Hermen decided to shut it down. It looks like now Sony might have to rethink and invest more internally again.
 
diffusionx said:
I think they could have gotten there, but Forbidden West was bad and they don't even realize it. I think FW killed the momentum for it actually.
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Bad to who? Cause I loved it and thought they took the story in some very interesting directions. I can't wait for the 3rd one.
 
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