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World of Warcraft
- Thread starter Cerebral Palsy
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jim-jam bongs
Member
That's crazy stuff. My only rule is that I won't bother healing something heroic with a < 30k HP tank, maybe 35k+ for the ICC 5 mans. My druid has over 30k in terrible gear, so I know it's not super hard to get there, even for classes that don't get built-in stamina scaling.
jim-jam bongs
Member
Tamanon said:
Hmm I didn't realise that. I mostly run into warriors and paladins in random anyway though, it doesn't seem like there are many DKs pugging it as tanks in my battlegroup. There are a lot of DPS ones grabbing stuff for off-spec, so that will probably change in time.
Yeah my Death Knight still doesn't tank, but even in tank gear that is almost completely iLevel 219++ he only has about 30K HP. I haven't really gemmed or enchanted for Stamina, but I doubt it would make that much of a difference. Getting a bigass health pool is a big deal, since it's a stat that is pretty obvious to all group members.
You don't need guildies to carry you. Just sign up as DPS for Icecrown 5-mans everyday....it'll take 10-15 minutes to get a group, but during that time you can go make some money either with a gathering profession or Argent Tournament dailies. Pick up a ton of badges and roll on any tank gear that the tank doesn't need (most of them are overgeared and only looking for a rare drop shield or trinket or something). My DK was my time-killing alt a month ago, now he is probably better geared than either my warlock or my tanking warrior.Sebulon3k said:
Johnlenham
Member
Wow. I was raped, everythings stripped from my bank, had 3G on me and it was a farmer as I had a bag full of crap and was by the fire revnants near ulduar. Atleast all the trash in my bag gave me 160g..:lol
Wow Dks even worse about 20S on him, all my alchemy potions gone. Also the prick had used up all my badges buying junk so now all ive got is 5 frost
Wow Dks even worse about 20S on him, all my alchemy potions gone. Also the prick had used up all my badges buying junk so now all ive got is 5 frost
J-Rzez said:
I'm 31k Unbuffed, could probably kick that up to 35 if I wanted to blow money on epic gems (which, until I grab more Tier 9 with Triumph Badges, is pointless)...
On the subject of terrible PUGs... I run with a pretty small guild, mostly just family (father & two brothers) and friends we've made over the years. We can pull off a full guild 5-man on a good day, but usually it's just 2 or 3 of us on filling the gap with the LFG tool. Luckily, between the 7 accounts in the guild, we always have somebody with a decently geared healer/tank...
It's so wonderful to always have those roles filled, and just pick up filler DPS... and then comment in guild chat about how bad they are. Oh, and never having to hear people complain for longer than it takes to majority vote somebody when we represent the majority? Great :lol
Azwethinkweiz
Member
jim-jam bongs said:
I'm fairly geared as a DK tank, for heroics anyway (around 4750 GS), and my health is still only 33.1k.
Does anyone know Blizzards rationale for not being able to vote to kick a player before the 15 minute LFG debuff wears off? I can somewhat see the theory behind it being they dont want 3/4 people dominating a group kick function and keep recycling players until they get 1 that they like (which I think could have been avoided by only letting you initiate 1 vote per run). To me, it seems kind of pointless to not be able to vote someone out until the debuff is gone I might as well just leave group and wait it out myself and re-que later rather than dying in that time frame and waiting to be able to kick the guy/girl.
There has really only been 2 examples I can think of that I wanted to kick someone instantly from group, both revolving around people being lazy/not waiting to wait around for another que:
1) The person qued for a role that they are not able to fill. Ive actually gotten people who will que as a tank or healer, but then come in without that respective spec and/or gear. I know some heroics can be tanked by a dps offspec or healed by a dps offspec (usually depending on how geared the group in general is), but this is not always the case. If you come into the heroic with the appropriate spec/gear and then see that we can change up gear/roles to plow through it faster, cool. But if the group is filled with newly 80s, were probably gonna need a full time healer, not a part time healer, and if you only have a dps spec, we are hosed. I assume they que as tank or healer without actually being that role so that dont have to wait as long in the que for a random.
2) The afker. Ive had a couple of people who either go afk for 10 mins right from the start or are constantly going afk every couple of minutes/trash mobs. I realize real life stuff pops up and sometimes you gotta afk, but if you are going to be gone a prolonged amount of time/constantly are going to have to leave, why wouldnt you just bow out and re-que later? Its not that heroics are hard (assuming the afker is dps and not the tank or healer), I just dont want to carry people through that I dont even know.
