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[keeblerdrow]

I think the most interesting part of that "Rage revamp" is the changing of how shouts work and especially the removal of all next-swing attacks. I never really understood how those made fighting exciting in the least and actually made managing whatever rage I had rather frustrating instead of fun.

 

[Ferrio]

I personally don't think that makes Rage more interesting. Rage is a boring mechanic and normalizing rage makes it even more boring since the brunt of normalizing it is that you generate less of it.

They should have just removed Titan's Grip since that ability is bullshit anyways.

Moreover, the Heroic Strike change is almost literally just making it Execute at all damage levels. I don't even get why Execute can't be used in Def. Stance anyways. Paladins can use Hammer of Wrath while tanking.

I like the change, as of now rage is kinda bullshit mechanic currently. As a prot you either have a shit ton (practically infinite), or none which to me isn't very interesting.

Also I don't get where you're finding you'll generate less. Yes I think you won't have infinite amounts, but that's a good trade if I don't get stuck in those "Fuck I have no rage, but I need rage to get aggro to generate rage... ahhh fuuck"

 

[Angry Grimace]

I like the change, as of now rage is kinda bullshit mechanic currently. As a prot you either have a shit ton (practically infinite), or none which to me isn't very interesting.

Also I don't get where you're finding you'll generate less. Yes I think you won't have infinite amounts, but that's a good trade if I don't get stuck in those "Fuck I have no rage, but I need rage to get aggro to generate rage... ahhh fuuck"

Because if you're saying you have infinite now and the Cataclysm model is < infinite, then you are generating less rage. It's a given that you will generate less rage; that's how rage normalization worked in BC; by design it scales poorly.

Bloodthirst should have always generated 50 rage and 50 rage over time. The reason being; Rage isn't a mechanic that just magically reappears like Energy and it doesn't have the duration of mana.

The problem is the entire mechanic needs to be overhauled. It isn't interesting in any iteration.

 

[Ferrio]

Because if you're saying you have infinite now and the Cataclysm model is < infinite, then you are generating less rage. It's a given that you will generate less rage; that's how rage normalization worked in BC; by design it scales poorly.

Bloodthirst should have always generated 50 rage and 50 rage over time. The reason being; Rage isn't a mechanic that just magically reappears like Energy and it doesn't have the duration of mana.

The problem is the entire mechanic needs to be overhauled. It isn't interesting in any iteration.

But sounds like they *are* overhauling it. And yes, < infinite is less. But infinite is bullshit, I'm not going to whine about losing infinite resources cause I realize it's retarded to begin with. Now if we lose infinite but they don't fix rage starvation, then I'll be up in arms. But if it works like they want it to, you should always have a decent set of rage at your disposal, never so much you have rage dumps and never so little that you get screwed over.

Concept is sound, execution is what we'll have to see.

 

[Alex]

Dispel changes

We wanted to introduce some of the changes to dispel mechanics coming in Cataclysm. Our goals were to make dispelling a little less trivial to do in PvP, and to make sure there is more equity in dispel capabilities among healers in both PvP and PvE.

Within the system, there are currently five types of dispellable (or curable) buffs and debuffs: curse, disease, poison, defensive magic, and offensive magic. An example of defensive magic dispelling would be using a dispel to free a polymorphed ally, while offensive magic dispelling would be utilizing a dispel ability to strip away an enemy’s buff or heal-over-time (HoT) spell. The main distinction between these two types is in whether or not you can target an enemy with your dispel.

In Cataclysm each healing class will be getting three out of the five types of dispels, with one of these always being a defensive dispel magic. This design makes sure that finding a healer with the ability to remove magic isn’t restrictive in building teams for Arenas or rated Battlegrounds. It also allows the encounter designers to assume, when designing dungeon or raid fights, that every group can dispel magic.

