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[Robert at Zeboyd Games]

Big budget Turn-based JRPGs are pretty rare these days though. Just about everything's either Action/RPG hybrids or low budget sexualized moe dungeon crawlers. I mean, what's the most recent big budget turn-based JRPG? Lost Odyssey in 2008?

I really hope Persona 5 is amazing.

 

[AzureFlame]

Lost Odyssey was the last best traditional JRPG for me and one of my favorite games of all time.

Microsoft if you make Lost Odyssey 2 I'll forget all the bad things you did recently.

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

The OP is built on a false premise. The idea that a JRPG is western influenced if its action orientated is bogus, imo, because Xenoblade and Tales for example, are two of the most 'Japanese' role playing game franchises out there.

And what's this about Atlus not churning out games anymore? They seem to have a stacked line up on handhelds every year, and have Persona 5 coming this year. This thread makes absolutely not sense to me, when there are tonnes of JRPG's being released across Vita and 3DS this generation.

If you choose to ignore them for inconsequential reasons just to suit your narrative OP, then that's fine. But it still makes no sense to me at all. The golden days of JRPG's are over, sure, but the situation isn't nearly as bad as you make it out to be, sorry.

 

[Fbh]

Yeah if you only look at traditional turn based JRPG's then there is a clear decline that will probably just keep going. Arena shooters are also rare on consoles but it doesn't mean that shooters in general are dying

JRPG's are still doing fine. There are more interesting JRPG projects right now than at the start of last gen IMO.

Also, Atlus is still very active. Right now they are working on 2 big home console JRPG's (Persona 5 and SMT X FE), compared to last gen where their only home console release was a Puzzle game.

 

[DNAbro]

Atlus isn't churning out games anymore

they release so many handheld games it's ridiculous.


Also yeah Persona 5. Biggest JRPG in a long time.

 

[Dr. Kitty Muffins]

It would be nice if there were internal first party teams devoted to the genre. I think there was a rumor by one of the NEOGAF moles that Sony had one. And I'm pretty sure the head of the Xbox unit unit hinted there may be something on the JRPG front cooking from Microsoft. We may all end up a bit more cheery in less than a month.

 

[RPGCrazied]

Also yeah Persona 5. Biggest JRPG in a long time.

Day 0 for that one. They also do first buyers justice with their games. Always a soundtrack and artbook.

 

[Robert at Zeboyd Games]

And what's this about Atlus not churning out games anymore? They seem to have a stacked line up on handhelds every year, and have Persona 5 coming this year. This thread makes absolutely not sense to me, when there are tonnes of JRPG's being released across Vita and 3DS this generation.

Atlus now just can't compare to what they used to be doing.

2004-2009 :

SMT: Nocturne (2004)
Digital Devil Saga (2005)
Digital Devil Saga 2 (2005)
Raidou (2006)
Persona 3 (2007)
Etrian Odyssey (2007)
Persona 3: FES (2008)
Etrian Odyssey 2 (2008)
Persona 4 (2008)
Raidou 2 (2009)
Devil Survivor (2009)

I mean, look at that. The best SMT. Revitalized Persona with 2 of the best JRPG ever. Several great new SMT spinoffs with DDS, Raidou, and Devil Survivor. And one of the best portable RPG series ever in the form of Etrian Odyssey.

 

[LiK]

Turn-based JRPGs have gotten stale. I'll miss them when they try to make the combat fun and not repetitive.

 

[Rad-]

We need more FF12/Xenoblade type JRPGs.

 

[Tizoc]

Still hoping to release it by the end of the year. And I know we missed our original release date, but we haven't even been working on the game for a full 2 years yet and we post updates frequently on Twitter and our website; it's hardly vaporware.

I have a weird way fo doing media blackout on games and movies =X

 

[KuwabaraTheMan]

Atlus might not release quite the same volume of games that they were in the mid-2000's, but it's not like they aren't still putting new RPGs out. Etrian Odyssey is an annual franchise, Persona 5 and Illusionary Revelation come out this year, and we're supposed to hear about Team Maniax's new game soon. Square also just released Bravely Second, so it's not like they're only doing Dragon Quest ports. Plus, they have a new Saga scheduled for this year. Pokémon is as big as ever, Kiseki is an almost annual series, Fire Emblem is actually bigger than ever before, Gust's output has been incredibly stable, and Bandai just released the excellent Digimon Story Cyber Sleuth in March, which was one of the most enjoyable RPGs of the last couple of years. Things may have declined since the PS2 era, but there's no need for doom mongering.

