Nose Master
Member
Owens match was the only match worth watching. Bleh. Sasha/Charlotte was really bad. Even the "main" bit of the match was awkward butterfingers the entire time, those two have zero chemistry together.
WWE Hell in a Cell |OT| You get a main-event and you get a main-event!
- Thread starter BewareTheBatsie
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sf2fanatic
Member
Did Chris just say "TheHabit from Indiana"?
Yep. I completely agree.
You're right, she doesn't have zero mic skills. I'd say more like less than zero mic skills. I pine for Stephanie McMahon's voice when Charlotte opens her mouth. Her voice and delivery of "yell everything as loud as I can" is absolutely brutal. Rather listen to Braun Strowman talk.
EnlightenedMint
Member
That was a perfect ending from Owens.
serenewarfare
Banned
I take it all back. RAW Talk is alright.
RecRoulette
Member
Had my doubts about Talking Raw but real-ass Booker T showed up to drag Kendrick.
Really glad that Jericho is having one of his best runs in a long time too.
Really glad that Jericho is having one of his best runs in a long time too.
Ryo Hazuki
Member
Oh Raw Talk is just for PPV's. Renee just said they'll be back for Survivor Series.
I think Sasha's main problem is that the frequent major botches are starting to blow up her spot with fans. I hope she turns heel soon but I doubt WWE is going to do that with Charlotte having the belt and Emma about to return.
Fingers crossed that Emmalina is a fakeout and Evil Emma comes back in full force.
I should have noted that I meant "you" in general, as in many posters in this thread. I like Asuka, and I agree she doesn't need great mic skills to get over, I just don't understand the whole, flip flopping on wrestlers based on whether they are faces or heels when, to me, its their ring work that ultimately gets me to pay attention to them. Heels are generally more fun and entertaining, but they need good foils to feud against. Nobody wants asshole good guys like Cena, Reigns and Sheamus (when face). I like Sami, I like Bayley, I enjoy the straight laced good guy, Ricky Steamboat archetype.
True, but Charlotte's had a few in her time as well, some that seemed kinda dangerous.
Spirit of Jazz
Banned
How was the perfect ending for Owens not him looking strong given Seth's bee painted as a chickeshit for his entire life as a main eventer? Surely that's why HHH would want him to be champ over Seth?
ThreePiMatt
Member
The only redemption for Sasha constantly bringing up Eddie Guerrero is if she turns and starts to lie, cheat, and steal.
All and all, I thought that was a decent PPV. Good matches hurt by booking, which is the standard for Raw.
The Raw side really needs a creative shakeup. WWE isn't transparent enough for us to know who is making all the creative decisions, but it's clear whomever is in charge of Smackdown gets in a way their Raw counterpart(s) does not. While SD will need to widen its talent depth soon, right now, it's doing more with less.
Raw has the people fans want to get behind and can put on great matches, but the booking is making so that they have no heat heading into these PPV matches. Which is a shame, because with a few adjustments, Raw could be a stellar show.
Everyone else seems like WWE is taking cues from the current crop of superhero movies where most of the good guys are smarmy assholes
The Raw side really needs a creative shakeup. WWE isn't transparent enough for us to know who is making all the creative decisions, but it's clear whomever is in charge of Smackdown gets in a way their Raw counterpart(s) does not. While SD will need to widen its talent depth soon, right now, it's doing more with less.
Raw has the people fans want to get behind and can put on great matches, but the booking is making so that they have no heat heading into these PPV matches. Which is a shame, because with a few adjustments, Raw could be a stellar show.
I think WWE has forgotten how to book that kind of babyface. The only people with that kind of booking right now are Sami, Bayley, and Heath Slater.
Everyone else seems like WWE is taking cues from the current crop of superhero movies where most of the good guys are smarmy assholes
BewareTheBatsie
Member
If anything this match confirms that WWE don't have any plans in the near-future to turn Sasha heel. This was a babyface solidifying match.
Then why play hot potato with the fuckin title?
He was talking about raw talk i think and Owens hiding the hosts by walking in front of the cam.
