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[scsa]

Jeff, still waiting for the hyperbole revamped ps3's with HDMI pass through and 360 with similar capability that you spent years arguing.

(Can't seem to remember the actual stuff you predicted or were constantly enlightening people about, but I guess it was on similar lines as above).

 

[daveo42]

I agree that the home console will eventually die, but for that to happen, you would need some sort of living room replacement that is easy to set up and use out of the box without needing to delve into forums to figure out why something might not work or need to look at your spec sheet to see if your system can run a game and at what settings. It also needs to be relatively cheap for users.

Gaming PCs in the living room are fantastic, but the average joe isn't going to do much other than boot it up, run some mandatory update and play their game. Much work beyond that and the system gets returned. Hell, look at all the posters here who get upset over updates and install times on consoles and that will give you an idea how much less patience the general populace will have when it comes to these kind of issues.

 

[Tagyhag]

Plug and play consoles are dead and will never come back.

Consoles as they are now have at least one more gen until at least one goes through a radical change.

 

[rrvv]

Does your PC meet the minimum specs as outlined by the dev? If yes, then you can play it. If not, you're taking a gamble, but at least you have the option. And looking at specs is no different than making sure you buy the PS4 version over the Xbox One version.

The thing is not everyone know their pc spec. Most people usually own off-shelf pc or laptop. They may recognise ram and hhd size but the graphics card maybe be bit iffy. Not every game run perfectly on integrated graphic.

Also usually is not just the spec. AMD vs NVIDIA problem. The OS ( once I have friends complaining why pc game that he but cannot run on Mac.), driver etc etc.

Not every one is tech savvy as we do

 

[FLAguy954]

I can't believe people are quoting this like it's at all true.

Nice edit, I can't believe people are quoting his post like it's the gospel, especially since the current gen consoles have some of the same (and some unique) problems as PCs.

 

[Altered Juice]

hope not! i don't want it to be a pain in the ass for me whenever there is a technical issue that no one else has.

"i have a problem with *insert game here* can somebody help me?"

"did you go into the game folder and try this?"

"ya"

"did you go into game settings and try that?"

"ya"

"try rebooting the computer."

"still bad"

"ok now try deleting system 32"

 

[bomblord1]

Does your PC meet the minimum specs as outlined by the dev? If yes, then you can play it. If not, you're taking a gamble, but at least you have the option. And looking at specs is no different than making sure you buy the PS4 version over the Xbox One version.

Uhh, knowing your cpu, GPU, and ram and how your CPUs and GPU's fits into a heirarchy of hundreds of cpus is way different than checking if there is a PS4 or Xbox one logo on the box.

An average consume has no way of knowing if their Pentium e5800 is more or less powerful than the i5 3470 listed as minimum by the dev.

 

[A_Gorilla]

How is this thread still open?

 

[Wyndstryker]

Consoles will be fine.

Only reason things may feel weird is because PC's are a viable alternative again as it has it's own market segment that consoles don't have. (f2p/moba/rts/indie/etc)

Just play on what machine you like and just leave it at that.

 

[digita1alchemy]

You can't have a legitimate conversation about the future of game consoles and not even mention Nintendo, irregardless of the sales performance of the Wii U. But then the value of their home consoles have almost always transcended hard system specs, which is almost your entire argument.

 

[Kaydan]

I strongly believe gaming consoles won't disappear, but I also believe they will more and more look like PCs. I wouldn't be surprised if the next microsoft console actually fully runs on windows.

 

[Blarg]

The OP actually thinks the average couch gamer is going to switch to a gaming PC powered by Linux instead of their PS4?

 

[Seanspeed]

come on man

don't think there is a single person in here who doesn't know what he means by console.

Is this a game console?

 

[Nzyme32]

Yep I'm totally sure my neighbor that can barely browse to google is going to setup a linux/BSD box to start playing his Sony games.

As much as the PC master race wants them to, consoles aren't going anywhere anytime soon.

As usual, "PC Master Race" specifically used as a derogartory and in defence of something something something Sony / MS / Console. Makes me want to yawn every time.

Also, plenty of OS are based on Linux and worked pretty fantastically, Android and Ubuntu being two of the most popular and very easy to use even for an older generation of folk

Is this a game console?

My answer is, yes, it is by most definitions so why not. It is also a PC, and I'd personally just call it a PC through force of habit.

 

[Bjomesphat]

Uhh, knowing your cpu, GPU, and ram and how your CPUs and GPU's fits into a heirarchy of hundreds of cpus is way different than checking if there is a PS4 or Xbox one logo on the box.

An average consume has no way of knowing if their Pentium e5800 is more or less powerful than the i5 3470 listed as minimum by the dev.

