King Gilga
Member
I totally forgot about the warlords.
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World of Warcraft |OT7| Feel the hatred of 10,000 Murlocs
- Thread starter ampere
- Start date
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
i disagree that the old world revamp was essential. i don't think it was ever proven to bring more people in and even though it was "new content" it wasn't end game content. the only functional reason was to implement flying and the fill-in zones, but we know with blizzard's new philosophy on flying they probably wouldn't have allowed flying everywhere if they were going to do it over again.
i think WoD is definitely not the greatest expac, but it gets a bad wrap. Its definitely a step down from Mists, but everybody hated Mists or quit because of "pandas" and it was easily top 3 expansion after Lich King/BC.
Garrisons fell flat, but at least there is something to do. Tanaan Jungle sucks compared to Timeless Isle, but what Cata was to me was basically WoD without Tanaan and no Garrisons. It was only raiding and catching up on old content and that was it. That was the last time I even bothered leveling alts seriously since there was nothing else better to do. I haven't since.
the story is stupid in WoD, they misused characters, they threw away lots of important ones. there's a lot to be angry about, its the Star Trek Into Darkness of the WoW storyline.
To be honest, when i thought "warlords", i thought about the main guys you met during the introduction Draenor quest line, those shown in the main loading screen(Kargath, Blackhand, Kilrogg, Nerzhul & Grommash). Gul'dan never really worked for the Iron Horde, so I didn't include him. Garrosh came from Azeroth, so not really a "Warlord of Draenor". Zaela & Azuka? Lol forgot about them, not really sure we could call them warlords. Dharl, I don't even know who that is.
Anoregon
The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
I dunno man, as someone who was always leveling alts on multiple servers I would absolutely argue that it was essential to overall gameplay in ways much more overarching than just flying compatibility. Vanilla Azeroth was just so brutally dated by the time Wrath came out, in pretty much every way. Zone and quest design, level distribution across zones, modes and length of travel. It was an absolute chore to play through vanilla after experiencing the vastly improved quest and zone design of Northrend (and even Outland, albeit to a lesser degree.) As new content was getting added it was just showing its age more and more.
The fact that it's not end game content is obvious, but it's also not really the point. Sooner or later they were going to have to tackle it. And although the Cata end game suffered for it, the actual overhaul itself is definitely a success.
In regards to people talking about Legion/Draenor visually, there's nothing in Legion yet that has impressed me as much as Karabor and maybe the whole of Shadowmoon Valley. The area is just so dense with detail that it just dwarfs what they've shown in Legion so far. Maybe that's why I'm sort of bummed out about going back to Dalaraan without it seeing much of a visual overhaul. Blizzard as the capacity to make a really cool capital city but time and time again we just get a workaround.
Yeah, at one point I said Cata was the worst but a year later WoD has pretty easily stolen the title. The big thing for me is just the lack of patches, like fuck man. I don't agree that Warlords had enough launch content but even if it did the fact that we had to wait nearly 8 months for a real content patch that wasn't even that good until they patched it 2 more times (6.2.2 and 6.2.3) is so ridiculous. Not to mention my favorite part of the expansion has been reused content (mythic dungeons and timewalking dungeons) which is... weird to say the least.
King Gilga
Member
The numbers don't lie, cata > mop.
Cata PvP was also the most fun after wotlk.
Cata PvP was also the most fun after wotlk.
CarbonatedFalcon
Member
Yeah. Though Wintergrasp was better than either.
Anoregon
The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
That doesn't work the way you think it works.
Agree with all of this. Cata is low on the list near WoD, but I'll always be thankful for the old world revamp that it brought.
Eklipsis
Member
Gawd I need a new graphics card...I've never played wow on anything but the lowest possible settings
CarbonatedFalcon
Member
97 attempts in. Yogg pls.
Anoregon
The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
phoenix296
Member
Two Blingtron Missions today. Cha-ching.
jaundicejuice
Member
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngcjAmp5GkM
Legion Herbalism overview. I like the idea of profession quests and reward tiers (more herbs, rare mats, proc'ing random events, etc) but I'm not a fan of the WoD-style profession currency and what that potentially means. I sincerely hope that the class hall isn't like the garrison, basically a timegate and a throttle for professions. I hope there aren't daily allotments of resources I can create or that you need that prof currency to use a building of some sort to generate an additional drip feed of more crafting resources. WoD's approach to professions, beyond it's awesome catch-up mechanics, was kind of terrible.
