-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
World of Warcraft
- Thread starter Cerebral Palsy
- Start date
- Status
ToyMachine228
Member
fallout said:
More like...40-players stand around a Shaman and attack over and over and over only the watch the Shaman heal himself back to full health over and over and over.
Finally getting enough points for a HWL wep today, and I think I want to try this Hemo build: http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=i0xZhZAMe00uRRxst
I think I'll snag the mace, even though it does look like a lollipop.
I think I'll snag the mace, even though it does look like a lollipop.
Fixed2BeBroken
Member
Mute said:
mutilate.
I can't believe how broken 41/3/7 is.
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=fhe0oxTsVdVohZi
I tried out cloak of shadows which is also broken with prep, but that's nerfed in tbc...and in tbc you automatically get cloak of shadows.
Cloak of shadows + mutilate imo will be ridiculous. I forsee a nerf coming to mutilate. It seriously is ridiculous at the moment, And I could never understand why a Dagger rogue would ever not spec it at the moment. However, you may be using swords? hemo/prep is cool....but if I were you, I would try to snag some daggers and go mutilate. In fact, you can just grab some crappy blue daggers and still pwn with mutilate. That is how broken it is.
You can have a crappy geared rogue and destroy people with mutilate who are in tier 3. It makes no sense.
speedpop said:
Hunters are pretty much king in PvP period almost. I swear, the hardest arena matches always occur when their is a hunter on the opposing team. Blizzard tottally made hunters ridiculous. And dont let me get started how broken Hunters are in TBC.
Azwethinkweiz
Member
Fixed2BeBroken said:
If you mean in terms of being overpowered for pvp yet at the same time utterly useless in the end game dungeons, then I agree.
Fixed2BeBroken
Member
Azwethinkweiz said:
While I will disagree that they are "useless" in pve....i will say they are boring as hell in pve.
well, end game pve that is.
Fixed2BeBroken
Member
speedpop said:
Also...this is my druid...I wonder how much he would sell for...if I even did sell it...
Main pve set
http://ctprofiles.net/4827491
Fr set
http://ctprofiles.net/4827536
NR set
http://ctprofiles.net/4827574
Sr set
http://ctprofiles.net/4827587
pve, was a mix of gear...rank 10 gear in the bank heh.
Right now I'm 2/8/41 for sake of Cloak of Shadows, and before this patch I was one of the thousands of seal fate rogues. I'm sick of daggers though. It's great for cloth, but not so much other non-dagger rogues and pallys/warriors/bear druids. My gear is pretty terrible, and I tried Mutilate on the PTR on a friend's geared rogue and didn't like it. Hemo interests me mainly because it is different. However, I know you need around 1k~ AP for it to be really good. I still want to at least try it. Can you imagine a geared Hemo rogue with Premed and Cold Blood? Premed -> Cheapshot -> Cold Blood -> (four or more likely FIVE points) Eviscerate. That's a lot of damage.Fixed2BeBroken said:
http://www.warcraftmovies.com/movieview.php?id=31607
This is what I'm aiming for. I realize he's ridiculously well geared (Claw of the Frost Wyrm?), but still. By the way, about that video, does anyone know the Casting Alert mod he has? Also, that's the first time I've really seen high-quality footage of the BC scenery. Wow. It looks beautiful. I'm definitely getting expansion.
Mute said:
What's the point of going hemo if you're just going to Premed -> CS -> CB -> Eviscerate? One 5cp eviscerate crit won't be enough to take down most clothies, let alone the warriors and druids.
Right now I'm 2/8/41 with a freshly grinded GM dirk MH and a FotF OH. The only way I really can see myself changing this spec is when TBC hits and Imp Backstab gets swapped with Imp SnD.
Anyway, for warriors, try this:
Premed -> Garrote -> SS (should have 5cp by now) -> Rupture
I assume at least one of your weapons has crippling poison on it, so by then it should have applied at least once here. Now all you need to do is circle-strafe him so that you're out of his melee range but still inside of intercept's minimum range. Let the bleeding DoTs slowly tick his life meter away since all that plate won't help him any. If you don't mind sacrificing the control ability of your Gouges, then you can use Deadly Poison to add on to this. And when you feel confident with this, I often run in just enough to do a SS or BS to generate some more CP's just in case.
