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World of Warcraft

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border

Member
The revamps so far look pretty cruddy. "Now this place that used to be a desert has been recolored green!"

Even if they were a little more creative, I just don't have it in me to do another 1-80. Unless the leveling curve is drastically sped up (and I'm talking like 2 levels per hour here), I just don't see the point with recolored areas and slightly better quests.

It feels like the expansion is meant to cater to casuals and altoholics. Which is fine I guess since the last 2 xpacs mostly ignored them,
 

speedpop

Has problems recognising girls
Had to fall asleep 7:30am local time otherwise my eyes would burst. Some nice changes, making the game more friendlier. Was going to level up my Orc Hunter stuck in Barrens just to see quests that may change and such (Mankrik's Wife!), but the class change for them motivated me a little bit more.
 

speedpop

Has problems recognising girls
border said:
It feels like the expansion is meant to cater to casuals and altoholics. Which is fine I guess since the last 2 xpacs mostly ignored them,
Yeah, this expansion may alienate the more dedicated and hardcore players but at the same Blizzard knows that they'll come back eventually if they ever unsub.
 

Interfectum

Member
Spruchy said:
Resubbed tonight, gonna get in a friend's guild and finally do Ulduar and check out this argent tourney stuff.

welcome back... we got a fresh batch of crack on the counter and a few gnome ladies are doing lines in the bathroom. enjoy your stay. :lol
 

Interfectum

Member
speedpop said:
Yeah, this expansion may alienate the more dedicated and hardcore players but at the same Blizzard knows that they'll come back eventually if they ever unsub.

I dunno about that... they said there were more raids in this new xp than ever. that seems to cater to the hardcore, along with ranked battlegrounds.
 

Spruchy

Member
Interfectum said:
welcome back... we got a fresh batch of crack on the counter and a few gnome ladies are doing lines in the bathroom. enjoy your stay. :lol

Haha, thanks...hardest semester of college coming up, o well.
 

GDJustin

stuck my tongue deep inside Atlus' cookies
border said:
It feels like the expansion is meant to cater to casuals and altoholics. Which is fine I guess since the last 2 xpacs mostly ignored them,

Ehh... Blizz has stated there's only 5 levels this time around in order to place a greater emphasis on endgame.
 

speedpop

Has problems recognising girls
GDJustin said:
Ehh... Blizz has stated there's only 5 levels this time around in order to place a greater emphasis on endgame.
I think he means in terms of news announced relative to the 1-60 grind, as well as various class revamps and statistical garbage being thrown out the door (mp5, defence, etc).
 

border

Member
So how do warlocks feel now? Rejoicing or worried?

* Soul Shards are no longer in your bags. The goal is to make them fun, not a hassle.
* Soul Shards will be integrated to the user interface. (Just like Death Knight runes)
* You get three shards per fight, they will regen very quickly out of combat.
* It will be possible to get more for long fights or mistakes through Drain Soul.
* Soul Burn (New Spell) : Cost 1 Shard, 30 sec cooldown, off the GCD. Empowers your next spell, many (not all spells) behave differently when empowered.
* Empowered Searing Pain : Next 3 Searing Pains crit
* Empowered Summon Demon : Instant Cast
* Empowered Soulfire : Instant Cast
* Empowered Fear : Instant Cast
* Empowered Death Coil : Longer Horror, more healing received.
* They are only used in combat, summons or demons won't use your shards.


Hooray -- not having to carry a bag for Shards increases our inventory space by like 20%.

On the other hand, only having 3 shards per fight doesn't sound so good for long encounters (I guess it depends on whether or not they remove Shard requirements on stuff like Soulshatter and Shadowburn).

On the other hand, it sounds like this will be a way to give even Affliction warlocks a pretty good chance to deliver insane burst damage on-demand.

On the other hand (up to 4 hands now), this sounds like the kinda thing that might end up buggy out of the gate. Or that they might try to use it to put Shard requirements on stuff like Death Coil.
 
laserbeam said:
Bah Blizzard says with lich King Casters will get the next legendary after healers now Hunters get a Legendary again instead and casters pushed til next expansion. I mean wtf they just got a Legendary with Sunwell
MMO-Champion said:
Casters will finally get a Legendary item in one of the first raids of the expansion.
Does it really matter that much?
 