But the average consumer isn't using their average desktop for gaming. If you're a gamer and you either built a gaming PC or bought a pre-built one, the hierarchy of parts should be pretty evident as configurations for gaming PCs are homogeneous.

 

[Tigress]

So buy a pre-built machine and do just that.

Can I go buy a game that says, "This game is for the pre-built machine that you just bought and will work as advertised or at least as reviewers saw it on that machine" with a pre built machine (and I mean the game specifically says, "Brand pre built machine" will play this not just machine with these specs)? Can I not worry for years that the specs on my pre built machine will play the games and that developers will consider my machine and try to optomize for it rather than just think I'll just upgrade if I need to?

No?

Ok then (and I did address this in my first post, I didn't just say go buy a pre built machine but one that had those qualifications).

My point is that consoles make it very easy to just pick up a game and play and not worry if you have the right specs for it or if you need to upgrade. They are for the lazy and/or computer illiterate who don't want to have to worry that the game might not run as well or at all on their machine. WOrse comes to worse, a reviewer reviewing a copy of the game on a console will have used your console's version and you can see if ti actually runs as well as claimed.

(and btw, a console is a pre built machine that does address the issues I talk about ).

Anyone who doesn't consider that factor when saying PCs will overtake consoles aren't really considering the true factors as to why consoles exist.

 

[Zelenogorsk]

As long as there are great exclusive games on consoles I'll keep buying them.

 

[Seanspeed]

As long as there are great exclusive games on consoles I'll keep buying them.

And that's the main idea. Keep games behind walled gardens so that customers are locked into your ecosystem.

 

[Coolwhip]

When I buy a PC game I have to go through this:

1. Will it run on my hardware?

2. Check what 3rd party DRM/activation limits it has, if any.

3. Research into the quality of the port.

4. Decide which service to buy from. GOG, Steam, Uplay, Origin, and so on.

5. Research into any known bugs and workarounds.

6. Can I use a 360 pad?

7. Is the text/UI too small for TV gaming?

8. Buy and Downlaod (On my connection, takes up to two days)

9. Find out that it doesn't boot up, despite meeting specs.


When I buy a console game:

1. Decide if I like the look of it.

2. Buy it.

3. Play it.


Disclaimer: This is just my personal experience.

You forgot a few steps for buying a console game though:

3. Install it

4. Buy DLC

5. Download patch

6. Download another patch

 

[Ivory Samoan]

To be honest, I'm not really sure what OP is trying to say... gaming consoles were supposed to be dead a few years ago I thought, and PC was dead in the water around 2000 wasn't it?

...and then it all happens again, which I'm glad about - I'm pretty sure PS4/Xbox One have a healthy life ahead of them.

...and I'll buy the next gen when that drops too.

 

[Seanspeed]

My answer is, yes, it is by most definitions so why not. It is also a PC, and I'd personally just call it a PC through force of habit.

Well yea, but my point is that there is definitely a lot of blurring the lines and convergence between PC's and consoles nowadays and there's no reason to think that wont continue.

I don't think its going to mean the end of 'traditional' consoles, but it can certainly be enough to challenge this forced perceptual difference between PC's and consoles that so many think is so massive that they aren't even worth comparing(according to many).

 

[Flappy]

You forgot a few steps for buying a console game though:

3. Install it

4. Buy DLC

5. Download patch

6. Download another patch

True. But these are just time consuming and usually fail-safe. The PC steps are more of a minefield.

 

[Flavius]

I don't necessarily agree with all of the evidence presented by the OP, but I absolutely agree that proprietary console hardware as we know it will be no more, going forward.

 

[jeff_rigby]

Jeff, still waiting for the hyperbole revamped ps3's with HDMI pass through and 360 with similar capability that you spent years arguing.

(Can't seem to remember the actual stuff you predicted or were constantly enlightening people about, but I guess it was on similar lines as above).

Game Consoles to replace Cable boxes and the connected home starts in 2014

PS3 Web Browser Discussion - big upgrade rumoured for long time, but no concrete news

For those of you who think the 4K stack (what is used to support 4K video/blu-ray players) is useless to you, this is what Sony is going to do next year with ATSC 2.0 and the hevc (h.265) 4K codec. http://www.atsc.org/cms/pdf/pt2/Naohisa-Kitazato-Next-Generation-Broadcast.pdf It's the Sony Media Fusion proposal listed in the Broadcasters Perspective on ATSC 2.0

Both of the above should be viewed, lots of pictures and fairly easy to follow. This is the end game and the reason for the PS3 having Blu-ray, 1080P support and browser, it's the endgame and only realized in hindsight. Both Microsoft and Sony are preparing to Support this for 2013 so most of this should be in the PS3 and Xbox 360 by the end of the year. Blu-ray only because a blu-ray player has the ATSC 2.0 codec h.264 AVC, 1080P & 3-D support, Java (EU DVB hbbTV Apps standard) and browser for XHTML (US apps standard). In 2001, Blu-ray players were speculated as set top boxes to support ATSC 2.0; this is how long ago this was planned. This is also the reason Sony was in no hurry to port a modern browser (waiting on a standard for ATSC 2.0 to be supported)

The features in this 2010 Sony white paper that was presented to the ATSC committee on what would become Sony Media fusion will be supported by Playstation Vue.