If a druid is in bear form, I usually do the same. However, most of the stupid rawr/meow druids will often shapeshift when you get them low enough to begin trying to cast a healing spell. That's when you either Kidney Shot him or Vanish + Cheapshot and then have your way with his less armored, more vulnerable squishy self.
Son of Godzilla
Banned
Chicken Mount, Ahoy!
Fixed2BeBroken
Member
Mute said:
if i had the time i could make a video and just show you why Mutilate is ridiculous. Cloak of shadows is great, trust me, I've tried it. However, Mutilate is just ridiculously better. I am seriously blown away by how easily i can destroy people who outgear me on a crappy gear rogued (and this is all classes, including the more tougher classes for rogues such as paladins)....and when im an epic rogue, its even more ridiculous.
I'd say give it a shot in arena...Alot of people I know say "it sucked on ptr" so they dislike it. Think about it like this...You can't do "premed > cheapshot > coldblood > evis" with your spec because you dont have coldblood. So I am assuming it would actually be "premed > cheapshot > evis > which is nice...but that person will still be alive...and u will get rooted, frost trapped, stunned, SOMETHING and you will have no energy (unless you thistle tea)...
It's so much better to "Cheapshot > Mutilate > Kidneyshot > Gouge > Coldblood > Mutilate > Evis" ALso, another thing to note about Mutilate...when you coldblood it, it effects BOTH attacks.
Seriously, after playing around with both 8/2/41 and 41/3/7...I just cannot go back to cloak of shadows. Now I will agree that Prep and Cloak of shadows does wonders in Arena....but mutilate does wonders in all BGs.
and honestly, I just dont do enough damage with going 41 in sub.
And yea, you might be sick of Ambush/Backstab...but with Mutilate...honestly...you won't be Ambushing much...and you will probably NEVER backstab again.
Also, Mutilate makes Premed look like a dumb talent...however premed is 31 and mutilate is 41 so I guess it makes sense. Only things I am gonna miss in the Sub tree are IMP sap and Prep...but its ok because Prep is nerfed in TBC anyways.
oh, and the only rogue vids i like are by happy minti. heh.
Teknopathetic
Member
"What's the point of going hemo if you're just going to Premed -> CS -> CB -> Eviscerate?"
This is very incorrect. With Master of subtlety going, a 2.5k eviscerate crit on top of your white and hemo damage (there's still some time before CS wears off) is more than enough to drop a clothie, sans warlocks due to their high stamina.
"let alone the warriors and druids."
Of course not, that's why you use rupture, a 5 pt. rupture for me with a very low 844AP is still ticking for 180~ damage and no damage mitigation vs. high armor targets and sans dwarves/paladins, can't be circumvented.
"Now I will agree that Prep and Cloak of shadows does wonders in Arena....but mutilate does wonders in all BGs."
I disagree, I'd actually say the opposite. With cloak of shadows, I can attack one target in a mob of people and still feel comfort that I can kill and survive, etc. Right now, Cloak of shadows is very, very much broken for the fact that it's a 2 minute "IWIN" button against casters. 5 seconds doesn't sound like a lot, but when warlocks blow death coil or a mage blows blink and frost nova and you resist it all, they're left without some key defense tools for more than the duration of the fight is going to last.
As far as damage, most of you guys have access to much better gear than I do and when I pop out of stealth and start hammering out 7-800 hemo crits on cloth unbuffed, the caster will be well under 50% and with CloS, they have no defense afterwards. Now, when Muti builds can use cloak of shadows (and on a shorter cooldown to boot) -- look out.
This is very incorrect. With Master of subtlety going, a 2.5k eviscerate crit on top of your white and hemo damage (there's still some time before CS wears off) is more than enough to drop a clothie, sans warlocks due to their high stamina.
"let alone the warriors and druids."
Of course not, that's why you use rupture, a 5 pt. rupture for me with a very low 844AP is still ticking for 180~ damage and no damage mitigation vs. high armor targets and sans dwarves/paladins, can't be circumvented.
"Now I will agree that Prep and Cloak of shadows does wonders in Arena....but mutilate does wonders in all BGs."
I disagree, I'd actually say the opposite. With cloak of shadows, I can attack one target in a mob of people and still feel comfort that I can kill and survive, etc. Right now, Cloak of shadows is very, very much broken for the fact that it's a 2 minute "IWIN" button against casters. 5 seconds doesn't sound like a lot, but when warlocks blow death coil or a mage blows blink and frost nova and you resist it all, they're left without some key defense tools for more than the duration of the fight is going to last.