/end rant
There has really only been 2 examples I can think of that I wanted to kick someone instantly from group, both revolving around people being lazy/not waiting to wait around for another que:
1) The person qued for a role that they are not able to fill. Ive actually gotten people who will que as a tank or healer, but then come in without that respective spec and/or gear. I know some heroics can be tanked by a dps offspec or healed by a dps offspec (usually depending on how geared the group in general is), but this is not always the case. If you come into the heroic with the appropriate spec/gear and then see that we can change up gear/roles to plow through it faster, cool. But if the group is filled with newly 80s, were probably gonna need a full time healer, not a part time healer, and if you only have a dps spec, we are hosed. I assume they que as tank or healer without actually being that role so that dont have to wait as long in the que for a random.
2) The afker. Ive had a couple of people who either go afk for 10 mins right from the start or are constantly going afk every couple of minutes/trash mobs. I realize real life stuff pops up and sometimes you gotta afk, but if you are going to be gone a prolonged amount of time/constantly are going to have to leave, why wouldnt you just bow out and re-que later? Its not that heroics are hard (assuming the afker is dps and not the tank or healer), I just dont want to carry people through that I dont even know.
/end rant
jim-jam bongs said:
That's a terrible rule. I did all those instances with 22k hp unbuffed in november 2008. Since then, those instances have been nerfed to the ground. What do you want? A mindless run where you only have to heal your tank once every 2 minutes? We DPS tank all the heroics except the ICC ones now.
Johnlenham said:Wow. I was raped, everythings stripped from my bank, had 3G on me and it was a farmer as I had a bag full of crap and was by the fire revnants near ulduar. Atleast all the trash in my bag gave me 160g..:lol
Wow Dks even worse about 20S on him, all my alchemy potions gone. Also the prick had used up all my badges buying junk so now all ive got is 5 frost
It really is a shame Blizzard can't/won't do anything legally to these people, or I guess it can't be done over-seas. I hope they all "diaf plz".
I don't remember my DK's HP pool in tank gear, i'll check it out later. It's not really that super high either iirc.
Johnlenham
Member
J-Rzez said:
Im just glad that some gear cant be sold or id be really fucked. Atleast now I can still do Heroics and grind out some gold on dailys to pay for repairs/ammo and that I have the account back in general.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
It took less than a week to get over 34K on my Pally from full Tempered Saronite. That said, I ran a fucking lot of dungeons.J-Rzez said:
In reality, most people are happy to have a tank at all.
That is a terrible rule, man...you can tank 100% of heroics with like 25-27K.jim-jam bongs said:
I never bothered to stack Stamina in 3.0.2-.0.8. I literally tanked every single one with 25K health, because people weren't stam. stacking then. It has nothing to do with skill or gear, it's just not what tanks were doing back then and 100% of the items available to me were level 200. Stamina Stacking is a result of how the bosses in raids past Eye of Eternity hit you.
Johnlenham said:Wow. I was raped, everythings stripped from my bank, had 3G on me and it was a farmer as I had a bag full of crap and was by the fire revnants near ulduar. Atleast all the trash in my bag gave me 160g..:lol
Wow Dks even worse about 20S on him, all my alchemy potions gone. Also the prick had used up all my badges buying junk so now all ive got is 5 frost
Posted about this a few weeks back. I was hacked (surprisingly) and was fortunately enough to be at my comp when it happened. The hacker got a little over-zealous and changed my password... alerting me of the switch. I simply logged onto my account from a different machine (using my secret question answer) and changed everything back. In the 5 minutes the hacker had my account... I had found that all my badges were spent (to the tune of about 15-20 Crusader Orbs) and all my gold missing (approx. 30k). I joked with my guildees telling them that the hacker was too busy with my bags... sending everything away... to notice I was an Enchanter so he could DE all my gear.
I was fortunate on a few grounds. Firstly that I got control of my character almost immediately and placed an authenticator on the account right away (again, guys, I really recommend this). Secondly that my gear was untouched and I could still run everything, raid-wise, as if nothing had ever happened (couple guildees spotted me a few flasks). And thirdly that I acted quickly in talking to Blizzard about the issue. I got everything back in about 2 days. I sent them an email and I called them. Turns out the call was unnecessary... the email was more than enough and I had GM emailing me in about 24 hours. To me it seems as if the more information you can gives them (time character was hacked... what was taken... amount of gold, etc.) the better and quicker they can serve you. They told me it was first come, first serve... but the speed at which I was taken care of suggested otherwise.