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

Pretty much. Which is a shame. Especially on consoles. Maybe Persona 5 can light a match under some asses if it does well, but the era of turn based is most likely over. Never get that real sequel to FFT either.

 

[Orayn]

We need more FF12/Xenoblade type JRPGs.

I'm extremely fond of that formula because it feels like an awesome modern outgrowth of the sprawling 16-bit JRPGs that got me interested in the genre in the first place. It's honestly kind of mystifying to see people reject it because it's "tainted" with Western game design.

News Flash: The pillars of the JRPG genre were attempts to make Western game design more accessible and bring them to a different market. Dragon Quest started with Yuji Horii seeing Wizardry at a trade show and thinking "Wow, this really inspires me. I want to make my own version of something like this."

 

[RPGCrazied]

I really want to know what Monolith Soft is up to once they finish up XCX DLC. XCX 2? I really want them to do another Baten Kaitos personally.

 

[Mauricio_Magus]

Don't worry guys, Atlus will drop EO3U and EOV and they will be the best games ever.

Spoiler

Please don't fuck up EOV, Atlus.

In a more serious note, JRPGs are going to be fine, and even if they suddenly died I'd still never finish my backlog of them.

 

[Falk]

Persona 5? Final Fantasy XV? Star Ocean 5? Tales series?

Xenoblade chronicles X ?

"I don't like them so they don't count lalalalalala"

 

[SatelliteOfLove]

This is doing upcoming JRPG sales no fucking favors, OP.

 

[BadWolf]

If people want the genre stuck in the past with the old traditional battle systems then the genre really will die, those aspect of RPGs are far too dated to be relevant today to a wide audience.

The fresh things that games like FFXV are doing is the right approach.

 

[Robert at Zeboyd Games]

I have a weird way fo doing media blackout on games and movies =X

We announced the game when we did the Kickstarter because we needed funding. There's a reason we had no gameplay footage; we had just barely started working on the game.

In contrast, most games don't get announced until they're mostly done unless they're part of a popular franchise and then they might get announced earlier.

Square also just released Bravely Second, so it's not like they're only doing Dragon Quest ports.

Unfortunately, Bravely Second sales weren't all that amazing so that could be the end of that series.

If people want the genre stuck in the past with the old traditional battle systems then the genre really will die, those aspect of RPGs are far too dated to be relevant today to a wide audience.

As long as you're not counting "turn-based" as being stuck in the past, I'm fine with this statement. Even as recently as last year, there were a lot of interesting experiments with turn-based combat from Persona Q's use of temporary MP to encourage ability use, Child of Light's slowdown support to make Grandia interrupts less chance based, and Bravely Default's use of storing up turns.

 

[Neff]

Lost Odyssey was the last best traditional JRPG for me and one of my favorite games of all time.

Microsoft if you make Lost Odyssey 2 I'll forget all the bad things you did recently.

Definitely with you on this.

Lost Odyssey felt flashy and decadent in all the ways I wanted a generation 7 JRPG to be, but was able to retain that classic turn-based feel without feeling stale by giving it several new twists. The challenge level was welcome, too.

I enjoyed Bravely Default, but it didn't pull off the mix of old/new quite as well as Lost Odyssey did imo.

The future doesn't look good for the classic style JRPG, at least on consoles.

If people want the genre stuck in the past with the old traditional battle systems then the genre really will die, those aspect of RPGs are far too dated to be relevant today to a wide audience.

The fresh things that games like FFXV are doing is the right approach.

I'm not so sure. As someone who loves FFXIII, corridors and all, I feel that FFXV is quite a step back based on Episode Duscae. It has some good ideas (the camping stuff is great), and is likely to be changed in light of feedback, but the combat really was brain-dead simple to the point where it neither worked as a strategic RPG system nor an action title. If this sort of streamlining and innovation is the future, then it's a direction I'd prefer JRPGs not to go in.

 

[Kintaro]

Unfortunately, Bravely Second sales weren't all that amazing so that could be the end of that series.

It could still survive...after either Nintendo or SE release the game in the west 2-3 years from now. =/

 

[FluxWaveZ]

Atlus isn't churning out games anymore.

With comments like this and the very premise of this thread, I feel like you're just trying to start shit and that you don't actually care about upcoming JRPGs.