Cipherr

Member
So how does this RAF thing work? Was thinking of doing it since Id like to reroll on another server for PvP from 1. Not sure if leveling to 60 at 3x speed is a good idea though when Id be starting broke.

Anyone care to explain how it works?
 
speedpop said:
Yeah, this expansion may alienate the more dedicated and hardcore players but at the same Blizzard knows that they'll come back eventually if they ever unsub.

Hopefully they've learned their lesson about playing favoritism (vanilla vs wrath) and don't. Blizzard doesn't do good work then they assume rather than KNOW they know better.
 

laserbeam

Banned
Orbitcube said:
Does it really matter that much?

Well it is not really fair to a set of classes that have not seen a Legendary since just before Burning Crusade and the massive overhaul wow went through from Vanilla to Burning Crusade making the legendary a piece of shit to a starter green in outlands.
 

border

Member
GDJustin said:
Ehh... Blizz has stated there's only 5 levels this time around in order to place a greater emphasis on endgame.

Well I think that their argument is basically that they wasted all this effort on zones like Borean Tundra, Grizzly Hills, Howling Fjord, Dragonblight, etc because people went through those zones once and never came back. The money spent on Sholozar, Icecrown, and Storm Peaks was "better spent" because those areas were still relevant to people at 80. So now they will create 3-4 new zones and those zones will remain relevant to people even at the level cap (presumably they'll have dailies and important reputation factions and stuff like that).

So instead of "leveling zones" and "endgame zones" now they will have nothing but endgame zones (that are relevant at 80 and at 85)....and all the money they would have spent on leveling zones goes to raids and dungeons.

I see their point, but ultimately I'm gonna feel cheated if I buy an xpac and there's only a handful of legitimate new zones.
 
speedpop said:
Yeah, this expansion may alienate the more dedicated and hardcore players but at the same Blizzard knows that they'll come back eventually if they ever unsub.

Truly hardcore players are those that love playing the game, so the opportunity to level from 1 - 85 with even only 50% new content is really exciting :D

border said:
I see their point, but ultimately I'm gonna feel cheated if I buy an xpac and there's only a handful of legitimate new zones.

It would appear to depend quite heavily on your and Blizzard's definition of legitimate. If the old zones look substantially different and have a lot of new Cataclysm related questing to do, then we are actually getting a LOT more content than either previous expansion.
 

border

Member
Tanks never got a legendary weapon, did they? Come to think of it I guess they never will, considering that every tanking class now needs a wildly different weapon type. Druids want staves, DKs need 2H weapons, etc.....I guess a 1H Legendary mace might work if Dual-Wield DK tanking is ever viable.

jim-jam bongs said:
Truly hardcore players are those that love playing the game, so the opportunity to level from 1 - 85 with even only 50% new content is really exciting :D

I love the game, and maybe I'm not "truly hardcore"....but honestly I just don't wanna do 1-85 again unless it'd be at some ridiculous speed.
 

laserbeam

Banned
border said:
Tanks never got a legendary weapon, did they? Come to think of it I guess they never will, considering that every tanking class now needs a wildly different weapon type. Druids want staves, DKs need 2H weapons, etc.....I guess a 1H Legendary mace might work if Dual-Wield DK tanking is ever viable.

Thunderfury was a very good tanking sword
 

border

Member
laserbeam said:
Thunderfury was a very good tanking sword
I thought about that, but considering that warriors already had a debuff that lowers attack speed and warriors were really only the viable raid tanks at the time it doesn't seem so hot. It doesn't have any defense stats on it and the resistance increases are negligible. Obviously Thunderfury is a kinda wishy-washy compromise between trying to make a DPS item and a tanking item. They wanted something that both rogues and warriors would covet.

Which is not to say that it wasn't a good sword for tanks or anything, but there's never been a Legendary that tanks exclusively had claim to. Nothing with mitigation stats.
 

sykoex

Lost all credibility.
I could have sworn they said the worgen and goblin starting areas were playable, but I can't find any impressions online.
 