In addition, we're making the opportunity cost (what the player could have accomplished with different actions) for dispelling a bit steeper. We think the cost is too low for three reasons: 1) The actual mana cost is low. 2) You never waste a dispel. If you try to dispel a debuff that isn’t there then the dispel just won’t go off. 3) We have spells that remove debuffs with minimal input on the part of the player. In Cataclysm we are raising the mana costs, making it possible to waste mana by casting a dispel when there is nothing to dispel, and removing Cleansing Totem, Abolish Disease, and Abolish Poison from the game. With these changes in mind, we are working to plan dungeon and raid encounters where dispels aren’t in constant demand or spammed in order to be successful, though some need for dispels will still be a part of the design.

As previously mentioned, we are providing three dispel capabilities to all healing classes as follows:

Druids will be able to dispel defensive magic, curses, and poison.
Paladins will be able to dispel defensive magic, diseases, and poison.
Priests will be able to dispel defensive magic, offensive magic, and disease.
Shaman will be able to dispel defensive magic, offensive magic, and curses.

There is some trade-off that is being made in making these changes and we wanted to expand on this further.

Protection and Retribution paladins will lose their current ability to dispel magic.
All shaman will lose dispel disease and dispel poison in exchange for Restoration gaining dispel magic.
Restoration shaman, Restoration druids, and Holy paladins will need to talent into their defensive magic dispels.
Shadow priests won’t be able to remove disease in Shadowform.
Mage, hunter, and warlock will retain their current dispel mechanics.
Body and Soul remains the same, and basically any dispel mechanic not mentioned above is currently planned to remain as it is.
When possible, we’d like to combine dispels into a single action. For example, the druid ability to dispel curses and poisons might be a single spell with a Restoration talent that also allows it to dispel magic. This part of the design isn’t finalized, however.

As with all of our Cataclysm previews, keep in mind that any of these decisions could change when we’re in beta.

These seem really, really idiotic under the current structure of things, but who knows for Cataclysm. I'm excited to see the alpha/beta notes and I'm not even sure if I'll play!

 

[DarkAngelYuna]

I wish I could quit this game already ;(

 

[Retro]

Dispel changes

Hmm... stripping Ret and Prot paladins of their Magic Dispel (Cleanse) is going to cause some problems in PVP if changes aren't made. I already get kited like crazy by mages, and the one thing that usually saves me is being able to cleanse off Frost Nova and the various magic-based debuffs they cast. Earthbind totem and Entangling Roots too. Without cleanse, I'm basically looking at blowing Hand of Freedom (which I usually save for non-magic snares) or my trinket.

Paladins are already pretty easy, if not the easiest class, to kite and I'm pretty sure this is common knowledge. So I'm optimistic that if this change goes through, Pallies will get some kind of consolation prize. Probably a tweak to Hand of Freedom, but.. I'm hoping for some kind of gap-closer that isn't just a carbon-copy of Death Grip or Charge... neither of those are very interesting, but... we'll see.

 

[Swag]

So first time in ICC on my hunter, I get my Kingslayer :lol

 

[Xabora]

So first time in ICC on my hunter, I get my Kingslayer :lol

I hate my server. :|

 

[Sullen]

Shadow Priests cant remove disease in shadowform again? Ugh, it was so retarded when you couldn't do that back in the day and then they finally changed it and it made sense again, and now we are going back to that stupidity.. groan.

 

[Ferrio]

Guild finally got to Lich King in 10 man. Then after sitting on his lap and telling him what we wanted for xmas, we marched to our deaths.

 

[speedpop]

removing Cleansing Totem, Abolish Disease, and Abolish Poison from the game

What the fuck?

Shaman get destroyed by Rogues as it is, yet Blizzard want to take away a big part of our slim chance of survival against them?

Stupid.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Hmm... stripping Ret and Prot paladins of their Magic Dispel (Cleanse) is going to cause some problems in PVP if changes aren't made. I already get kited like crazy by mages, and the one thing that usually saves me is being able to cleanse off Frost Nova and the various magic-based debuffs they cast. Earthbind totem and Entangling Roots too. Without cleanse, I'm basically looking at blowing Hand of Freedom (which I usually save for non-magic snares) or my trinket.

Paladins are already pretty easy, if not the easiest class, to kite and I'm pretty sure this is common knowledge. So I'm optimistic that if this change goes through, Pallies will get some kind of consolation prize. Probably a tweak to Hand of Freedom, but.. I'm hoping for some kind of gap-closer that isn't just a carbon-copy of Death Grip or Charge... neither of those are very interesting, but... we'll see.