As far as damage, most of you guys have access to much better gear than I do and when I pop out of stealth and start hammering out 7-800 hemo crits on cloth unbuffed, the caster will be well under 50% and with CloS, they have no defense afterwards. Now, when Muti builds can use cloak of shadows (and on a shorter cooldown to boot) -- look out.
Teknopathetic said:
I was merely commenting on the combination of attacks that Mute stated. If you throw a hemo in the mix, preferably sooner, then yes, that's a lot of damage. However, with the combo listed I didn't see a reason to go for hemo since, you know, it wasn't even used in the theoretical opener.
I don't understand why you commented on this, unless you're trying to disagree with me that Premed -> CS -> CB -> Eviscerate won't kill the average warrior or bear druid. I even go on to explain how to take out these targets with garrote/rupture kiting. Did you read my whole post?
I tested Mutilate on the PTR but wasn't too happy with the results, perhaps because I only got to test it out in Arenas and a 41 point assassination build lacks survivability.
Right now with Cloak of Shadows, I feel like a god against most classes in fights. Stunlocking casters from 100% to an HK is now nothing more than just popping CloS right before my last stun ends. Watching the 'Resist' go up on my SCT when the clothie tried to Deathcoil/Psychic Scream/Frost Nova continues to make me grin. I've had fights against casters where once they realized their CC was resisted on me they just stood there and let me kill them since they know there's nothing else they can do. I'm sure many other sub. rogues will have similar stories. My personal favorite was a UD warlock doing /gasp at me. :lol
Cloak of Shadows is such a great talent/ability, and I really can't imagine playing my rogue without it. I'm still in disbelief that Blizzard isn't even nerfing it, but instead putting it on a shorter cooldown in TBC. CloS is everything that Vanish should've been.
Fixed2BeBroken
Member
Teknopathetic said:
but as a rogue you shouldnt run into a group of people just to kill one person.
and I know cloak of shadows is a beast. its bad news for some warlocks. However, What about that mage who ice blocks through both? Honestly, It's great against a few classes, however It's useless against others. Plus we will be getting cloak of shadows anyways as a standard ability. with that said, Mutilate is NUTS with combo points. combo points all over the place, plus Stacked damage. You get the damage increase from kidney shot, the increase to poisons being applied which is where the mutilate damage is increased and then Opputunity increasing your mutilate damage on top of your finishing moves increasing your damage as well...it all adds up.
Meh, alot of people sleep on mutilate and it blows my mind just because of how broken and overpowered it is. I guess the better for me....Makes it more easier when going against other rogues.
And Hero, I will agree that 41 points in ass does lack survivability/utility....however...that extra utility isn't needed if you kill things as fast as you can with mutilate (if done right).
my main problem with 41 in sub...while it has amazing survivability and utility....it REALLY lacks the quick damage and energy......Just not enough yellow damage which pvp is all about, I could care less about white damage, save for pve (4 points, slice and dice, 3 points, slice and dice, 3 points slice and dice, yawn, etc).
and for those who have tried out mutilate and haven't been impressed, I am kinda shocked. Did you even have crip poisons on both daggers? Seriously, if you double crip and try this combo "Cheapshot > Mutilate > Kidneyshot > Gouge > Coldblood > Mutilate > Evis"....you will see the beauty of it.
Shaman resto spec has always been looked down upon before this patch. Personally, I'm quite disgusted by those that changed their opinions since then, not to mention all the people that have respec to resto but have absolutely no clue how to heal, just because it's touted as the best PvP spec for Shamans. Such posers.
I try not to get too uppity about the new Resto Shaman groups but from what I've seen they do heal.
I had a Hunter lambast me to put some healing spells on my spell bar because he died twice in my company. First time there were two Warriors after him, I did threw down an Earthbind and Warstomp'd them but he died from their Rends/Deep Wounds too quickly. I figured a Hunter wants space, I'll give it to him then throw a quick spot heal on him before the big one.
Second time I wasn't paying attention when a Druid was hitting on him in catform (both at Mine in AB, he was in the Mine cave, I was down doodling at the flag in Ghost Wolf)
Shrug.