 

[Noirulus]

Bravely Default, Bravely Second and SMTIV are all pretty great.

Hahaha, good one.

 

[Falk]

If people want the genre stuck in the past with the old traditional battle systems then the genre really will die, those aspect of RPGs are far too dated to be relevant today to a wide audience.

The fresh things that games like FFXV are doing is the right approach.

Eh, I'd say in this case you can have your cake and eat it. Just like CRPGs have a die-hard fanbase that's willing to pay for new stuff, the JRPG fanbase who enjoys turn-based games are out there. More diluted, perhaps, but still there. Those things wouldn't really do well in a brick-and-mortar environment, but when you take that out of the equation, I'd say there's still a very viable niche market out there with a strong sense of brand loyalty.

I've been turning my brain off to play Hyperdimension Neptunia (Rebirth, obviously) and seriously, it's the most fun I've had on a non-portable turn-based JRPG in forever. (*While I said non-portable to make a distinction from Bravely, I know it's a bit of a stretch considering the Neptunia Rebirth series have been on portable)

What PROBABLY won't work anymore are left-vs-right turn-based systems (NES/SNES era Final Fantasy) without a deep gimmick of some sort like Brave/Default. However, the fact that both Neptunia and Atelier series have been able to keep their combat fresh by introducing positioning and subbing elements shows that at its very core, the idea has legs.

(And no, neither of the two are new concepts - positioning was done by Grandia, and subbing was done by FFX, neither of which are probably the earliest examples either)

 

[Durante]

Don't worry, just because Gust haven't announced the next Atelier yet doesn't mean it won't happen.

 

[KuwabaraTheMan]

Unfortunately, Bravely Second sales weren't all that amazing so that could be the end of that series.

Yeah, I'm aware of that, although the first game sold well in the west, so it could be saved by that.

 

[Nightbird]

Persona is bigger than ever, Pokémon just as big as always, so no, the last bastion still stands, but everything else is pretty much down.

 

[cm osi]

how is xenoblade western influenced? it's anime, it's fantasy (and i mean original fantasy, not dragons, goblin, dwarves and elves) and has MECHAS. just because "open world"?

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

how is xenoblade western influenced? it's anime, it's fantasy (and i mean original fantasy, not dragons, goblin, dwarves and elves) and has MECHAS. just because "open world"?

Takahashi said that he was inspired by the Elder Scrolls series when developing Xenoblade, but yeah, the game still clearly has a lot of J.

 

[Robert at Zeboyd Games]

how is xenoblade western influenced? it's anime, it's fantasy (and i mean original fantasy, not dragons, goblin, dwarves and elves) and has MECHAS. just because "open world"?

Setting & story is very Japanese, gameplay is very Western. Open world, lots of throwaway MMORPG-style sidequests, combat with a focus on tanking (a very Western MMORPG concept) & abilities that are based on cooldowns rather than MP. It's very much a fusion between Western & Japanese RPG sensibilities. Not surprisingly, it's not a big seller in Japan itself; I wouldn't be surprised if Xenoblade X (which is even more MMORPG-esque than the first game) does better in America & Europe than it does in Japan.

 

[Falk]

Takahashi said that he was inspired by the Elder Scrolls series when developing Xenoblade, but yeah, the game still clearly has a lot of J.

Final Fantasy was inspired by Dungeons & Dragons, and thus Tolkein.

Guys our JRPG history has been a lie.

!!!

D:

Setting & story is very Japanese, gameplay is very Western. Open world, lots of throwaway MMORPG-style sidequests, combat with a focus on tanking (a very Western MMORPG concept) & abilities that are based on cooldowns rather than MP. It's very much a fusion between Western & Japanese RPG sensibilities. Not surprisingly, it's not a big seller in Japan itself; I wouldn't be surprised if Xenoblade X (which is even more MMORPG-esque than the first game) does better in America & Europe than it does in Japan.

In all seriousness though, FFXII had just about as many westernized and/or MMO gameplay elements. Probably a direct result coming off FFXI.

 

[foxuzamaki]

Takahashi said that he was inspired by the Elder Scrolls series when developing Xenoblade, but yeah, the game still clearly has a lot of J.

They didnt say they were inspired, they said they want to beat the elder scrolls series.