Legion Herbalism overview. I like the idea of profession quests and reward tiers (more herbs, rare mats, proc'ing random events, etc) but I'm not a fan of the WoD-style profession currency and what that potentially means. I sincerely hope that the class hall isn't like the garrison, basically a timegate and a throttle for professions. I hope there aren't daily allotments of resources I can create or that you need that prof currency to use a building of some sort to generate an additional drip feed of more crafting resources. WoD's approach to professions, beyond it's awesome catch-up mechanics, was kind of terrible.
This would turn me off in an instant. There was nothing wrong with professions before WoD, and even the possibility of them going all-in with the gating system annoys me.
Fuck off with that bollocks. Bah. BAHHH!
jaundicejuice
Member
The only throttle I want on professions is my ability to gather resources.
I also would rather they go back to adding rarer secondary resources showing up alongside the main resource. Like gems showing up in ore veins that I could sell on the AH to Jewel Crafters as a Miner/Engineer or Blacksmith. I don't want added currencies.
I also don't want a singular crafting resource, like using X number of gear springs to craft everything your profession produces. It just makes crafting boring.
I also would rather they go back to adding rarer secondary resources showing up alongside the main resource. Like gems showing up in ore veins that I could sell on the AH to Jewel Crafters as a Miner/Engineer or Blacksmith. I don't want added currencies.
I also don't want a singular crafting resource, like using X number of gear springs to craft everything your profession produces. It just makes crafting boring.
Robin64
Member
I really enjoyed the olden days of finding weird stuff to add to your crafting recipes. As a tailor, I sometimes needed to find a potion, or different dyes, or rare silk from mobs, or pearls from clams, or components from other professions, or... I could go on. I still remember how awesome it was to craft a Robe of Power back then. As said above, one type of thing to craft is boring.
CarbonatedFalcon
Member
Professions in WoD were some intern-level shit. They went live with depreciated items FFS. Besides the just blahness of it all. I will be extremely disappointed if we see something like that again.
Gathering a bunch of different weird, eclectic materials (at least some of the time) is part of the fun.
Gathering a bunch of different weird, eclectic materials (at least some of the time) is part of the fun.
jaundicejuice
Member
Leveling up a Gnome Affliction warlock and having a lot of fun. I know most people go with Destro but I like Affliction for speed running the older dungeon content. A couple of quick channels and insta-casts, lots of DoTs to throw around and Soulburn to insta-summon a Voidwalker if things go south with the tank, even with Soulstone on them.
Exactly. I actually like having to gather and find different materials, buy materials off of vendors, interact with other players to make stuff or buy things off of the auction house. that's so much better than spamming your one profession crafting mat. And maybe a resource gathered from your garrison. Filling out a shopping list for a specific craft becomes a little activity of its own, and that's sorely missing from WoD.
Exactly. I actually like having to gather and find different materials, buy materials off of vendors, interact with other players to make stuff or buy things off of the auction house. that's so much better than spamming your one profession crafting mat. And maybe a resource gathered from your garrison. Filling out a shopping list for a specific craft becomes a little activity of its own, and that's sorely missing from WoD.
CarbonatedFalcon
Member
BRING BACK THE SHUFFLE
RIP PROSPECTING
RIP PROSPECTING
It's a complicated thing imo, cause on the one hand I am very much in the camp of having tons of different crafting mats from all over the world is way more fun. It adds flavor to the world which I am a big fan of, like it's really cool that living enemies in Strat have a chance to drop these powerful Orbs filled with holy energy, or that elemental enemies all dropped their essence that could be used for various stuff.
But on the other hand I also remember how awful it was practice. I lived through spending hours farming air elementals in Silithus so I could get multiple agility enchants made. There was nothing fun about the heavy RNG involved with that stuff. You'd kill like 30 or 40 of those tornado fuckers and be lucky if you had 1 essence.
Basically, I'm not interested in that style of crafting if it was just going to continue to be a slot machine like it was in vanilla. You need some control over your material gathering outside of just buying stuff off the auction house, as that isn't a fun solution.
But on the other hand I also remember how awful it was practice. I lived through spending hours farming air elementals in Silithus so I could get multiple agility enchants made. There was nothing fun about the heavy RNG involved with that stuff. You'd kill like 30 or 40 of those tornado fuckers and be lucky if you had 1 essence.
Basically, I'm not interested in that style of crafting if it was just going to continue to be a slot machine like it was in vanilla. You need some control over your material gathering outside of just buying stuff off the auction house, as that isn't a fun solution.
jaundicejuice
Member
I like The Burning Crusade approach where you get rare secondary resources off of your main resource nodes, like Primal Fire, or need multiple mats from main resource nodes that you can gather to make one resource, like Felsteel or Hardened Admantite. Or just have outright rare resource spawns like Khorium. Occasionally you need a resource from another profession but in some cases fishing covers that with the trunks you pull up.