Tamanon

Banned
border said:
So how do warlocks feel now? Rejoicing or worried?

* Soul Shards are no longer in your bags. The goal is to make them fun, not a hassle.
* Soul Shards will be integrated to the user interface. (Just like Death Knight runes)
* You get three shards per fight, they will regen very quickly out of combat.
* It will be possible to get more for long fights or mistakes through Drain Soul.
* Soul Burn (New Spell) : Cost 1 Shard, 30 sec cooldown, off the GCD. Empowers your next spell, many (not all spells) behave differently when empowered.
* Empowered Searing Pain : Next 3 Searing Pains crit
* Empowered Summon Demon : Instant Cast
* Empowered Soulfire : Instant Cast
* Empowered Fear : Instant Cast
* Empowered Death Coil : Longer Horror, more healing received.
* They are only used in combat, summons or demons won't use your shards.


Hooray -- not having to carry a bag for Shards increases our inventory space by like 20%.

On the other hand, only having 3 shards per fight doesn't sound so good for long encounters (I guess it depends on whether or not they remove Shard requirements on stuff like Soulshatter and Shadowburn).

On the other hand, it sounds like this will be a way to give even Affliction warlocks a pretty good chance to deliver insane burst damage on-demand.

On the other hand (up to 4 hands now), this sounds like the kinda thing that might end up buggy out of the gate. Or that they might try to use it to put Shard requirements on stuff like Death Coil.

Soul shards are only used for Soul Burn, that's it, they removed the soul shard requirement from every other warlock spell.
 

1up

Member
Spy sappin my blizzcon?

spysappin.jpg
 

Retro

Member
rhfb said:
no new class is really somewhat disappointing :( Not that I wanted a new hero class...

Considering the horrible mess class balance has been since DKs shook things up, I hope the next expansion after Cataclysm lacks a hero class as well.
 
border said:
So how do warlocks feel now? Rejoicing or worried?

* Soul Shards are no longer in your bags. The goal is to make them fun, not a hassle.
* Soul Shards will be integrated to the user interface. (Just like Death Knight runes)
* You get three shards per fight, they will regen very quickly out of combat.
* It will be possible to get more for long fights or mistakes through Drain Soul.
* Soul Burn (New Spell) : Cost 1 Shard, 30 sec cooldown, off the GCD. Empowers your next spell, many (not all spells) behave differently when empowered.
* Empowered Searing Pain : Next 3 Searing Pains crit
* Empowered Summon Demon : Instant Cast
* Empowered Soulfire : Instant Cast
* Empowered Fear : Instant Cast
* Empowered Death Coil : Longer Horror, more healing received.
* They are only used in combat, summons or demons won't use your shards.


Hooray -- not having to carry a bag for Shards increases our inventory space by like 20%.

On the other hand, only having 3 shards per fight doesn't sound so good for long encounters (I guess it depends on whether or not they remove Shard requirements on stuff like Soulshatter and Shadowburn).

On the other hand, it sounds like this will be a way to give even Affliction warlocks a pretty good chance to deliver insane burst damage on-demand.

On the other hand (up to 4 hands now), this sounds like the kinda thing that might end up buggy out of the gate. Or that they might try to use it to put Shard requirements on stuff like Death Coil.


i think they are removing shard requirements for some spells unless I read it wrong.



LOL @ aion players, wow will still be going when they turn off that games servers.
 

Chris R

Member
Retro said:
Considering the horrible mess class balance has been since DKs shook things up, I hope the next expansion after Cataclysm lacks a hero class as well.
I don't ever want a new hero class, and wish DKs didn't exist (if they weren't so powerful, they would be fine) I wish there were more classes though, or more well defined classes/specs. You get raids now that say melee DPS is full, when what they mean is they have 5DKs and 5 retardins. Ya know, reason to bring at least one of each class, but that will never happen now, with Blizzards bring the player bit :|
 
1up said:
Spy sappin my blizzcon?

spysappin.jpg

That was awesome :lol

border said:
I love the game, and maybe I'm not "truly hardcore"....but honestly I just don't wanna do 1-85 again unless it'd be at some ridiculous speed.

