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i dont know about that border

in MC the only all ranged fight is Shazz

and wiping on bosses is part of the learning experience, u want to do endgame, but u dont want to take the time to learn the encounters, u wipe, u learn, u down the boss, and u collect teh purples, thats how it works

its only easy if you join a guild that has the said places on farm status, but whats the fun in that?
 
As a hunter if you put in some strong shots the monsters go after you this doesnt happen on the world map much but otherwise it happens alot. Ussualy i am done for when they get in lol.
 
border said:
Question for experienced raiders -- is it me or do the endgame boss encounters seem biased against melee classes? I've never been beyond UBRS, but I've been reading a few boss guides for MC, BWL, and Onyxia and almost all of them seem centered around having a tank hold aggro while everybody else nukes it from 30 yards away. All of the bosses have such nasty AoE that getting close becomes less than desirable......and I guess this problem is only compounded by the fact that warriors and rogues are some of the most widely-played classes.

I wouldn't mind joining an endgame guild or anything, but as a warrior I've pretty much resigned myself to the fact that it's not really gonna happen. I get plenty of guild invites, but you pretty much know that if you're being invited it's because that guild sucks. To misquote Groucho Marx, "I wouldn't want to join any organization that would have me as a member." I guess I could spend my Saturday nights wiping on the ZG Bat boss or something, but obviously there's not much appeal to that.
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Just because a guild currently sucks doesn't mean it doesn't have potential.

If you don't think you're going to get into a guild that's raiding, then try getting into a guild that has potential too.

And as Yacobod said, From MC, Ony, BWL there's only one boss I can think of that I as a rogue don't melee and that's Shazzarah.

------------------------------------------

As for me, I should have the THunderfury by Friday at the latest, should be interesting.

Also my mass collecting of +hit gear is almost complete. When said and done I should have a total of +14% to hit. Never would of seen the day I'd be valuing +hit over AP and agility.
 
Ferrio said:
Just because a guild currently sucks doesn't mean it doesn't have potential.

If you don't think you're going to get into a guild that's raiding, then try getting into a guild that has potential too.
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I started raiding in January and I'm SO glad I got into a guild as they started MC. Infinitely more rewarding to be there for the first kills. Would of been faster and easier to get "ph4t l00tz" joining a well established guild, but not nearly as rewarding ... at least in my opinion.
 
SaitoH said:
I started raiding in January and I'm SO glad I got into a guild as they started MC. Infinitely more rewarding to be there for the first kills. Would of been faster and easier to get "ph4t l00tz" joining a well established guild, but not nearly as rewarding ... at least in my opinion.
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Yes I meant to mention that. Joining a guild that already has something on farm status is boring. It's not fun, it's just a grind. You join, do the motions, wash rinse repeat.

There's no satisfaction, just a pure grind for gear which in the end usually kills the game for players.
 
yacobod said:
its only easy if you join a guild that has the said places on farm status, but whats the fun in that?
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I don't want to to join a guild that has dungeons on farm status, but I'd at least like something that is capable of going to MC or Onyxia. The last couple I putzed around with couldn't even fill up a ZG raid completely with guild members, and even then the class imbalances in the group were enough to make the place kinda crappy. I'm not sure where the "satisfaction" is in that either.
Just because a guild currently sucks doesn't mean it doesn't have potential.
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It just means that improvement is months away.....assuming that the whole guild doesn't collapse with in-fighting, which is kind of tough since the newer guilds end up having to let in a bunch of jackasses. With last guild, GM just got sick of complaints and disbanded the whole thing. Lost a bunch of Souldarite I donated to the bank, too =\
 
Just build up your gearage the best you can and pay attention to the larger named guilds and when they are recruiting and app away. Depending on the server there may or may not be stepping stone guilds, ones which progress really slowly through new content but are decent enough to farm older bosses. These types of guilds are usually very porous and constantly in need of new recruits, and willing to give decently geared people honest tries. With BWL and now AQ there will always be new content to learn and enjoy learning, so no reason to get preoccupied over that. Trust me, you aren't living a life less priveledged from not wiping on Domo six times a week.

As far as melee goes, it's not a big deal on most fights. As long as you've got 4-5k hp raid buffed you can survive long enough to be healed from anything so long as you aren't tanking.
 
so, anyone able to connect? It fucked up for me a few hours ago and still hasn't worked right... I can't seem to get ANY server to work.
 
I just got back in, but yeah, it was taking awhile to connect. Before it wouldn't even get to the character list before disconnecting me.
 
Son of Godzilla said:
Just build up your gearage the best you can and pay attention to the larger named guilds and when they are recruiting and app away. Depending on the server there may or may not be stepping stone guilds, ones which progress really slowly through new content but are decent enough to farm older bosses. These types of guilds are usually very porous and constantly in need of new recruits, and willing to give decently geared people honest tries. With BWL and now AQ there will always be new content to learn and enjoy learning, so no reason to get preoccupied over that. Trust me, you aren't living a life less priveledged from not wiping on Domo six times a week.