You're largely in control, and while there's some rng with drop rates or resource spawns, the rarity makes it worthwhile. I made more money off of BC mats than I have WoD mats.
You're largely in control, and while there's some rng with drop rates or resource spawns, the rarity makes it worthwhile. I made more money off of BC mats than I have WoD mats.
Problem with that is it's nothing like what was being described above
TBC removed all the crazy weird mats you needed from stuff and streamlined the process heavily. Nothing like blood of the mountain or righteous orbs and the like, it was all just replaced with primal nether. It's a way better system but it is very boring compared to the craziness that was vanilla crafting.
Oh edit: Will also say if we're talking about crafting woes I wish they could strike a better balance on crafting armor. As poor as crafting was in WoD the fact that you could level up items and make them actually useful long-term (I've been using the same cape on my rogue for over a year now) is something I love a lot, but, it is heavily hampered by the fact you can only wear 3 crafted items.
I don't like that personally even though I understand the logic behind it. I wish there was a way you could equip crafted stuff in every slot but balance it so that it still took a similar amount of time to craft and upgrade everything to keep it in line with other forms of gear progression.
Still required Spider Silk for some crafts, and Engineering was as good in TBC as it was in any other expansion in regards to crafting. TBC was the happy medium between Vanilla & WoD, but much closer to Vanilla.
Wouldn't work. It'd make the majority of HFC HC loot obsolete. The ability to get stat-perfect 725 gear in every slot would just be way too good.
Problem with that is it's nothing like what was being described above
TBC removed all the crazy weird mats you needed from stuff and streamlined the process heavily. Nothing like blood of the mountain or righteous orbs and the like, it was all just replaced with primal nether. It's a way better system but it is very boring compared to the craziness that was vanilla crafting.
Oh edit: Will also say if we're talking about crafting woes I wish they could strike a better balance on crafting armor. As poor as crafting was in WoD the fact that you could level up items and make them actually useful long-term (I've been using the same cape on my rogue for over a year now) is something I love a lot, but, it is heavily hampered by the fact you can only wear 3 crafted items.
I don't like that personally even though I understand the logic behind it. I wish there was a way you could equip crafted stuff in every slot but balance it so that it still took a similar amount of time to craft and upgrade everything to keep it in line with other forms of gear progression.
Wouldn't work. It'd make the majority of HFC HC loot obsolete. The ability to get stat-perfect 725 gear in every slot would just be way too good.
(I wouldn't mind it personally)
Looks like that Alliance area in Zangarmash.
But Karabor isn't even the capital. Ashran is and I sure as hell prefer dalaran to ashran.
Lol, dude you need to get a grip on reality if you actually believe that.
Vanilla endgame sword Arcanite Champion, requires mats from:
Mining for ore and multiple different gems
Blacksmithing
Alchemy
Enchanting (which in turn required Skinning since you were enchanting leather)
Item that only dropped in 1 specific dungeon (and only from certain mobs in that dungeon)
And to cap it off the blueprint from the weapon dropped from a boss in a different dungeon.
TBC endgame sword Lionheart Blade:
Mining for ore
Blacksmithing
Alchemy
How on earth is that closer to vanilla crafting than it is Warlords. You learned shit at a trainer and then gathered a few simple mats. Crafting an Arcanite Champion was an adventure, crafting a Lionheart Blade was visiting my trainer, killing some elementals, then waiting a few days on a transmute cooldown.
Fucking lol.
CarbonatedFalcon
Member
Also, bring back specializations (I think they're doing this though.)
"Endgame sword"... It was the equal of an entry level 630 crafted item. The Executioner required both dungeon & raid mats, as did Stunherald (GOAT PvP troll weapon). So what you're looking at is...
Mining for ore
Blacksmithing
Alchemy
Dungeons (for Primal Nether)
Raids (for Nether Vortex)
Go to Sunwell and the same holds true there for those items. Spellstrike/Whitemend/Spellfire/ShadowfrostMooncloth and whatnot (and the other I can't remember) required a dungeon run a piece, so they're more comparable to the WoD system, but the craftable weapons aren't one of them.
Or is my 630 crafted mace an endgame item?
R
Rösti
Unconfirmed Member
I already had a better weapon from Heroic. But that sword is nice for transmogrification.