Probably just nothing.

 

[Retro]

Probably just nothing.

I dunno, this morning's update actually makes me optimistic. Here's the entire blue post for people at work (specific item is bolded, however);

Beginning Wednesday, April 7 we will begin releasing class previews containing an overview of some of the changes currently being planned for each of the 10 World of Warcraft classes. The type of information you can expect from these posts are a list of the new spells from 80-85, the new passive mastery bonuses for all talent trees, a brief outline of some of the talent changes we're currently planning, and in some cases new low level spells for select classes.

These changes will by no means be comprehensive, and are subject to change between now and the launch of the expansion. It's also important to understand that some classes are currently further along in the development process than others, and as a result the amount of information will vary from class to class. Please do not let this frustrate you should your class be amongst those which are on the "lighter" side of things, as all classes will receive the same level of design attention before the expansion is released. Additionally we'll be providing more information for all classes, especially as we move into the beta phase.

Below is the schedule for each class:

* Shaman - April 7
* Priest - April 7
* Warlock - April 7

* Warrior - April 8
* Death Knight - April 8
* Rogue - April 8

* Hunter - April 9
* Druid - April 9
* Mage - April 9

* Paladin - April 16*

These posts are being coordinated internationally so they'll be posted at different times throughout the day and night on the given dates to give players around the world the ability to see posts made at a convenient time. This thread will be updated with links directly to each class preview as they're posted.

*The paladin is still deep in development. Instead of giving a preview that would be potentially less comprehensive than the other classes we made the decision to post it when it's ready, in order to properly honor the paladin class and those that play them. The wait isn't too long however as we're expecting to be able to post it on April 16.

My first impression is "Oh, great, Paladins are getting done last again", but honestly... the Paladin class is the one that, to me, seems to need the most work still. I don't think Blizzard has ever had a really solid idea on how they want the class to work, so it's no surprise that WotLK and TBC both had huge changes for the class. It looks like Cataclysm will be no different.

Stupid me, I'm usually optimistic when they stay stuff like that... I hope they're making good changes, but I'm pretty sure it will be less than pleasant. My only hope is that Blizzard isn't listening to the fucking morons over at the official forums who are practically calling for Paladins to be driven back to pre-TBC standing. It'll never happen, but who knows what the hell they're thinking, especially with this latest change to dispels for shamans.

Shamans and Paladins always feel like they're fighting over who can be screwed over worse.

I'll never understand why the 'holy' classes can't dispel curses and the 'nature' classes can't dispel poisons and disease. Seems like it should be reversed.

 

[ShallNoiseUpon]

If they fix spellpower plate, the extra wait for the paladin info will be worth it.

 

[speedpop]

Deep down inside the dispel changes do not bother me.

I have a level 80 Shaman and Druid, and I plan on creating a Paladin "for real" come Cataclysm with a Tauren.

I have a mid-40 Priest on standby on an entirely different server, and I always enjoyed the way they play, but I cannot be bothered rerolling without Heirloom gear.

So ultimately I get to pick and choose depending on my own playstyle at the time. Of course each character will have entirely different sets of gear but that doesn't really stop me from enjoying the game.

 

[evlcookie]

Will be interesting to see what the priest changes are since that was my main since TBC. And i want that two seater rocket mount :lol

 

[gottalovetheglove]

Will be interesting to see what the priest changes are since that was my main since TBC. And i want that two seater rocket mount :lol

Well, if you RAF people for our future AusGAF guild... just sayin'. :lol

 

[Entropia]

So first time in ICC on my hunter, I get my Kingslayer :lol

I hate you. :|

Also, :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol at the dispel changes. THANKS BLIZZARD. I AM GLAD YOU'VE PRETTY MUCH MADE THESE CHANGES BECAUSE OF PVP.


Also the fact that Shaman are going to be one of the first classes who get their changes revealed for Cataclysm... What are they going to change the icon to Stormstrike?:lol

 

[notworksafe]

If they fix spellpower plate, the extra wait for the paladin info will be worth it.