As far as melee goes, it's not a big deal on most fights. As long as you've got 4-5k hp raid buffed you can survive long enough to be healed from anything so long as you aren't tanking.
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Have you got the "back off and bandage to save mana thing" down, Border? That is HUGE on the fights you're mentioning towards keeping you alive and not taxing the healers, thus keeping the tank alive.

Also, when looking for a new up-and-comer guild, pay attention to how people react to one another as you're grouping with them before and after the invite; does it seem as if the officers regard members as cannon fodder to further their own ambitions? Do fellow members act like the brass should do all thinking and organizing? Avoid if true.
 
"Back off and bandage" I can understand.....I'm just saying that as a group it at least seems to make more sense to take ranged DPS instead of a gaggle of melee players. I have a hard time understanding why rogues are wanted at all....most of their special skills (stunlock, sap, etc) probably won't even work on raid bosses.

Small guild problems seem to be more about complacency than disrespect betwen leaders and members. "4-5 warriors showed up to ZG? Oh well, let's take them all cause we gotta fill up the group anyway...." Leaders aren't really in a position where they can boss people around or risk pissing them off, so they don't say "no" to potential members that are idiots and don't say "no" to people that show up to raid, even when that class is mostly full.
 
Rogues usually do the highest damage of any class. Their abilities being useless is unimportant. On these multiple minute long fights, mages will be conserving mana or waiting for it to regen by the end of it while the rogues will still be beating ass.
 
Does bandaging really work for rogues though? It's only +2000 HP (that gets interrupted if you have a DoT), and as a plate wearer I was burning through it pretty quick on just the ZG bosses.
 
border said:
Does bandaging really work for rogues though? It's only +2000 HP (that gets interrupted if you have a DoT), and as a plate wearer I was burning through it pretty quick on just the ZG bosses.
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You bandage A LOT (understatement) in raids as a rogue. Hell during hte Razorgore fight rogues are put on bandage duty to bandage OTHER PEOPLE.

Rogues should have special first aid skills....


Lui Kang is sorta right in saying rogues do the highest DPS in raids. It's true for the most part, that yes Rogues are usually the ones dishing out all the damage. BUT that's not what makes them useful in raids. What makes them useful in raids is they can dish out the most damage, AND they have skills to lose hate so they don't gain aggro.
 
border said:
Does bandaging really work for rogues though? It's only +2000 HP (that gets interrupted if you have a DoT), and as a plate wearer I was burning through it pretty quick on just the ZG bosses.
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Would raiders be saying that they bandage if they didn't?
 
Rogues will have a new way to bandage after the patch too!

Lightwells FTW!


Anyways, rest assured if you're a Rogue you do have a place in end game raids. So much of one that there's certain enounters that need rogue's in order to get past. (Vael and Supression room).
 
The general consensus here seemed to be that a Fury warrior could (for the most part) take the place of a rogue anyhow. They'd be bandaging less, and even if they pick up aggro they have the ability to take the hits. Is it the aggro-reducing powers that make rogues preferable, or just the fact that good Fury warriors are hard to come by?
Would raiders be saying that they bandage if they didn't?
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I'm not saying that the strategy isn't used.....just questioning its usefullness against just bringing a bunch of DPS casters instead.
 
The general consensus here seemed to be that a Fury warrior could (for the most part) take the place of a rogue anyhow. They'd be bandaging less, and even if they pick up aggro they have the ability to take the hits. Is it the aggro-reducing powers that make rogues preferable, or just the fact that good Fury warriors are hard to come by?
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Just because someone can take hits doesnt' mean you watn them to. Pulling aggro off the designated person in BWL could mean a wipe in less than 5 seconds on some encounters. Secondly it's been my experience that a PvE specced rogue will out damage a fury warrior (which essentially is PvE specced Warrior).
 
I think this has been earlier discussed earlier with no resolution, but has Blizzard ever actually explained how aggro works? I'm specifically interested in stuff like heals, Taunt, Mocking Blow, etc. Do the attacks that force a mob to focus on you amplify threat for their duration? Do armor reducing procs or spells increase threat like Sunder Armor, or is it exclusive to that ability?
 
border said:
I think this has been earlier discussed earlier with no resolution, but has Blizzard ever actually explained how aggro works? I'm specifically interested in stuff like heals, Taunt, Mocking Blow, etc. Do the attacks that force a mob to focus on you amplify threat for their duration? Do armor reducing procs or spells increase threat like Sunder Armor, or is it exclusive to that ability?
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Exclusive to that ability, though I'm sure they do a bit of threat.

