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[StormyTheRabbit]

Sexy, on a good boss I was topping the DPS meters there with the highest activity on boss too.
Razorscale is a great example considering the movement involved.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Undermine&n=Ardhavara
FR 2H Pri Spec
UH DW Sec Spec

Awesome, whats your rotation with the frost spec? As I assume thats your main.

 

[Epix]

Picked up Sif's Promise yesterday in what was a good week of raiding. Downed everyone through Thorim on two raiding days.

 

[GDJustin]

The Tier pieces I ended up with are Shoulder, Head and Chest. I don't have the rep with SoH yet to get any of the shoulder enchants, but I will as soon as I get them up.

I'm exalted with SoH and up until very recently I was still using the BC Aldor enchant because it was the only one that offered Hit, and I needed a little more.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Well, Ensidia's top Resto Shaman is convinced they are (at least in comparison to Priests and Druids right now).

Well of course he does. The only guy in Ensidia that DOESN'T think their class is fucked up and the only way they are succeeding is their own awesomeness is whoever is No. 1 in DPS within Ensidia. :lol

 

[Angry Grimace]

They tried spirit for all healers before and it was pretty bland. MP5 gives a big difference in playstyle even if it doesn't in simple terms for mana regen. Replenishment already exists in some form for every mana-based dps class except shamans. I mean, they could go back to it, but it requires a lot more talent/skill redesigns from the existing model. And all just so they could homogenize gear even further. Chances are after they did it you'd just complain about healer gear looking the same aside from its armor type.

As I said before, they should probably stop putting Plate healer gear in the game and just force Pally healers to use mail anyways :lol

 

[Kintaro]

Regarding the RAF program, can I use RAF for a friend who had already played before but canceled?

 

[Angry Grimace]

Regarding the RAF program, can I use RAF for a friend who had already played before but canceled?

Not unless he wants a new account. *shrug*

As to the issue about Spirit vs. MP5, my particular problem with spirit is that unlike every other base stat, it's benefit is too vague; it's too difficult to scry what benefit you're getting from it from class to class.

I'm personally happy that I won't have to be trying to cheat the 5-sec rule all the time when I ding 80 :lol

 

[Xabora]

Nice! Sent you a PM about the DK class.

PM Sent back.
You got some work to do.


EDIT:
Holy shit, WoW-Heroes has me ranked as the #1 DPS Frost DK for Undermine. :lol :lol

 

[Macattk15]

PM Sent back.
You got some work to do.


EDIT:
Holy shit, WoW-Heroes has me ranked as the #1 DPS Frost DK for Undermine. :lol :lol

To my knowledge, Wow Heroes does not rank by DPS .... just by gear item levels / enchants / gem values.

I'm #1 of all Warriors on Trollbane but there is no correlation to my DPS vs theirs.

 

[Quake1028]

So, my new tier headpiece has a meta gem slot. What's the best one to get for a mage?

 

[Angry Grimace]

So, my new tier headpiece has a meta gem slot. What's the best one to get for a mage?

Chaotic Skyflare is the best Meta for virtually every DPS class, caster or not. Just be sure that you have the other gems socketed to activate it.

 

[Chris R]

So, my new tier headpiece has a meta gem slot. What's the best one to get for a mage?

There is NO question.

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=41285

edit: posted wrong link heh sorry

 

[LAUGHTREY]

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bronzebeard&n=Requeim

Someone told me to get rid of my 'spirit' gems?


I have them for the Hit and the blue gem meta requirement, what the hell else am I supposed to put there?

 

[projectkuro]

I'm a moonkin and I got Rapture the other day, it's pretty amazing.


What kind of DPS do you do in Ulduar? I can only average about 3k and it's getting on my nerves. I just tried some new things and it upped it a little bit on the dummy, but I won't know for a few days.

Ah lucky you, I had Rapture drop once, but went to a healer. Lifebinder dropped but I passed on it so I could get my tier pieces first. I'm still deciding if I should go with Rapture / Lifebinder / Soulscribe.

As for my DPS in Ulduar, I wish I had parses I could show you, but it really varies from fight to fight. Fights like Razorscale, Ignis and Iron Council, I'll be getting 4.5 - 5.5k DPS. I'm usually in the top 5 of DPS charts, hovering over 4.5k DPS. And on dummies I don't do well at all, with a full mana bar, I'll end up with maybe 4.3k DPS and hitting 5.5-5.8k on the bursts.

Got a link to your armory? And what type of rotation do you use (Solar or Lunar)?