Have Holy and Ret share gear. It just makes sense. Ele/Resto shaman and Balance/Resto druids will share gear, and they both use unique spellpower gear.

 

[Macattk15]

I think I'm going to stop playing till Cata. Guild is working on Heroic LK 25 and I just don't care. Sure it'd be cool to be server first but I don't know ... just so bored with ICC and such now.

Don't care about the new Sanctum raid as it looks like it'd only be fun to run once, like VoA. I don't PvP at all. I don't want to level alts.

So I think this is my end. And I'm ok with it.

 

[Angry Grimace]

I hate you. :|

Also, :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol at the dispel changes. THANKS BLIZZARD. I AM GLAD YOU'VE PRETTY MUCH MADE THESE CHANGES BECAUSE OF PVP.


Also the fact that Shaman are going to be one of the first classes who get their changes revealed for Cataclysm... What are they going to change the icon to Stormstrike?:lol

More like:

Shaman

Your totems no longer have any function, but you cannot damage or heal anyone unless they are out.

 

[Jin]

Yay finally downed LK. 10man.

The ending movie kinda sucked, but oh well. Waited with watching it till I actually killed him myself.

I was kind of disappointed with the ending as well. Probably because I was so hyped for it.

Off topic: who is the girl in your avatar?

 

[Retro]

Not all doom and gloom for shamans... of course, I haven't managed to play one past 20, so I dunno how big of a change this is for you guys.

We agree with some of the recent discussion about Enhancement dps. We are going to hotfix a change to the Flurry talent to increase it from 25% to 30% attack speed with 5 ranks.

We also agree that Enhancement may have survivability problems and understand that players don't necessarily feel they can afford the bonus Stamina from the Toughness talent, at least in PvE. We don't have an immediate change to deploy here, but it's something we'd like to fix and a candidate for future patches.

Dunno why I've been so active in this thread today. You guys stuck at work at least appreciate the updates? If nobody beats me to it, I'll be sure to post anything that comes down the pipe tomorrow for Shamans, Priests, and locks. :lol

 

[Swag]

I hate my server. :|

What server are you on?

 

[explodet]

In my pvp resto gear it was hilarious having my cleansing totem out and outhealing a DK who was wailing on me, probably not realizing his diseases were being removed. A little more difficult with rogues, as they stack poison so fast… not to mention those damn stuns.

Wasn't Flurry 30% a long while ago anyway? Sheesh. I love my melee shaman, but there are so many tweaks to the class it's silly.

 

[Rapstah]

Yay at healing priests not getting that nerfed yet.

 

[Retro]

Yay at healing priests not getting that nerfed yet.

Tomorrow is the priest preview... be afraid!

More updates for those of you still at work...

We're doing our Cataclysm preview on the death knight changes later this week, but we knew one change risked overshadowing all the others, so we figured we'd go ahead and drop the proverbial Blood bomb today.

In Cataclysm, death knights will have a dedicated tanking tree, much like the other three tank classes. That tree will be Blood.

(Source)

And more on Shamans, along with other dispel clarifications...

- Shaman will get Cleanse Spirit as a base spell that removes curses. Restoration will have a talent to add magic dispelling (on friends or enemies) to Cleanse Spirit.

- We recognize this change risks making shaman too vulnerable to rogue and hunter poisons in PvP (and especially mind-numbing), and we might very well offer a talent or mechanic to compensate for that.

-If we didn’t mention a specific dispel mechanic (like Shield Slam), then you can assume it probably isn’t changing, at least for now. A lot may change in beta.

(Source).

I know most of this information is available, but a lot of people browse GAF at work... so... yeah, sorry if the news updates are obnoxious but I'm bored :lol .

 

[Tamanon]

You had to figure that with the mastery changes, they had to limit the DKs to a tank tree eventually. Makes sense.

 

[Retro]

You had to figure that with the mastery changes, they had to limit the DKs to a tank tree eventually. Makes sense.

Pretty much, and the rest of GC's post basically says "We felt like we were watering down the trees by trying to make all three specs tank-viable." Here's a few more notes from the same post;

With Frost as a dual-wield, spell and runic power focused tree, Unholy as a disease and minion focused tree, and Blood as a self-healing, defensive cooldown, tanking tree, we think the focus of each tree is a lot clearer and cooler.