I know I do my job properly because in every AB/WSG I'm either #1 or #2 healer. Only ones that do beat me are the Dwarf Priests *shakes fist*
I had a Hunter lambast me to put some healing spells on my spell bar because he died twice in my company. First time there were two Warriors after him, I did threw down an Earthbind and Warstomp'd them but he died from their Rends/Deep Wounds too quickly. I figured a Hunter wants space, I'll give it to him then throw a quick spot heal on him before the big one.
Second time I wasn't paying attention when a Druid was hitting on him in catform (both at Mine in AB, he was in the Mine cave, I was down doodling at the flag in Ghost Wolf)
Shrug.
I know I do my job properly because in every AB/WSG I'm either #1 or #2 healer. Only ones that do beat me are the Dwarf Priests *shakes fist*
Teknopathetic
Member
"but as a rogue you shouldnt run into a group of people just to kill one person."
In group PvP, you're sorta going to have to. And not to kill just one person, but if you can't survive past it...
Heals aren't always going to make it time, especially considering the pretty big change healers are dealing with.
"it REALLY lacks the quick damage and energy"
It doesn't really need it vs. most classes.
In group PvP, you're sorta going to have to. And not to kill just one person, but if you can't survive past it...
Heals aren't always going to make it time, especially considering the pretty big change healers are dealing with
."it REALLY lacks the quick damage and energy"
It doesn't really need it vs. most classes.
Fixed2BeBroken said:
My problem with Mutilate right now is that we don't have the Shiv ability. When I was using Mutilate on the PTR, I used Crippling Poison II and Mind-Numbing Poison III. I have 3/8 BF for the extra chance to apply poisons as well as having four points in the improved poisons talents. While most of the time it did work well, there were more than a few times where poisons failed to apply and that made the difference in me winning or losing.
Cheapshot -> Mutilate didn't always work well initially, either. One thing I did not know on the PTR was that Coldblood effected both hits of the Mutilate ability, so I will give it another chance soon.
Also, I don't really have a problem with yellow damage with 02/08/41. Improved Backstab and Improved Ambush give me very nice, big crits. I rarely find energy a problem either, 2 points in Dirty Deeds makes Cheapshot -> Backstab a very nice combo.
What kind of gear are you wearing? I find +10% AP and +15% agility pretty ridiculous. My unbuffed AP is over 1100.
Screaming_Gremlin
My QB is a Dick and my coach is a Nutt
Son of Godzilla said:
Heh, the amount of rep you can get in AV right now is insane. We have a mage who is now fully exalted with Exodar. I am currently about halfway through honored.
DarkAngelYuna
Banned
Lvl 54 lock who is tired of grinding in the crater... Whats another good grinding place ?
Teknopathetic
Member
"Lvl 54 lock who is tired of grinding in the crater... Whats another good grinding place ?"
WPL, Winterspring (sorta), Burning Steppes I think? Or Searing Gorge? I get those 2 mixed up. Whichever one is north of Blackrock Spire.
WPL, Winterspring (sorta), Burning Steppes I think? Or Searing Gorge? I get those 2 mixed up. Whichever one is north of Blackrock Spire.
PhlegmMaster
Banned
Sorry to interrupt this serious conversation , but I'm thinking about playing WoW (once again), and I was wondering if anyone has a character, or is planning on making a character on the new RPPvP server, Ravenholdt?
, but I'm thinking about playing WoW (once again), and I was wondering if anyone has a character, or is planning on making a character on the new RPPvP server, Ravenholdt?Question for locks:
Just made it to level 40 with my warlock (free mount woohoo). Do I have any chance of getting to 60 by the time Burning Crusade comes out (note: I work full time)? Can I grind any faster at 50 by switching to Demonology spec and using Felguard? Suggestions for fastest grinding (places to go, horde quests to grab)?
I don't remember how long the 40-60 grind was with my warrior, since I spent so much of that time in battlegrounds....
Just made it to level 40 with my warlock (free mount woohoo). Do I have any chance of getting to 60 by the time Burning Crusade comes out (note: I work full time)? Can I grind any faster at 50 by switching to Demonology spec and using Felguard? Suggestions for fastest grinding (places to go, horde quests to grab)?
I don't remember how long the 40-60 grind was with my warrior, since I spent so much of that time in battlegrounds....