About the booking of the title match, i think it was horrible, especially cause the match was about to be good. But when jericho goes in it's just a mess and Rollins surviving and overcoming the odds etc...
I have kinda accepted that hey, this is what they want right now. They want to force Rollins and Reigns as surviving super faces, cause they have nobody to replace Cena. So Owens is used that way.
The bad about it is that i want Owens to have moty contenders, not forgettable shenanigans matchs. When was his last really good single match ? Against Zayn ? That's such a fucking waste..
But hey it's WWE, they still book things like in the 70's. They don't get that Owens and Rollins having a competitive match, back and forth, even with a face/face tweener/tweener dynamic would be way more entertaining.
I think they are just afraid Owens and Rollins are not enough so they put the most Jericho they can into this.
But that's just the dynamic of this weird feud. Things will be better at some point i hope. Actually the best thing that can happen to Owens right now is that Jericho turns on him. He can retire Jericho for example (at least for 6 month) that would be good.
The thing about the HIAC matches is that Sasha looked like the weakest face out there. Reigns won clean. Rollins took a lot of damage and it took 2 guys to take him down. Sasha on the other hand lost clean and at the end there was no question as of who was better. Just looks bad for her in the long run. She keeps having these start and stop title reigns it's reminding me a lot of the Attitude Era.
As for Charlotte, she's reminding me a lot of Reign of Terror HHH always getting that belt put back on her.
As for Charlotte, she's reminding me a lot of Reign of Terror HHH always getting that belt put back on her.
Jericho has hinted that his current run with WWE, which is likely going to end at Mania, might be his last major run. WWE has relied on him in this time of transition, using him to build up the mid-card now that guys like Cena, Batista, Angle, Lesnar, Orton, Punk, etc are out the door or on their way out. He's worked closely with Vince on a lot of stuff this year (like helping get Styles over with Vince) and has proven his value. I think they're doing this as kind of a big send-off for Jericho.
And if anything, this gives them the opportunity to actually turn Rollins full face. Even though the Shield guys are top tier, I think they still need a little bit of cooking before they can carry the main event scene on their own through 2017. I'm just looking at this as Jericho getting Owens, Rollins, and the rest of the upper mid-card ready for the future while being damn entertaining at it.
Or you're just killing time waiting for Balor to heal up and come back as a heel vs Rollins as a face. There's what, still several PPVs before the Rumble?
Charlotte isn't burying people that brutally.
Don't let the stupid.booking of heels in WWE make it seem like the match in isolation makes Sasha look weak. It's fucking stupid that Seth doesn't need anyone now he has the power of the WWE universe and Owens needs people to beat him down. Every heel in the Raw title picture always does this and it's the same old shit.
The problem with the women on Raw is that there aren't many of them. They feel INSANELY over-exposed right now. It's the same shit week after week. Nia's basically disappeared as well.
For the Shield, Reigns needs a new look. He's overprotected to the point of insanity, and because of that, the crowd HATES him. Rollins and Ambrose are just floundering where they are right now.
For the mid-card, you have The New Day who are killing the Tag division, a broken G&A, the up-and-coming Enzo-and-Cass who, while great together, higher-ups want to split apart.
Jericho needs to put someone over HUGE at Mania, and it better not be Roman.
Women's match deserved better. Your champ gets slammed through a table and we spend 5 minutes of a ref shielding her like a wounded deer, her crying as she's raised on the stretcher, only to forget about that excruciating pain through the power of her warrior spirit to run in the cage and cast aside that metric ton of selling. The idea of a ref shielding a champion from more pain while still technically allowing her to be in the match is the height of idiocy. That and nearly every spot had the ref run in check on them like they're frail creatures. Great work, but a painfully flawed match. Bummer.
Autumn Wind
Member
I hated the way they worked the match. It should have been a standard HIAC match the same way good HIAC matches with two male competitors have been done. Of course this is WWE and also I was just waiting for Last Week Tonight which as usual didn't disappoint me.
excelsiorlef
Member
?
She did an adrenaline spot and then immediately got her back jacked by Charlotte to send her back to earth, Sasha sold that back injury far far more than just about anyone has in recent WWE. Literally her back being fucked was like the story of the match...