In Cataclysm, Blood will be the death knight version of a Protection tree. It will have passive talent tree bonuses that reflect tanking. It will have tools, such as a Demo Shout equivalent, necessary for tanking. Several of the more fun tanking talents from Frost and Unholy will be moved into Blood. We will be able to revise (or even remove) clunky mechanics like Rune Strike and focus on letting DKs generate threat with their normal Blood tanking rotation.

My biggest hurdle for playing a DK was that the roles were undefined, and I didn't feel like spending hours researching. A more focused approach to talents should make them much more approachable.

With Blood officially situated as the Tanking tree, I'm thinking Frost will become the PVP tree and Unholy will be the PVE DPS tree... but those are pretty random guesses from a guy who just admitted he doesn't play his DK much. :lol

 

[Angry Grimace]

I wonder when the opt-in for the beta starts.

If they are planning a late fall launch like Wrath (which is ridiculous by the way), I guess we'll see that in July or so.

 

[sykoex]

I wonder when the opt-in for the beta starts.

If they are planning a late fall launch like Wrath (which is ridiculous by the way), I guess we'll see that in July or so.

So with the Wrath beta they eventually let anyone try it like a patch PTR?

 

[Angry Grimace]

So with the Wrath beta they eventually let anyone try it like a patch PTR?

No.

You have to opt-in and a select few randomly get chosen to be in it. I think we had a couple of people in it during Wrath.

 

[HarryDemeanor]

I wonder when the opt-in for the beta starts.

If they are planning a late fall launch like Wrath (which is ridiculous by the way), I guess we'll see that in July or so.

With this much info coming from them now, I wouldn't be surprised if beta began in mid-May.

 

[Weenerz]

I enjoyed being in the WotLK beta test from F&F alpha to the last day. Fun times.

 

[Angry Grimace]

It would have been hilarious if the Death Knight changes they announced were that, due to the Lich King's death, all Death Knights will be deleted.

 

[notworksafe]

I enjoyed being in the WotLK beta test from F&F alpha to the last day. Fun times.

I managed to get in early as well. Blizzard seems to let almost all the Mac people into their betas right away. I guess we're just so small in number.

 

[Angry Grimace]

I managed to get in early as well. Blizzard seems to let almost all the Mac people into their betas right away. I guess we're just so small in number.

How similar was the first builds to the release discs?

 

[notworksafe]

How similar was the first builds to the release discs?

Some things were pretty close. A lot of quests and zones were already set, though there were some changes to make them a little easier to understand. There was a distinct lack of music, though. One thing I thought was interesting what the Lich King model in the DK starting area was totally different (and wasn't voiced...most characters weren't there). In fact the whole DK area was different. You had to go to a Frost trainer to learn Frost spells, UH trainer for UH spells, and Blood trainer for Blood spells. Luckily that was cleared up before launch.

I didn't really get into doing any instances or group stuff because I didn't want to get spoiled, so I can't comment on how that changed.

A lot of the classes were changed up a lot throughout the beta. The Death Knight class itself went through the most changes. First they were super overpowered, then super nerfed, then eventually landed somewhere in the middle. I remember when DK's were at their highest in crazy damage, I kited most of the mobs Hellfire Peninsula around and managed to kill them all without any trouble at all.

My guess is Cata will be the same way. The look and feel of the zones will (mostly) be set by beta. The classes and their mechanics will most likely change a ton before it's over.

EDIT: Found a pic of the first LK in Ebon Hold. You can't tell from this, but he was pretty small, only about 20% larger then a normal human model.

 

[Xabora]

What server are you on?

Undermine. :|

EDIT: Found a pic of the first LK in Ebon Hold. You can't tell from this, but he was pretty small, only about 20% larger then a normal human model.

Thats the second positon for the LK.
First one was on top of Ebon Hold.


And the LK used the Base Human Animations until late Beta actually.

 

[gottalovetheglove]

You had to go to a Frost trainer to learn Frost spells, UH trainer for UH spells, and Blood trainer for Blood spells. Luckily that was cleared up before launch.