I was sort of being ironic :) Honestly it's only a matter of time before they come up with a solution that pleases both of us. Whether it's just allowing you to start at a higher level or more gear with experience boosts, it seems pretty clear that there are a lot people of the same mindset.
 

border

Member
DKs don't indicate a problem with having Hero Classes. They just indicate a problem with DK design. They gave them the best parts of almost every single class, and that was a poor way to go about it.

Tamanon said:
Soul shards are only used for Soul Burn, that's it, they removed the soul shard requirement from every other warlock spell.
Only for Soul Burn? I kinda thought they'd at least introduce some new spells that require shards....maybe for tanking buffs (since the 3x Crit on Searing Pain seems to indicate that they want to have warlocks do a bit of specialized tanking or kiting at the very least).

I was also thinking they might shorten the cooldown on Death Coil, but put in a big shard requirement so that in situations like Arenas you could only use it once.

I'd really like to see them have spells/buffs that require 2-3 shards, so that towards the end of an encounter you could really blow something up if you were judicious and either saved your shards or replenished them by using Soul Drain during a boss fight.
 

Soule

Member
re-subscribed a bit earlier just from the speculation of the expansion so I'm happy to see a lot of it is true or close to the mark, really really psyched for the new expansion gonna level up some of my old classes in anticipation (gave away a 70 shammy and warrior when WOTLK was announced). have a high level priest at the moment but i want my warrior back! i dunno what i'll go with as goblin...
 
I don't really want to roll alts but, I'm going to have to roll some just to play through the Goblin and Worgen starting areas. Even if it is on another server where I have room for them. Gilneas looks so cool. I really love the style of the architecture.

Another thing I'm really looking forward to is the simplifying of stats. There's just so much crap on stats now. I wish they would do away with hit rating too. It's such a lame concept. Surely they can come up with a way to get everyone the hit rating they need with talents or this new mastery stuff.
 

Proc

Member
definitely gotta go for the all heroics achievement tomorrow...emblems must be looted!

I love this game when you have friends who are consistently good at tanking and healing. I get to sit back and aoe farm and smile :)
 

EDarkness

Member
VaLiancY said:

I'm curious about who can use it. It says Death Knights and Hunters, but I have access to the stream and didn't see it mentioned anywhere who could use it. Either way, I guess it's time to start thinking about guild runs through Icecrown. :)
 

Retro

Member
border said:
DKs don't indicate a problem with having Hero Classes. They just indicate a problem with DK design. They gave them the best parts of almost every single class, and that was a poor way to go about it.

Right; I didn't say DKs specificly were the problem, merely that the last time Blizz added a new class, it was a complete fiasco. They could have added a Purple People-Eater class and it would have been the same terrible mess. Not picking specifically on DKs, lord knows that gets done often enough. Just saying that the fallout from their arrival was... unpleasant.

border said:
Only for Soul Burn? I kinda thought they'd at least introduce some new spells that require shards....maybe for tanking buffs (since the 3x Crit on Searing Pain seems to indicate that they want to have warlocks do a bit of specialized tanking or kiting at the very least).

Well, this is what I think is happening; Warlocks are getting an entirely new mechanic to separate them further from Mages. Management of your shards and choosing which spells to empower with Soul Burn will become the new norm for the class. Rather than ramp up their DPS by carefully planning their rotation (forgive me if this is wrong, I haven't played a mage.), I'm thinking Warlocks get three shards to play with, allowing them to pick for higher DPS / utility based on what their current needs are.

The best warlocks would be those that can quick assess combat and use their empowered spells (and thus, their limited supply of shards) wisely. If I'm right (and so far, I see no indication that I wouldn't be), you'd have three shards to power up any of your spells, and probably quite a few abilities or talents that affect how you regenerate / obtain them.

I am hoping we'll see more about this later today, but... like I said, from the sound of things, it sounds like Locks basically have an entirely new class mechanic; like Rogues with combo points, DKs with rune management, and now Hunters with Focus, locks may be getting a Shard system.