Also the match hadn't even started so the ref being a bit more cautious made sense, not to mention last month we literally had refs stop Cesaro and Sheamus from continuing, literally piles of refs and doctors came out in the name of protecting Sheamus and Cesaro's safety. Once the match got started the ref was a non factor.
This was literally a standard HIAC match....
Stallion Dan
Member
Anyone get thrown off/through a cell? Is the only reason I see to do a HIAC instead of just a cage match.
Don't say who, just yes/no.
Don't say who, just yes/no.
Ninja Scooter
Member
Yes and it was Buff Bagwell
Stallion Dan
Member
WWE needs wrestlers with names like this again.
An adrenaline spot that was cheesy and transparent as fuck. I have no issue with her selling her back throughout the match, but being in such agony that she's crying on a stretcher and then magically getting some strength to run back in there was patently silly. Just look at the match that this was aping, Mick doesn't run back in like the Ultimate Warrior, he still sells it. You dig that spot, which is fine, but its corny WWE storytelling at its height. And I wouldn't even use the Cesaro/Sheamus buffoonery to justify the way they treated her.
excelsiorlef
Member
Umm Mick Foley climbed a giant cage with ease as his big return to action, Sasha hit like 2.5 movies and then her back gave out. Both did adrenaline things before dying again.
My point about Cesar/Sheamus was that WWE officials try and stop wrestler from competing whilst hurt is a staple match angle.
I mean shit they did in with KOTR 98 HIAC too.
sf2fanatic
Member
I laughed on how Rusev and Reign gave no fcks about the crowd's demand for tables. They were like "meh, we cool with the steps and chain"
No. No one went onto the roofs either, and only one of the matches had much going on outside the cage. Opinions, slight spoilers:
Reigns/Rusev didn't even need to be a HIAC match and Owens/Rollins had a minor gimmick that could only really work due to the setup of the match but it was more of a coward heel thing than an "extreme wrestling" sort of deal. I think Charlottte/Sasha was a good match that took fairly decent advantage of the HIAC format and was probably as far as WWE is willing to go with a women's match in the PG era, but it's also definitely not a HIAC greatest hit.
The Silver
Member
They were probably told they couldn't use them since the other two matches would have table spots.
sf2fanatic
Member
They should of used them instead of saving them for the Women's match.
Biggest-Geek-Ever
Member
I actually think the ending of the women's match could have worked if Charlotte just threw her into the table like, six or seven times (or until the fucking thing finally broke). Could have potentially looked really violent and awesome if she just ragdolled her for a good minute.
BewareTheBatsie
Member
The table definitely was meant to break. They had to work out something to do so in came the Natural Selection.
Sasha set the table up really badly. I dunno if she was told to do that or just went with it like that, but she should have pulled the table legs back in and just set the flat slab of the table up against the turnbuckle. Then you can do anything, even have Charlotte spear her through it.
I agree on all points with the women's division.
I think the much-talked about Roman heel-turn and Rollins face-turn could do wonders. I don't know what to do with Ambrose though. AJ Styles can only get so much blood from the stone with Wacky-Pak Dean.
I think the tag division can be salvaged after Christmas when WWE gets their holiday sales of New Day merch and Demolition's record is broken. G&A could be on the upswing if they team them with a returning Finn Balor.
Whoever Jericho works with, they'll be set. He did wonders for establishing Styles. I'd love to see him work with Zayn to kind of reset him.
excelsiorlef
Member
BTW for all the supposed Ultimate Warrior no selling Sasha did at the start I just watched the tape....
Banks falls off the stretcher and has to pull herself up by the cell, she punches a ref and stumbles into the cell holding her back and demanding the ref start the match. Bell rings and Banks pulls Charlotte out of ring and throw hers against cell after which Banks collapses against the cell using it to keep herself upright, grabbing her back the whole time. Banks then stalks Charlotte back into the ring hunched over limping the whole time. Mount punches for 10 seconds, Charlotte escapes out of ring and Sasha follows gingerly holding her back, two chops with some taunting in between from Banks, always with one hand on her back for support, yes even her fired up taunts included her selling her back, and then bam Charlotte pulls her face first hard into the post which Banks sells like a boss and we get the sick monkey flip into the cell crumpling sell from Banks and Charlotte takes control.