DarkAngelYuna
Banned
border said:
I'd have to say no since you're working full time. Affliction is the fastest grinding spec for locks. 40-60 is a long long journey
If you're affliction, stick with it since it's still the best grinding build. The felguard is good, but if you have good gear for your level, affliction is a lot better. If you're just running in greens and not doing instances, though, the felguard may be better at 50 simply because it's a tank + dps pet similar to a hunter pet.
Well, my warrior has a lot of gold so I can give that to the warlock to buy Auction House BOE blues/epics, plus I can get more blues from tailoring and good buffs from potions since the warlock is an alchemist. Is it unreasonable to expect another 20 levels in ~27 days? If so, I'd rather just slow down and take some time to get the warrior geared in PVP epics....even if it seems like they've borked warriors for the time being.
I'm still all Affliction -- just got Dark Pact. Should I move into the Demonology tree or Destruction for 40-50?
I'm still all Affliction -- just got Dark Pact. Should I move into the Demonology tree or Destruction for 40-50?
Fixed2BeBroken
Member
Teknopathetic said:
meh, i assist other melee or catch someone by themself....i dont play in pugs tho, so I cant comment on that.
Fixed2BeBroken
Member
Teknopathetic said:
mages, locks, priests, druids....need to have good burst damage, or your gonna get pwned eventually.
especially resto druids.
Hero said:
when I first tried 8/2/41...i was running 5 peice nightslayer, 3 peice bloodfang, maex fang, perd blade, drake fang, blackhands breath, an aq40 dps ring, and this other epic dps ring (Forgot) and some epic agility bow (dont feel like logging on and looking.) And i was having fun, loving cloak of shadows...etc.
NOW...
I then specced the horde rogue to 41/3/7 who is in ALL blues...gutgore ripper, and That one Blue dagger that applies slow damage...forgot whats its called...
And the damage difference was like Night and day...so...had to respec the epic rogue and was like :O.
It honestly seemed like i was destroying things ridiculously faster on the bluebie rogue than the epic rogue...in fact I was...cause I remember taking down paladins so fast with Mutilate, while against paladins with Cloak of shadows...I had to keep restealthing and what not...hence long fights (even tho I'd still win).
Oni Link 666
Member
So, I got into the Burning Crusade Beta. Don't ask me how or why. This is the first time I've ever gotten in on a Beta. I feel like I've won a contest or something. Installation is a total mess. :lol I had to reinstall WoW because it wouldn't launch after of 2.0.1 and Blizzard doesn't have any kind of fix for it. Now I have to download like 10 more patches. So, it's been like a 13 hour installation. But, whatever. First thing I'm going to do i make both a Bloodelf and a Draenei to check out their cicties and then I'm going to check out outland with my level 60. I'll take some screens.
Installation is a total mess. :lol I had to reinstall WoW because it wouldn't launch after of 2.0.1 and Blizzard doesn't have any kind of fix for it. Now I have to download like 10 more patches. So, it's been like a 13 hour installation. But, whatever. First thing I'm going to do i make both a Bloodelf and a Draenei to check out their cicties and then I'm going to check out outland with my level 60. I'll take some screens. So after sorting out some minor account issues today, I started a character transfer from one account to another around 3PM PST today. At the "Transfers Pending Approval" step, it said the estimated wait time was 5 hours. Not that bad. So I check back 2 hours later, and it's hit 6 hours. Still nothing to worry about. By 7PM, it's saying 7 hours. Come 10PM, when it should be done, it hits 8 hours. It is now 12AM, 9 hours later, and it is still saying "8 hours estimated." :lol Blizzard sure does work slow. Anyone transferred a character before? And how long did it take?
Oh, and if I'm understanding this correctly, this step, which is taking 9 hours, is nothing more than a credit card approval that consists of a charge and refund of $1. :lol :lol
Oh, and if I'm understanding this correctly, this step, which is taking 9 hours, is nothing more than a credit card approval that consists of a charge and refund of $1. :lol :lol
Teknopathetic
Member
"mages, locks, priests, druids....need to have good burst damage, or your gonna get pwned eventually.
especially resto druids."
Nope, nope, nope, kinda. Druids need a bit of anticipation to make sure they can't get off those heals when low-ish.
Like someone said earlier, once you've resisted all their defensive spells, mages and locks just sorta...stop.
"when I first tried 8/2/41...i was running 5 peice nightslayer, 3 peice bloodfang, maex fang, perd blade, drake fang, blackhands breath, an aq40 dps ring, and this other epic dps ring (Forgot) and some epic agility bow (dont feel like logging on and looking.) And i was having fun, loving cloak of shadows...etc."