 

[Cleve]

JRPGs are doing fine. They'll continue to grow and be influenced by other genres. You say we can't list "western influenced games" but game developers learn and adapt from other things on the market.

Taking JRPGs back to Dragon Warrior and Final Fantasy, those games are very heavily influenced by western games like Ultima and Wizardry. What you're considering JRPG seems arbitrary and narrow.

-edit-

Do people consider Sword Art Online to be a western style game with all it's mmo influences and styling? It's squarely in the JRPG camp from my viewpoint despite including things people consider western in design.

The Etrian games are considered JRPGS to a lot of folks. Looks like Akalabeth to me.

 

[Moon_frogger]

JRPGS ARE DEAD

*only turn based ones that have no western influence
**except the ones I like which may have been influenced by western crpg
***except also these other ones that aren't turned based which I enjoy



Did I pretty much get the gist here?

 

[Protag]

The OP is hyperbolic to a great degree.

Jrpgs will never die, yeah they will switch platforms, and if mobile is not a fad, thats probaly where it will stay alongside portable, but Jrpg's will die when gaming dies.

And honestly, my gaming diet is 90% Jrpg's, so if that happens, i wont be gaming as much anymore.

 

[Falk]

JRPGS ARE DEAD

*only turn based ones that have no western influence

**except also these other ones that aren't turned based which I enjoy



Did I pretty much get the gist here?

***except also Atelier and Neptunia etc. because I don't like the settings.

Spoiler

legit opinion mind you

 

[tokkun]

So what about games like Bravely Default, SMT IV, Etrian Odyssey, Persona Q, Pokemon, Fire Emblem, or Mario & Luigi? Do they not count because they are on handhelds?

 

[Mauricio_Magus]

Don't worry, just because Gust haven't announced the next Atelier yet doesn't mean it won't happen.

you're awesome.

I'm actually surprised by how good Gust has gotten on making turn based games really exciting, Shallie and Ar nosurge was amazing combat-wise and they are sooooo different.

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

you're awesome.


I'm actually surprised by how good Gust has gotten on making turn based games really exciting, Shallie was amazing combat-wise.

Not really surprising if you played Mana Khemia during the PS2 days

 

[Mauricio_Magus]

Not really surprising if you played Mana Khemia during the PS2 days

I didn't, and I know I should.

 

[Falk]

Not really surprising if you played Mana Khemia during the PS2 days

Mana Khemia HD remake please?

(Gust have said 'no' re: HD remakes augh)

 

[Mass_Pincup]

How are Xenoblade, Bloodborne and FFXV western influenced?

I really don't see it.

 

[Paltheos]

I swear we get one of these topics every other week. =/

 

[Morning Star]

Another fine doom and gloom thread.

 

[redcrayon]

Is this a 'portables don't count' thread? Because I'm struggling to keep up with the releases by just Atlus on mine.

If there is a 'last bastion of turn-based JRPGs', going by what has released in the last couple of years, it's a portable one rather than a home console. Development for home consoles seems to be about action-based combat these days.

 

[Squishy3]

Xenoblade X is definitely a JRPG, I don't see how you can call it an action RPG. It's just a further evolution of the FFXII formula, there's nothing action-oriented about it aside from some arts having bonuses when performed from the sides or from behind, there's no action element to dodging attacks or the like, all of that is still handled by stats.

The gameplay in Xenoblade Chronicles and Xenoblade X are a lot more active than most JRPGs, but that doesn't mean they're western-influenced action RPGs. That fits games like FFXV and Type-0 more than it does the two Xenoblade games. The future of JRPGs is more alive than last-gen (and we're going to be getting more high quality ones, hopefully) and thus we shouldn't be getting anything like Infinite Undiscovery again.

 

[Falk]

Type-0... really isn't western influenced. Unless that was your point.

 

[Mauricio_Magus]

Is this a 'portables don't count' thread? Because I'm struggling to keep up with the releases by just Atlus on mine.

yes, it's ignoring Atlus 100%.

Also, Experience games and Banned Travelers 2. There's a mini boom of Dungeon RPGs coming to the west and that should not be ignored if you're into turn based JRPGs.

 

[BadWolf]

The gameplay in Xenoblade Chronicles and Xenoblade X are a lot more active than most JRPGs, but that doesn't mean they're western-influenced action RPGs. That fits FFXV and Type-0 more than it does the two Xenoblade games.

FFXV's combat seems more influenced by Japanese character action games than anything western.