Hopefully Blizzard has realized that the best way to differentiate classes is not different colored versions of the same spells, and every class is getting a 'core mechanic' revamp like this, so that playing each is a completely different experience rather than different colored buttons and different colored icons to push in order.

From Blizzard:

Soul Shards are no longer in your bags. The goal is to make them fun, not a hassle.
Soul Shards will be integrated to the user interface. (Just like Death Knight runes)
You get three shards per fight, they will regen very quickly out of combat.
It will be possible to get more for long fights or mistakes through Drain Soul.
They are only used in combat, summons or demons won't use your shards.

So shards are not something you have to grab 20 of before going into a fight and keep a careful eye on; they regenerate on their own out of combat, but you have abilities that allow you to gain more in combat should you need them (though at the cost of DPS).

Soul Burn (New Spell) : Cost 1 Shard, 30 sec cooldown, off the GCD. Empowers your next spell, many (not all spells) behave differently when empowered.
* Empowered Searing Pain : Next 3 Searing Pains crit
* Empowered Summon Demon : Instant Cast
* Empowered Soulfire : Instant Cast
* Empowered Fear : Instant Cast
* Empowered Death Coil : Longer Horror, more healing received.

It sounds like most of the lock's spells will have empowered versions; while a lot of them have instant casts, there's the potential for new, interesting mechanics here; on-demand Ssearing Pain crits, for example. Empowering a spell could do any number of Really Cool Things™, and hopefully Instant Casts are the least interesting thing they'll do... if done correctly, it would give every spell in your arsenal a souped-up version.

Could be very interesting, if you ask me.
 

Scrow

Still Tagged Accordingly
Alex said:
I sincerely doubt Blizzard even bothers to look at it's competition.
seriously? blizzard wouldn't be where they are now if they didn't keep a close eye on the competition. and I don't mean "keep an eye on" them as a corporation, more as individuals in the company. artists, designers, programmers etc. at blizzard would all play a variety of games including rival MMOs. that's going to influence their work both directly and indirectly.

Kweh said:
Soooo will the Under Hunter's pets be decomposing?
why would they? the hunter simply tames the animal that's there. taming them isn't going to make them undead.
 

LAUGHTREY

Modesty becomes a woman
Scrow said:
seriously? blizzard wouldn't be where they are now if they didn't keep a close eye on the competition. and I don't mean "keep an eye on" them as a corporation, more as individuals in the company. artists, designers, programmers etc. at blizzard would all play a variety of games including rival MMOs. that's going to influence their work both directly and indirectly.


why would they? the hunter simply tames the animal that's there. taming them isn't going to make them undead.


If WoW took all its cues from competition then it wouldn't be where it is today. By the remote chance they do they deserve a little more credit for doing what they do about a thousand times better than anyone else.
 

LAUGHTREY

Modesty becomes a woman
Won said:
Ah, I love MMO communities.


Oh you mean the re-model feature that has been BEGGED since 2005 and they just suddenly Announce they're adding it after they seen a game become very popular to the ideas SIMILIAR to what they're updating?

I swear, they added a "remodel" armor feature... lol
Abilities scale on level up...
They're re-doing water....
Archeologist profession to find relics to advance your character further (AKA STIGMA)


Is there anything else WoW hasn't stolen?


I mean really.....


Now the new Azeroth has "Invisible" walls that bounce back if you fly near them... rofl.


Aion invented water. Confirmed.
 

Loxley

Member
Okay, now after sleeping on it and letting all the information about Cataclysm set in, I've come to the conclusion that I still still feel like this is absolutely the best thing Blizzard could possibly do. Unless we ended up with a World of Warcraft 2 within the next two years (which...seems unlikely at this point ;) ) Blizzard had to revamp the old world at some point. They couldn't just keep releasing Lich King-like expansions while EK and Kalimdor slowly rotted and decayed in terms of quality of content compared to the expansion zones.

I'm elated they decided to do this, and frankly am more excited for Cataclysm than I was for TBC or WotlK, which is definitely saying something.
 
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