I can only base my speculation on what is on the internet and Microsoft did have a HDMI pass-through but Sony did not.

 

[Duxxy3]

How many generations in a row have we heard this shit?

 

[Bjomesphat]

Can I go buy a game that says, "This game is for the pre-buitl machine that you just bought and will work as advertised or at least as reviewers saw it on that machine" with a pre built machine (and I mean the game specifically says, "Brand pre built machine" not just machine with these specs? Can I not worry for years that the specs on my pre built machine will play the games and that developers will consider my machine and try to optomize for it rather than just think I'll just upgrade if I need to?

No?

Ok then (and I did address this in my first post, I didn't just say go buy a pre built machine but one that had those qualifications).

My point is that consoles make it very easy to just pick up a game and play and not worry if you have the right specs for it or if you need to upgrade. They are for the lazy and/or computer illiterate who don't want to have to worry that the game might not run as well or at all on their machine. WOrse comes to worse, a reviewer reviewing a copy of the game on a console will have used your console's version and you can see if ti actually runs as well as claimed.

Anyone who doesn't consider that factor when saying PCs will overtake consoles aren't really considering the true factors as to why consoles exist.

Of course your qualifications can't be met on PC (because otherwise it would just be a console). But in practice, that pick up and play, no worry experience is exactly the same on PC as on a console.

 

[outunderthestars]

Is this a game console?

I own one, but think of it as a PC. That said, I do think that PC's like the Alpha will eat into the console market Jere and there. I imagine that people who normally buy more than one console platform could choose to add a small form factor PC instead. Me, I'm going to end up being an Alpha, PS4, Vita owner this generation.

 

[ElTopo]

I think the idea of everyone being able to stream games and have the same experience they have now with gaming is incredibly naive. First you have to have the infrastructure to stream and we're talking many millions of people gaming at once. Secondly you have to consider how bad our internet is in America. You really think Joe Sixpack is going to switch over to a streaming system when they can barely watch Netflix at 480P?

Now, the idea of there being a slimmer and scaled down system that can access Netflix and the internet and all that and downloads games that have a comparable quality to today's games is far more likely but we probably won't see that until around 2020 at least.

 

[JordanN]

Sony/MS could make consoles for 50 years if they wanted to.

Having a console means they can do whatever they want. They make games for it, you can't play them on PC. They make money from selling the hardware, games and services on it. There will be peripherals they can sell with them.

 

[Seanspeed]

When I buy a PC game I have to go through this:

1. Will it run on my hardware?

2. Check what 3rd party DRM/activation limits it has, if any.

3. Research into the quality of the port.

4. Decide which service to buy from. GOG, Steam, Uplay, Origin, and so on.

5. Research into any known bugs and workarounds.

6. Can I use a 360 pad?

7. Is the text/UI too small for TV gaming?

8. Buy and Downlaod (On my connection, takes up to two days)

9. Find out that it doesn't boot up, despite meeting specs.


When I buy a console game:

1. Decide if I like the look of it.

2. Buy it.

3. Play it.


Disclaimer: This is just my personal experience.

You exaggerate the extents you go to to play something on PC, yet oversimplify the extents you go to to play on console.

Lets say I agree with your PC list(which I don't completely, but lets roll with it anyways). Now I'm going to make a list for the console side that pulls out every little minor thing too, to make it sound worse than it is. Lets go.

1. Does it run on my hardware? (is it exclusive to another system or not?)

2. Check to see if its a retail release or digital only.

3. Research into quality of performance.

4. Decide which store to buy it from.

5. Does it have microtransactions or not?

6. Is the resolution high enough?

7. Research into any known bugs and workarounds(oh wait, you cant do that on console)

8. Get in car.

9. Stop at gas station and spend $50 to fill up tank.

10. Go into store and find out they don't have game.

 

[Nzyme32]

Well yea, but my point is that there is definitely a lot of blurring the lines and convergence between PC's and consoles nowadays and there's no reason to think that wont continue.

I don't think its going to mean the end of 'traditional' consoles, but it can certainly be enough to challenge this forced perceptual difference between PC's and consoles that so many think is so massive that they aren't even worth comparing(according to many).

Yeah that pretty much echoes what I was saying earlier.

 

[Jinkies]

Marketing, the crux of business, ensures that consoles (in some form) will always be viable.