 

[projectkuro]

You want to avoid gemming hit at all costs, unless you are really under the hit cap.
But you're Alliance, so you get 1% from Draenei's. 4% from Balance of Power. 3% from Faerie Fire. So that leave's 9% to get from items, which is very easy with Ulduar Gear.
A reason for why your DPS might be low is that you're not hit capped. 17% = Cap.

First thing you should change is your Glyph of Rebirth and switch it to Moonfire or Starfire, this will help increase your DPS.

With your current gear, I really think you will be doing much more damage with the Tier 7.5 4 piece bonus, than with what you have equipped. Stick with the 4 piece bonus until you get 2 pieces of Tier 8/8.5 and switch out pieces so you have 2pc 7.5 / 2pc 8.5 then move to 4pc 8.5.

I checked your gear, and I can see why you gem for hit, your gear lacks a lot of hit. Try replacing pieces of gear and get more hit on them, so you can remove all your hit gems. If you have disposable income, the first piece of gear I would suggest is Sash of Ancient Power.

As for gems: Red = 19 Spellpower / Yellow = 9 Spellpower&8Haste / Blue = 9 Spellpower&8Spirit.

 

[Xabora]

To my knowledge, Wow Heroes does not rank by DPS .... just by gear item levels / enchants / gem values.

I'm #1 of all Warriors on Trollbane but there is no correlation to my DPS vs theirs.

Holy Compression Batman!

DKs are sorted differently due to specs.

 

[GDJustin]

You want to avoid gemming hit at all costs, unless you are really under the hit cap.

I have never heard this. And as a statement it honestly doesn't make much sense. o.0 Whether you're "a little" under cap or "very" under cap doesn't matter. Under is under.

Yes, everyone is always working towards gear upgrades, but the fact is... what you have is what you have. There's a reason the Yellow pure-hit gem is incredibly popular. It's pretty much the only way to get hit-capped if your gear doesn't get you there.

Yes, in ideal circumstances you'd get all the hit you need from gear. But in ideal circumstances we'd all be decked out in Uld25 hard-mode epics, too.

In my experience, gear upgrades follows this cycle, as someone dings 80 and wants to raid, they gem exclusively hit, gobble hit food, and scrap together their 17% any way they can. As they raid Mal, Naxx, whatever, and get hit upgrades, they can then replace those Yellow Hit gems with red SP ones, or work towards socket bonuses. Or start eating the Fish Feast instead of their hit food.

 

[Angry Grimace]

I have never heard this. And as a statement it honestly doesn't make much sense. o.0 Whether you're "a little" under cap or "very" under cap doesn't matter. Under is under.

Yes, everyone is always working towards gear upgrades, but the fact is... what you have is what you have. There's a reason the Yellow pure-hit gem is incredibly popular. It's pretty much the only way to get hit-capped if your gear doesn't get you there.

Yes, in ideal circumstances you'd get all the hit you need from gear. But in ideal circumstances we'd all be decked out in Uld25 hard-mode epics, too.

In my experience, gear upgrades follows this cycle, as someone dings 80 and wants to raid, they gem exclusively hit, gobble hit food, and scrap together their 17% any way they can. As they raid Mal, Naxx, whatever, and get hit upgrades, they can then replace those Yellow Hit gems with red SP ones, or work towards socket bonuses. Or start eating the Fish Feast instead of their hit food.

Agreed.

The reason gem slots exist is because by design gear is not perfectly optimized. There is a reason that you don't see, for example, a plethora of 2H weapons that have Hit, Crit and Strength. Because it's intentional that it's more difficult to measure the value of ArP, Haste, Spirit, etc.

Almost no one can simply peg a gear set in AtlasLoot/WoWheroes, etc. and simply acquire it. You have 14 slots and with minor exceptions, it's almost impossible to simply put what you want in each of those slots since even if you have the opportunity to get what you want, it's impossible to force it.

 

[Quake1028]

This meta gem is really fucking me up. I need 2 blue gems in my gear to get the benefits, but I don't have ANY at all. Fuck.

 

[Chris R]

This meta gem is really fucking me up. I need 2 blue gems in my gear to get the benefits, but I don't have ANY at all. Fuck.

purples work too. I use http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40026

 

[Quake1028]

I know they work, but I'm going to have to lose 2 socket bonuses to get them to work. Nothing I have even uses a blue gem slot.

 

[funkmastergeneral]

I know they work, but I'm going to have to lose 2 socket bonuses to get them to work. Nothing I have even uses a blue gem slot.

What? Using purples in a red slot will give you the socket bonus plus work towards the meta. Only problem is you can't use 19 SP gems in your red slots.