Total time from Sasha getting off the stretcher to getting her bell rung against the post? 90 seconds....
Banks falls off the stretcher and has to pull herself up by the cell, she punches a ref and stumbles into the cell holding her back and demanding the ref start the match. Bell rings and Banks pulls Charlotte out of ring and throw hers against cell after which Banks collapses against the cell using it to keep herself upright, grabbing her back the whole time. Banks then stalks Charlotte back into the ring hunched over limping the whole time. Mount punches for 10 seconds, Charlotte escapes out of ring and Sasha follows gingerly holding her back, two chops with some taunting in between from Banks, always with one hand on her back for support, yes even her fired up taunts included her selling her back, and then bam Charlotte pulls her face first hard into the post which Banks sells like a boss and we get the sick monkey flip into the cell crumpling sell from Banks and Charlotte takes control.
Total time from Sasha getting off the stretcher to getting her bell rung against the post? 90 seconds....
I think Styles established himself by beating John Cena. Jericho did nothing for Styles. It went by way too fast and did nothing but deny Styles his first Mania win.
Jericho is gonna have to lose to Owens to establish/boost him up again.
PHOENIXZERO
Member
Yeah that was pretty meh... I would love to be a fly on the wall with whoever came up with that match layout for Sasha and Charlotte and thought it was good.
Raging Spaniard
If they are Dutch, upright and breathing they are more racist than your favorite player
Such a great main event that turned to shit just because of booking. I dont even mind the tables not breaking, shit happens, but if they didnt know that ending would land super flat then I dont know what the fuck theyre thinking.
aGuyInaBearSuit
Member
I'm sure it's been complained about ITT already but I'll just pile on:
Charlotte is a good worker but after a year of her dominating the title picture I'm burned out and totally bored with her. She lands in the same territory as New Day, a territory I have lovingly named "Oh. This again."
But then I look at the rest of the women's title picture on Raw and the only actual contenders on the whole show are Charlotte, Sasha and Bayley. So I guess Charlotte and Sasha just trade the belt back and forth endlessly until they inevitably inject Bayley into the situation?
Some aspects of this brand split seem poorly thought out.
Charlotte is a good worker but after a year of her dominating the title picture I'm burned out and totally bored with her. She lands in the same territory as New Day, a territory I have lovingly named "Oh. This again."
But then I look at the rest of the women's title picture on Raw and the only actual contenders on the whole show are Charlotte, Sasha and Bayley. So I guess Charlotte and Sasha just trade the belt back and forth endlessly until they inevitably inject Bayley into the situation?
Some aspects of this brand split seem poorly thought out.
excelsiorlef
Member
I do agree that both the Cruiserweight and Women's divisions should be on both shows. We'd get a larger roster with the same number of matches...
I think Jericho did Styles a huge favor in helping him become established in the WWE in just two months. He put him on the fast track to the upper-mid card which allowed him to then step into the feud with Roman and then Cena. If AJ went any other route, he might be in the same position as A&G or Sami Zayn.
I think we're going to see Charlotte vs Bayley or Charlotte vs. Nia start tomorrow while Sasha feuds with Emma or gets hurt again.
His Latino heat was set to muy caliente.
aGuyInaBearSuit
Member
Yeah, the Cruiserweight division seems to be introducing too many new people at once. Even Perkins feels underdeveloped as a character. Kendrick and Swann are the only two who have shown any real personality thus far. Spreading it between shows could help alleviate that.
Savio noooooooo
Discotheque
Banned
Seth and Sashas dives in this ppv really put ambroses wacky clothesline to shame
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Women's match was quite good. I don't know what you guys were watching to complain about it.
The transition from stretcher spot to bell was sloppy and cornball as fuck and the table botches killed the match. It started great outside of the cage and some of the chair spots were good though.
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