Karabor was supposed to be the capital. That location and even the Alliance garrison feel like they've moved well past Dalaran when it comes to texture work, object density/placement, stuff like that. While I understand the appeal of going back to Dalaran, its current iteration on the Legion Alpha feels like a hodgepodge of disparate pieces. Its new locations, which are primarily class halls, are substantially more complex than what was built in Wrath. Blizzard has the capacity to do a lot with a capital city but it feels like they're going to take another half-step with Dalaran.
jaundicejuice
Member
I'm surprised that they're using Wrath-era Dalaran. You would think that it would get a beauty pass with its textures and smaller world objects, at least to bring it up to date with the rest of Legions content. Since it's still Alpha, maybe that will happen. I hope it does, they've got a lot of ill will from WoD and have a lot to prove with Legion.
Seems like Blizzard is afraid of spending time & effort on new capitals. Considering Dalaran was the last one we got... And no I don't count Warspear/Stormshield, or the Shrines in Pandaria as capitals... More like towns/big buildings if you ask me.
Not sure I should blame them, considering that all but Stormwind, Orgrimmar, Ironforge and Undercity are pretty much ghost towns.
And even then... i feel like Stormwind isn't even what it used to be. The AH used to have tons of people just standing there. Nowadays, I'm lucky if I see more than 5 at once. Might just be my server anyway. Or could be simply due to everyone being in their Garrisons.
Not sure I should blame them, considering that all but Stormwind, Orgrimmar, Ironforge and Undercity are pretty much ghost towns.
And even then... i feel like Stormwind isn't even what it used to be. The AH used to have tons of people just standing there. Nowadays, I'm lucky if I see more than 5 at once. Might just be my server anyway. Or could be simply due to everyone being in their Garrisons.
CarbonatedFalcon
Member
I usually use the Ashran AH now when I'm not on my bank alt. Too cheap to finish up the garrison one. Bank alt is parked in Valley of Wisdom.
Anyway....
Today I finished up my Steamwheedle Cartel reps. Got in a group and it went super fast, though I had them all at like 10k+ revered already. Just need Ravenholdt for the Insane title now. Could buy boxes off someone, but it's not so bad solo. Skipping the mob grinding since that's usually contested and the lockboxes give more rep anyway.
Anyway....
Today I finished up my Steamwheedle Cartel reps. Got in a group and it went super fast, though I had them all at like 10k+ revered already. Just need Ravenholdt for the Insane title now. Could buy boxes off someone, but it's not so bad solo. Skipping the mob grinding since that's usually contested and the lockboxes give more rep anyway.
jaundicejuice
Member
For Alliance I think it depends on the server. On Dalaran I find the Commons in Ironforge is way more packed than Stormwind simply because, like Orgrimmar's Valley of Strength, the Commons is a large place that can accommodate lots of players.
LAUGHTREY
Modesty becomes a woman
But they did do that. There are tons of comparison screenshots, Legion Dalaran is updated tremendously.
jaundicejuice
Member
I'll have to go look up comparison shots then.
They took Wrath Dalaran and copy pasted it into the Broken Isles. Then started updating it a lot, but there are still some areas that have holes, dead ends, etc. It's getting a substantial makeover for sure, just not finished yet.
I'm pretty thrilled about having Dalaran as a main city again, it's so much better than Garrisons...
I'm pretty thrilled about having Dalaran as a main city again, it's so much better than Garrisons...
Just came back after like... A year break?
My warrior is 100 and has some normal first raid gear, should I just head straight to tanaan?
What are the coolest things I should do for my 2 month card sub?
Also, enhance feels terrible. My Lvl 94 sham just feels like a spam machine
My warrior is 100 and has some normal first raid gear, should I just head straight to tanaan?
What are the coolest things I should do for my 2 month card sub?
Also, enhance feels terrible. My Lvl 94 sham just feels like a spam machine
Just came back after like... A year break?
My warrior is 100 and has some normal first raid gear, should I just head straight to tanaan?
What are the coolest things I should do for my 2 month card sub?
Also, enhance feels terrible. My Lvl 94 sham just feels like a spam machine
Do you like PvP at all? There's a battleground even this week that gives a ton of bonus honor, and blue pvp honor gear is ilevel 700. It's by far the best way to gear a new character
I feel like it's a stretch to say Dalaran has seen dramatic change. Textures have been given stronger color highlights in places, but it doesn't change that these changes clean things up rather than reworking them. Even when there is new texture work it often uses the old textures as a base/starting point. Ultimately the geometry of Dalaran is largely unchanged, and it feels very dated to me at this point.
Yes, regular random battleground queues.