 

[Angry Grimace]

I know they work, but I'm going to have to lose 2 socket bonuses to get them to work. Nothing I have even uses a blue gem slot.

Change a Red to a purple, and socket a Purple in your new hat = win.

There's always an Enchanted Tear, although I don't know anyone that uses one. *shrug*

 

[Son of Godzilla]

I have never heard this. And as a statement it honestly doesn't make much sense. o.0 Whether you're "a little" under cap or "very" under cap doesn't matter. Under is under.

Bullshit.

My hunter is 1 point under the hit cap. I wouldn't gem to make that up in a million years. 1 point is .03% miss rate. The chances of missing with anything important is pathetic. If you really think that's significant you might as well never gear for crit, ever.

Gloom: That's why JC is so overpowered. You don't have to worry about metas and you get free socket bonii.

 

[projectkuro]

Sorry about that, my mistake for wording it so poorly

I forgot to add that, you might want to consider eating hit food to bridge a small gap in lack of hit, versus gemming straight hit. My bad on that one.

And the thing is, you don't have to have "ideal" situations to get hit capped. There are very many solutions out there, that are easily accessible that will allow you to remove the hit gems from your gear and gem it with something different.

Easily Obtainable:
Plush Sash of Guzbah (40 Heroism)
Titan-forged Rune of Accuracy (25 Wintergrasp Marks)

Naxx 10:
Signet of the Malevolent

Use these items until you are hitcapped. After that, all excess hit is wasted points.
You're currently 68.25 points under the hit cap, swapping out your Battlemaster's for the WG Hit trinket will allow you to be hit capped and replace some hit gems in your gear.
Also, I would suggest Deathchill Cloak over the cloak you're currently wearing.

Also, don't be afraid to roll on cloth, quite a few of the best Moonkin pieces are cloth.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Bullshit.

My hunter is 1 point under the hit cap. I wouldn't gem to make that up in a million years. 1 point is .03% miss rate. The chances of missing with anything important is pathetic. If you really think that's significant you might as well never gear for crit, ever.

Gloom: That's why JC is so overpowered. You don't have to worry about metas and you get free socket bonii.

That's part of why the nerf sucks. It's not the socket bonuses, it's that virtually every class struggles to get the blue gems in for metas. Nobody likes Blue gems except tanks.

 

[projectkuro]

That's part of why the nerf sucks. It's not the socket bonuses, it's that virtually every class struggles to get the blue gems in for metas. Nobody likes Blue gems except tanks.

Well we needed to be nerfed, we basically got free metas, free socket bonuses + awesome gems. It really puts us way over anyone who isn't a JC.

 

[Quake1028]

OK I have replaced a red gem with purple, have a purple in the red socket of the hat, and have the meta gem in there but the crit bonus is still grayed out. What am I doing wrong?

Nevermind I got it. I had to socket the purple first and then the meta. This is stressful :lol .

 

[firex]

This meta gem is really fucking me up. I need 2 blue gems in my gear to get the benefits, but I don't have ANY at all. Fuck.

For blue sockets, get sp/hit rating (purple) or hit/stamina (green), and for red/yellow sockets you can use those same gems. Maybe hit/spirit would be better for yellow sockets.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Sorry about that, my mistake for wording it so poorly

I forgot to add that, you might want to consider eating hit food to bridge a small gap in lack of hit, versus gemming straight hit. My bad on that one.

And the thing is, you don't have to have "ideal" situations to get hit capped. There are very many solutions out there, that are easily accessible that will allow you to remove the hit gems from your gear and gem it with something different.

Easily Obtainable:
Plush Sash of Guzbah (40 Heroism)
Titan-forged Rune of Accuracy (25 Wintergrasp Marks)

Naxx 10:
Signet of the Malevolent

Use these items until you are hitcapped. After that, all excess hit is wasted points.
You're currently 68.25 points under the hit cap, swapping out your Battlemaster's for the WG Hit trinket will allow you to be hit capped and replace some hit gems in your gear.
Also, I would suggest Deathchill Cloak over the cloak you're currently wearing.

Also, don't be afraid to roll on cloth, quite a few of the best Moonkin pieces are cloth.

That belt is lower ilvl than what he already has. I can't see how picking it up is anything other than a waste of badges, given that he's already in H-Ulduar, and a 226 upgrade with some hit on it could be forthcoming at any time.

The trinket is actually not a bad idea, given that he has beyond ample amounts of haste.

The best options of course, are to hopefully pick up the T8.5 Pants and gloves which have a health chunk of +hit.