Blizzard has never come out and said how exactly aggro works, and I doubt they ever will as it's one of the main hurdles of the game. Though recently people have been using Threatmeters which are suppose to calculate how high on the aggro list you are. OF course all these are made just from educated guesses and testing ect. Which means their accuracy can always be called into question.

I don't trust them myself, and rather use my own intuition and experience to knwo whne I should hold back.
 
border said:
I think this has been earlier discussed earlier with no resolution, but has Blizzard ever actually explained how aggro works? I'm specifically interested in stuff like heals, Taunt, Mocking Blow, etc. Do the attacks that force a mob to focus on you amplify threat for their duration? Do armor reducing procs or spells increase threat like Sunder Armor, or is it exclusive to that ability?
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Read this ^_~
 
border said:
"Back off and bandage" I can understand.....I'm just saying that as a group it at least seems to make more sense to take ranged DPS instead of a gaggle of melee players. I have a hard time understanding why rogues are wanted at all....most of their special skills (stunlock, sap, etc) probably won't even work on raid bosses.
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Alright I'm a rogue currently in a guild doing MC the hard way (learning). We're on Domo - summoning for the first time next Wed. I am consistently 1/2/3 on the ePeen meter. Usually mages gets me because of aoe (we do the corehound packs by wrangling them up and doing consistent AoE). Right now, I have 3 out of 8 NS, and Aged Core Leather Gloves. My weapons are still meh, Shanker / Distracting Dagger with 2 +15 agi enchants. Usually I have the hunters doubled up on the meter.

Granted I expect to drop a little more as more folks get better equipped, but right now the difference between doing 8 MC bosses in 4 hours vs. 8 hours over 2 days is good high damage rogues.
 
I picked up a couple pieces of Deathbone armor today. When this set is upgraded in the 1.10 patch, will it just automatically change in my inventory? Or will the upgraded version only be attainable as a drop in Scholomance?
 
border said:
I picked up a couple pieces of Deathbone armor today. When this set is upgraded in the 1.10 patch, will it just automatically change in my inventory? Or will the upgraded version only be attainable as a drop in Scholomance?
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They'll change automatically for you.

I'm glad I saved a Naglering on my warrior for like a year now for no real reason. :)
 
Is there any place that lists the all items that are going to be upgraded? I'd like to grab whatever's easily farmed in a 10-man before the patch hits and it becomes more difficult to get them.
 
I would try to pick up Naglering too, but it's impossible to put together a BRD group for anything besides attunement runs.

From UBRS:

From Gyth:
Gyth's Skull of <Something> Resistance
Plate Helm
509 Armor
20 Stamina
15 Random Resist
9 Defense
Now rare.

Holy crap, I got this drop yesterday. I can only pray that when 1.10 hits it'll give me Fire Resist. That'd make it way better than Enchanted Thorium Helm, which I expected to have to drop 150-200g for. WoWGuru lists this the new stats as being merely +9 Defense, +20 Stamina. Is the resistance bonus confirmed or not? The resistance bonus on top of everything else probably makes it better-than-blue quality.


UBRS:

From Drakkisath:
Blackblade of Shahram
Epic Two-Hand Sword, 3.5 Speed, 59.4 dps
Chance on hit: Summons the infernal spirit of Shahram.
(speed changed)

What exactly does the proc on this do? A ghost shows up and kicks ass?
 
aww yeah. We killed chrom last night rather easily, and I got shoulders of sexiness. Of course, they don't match with my felheart, but still... shoulders of sexiness.

 
wowguru lists it as only stam and defense because the resistance on it is random. it's like the <Random enchantment> tag on some crafted gear.
 
speshylives said:
You are not wrong, Pads of the Dread Wolf are still better then SC boots. Bracers of the Eclipse are way better then SC bracers. Muggers Belt is better then SC belt. Devilsaur set is better then the pants / gloves. Really, the cap and chest are the only 2 pieces worth the effort.
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Cadaverous Armor is arguably better, and Ghostshroud has like 1 less STA than SC.

oh god why do i remember all this, even though i havent played for 6 months :(
 
My guild downed Rag tonight! Pretty psyched. We wiped at 1% on the first try, and got him the second try. It went really smoothly the second time so I think we're getting it. Hopefully we'll be doing Rag every Friday MC run now :)
 
ToyMachine228 said:
My guild downed Rag tonight! Pretty psyched. We wiped at 1% on the first try, and got him the second try. It went really smoothly the second time so I think we're getting it. Hopefully we'll be doing Rag every Friday MC run now :)
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Once you down Rag once, unless there's a huge guild fallout, ther'es no reason you shouldn't be able to down him next time. Incredibly routine fight, once you got it that's all there will ever be.