I thought that was changed after launch? I remember having to do that for my first DK and I didn't play during the beta so I know for sure it wasn't then.

 

[ShallNoiseUpon]

We're doing our Cataclysm preview on the death knight changes later this week, but we knew one change risked overshadowing all the others, so we figured we'd go ahead and drop the proverbial Blood bomb today.

In Cataclysm, death knights will have a dedicated tanking tree, much like the other three tank classes. That tree will be Blood.

We’ll go into more detail in the upcoming preview, but we wanted to take the opportunity to explain the reasoning for such a big change.

Why the about face? We actually thought the “tri tank” experiment worked out okay. We suspected there would always be a “best” tanking tree, because that’s the way these things shake out, but we hoped it would be close enough that many players could tank with their favorite tree. When we tried out this design for Wrath of the Lich King, we were using it as a test case to see if we wanted to do similar things with the warrior and paladin talent trees.

A lot has happened since that time. We introduced the dual-spec feature, allowing players to have a tanking spec and dps spec that they could switch between. We introduced Dungeon Finder, which makes it easier to find players who want to tank, and even let players level up using a dedicated tank spec. In Cataclysm, we are introducing the concept of passive talent tree bonuses and we think that feature is a lot stronger when the talent tree has a particular focus (such as damage, tanking or healing). For example, it’s safer to give more passive damage to a tanking tree than we can a dps tree. Above all, we were just spending a lot of effort trying to balance three trees (though it was really six trees, since each tree was trying to do two things).

It started to feel unfair to the other tank classes that we had to spend so much effort tweaking three types of DK tanks, and it even started to feel unfair to the DK that we couldn’t focus their tanking experience. One bit of feedback that really struck home was the DK players who said, essentially, “I look at the Protection tree and I’m jealous of all of the cool tools they have to help their tanking. As a DK, I have to pick and choose tanking talents from within a sea of dps talents.” Rather than have a strong focus, the trees felt a little watered down because they were trying to do so much. With Frost as a dual-wield, spell and runic power focused tree, Unholy as a disease and minion focused tree, and Blood as a self-healing, defensive cooldown, tanking tree, we think the focus of each tree is a lot clearer and cooler.

In Cataclysm, Blood will be the death knight version of a Protection tree. It will have passive talent tree bonuses that reflect tanking. It will have tools, such as a Demo Shout equivalent, necessary for tanking. Several of the more fun tanking talents from Frost and Unholy will be moved into Blood. We will be able to revise (or even remove) clunky mechanics like Rune Strike and focus on letting DKs generate threat with their normal Blood tanking rotation.

This is major change, and we understand it will be met with some disappointment from players who really liked the flexibility, those who appreciated the unorthodox talent tree design, or those few of you who really liked Blood dps. Nevertheless, we are convinced that this is the right change for the game.

More exciting death knight news coming up soon in the preview.

At least we won't have DKs in randoms that say "frost is the tank tree!!111!" and not have a single tanking talent.

 

[Retro]

At least we won't have DKs in randoms that say "frost is the tank tree!!111!" and not have a single tanking talent.

14 posts late on that info, good buddy.

I can't help but wonder why Blizz decided to go with Blood as the tanking tree, especially when Frost Presence is the 'tanking' stance. It seems to me that Blood would be a great "Self-healing/fast DPS" tree (aimed more towards PVP) while Unholy would be the "Bag-o-tricks/sustained DPS" tree, with Frost assuming the tanking role.

Maybe they figured that Blood's self-healing abilities can be ramped up to provide the breathing room that a shield provides for the other tanks without having to ramp up max health like they do for Druids... sort of turning them into "Vampire Tanks", for lack of a better term.

The two people I know who seriously play DKs have both said Unholy and Frost are boring specs to play, and one had dual blood specs for both tanking and DPS. He also plays a Shaman, so you can imagine how happy he is right now :lol.

 

[Azwethinkweiz]

At least we won't have DKs in randoms that say "frost is the tank tree!!111!" and not have a single tanking talent.

Dual Wield Frost Tanking 4 LYFE!