 

[Quake1028]

For blue sockets, get sp/hit rating (purple) or hit/stamina (green), and for red/yellow sockets you can use those same gems. Maybe hit/spirit would be better for yellow sockets.

I didn't see any purples with SP and Hit. I went with the SP/Spirit ones linked above.

 

[Angry Grimace]

For blue sockets, get sp/hit rating (purple) or hit/stamina (green), and for red/yellow sockets you can use those same gems. Maybe hit/spirit would be better for yellow sockets.

SP/Hit rating gems are Orange.

 

[Quake1028]

OK here is my last dilemma (for today anyway):

I can equip this and have these stats:

H: 14963
M: 16323
SP: 1502
Hit: 303
Crit: 23.62%
Haste: 150
Regen: 214

Or I can keep this equipped and have these stats:

H: 14823
M: 16323
SP: 1489
Hit: 332
Crit: 23.62%
Haste: 125
Regen: 200

So, is losing 29 hit worth the small bonuses elsewhere, keeping in mind that even 303 should have me hit capped if I have a moonkin or shadow priest in my group?

 

[projectkuro]

That belt is lower ilvl than what he already has. I can't see how picking it up is anything other than a waste of badges, given that he's already in H-Ulduar, and a 226 upgrade with some hit on it could be forthcoming at any time.

The trinket is actually not a bad idea, given that he has beyond ample amounts of haste.

The best options of course, are to hopefully pick up the T8.5 Pants and gloves which have a health chunk of +hit.

iLevel shouldn't be an issue here, he needs almost 70 points of hit and if he doesn't have the WG marks for the trinket, the belt is an easy solution. It's a really good belt, gives him extra hit and puts him closer to being hitcapped. Adding hit gems to the belt will give him 69HIT, enough to cover the difference. And even if it is a temporary fix, it only costs 40 Heroic badges, you don't really need 'em anyways.

Ulduar-25 offers one solution for a hit belt Belt of the Darkspeaker and since they haven't downed Thorim or Mimiron yet, I didn't suggest it.

Sash of Ancient Power is the best belt in the game for us with hit, but it requires 10 Spellweave, 10 Ebonweave, 6 Runed Orbs = ~7-8k gold depending on your server.

If iLevel is really a concern, Cincture of Polarity drops off of Thaddius and would be a good fix.

Yeah, as mentioned 8.5 Pants and Gloves are great and you have a chance at getting them in Vault of Archavon too, which is a plus. Keep running Malygos-25 as well and maybe Leggings of the Wanton Spellcaster will drop, and these are amazing.

@Gloomfire: mp5 ain't really ideal for you, I would suggest getting Deathchill Cloak crafted if you are over the hit cap. It's cheap and it's great.

 

[Xabora]

This is a server pastime a guildie started.
Dragging the Pit Commander to Various outposts in Hellfire. :lol
I've been told the Pit Commander can last somewhere around 10+ minutes at each of the outposts... while killing everything.

 

[offtopic]

To my knowledge, Wow Heroes does not rank by DPS .... just by gear item levels / enchants / gem values.

I'm #1 of all Warriors on Trollbane but there is no correlation to my DPS vs theirs.

Any sort of total ilevel ranking has to be taken with a grain of salt. Its a good rough indicator of gearing but nothing more. Definitely a very loose correlation to dps.

 

[GDJustin]

There's an exact copy of that WG-mark hit trinket available for honor points - that's what I bought. It's actually a great trink, because when you're in a ten-man and less likely to have a dran. or hit debuffs on the boss, you can slot it in. But in a 25-man when you probably won't need that hit, you can slot something else in. I'm a Warlock so I'm not in the habit of slotting "situational" gear in and out... but that trink is a no-brainer.

 

[Angry Grimace]

iLevel shouldn't be an issue here, he needs almost 70 points of hit and if he doesn't have the WG marks for the trinket, the belt is an easy solution. It's a really good belt, gives him extra hit and puts him closer to being hitcapped. Adding hit gems to the belt will give him 69HIT, enough to cover the difference. And even if it is a temporary fix, it only costs 40 Heroic badges, you don't really need 'em anyways.

Ulduar-25 offers one solution for a hit belt Belt of the Darkspeaker and since they haven't downed Thorim or Mimiron yet, I didn't suggest it.

Sash of Ancient Power is the best belt in the game for us with hit, but it requires 10 Spellweave, 10 Ebonweave, 6 Runed Orbs = ~7-8k gold depending on your server.

If iLevel is really a concern, Cincture of Polarity drops off of Thaddius and would be a good fix.