Good luck. Blizzard was really wonderful in resolving my situation.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
The default UI.Kweh said:
jim-jam bongs
Member
Fularu said:
Well yeah, so do we but our DPS tanks are all at over 30k anyway. And come now, all heroics are mindless at this point.
Angry Grimace said:
Huh. I thought this was a fairly standard baseline for tanks; at least, it is according to the ones in my guild but it's been a long time since any of them were tanking heroics I guess. To be honest, it's mostly just a quick way to guess approximate gear level of a tank without using gearscore (which I've had switched off for a while - I'm free!)
I usually assume that a sub 30k HP tank is going to have lower avoidance and armour too, just by nature of where their gear is at. Though, now that I think about it, they'd be stacking critical tanking stats for their class like defence/parry/block/dodge which would chew up some of the budget for stamina.
Well, consider me schooled at any rate. I'm just getting a little tired of runs where the DPS out-gear the tank so much that I just sit there casting CoH > PoH > PoM > CoH... over and over (and fading of course) because the mobs are bouncing around so much. Still, I'll try to find a better way to guess if that's going to happen.
Johnlenham
Member
Cant you just shift-click said item and it compares it to every other item of that slot you own?Xabora said:
You can do it for items that someone links you by right clicking the tooltip and it will compare the equivalent slot item.Johnlenham said:
As does pawn, but also gives you the weights.Epix said:
Heck you can even ignore it too. >_>
Also don't forget blizzard already implemented a way to show which of each stat between two items that you gain or loose.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
:lolXabora said:
Got hit with a temp ban for that Elitist Jerks post because the Ban-guy said, "question was answered on the first page," despite the fact that, it clearly wasn't since the guys that wrote the modeling programs didn't even really know the answer and went ahead and remodeled it to account for the discrepancies they saw :lol
The only way to not get banned if you post anything on EJ if you have any question at all is to actually be in a recognized guild on Mal'ganis as far as I can tell :lol
And I though GAF could be Draconian in its ban policies :lol
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
http://elitistjerks.com/f76/t68951-retribution_updated_3_3_a/p57/Xabora said:
The problem is, you have to phrase a question in an ultra specific, virtually impossible way to not get banned.
The question is really, "What is the exact value of haste for a paladin vs. an Unholy Death Knight (because the DK thread provides stat weights in terms of AP = 1, haste = 1.8, etc.)," and also because the actual OP, while ultra-useful, fails to provide any relative weighting to haste (not to mention, the value of haste isn't necessarily the same across multiple simulators.). But I'm not used to providing zero background into a question, so I guess that's what "angered" the mods
.It's not like the responses weren't helpful (they were actually very helpful and insightful), so whatever, doesn't bother me, really. Just awfully Draconian. Even NPD threads aren't that moderated :lol I'm not sure it makes a lot of sense to require people to be familiar with the actual mechanics behind RAWR to have a question.
:lolAngry Grimace said:http://elitistjerks.com/f76/t68951-retribution_updated_3_3_a/p57/
The problem is, you have to phrase a question in an ultra specific, virtually impossible way to not get banned.
The question is really, "What is the exact value of haste for a paladin vs. an Unholy Death Knight (because the DK thread provides stat weights in terms of AP = 1, haste = 1.8, etc.)," and also because the actual OP, while ultra-useful, fails to provide any relative weighting to haste (not to mention, the value of haste isn't necessarily the same across multiple simulators.). But I'm not used to providing zero background into a question, so I guess that's what "angered" the mods
It's not like the responses weren't helpful (they were actually very helpful and insightful), so whatever, doesn't bother me, really. Just awfully Draconian. Even NPD threads aren't that moderated :lol I'm not sure it makes a lot of sense to require people to be familiar with the actual mechanics behind RAWR to have a question.
Wow, that is a crazy temp ban.
But yeah Haste while good for a ret is not that good enough to go balls out and gem for.
Pretty much the same level as an Unholy DK. (Due to how it helps with White Damage (Necrosis & BCB) + Garg/Pet) >_>
Johnlenham
Member
Fuck. Just realized when I got hacked the bastard sold all my tanking gear on my Dk so until the GMs refund the stuff I have to dps if I want my daily badges
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I guess I just figured that a well reasoned, clearly on topic post would get by even if I threw some background in there in case it mattered.Epix said:
Apparently not.
The temp ban is already over, not that I would know, since I logged out so that when I inevitably drew a ban for whatever, I could still read it without having to clear my history. Seems like it would be more trouble than it's worth to actually moderate something in a manner like that. I mean, it's a video game forum (dedicated to a single game, no less).