Unlike......vael.....GRRRRR
 
I love BA, cause I'm most likely going to die anyway during that fight. and it makes me go from sit there, channeling a shadowbolt for 5 seconds, to machine gun firing them and breaking 1k dps (unless I get lots of resists).
 
Well, my guild downed Onyxia for the first time tonight:) Woooo!!!! Got her to 42% first try, 1% second try(argh!!), 39% third, then got her the 4th try. I won the head and got:

Dragonslayer's Signet

Woohoo!!!!

good times!!

But for some reason we did not get the ony buff and the head was not hung in SW. Anyone know why that did not happen? Thanks.
 
darkiguana said:
But for some reason we did not get the ony buff and the head was not hung in SW. Anyone know why that did not happen? Thanks.
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Only get it if there isn't a Onyxia Head already hung up.
 
Ferrio said:
Only get it if there isn't a Onyxia Head already hung up.
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But there was not another Ony head hung up. There was a Nef head, but not Ony. I spoke to a GM about it and he seemed to indicate that the quest did not work properly.
 
Finally we get a good allaince guild we're on Week 3 of running MC and we just downed Golamag. This allaince is going pretty smooth so far no DKP just rand 100 for loot.

The first week we downed lucci after 3 tries and Gar after 2, then came back the next monday and dowed the other guy who looks like lucci. The next week we did fri/sat and downed the first 4 bosses. This week we downed Lucci (no one died) Gar, Lucci 2 electric bogaloo, the rock guy, the fire element guy, Shizza, and Golamag over 3 days. Sulfruisomething was our bump in the road.

Also this week one of the big raiding guilds is going to take the officers in our guild through ZG to Hakkar so we can get an idea what to do.

I'm actually begining to like raiding.

anywho a question to the hunters...whats a good alternitive to the BS set. 1.10 makes the BS set a POS set, and I got 2/8 GS so I'm missung the 60+ ranged ATP if I wear my GS gear. I heard about the DM set and got the chest peice for the tribute run last night, IMO it really kinda sucks compared to the BS chest. less agility, MUCH less stamina and the 1% crit I get anyway from form 6/8 of BS.

and I've heard many many argueements about whats better

2x BSH w/ +15 agil OR the Barbarious Blade w/ +25 agility.

With the 2X BSH (13 Agil ea.& 10 Stam ea) w/15 agil you get 56 agility which IIRC 56 Agility would be...

Roughly 1% crit
+ 112 attack power
+ 8 DPS
+ Armor
+ Dodge %(good for CA and not taking damage when getting range)
+ 100 HP from the total 10 Stamina on each.

The BB (1% crit and 60 ATP) with 25 agility would be...

a little less them 1.5% crit
+ 110 Attack power
+ 7 +/- DS
+ Dodge %
+ Armor
+ 0 HP

So is the .5% crit worth it if you give up 2 ATP, 1 DPs, About half the dodge % and armor bonus you would get from 56 agility and no HP bonus to get the BB?
 
But for some reason we did not get the ony buff and the head was not hung in SW. Anyone know why that did not happen? Thanks.
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Not sure about the head but as for the buff it's wierd I'll be in SW and standing next to someone they'll get the buff anf I won't or visa versa...whats up with that?
 
darkiguana said:
But there was not another Ony head hung up. There was a Nef head, but not Ony. I spoke to a GM about it and he seemed to indicate that the quest did not work properly.
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If the buff has fired within a time limit it won't do it again.
 
Sulfuron Harbinger is easy. You need 5 warriors who can tank Sulfuron and his 4 adds (MT should be on Sulfuron).

Each warrior pulls one of his 4 priests away from each other (at the very least, the first 2 should be off on their own, with the last 2 near each other since there's not enough room to spread all 4 of them out). Raid DPSes priest 1 down, then priest 2, then split 3 and 4 apart and DPS each of them down individually. If you keep them too close they heal each other (and Sulfuron). Sulfuron himself is easy, but he hits hard enough to make it necessary for the MT to tank him the whole fight. Spell interrupts work on the priests as well.
 
epmode said:
No way, BA is fantastic. No durability hit!
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Oh yeah... the instant cast is fun and all, except when you lose all the priests when the first few BA's are cast on them... Then we usually wipe.
 
Finally got my ThunderFury. Thunderaan was soooooooo easy that I didn't even get to snap a picture really. Though We did fight him twice (you can summon until you finish the quest).

The sword so far is OK, I seem to be leading in DPS... but barely. Though I used to lead a lot before, so the change isn't that big which is disappointing. If I had known it would be like this when the bindings dropped 6 months ago, I would of passed... the time money and effort to get it was not worth it for a rogue really.

Here's hoping there was a stealth buff in the patch (they made thunderclap and TF stack again, on purpose... who knows).

thunderfury.jpg

thunderfury2.jpg

thunderfury3.jpg
 
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