41 sub daggers and 41 sub Hemo are almost 2 completely different builds playstyle-wise.
"meh, i assist other melee or catch someone by themself....i dont play in pugs tho, so I cant comment on that."
As if that prevents other people from attacking you, premade or pug, you're gonna need some defenses. What do you do when you play against another group? Scout and/or AFK out?
especially resto druids."
Nope, nope, nope, kinda. Druids need a bit of anticipation to make sure they can't get off those heals when low-ish.
Like someone said earlier, once you've resisted all their defensive spells, mages and locks just sorta...stop.
"when I first tried 8/2/41...i was running 5 peice nightslayer, 3 peice bloodfang, maex fang, perd blade, drake fang, blackhands breath, an aq40 dps ring, and this other epic dps ring (Forgot) and some epic agility bow (dont feel like logging on and looking.) And i was having fun, loving cloak of shadows...etc."
41 sub daggers and 41 sub Hemo are almost 2 completely different builds playstyle-wise.
"meh, i assist other melee or catch someone by themself....i dont play in pugs tho, so I cant comment on that."
As if that prevents other people from attacking you, premade or pug, you're gonna need some defenses. What do you do when you play against another group? Scout and/or AFK out?
fallout said:
Well, my comment wasn't targeted at you specifically, so I don't know if it applies to you. And yeah, the ex-enhancement spec Shamans in my guild have healed before too, but that doesn't mean they do a very good job at it just because they are now restoration, I'm sorry, spec and gears only makes you a more effective healer, not a better one if you are terrible in it in the first place. As for your screenshot, my "healing done" is usually twice than your's if not more, unless it was a very short game, nothing to brag about though, it's just what I do, no matter what the setting is.
MrPing1000
Member
Mute said:
30mins on the euro servers, I even had to be moved from a german hub to a french one. I was very pleased.
Fixed2BeBroken
Member
Teknopathetic said:
Disagree on the druid, only time you can really kill a good one is if you can burst them at a vunerable state. my main is a druid, rogues are cake for me. Only time I ever die to a rogue is if they some how are lucky enough to get a blind on me while I am in caster and then burst me down...but not alot of rogues are mutilate so...the prep rogues get pwned.
a mage who double ice blocks both cloaks of shadows makes cloak of shadows useless. with 41 in sub, you won't have the damage to kill a good shadow priest while cloak of shadows is up, that goes for a good soul link warlock as well. However, locks are alot easier with cloak of shadows/prep imo than with mutilate...as I stated earlier.
well yea, but I'd only go hemo if I was swords. Hemo daggers is weak. I don't think I was ever referring to hemo anyways. Just the advantages of mutilate over cloak of shadows currently. If you're swords...hemo or adrenaline rush is the way to go...not mutilate of course. Tho the sword rogues in my guild wish they had maex/perd blade instead of CTS and brut blade now that they've discovered how great mutilate is.
Eh....people usually don't attack me until I have killed a few people...usually they attack the healers first. when we play another group....we play another group. Honestly, I don't know what strats your groups may do, but In all the groups I have been in....if there is a group of people...there has never been the strat of "kill the rogues first". Usually tho, when I'm assisting, I never get attacked unless its a group that knows me and purposefully goes for me, which only happens with groups from my server...but other than that I usually get free reign while the other team is busy trying to kill our healers/druids/casters..etc
Teknopathetic
Member
"Disagree on the druid, only time you can really kill a good one is if you can burst them at a vunerable state. my main is a druid, rogues are cake for me. Only time I ever die to a rogue is if they some how are lucky enough to get a blind on me while I am in caster and then burst me down...but not alot of rogues are mutilate so...the prep rogues get pwned.
a mage who double ice blocks both cloaks of shadows makes cloak of shadows useless. with 41 in sub, you won't have the damage to kill a good shadow priest while cloak of shadows is up, that goes for a good soul link warlock as well. However, locks are alot easier with cloak of shadows/prep imo than with mutilate...as I stated earlier."
I was typing up a post in reply to this, but then saw you were only talking about dagger builds, not hemo. I dunno how you can really compare the builds without taking a hemo based 41 sub build into consideration. Druids haven't ever really been an issue for me, with evasion and ghostly strike they can barely touch me (assuming they're feral) and balance druids have never been an issue either. Resto/Swiftmend is obnoxious, but still a winning battle for a CloS rogue, especially considering all they can really do in between heals is some relatively meh spell damage. The new wounding poison's going to really put a hurting on that.