 

[Rapstah]

Dual Wield Frost Tanking 4 LYFE!

I had a guy say that once. We wiped on the first two mobs in Utgarde Keep.

 

[Tacitus_]

14 posts late on that info, good buddy.

I can't help but wonder why Blizz decided to go with Blood as the tanking tree, especially when Frost Presence is the 'tanking' stance. It seems to me that Blood would be a great "Self-healing/fast DPS" tree (aimed more towards PVP) while Unholy would be the "Bag-o-tricks/sustained DPS" tree, with Frost assuming the tanking role.

Maybe they figured that Blood's self-healing abilities can be ramped up to provide the breathing room that a shield provides for the other tanks without having to ramp up max health like they do for Druids... sort of turning them into "Vampire Tanks", for lack of a better term.

The two people I know who seriously play DKs have both said Unholy and Frost are boring specs to play, and one had dual blood specs for both tanking and DPS. He also plays a Shaman, so you can imagine how happy he is right now :lol.

The official explanation being

"
We thought Unholy had a pretty strong kit with its diseases and pet, and Frost has gotten a lot more popular lately. Frost has always been about mixing in a lot of Frost spells with weapon damage and the DW kit has worked out pretty well. Blood on the other hand was the tree that we designed to be the "safe" one (meaning not too far out there) that focused on weapon damage and might appeal to current warriors. The closest thing it has to a real kit is the self-healing component, and that actually translates well to tanking. While there are some unusual talents in Blood, those are also some of the ones players skip over in preference for useful but boring +damage talents. The tree has a lot of those, which we need to tone back for Cataclysm anyway, giving us a lot of holes to fill. So the Blood tree was going to cause a lot of reworking anyway. Plus there were mechanics that just never quite gelled, like Heart Strike itself. "

Somewhat reasonable, although I'm waiting how they're tackling the druid feral tree for mastery.

 

[Door2Dawn]

For the love of god please bring back 2h frost.

 

[Tacitus_]

GC, any chance that we'll have a hard-hitting 2h physical dps spec? I adored blood dps (I abhor tanking), and I hate dw dps as well.

Pet class? No thx

It's possible we'll keep Frost as a DW and 2H tree just for that reason. It's just a matter of a few talent points at the moment that make a difference, unlike say Enhancement where a lot of mechanics are tied into dual-wielding. It's also possible, if a little harder, to make an Unholy build sans Ghoul.

Mmkay?

 

[geinou]

Whaaat? Blood spec will be Tank spec? Well, thank you Blizzard, loved to do massive damage as a blood Deathknight.

 

[ShallNoiseUpon]

14 posts late on that info, good buddy.

I can't help but wonder why Blizz decided to go with Blood as the tanking tree, especially when Frost Presence is the 'tanking' stance. It seems to me that Blood would be a great "Self-healing/fast DPS" tree (aimed more towards PVP) while Unholy would be the "Bag-o-tricks/sustained DPS" tree, with Frost assuming the tanking role.

Maybe they figured that Blood's self-healing abilities can be ramped up to provide the breathing room that a shield provides for the other tanks without having to ramp up max health like they do for Druids... sort of turning them into "Vampire Tanks", for lack of a better term.

The two people I know who seriously play DKs have both said Unholy and Frost are boring specs to play, and one had dual blood specs for both tanking and DPS. He also plays a Shaman, so you can imagine how happy he is right now :lol.

I didn't see the entire thing posted, just that you said "Blood Will be Tank Tree" or something. Hell, I didn't even see that you put a link to the source.


I'm going to wait it out and see what Blizzard is going to do in terms of an overhaul of the DK trees -- obviously the tanking talents will be shifted into blood (stuff like howling blast, I would assume, would be retuned and renamed to something like Bloodbath, which is an awesome sound ability if I do say so myself). This potentially leaves them room to totally change they playstyle of both unholy and frost to remove some of the more "boring" stuff in their rotations.

I do agree with the point that the potentially ramping up self healing could make up for the lack of having a shield, and seems interesting, but the self-healing would have to scale with gear and could easily trvialize lower tier content (I don't know how far Blizzard is willing to go to do that).