Yeah, as mentioned 8.5 Pants and Gloves are great and you have a chance at getting them in Vault of Archavon too, which is a plus. Keep running Malygos-25 as well and maybe Leggings of the Wanton Spellcaster will drop, and these are amazing.

@Gloomfire: mp5 ain't really ideal for you, I would suggest getting Deathchill Cloak crafted if you are over the hit cap. It's cheap and it's great.

He shouldn't be sacrificing an overall stat budget to gain hit rating unless he's in some dire situation, which he's not.

Saying he shouldn't gem for hit for some reason, but then should take a downgrade from a 213 belt to a 200 are completely illogical statements really. I don't even really know where you came up with this "theory" that one shouldn't gem/chant for hit. :lol

One simply needs to reach the hit cap; it's not like hit is itemized in some hyper-negative way versus spell power. If he could make his gear have his haste turned magically into hit, I'm sure he would, but it doesn't really work that way. I would personally recommend just getting a +hit trinket to replace the haste trink.

 

[offtopic]

Saying he shouldn't gem for hit for some reason, but then should take a downgrade from a 213 belt to a 200 are completely illogical statements really.

.

 

[firex]

SP/Hit rating gems are Orange.

yeah, I forgot that hit is yellow. for some reason I thought it was blue even though I've been making tons of rigid autumn's glow lately.

 

[Quake1028]

Sweet, made around 486 gold from the AH today off of all of those Abyss Crystals and a few other things. Of course I spent around 246 gold getting all of my new gems/enchants.

 

[Alex]

Under cap varries from class to class, for some it's not a big deal, Retribution Paladins for example never gem hit ever, STR still outscales hit even if youre under cap.

But Fire Mages, for example do. Any misses will fuck you up hard. Doesn't matter how small or how irrelevant you think it is, capping your hit is number one priority as a Fire Mage.

 

[Angry Grimace]

.

I don't see how that's wrong though. If you're under the spell hit cap, it's not like you magically have less Spell Power or haste rating; the way items are budgeted it just means you have more of the latter and less of the former; just gem for it. And lowering your overall stat budget makes no sense either, especially when Laughtrey's guild seems to run Ulduar every week.

 

[Macattk15]

Any sort of total ilevel ranking has to be taken with a grain of salt. Its a good rough indicator of gearing but nothing more. Definitely a very loose correlation to dps.

I know that? I was telling Xabora that Wow-Heroes does not rank by DPS ... it ranks by item levels, enchants and gemming.

 

[offtopic]

I don't see how that's wrong though. If you're under the spell hit cap, it's not like you magically have less Spell Power or haste rating; the way items are budgeted it just means you have more of the latter and less of the former; just gem for it. And lowering your overall stat budget makes no sense either, especially when Laughtrey's guild seems to run Ulduar every week.

I'm saying I agree. It always baffles me why people take lower ilevel items instead of tweaking enchants and gems instead.

 

[projectkuro]

You see, I would agree with you for the iLevel thing, if it was even relevant in this case.

Pre-Ulduar, this is what the list for belts are for Moonkins:
1. Leash of Heedless Magic - Malygos (H)
2. Cincture of Polarity - Thaddius (H)
3. Plush Sash of Guzbah - 40 Emblems of Heroism
4. Shackled Cinch - Gothik the Harvester (H)
5. Sash of Blood Removal - Gal'darah the Prophet (H Gundrak)

And because he's UNDER the hit cap by 70pts, it makes the belt even MORE attractive. If he's able to get a hit trinket to replace the haste one, that's even better than changing the belt. But if he can't, where's the harm in getting hitcapped with an item that is GOOD and EASY to get.

Pre-Ulduar Notes on belts:

It is quite difficult to find a straightforward upgrade path from the Emblem belt in leather, the only way it becomes possible to do so is if all the hit rating on the emblem belt is going to waste, and it is better itemized than any leather belt in the game for moonkins.

 

[Xabora]

I know that? I was telling Xabora that Wow-Heroes does not rank by DPS ... it ranks by item levels, enchants and gemming.

Oh I know that.
I was talking gear wise.

 

[Quake1028]

Are any of the Darkmoon cards worth the cost/trouble for a mage?

 

[Xabora]

 

[Angry Grimace]

Are any of the Darkmoon cards worth the cost/trouble for a mage?

Not really.

The Illusions card is extremely underrated for healers, and the Greatness card is a bit overrated for Melee and Hunters. The Int and Spr cards mostly help with regen, as the proc's primary benefit is that it scales the amount you gain via the replenishment buff.

The Death card is simply not as good as the Sundial of the Exiled, imho.