As far as groups vs. groups, the groups I play against usually don't take kindly to people beating up on their healers.
a mage who double ice blocks both cloaks of shadows makes cloak of shadows useless. with 41 in sub, you won't have the damage to kill a good shadow priest while cloak of shadows is up, that goes for a good soul link warlock as well. However, locks are alot easier with cloak of shadows/prep imo than with mutilate...as I stated earlier."
I was typing up a post in reply to this, but then saw you were only talking about dagger builds, not hemo. I dunno how you can really compare the builds without taking a hemo based 41 sub build into consideration. Druids haven't ever really been an issue for me, with evasion and ghostly strike they can barely touch me (assuming they're feral) and balance druids have never been an issue either. Resto/Swiftmend is obnoxious, but still a winning battle for a CloS rogue, especially considering all they can really do in between heals is some relatively meh spell damage. The new wounding poison's going to really put a hurting on that.
As far as groups vs. groups, the groups I play against usually don't take kindly to people beating up on their healers.
If you use blind on a mage, it will ice block. It's like a rule of nature.Teknopathetic said:
Anyways people have been hinting that frost mages will be rogue eaters in the expansion. So we might just get it in our heads they will be superior to us, pvp + pve dps, pvp survivability, pve viability... at least they don't get to have stealth... oh wait...
Right now if a frost mage has any skill, it will take more than vanish + blind to kill one. Sorry to say.
This game will never be balanced around 1on1. I would say the rogue has the abilities necessary to kill every class in a duel, so we should not complain.
John_B said:
Mage invisibility is utter garbage. It has some use as a PvE aggro dump, and that's pretty much it. It certainly doesn't compare to stealth in any meaningful way. As for PvE, who knows. I don't trust Kalgan's "wow mages are awesome DPS!" comments one bit. Warlocks and shadow priests will probably be spanking both mages and rogues for raid DPS anyway
Yes, I know they don't get stealth. If any other class was granted stealth there would have been an outcry.
I just think the mage is being developed into the superior class of the two. On top of all the advantages, they kick our ass with little skill required.
I don't really care about other classes, I just want to play as a rogue. Though I have become very attached to raiding, and it seems like rogue will be the most gimp raiding class in the expansion.
I just think the mage is being developed into the superior class of the two. On top of all the advantages, they kick our ass with little skill required.
I don't really care about other classes, I just want to play as a rogue. Though I have become very attached to raiding, and it seems like rogue will be the most gimp raiding class in the expansion.
Teknopathetic
Member
"I just think the mage is being developed into the superior class of the two. On top of all the advantages, they kick our ass with little skill required."
Since when? Even before I was cloak of shadows, losing to a mage, frost or no, was very rare, unless they got some pom'd pyroblast crit from 40 yards away while I wasn't paying attention to them.
Mages are a free HK with cloak of shadows. Literally. And I haven't been hearing mutilate rogues complaining about mage fights either. I don't generally like to make ballsy statements like that, but there really is no contest.
Since when? Even before I was cloak of shadows, losing to a mage, frost or no, was very rare, unless they got some pom'd pyroblast crit from 40 yards away while I wasn't paying attention to them.
Mages are a free HK with cloak of shadows. Literally. And I haven't been hearing mutilate rogues complaining about mage fights either. I don't generally like to make ballsy statements like that, but there really is no contest.
Went to sleep last night pretty late, just woke up, and what do you know, nothing has changed. "Estimated Wait Time: 8 hours" :lol ****.
EDIT--
Aw man, Just got an e-mail saying it's going to take 5 days, and I can't play the character at all during this time. Christmas break..plenty of time to pvp..and I can't use it. Owned. Hmm. It says my character will be "locked and unable to play" during this process, yet I can log in fine. Think it will do any damage? I'm assuming when it's "locked" I won't be able to log in.
EDIT--
Aw man, Just got an e-mail saying it's going to take 5 days, and I can't play the character at all during this time. Christmas break..plenty of time to pvp..and I can't use it. Owned. Hmm. It says my character will be "locked and unable to play" during this process, yet I can log in fine. Think it will do any damage? I'm assuming when it's "locked" I won't be able to log in.
- Status