Elitist Jerks is good only if you use it as a guide or a tool. Anything more than that (like a BIBLE, for example) and your heading down a dark, lonely, cold path.
I stopped reading it and following it as much when I realized these people enjoyed talking about the game more than actually playing it. I'm sorry... I'm just not into discussing the validity of whether or not I should alter my cast rotation by a half second in order to gain 5 DPS over the course of a 3 minute encounter. Once you realize that most of what they are talking about is theoretical and implausible... it's kinda like finding out there isn't a Santa (spoiler).
Checking out gear selection -- Discussing options -- You really need to sift thru a lot of junk posts to get to the people that actually know what the fuck they are talking about. If you've got a good couple of hours to waste... then by all means... find the good stuff. But lately it's been pretty shitty... at least from a Mage's perspective.
I stopped reading it and following it as much when I realized these people enjoyed talking about the game more than actually playing it. I'm sorry... I'm just not into discussing the validity of whether or not I should alter my cast rotation by a half second in order to gain 5 DPS over the course of a 3 minute encounter. Once you realize that most of what they are talking about is theoretical and implausible... it's kinda like finding out there isn't a Santa (spoiler).
Checking out gear selection -- Discussing options -- You really need to sift thru a lot of junk posts to get to the people that actually know what the fuck they are talking about. If you've got a good couple of hours to waste... then by all means... find the good stuff. But lately it's been pretty shitty... at least from a Mage's perspective.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Well, it's pretty obvious given that moderating a forum like that requires you literally sit around moderating full time instead of playing.hobart said:
I doubt there's not even a question in anyone's mind that the people that run it are probably power-tripping raid leaders trying to extend the only real influence they have beyond the game itself.
But whatever, it has stuff that's useful.
I just think EJ tries to hard to live up to their name.
The moderating is ridiculous. To see some guy post stats of a new trinket that will benefit his class while 3.3 was still on test before any discussion had been started on it, get a warning is just ridiculous.
Its either be well known, or dont post, they will find a way to ban your ass over bullshit. I havent gotten any of those warnings or bans yet but still. Their forum is horrible for discussion of any kind.
The moderating is ridiculous. To see some guy post stats of a new trinket that will benefit his class while 3.3 was still on test before any discussion had been started on it, get a warning is just ridiculous.
Its either be well known, or dont post, they will find a way to ban your ass over bullshit. I havent gotten any of those warnings or bans yet but still. Their forum is horrible for discussion of any kind.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I really am just interested in, "Do this, not this," or "stack X not Y." I can't imagine actually wanting to sit around talking about howPuncture said:
Certain players at World of Warcraft develop bizarre superiority complexes because they not only forget that WoW is a video game, but that it's only one game in a million other games.
jim-jam bongs
Member
Had my first lol-culus run in random LFG.
Joined up and the tank dropped before I even zoned in. So the ret pally puts his tanking gear on and changes spec, and we start clearing while waiting for a DPS. First DPS joins, types "nooooooooooooo" into chat then drops the group.
This happens 3 times before the first boss. The funniest part was that we made it through easily and even did the 20 minute achievement. People just hate Oculus.
Joined up and the tank dropped before I even zoned in. So the ret pally puts his tanking gear on and changes spec, and we start clearing while waiting for a DPS. First DPS joins, types "nooooooooooooo" into chat then drops the group.
This happens 3 times before the first boss. The funniest part was that we made it through easily and even did the 20 minute achievement. People just hate Oculus.
Johnlenham
Member
jim-jam bongs said:
:lol
The thing you have to remember about Elitist Jerks is that they are now a fairly well known website. They have to be strict with their moderation to prevent an influx of useless posts such as the ones you see on the Blizz forums. IMO, they are deliberately discouraging people from posting there unless you can directly contribute to the theorycrafting.
LAUGHTREY
Modesty becomes a woman
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
It probably takes more time to moderate like that than to just sift through the drivel.Bregor said:
SuperAndroid17
Member
:lol :lol
so much for taking icecrown citadel seriously
DADDY I DID IT!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBY8empHf2M
DAD... DAD... DAD!
so much for taking icecrown citadel seriously
DADDY I DID IT!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBY8empHf2M
DAD... DAD... DAD!
Angry Grimace said:
Theorycraft and drivel aren't even mutually exclusive, that's the dumb thing. When 3.1 came out, people on the DK section spent 2-3 weeks on some retarded Death and Decay based dual wield build before coming to the conclusion that it was completely retarded. Meanwhile, I found a spec two days after the patch on the WoW boards that a month later EJ determined was "the" spec.
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