It is incredibly difficult to market PC gaming, by comparison.

I agree that Web gaming (as a platform, not necessarily in the browser) will become more prominent.

 

[Tigress]

Of course your qualifications can't be met on PC (because otherwise it would just be a console). But in practice, that pick up and play, no worry experience is exactly the same on PC as on a console.

Ok... what?

So what I listed which makes the console so easy to pick up and play is not on PC (and you admit there is a difference cause it would be a console if it was met), and yet... some how PC is the same experience as console? Did I get what you are saying right?

And no, I don't think PC is as easy as pick up and play. Just recently I wanted to play Wasteland 2 on my Mac and to figure out if I could play it I had to ask around cause it didn't list my graphics chip and I don't know enough to know what mine is equivelant to. That right there is exactly why I prefer my console. I can look at a game, it says it plays on PS4, and I know it will. Not have to know the hardware and what is equivelant so that I know what specs meet the requirements.

So, in my recent experience, no, PC games aren't just pick up and play. And that is with a Mac where there is less options than a windows machine so many times they'll just list what macs you can play it on (You have to have this year or newer one or this mac with this processor or newer).

I would rather have just taken a slightly compromised version and not have to sit there and worry on whether I could play it or not or even at what quality it would end up playing at on my computer (like am I going to have it run like crap or will it at least run decently).

 

[martino]

True. But these are just time consuming and usually fail-safe. The PC steps are more of a minefield.

Depend on the service
for example steam you donwload the lastest patched version.
It installs all needed redistribuable.
You launch and play

 

[Hiko]

I don't necessarily agree with all of the evidence presented by the OP, but I absolutely agree that proprietary console hardware as we know it will be no more, going forward.

What's it going to be replaced by?

 

[Seanspeed]

And no, I don't think PC is as easy as pick up and play. Just recently I wanted to play Wasteland 2 on my Mac

I think we found your problem, mate. lol

I agree that consoles and PC aren't the same experience. But the exaggerations as to how difficult playing on PC is should really stop.

 

[outunderthestars]

Ok... what?

So what I listed which makes the console so easy to pick up and play is not on PC (and you admit there is a difference cause it would be a console if it was met), and yet... some how PC is the same experience as console? Did I get what you are saying right?

And no, I don't think PC is as easy as pick up and play. Just recently I wanted to play Wasteland 2 on my Mac and to figure out if I could play it I had to ask around cause it didn't list my graphics chip and I don't know enough to know what mine is equivelant to. That right there is exactly why I prefer my console. I can look at a game, it says it plays on PS4, and I know it will. Not have to know the hardware and what is equivelant so that I know what specs meet the requirements.

So, in my recent experience, no, PC games aren't just pick up and play. And that is with a Mac where there is less options than a windows machine so many times they'll just list what macs you can play it on (You have to have this year or newer one or this mac with this processor or newer).

I would rather have just taken a slightly compromised version and not have to sit there and worry on whether I could play it or not or even at what quality it would end up playing at on my computer (like am I going to have it run like crap or will it at least run decently).

Until November I had never played a PC game. I have hundreds of Steam games now, and only one game has not been pick up and play for me (Fallout 3 needed a GFWL installer that was not explained on the store page). I buy a game, download it, and play. Not really seeing what people think is so hard about that. Sure, I could go in and dick about in settings, but I don't and it hasn't impacted my enjoyment.

 

[tokkun]

come on man

don't think there is a single person in here who doesn't know what he means by console.

Ah, the old obscenity argument. "I can't define it, but I know it when I see it." Is that the type of argument we are having?

Let me ask you, is Ouya a console? AppleTV & FireTV?

 

[Nzyme32]

And no, I don't think PC is as easy as pick up and play. Just recently I wanted to play Wasteland 2 on my Mac and to figure out if I could play it I had to ask around cause it didn't list my graphics chip and I don't know enough to know what mine is equivelant to.

So that is the situation on your Mac then, not your PC. What is your Steam Profile name? Curious to see the games you have and what others you have problems with vs what you don't

 

[Bjomesphat]

Ok... what?

So what I listed which makes the console so easy to pick up and play is not on PC (and you admit there is a difference cause it would be a console if it was met), and yet... some how PC is the same experience as console? Did I get what you are saying right?

And no, I don't think PC is as easy as pick up and play. Just recently I wanted to play Wasteland 2 on my Mac and to figure out if I could play it I had to ask around cause it didn't list my graphics chip and I don't know enough to know what mine is equivelant to. That right there is exactly why I prefer my console. I can look at a game, it says it plays on PS4, and I know it will. Not have to know the hardware and what is equivelant so that I know what specs meet the requirements.

So, in my recent experience, no, PC games aren't just pick up and play. And that is with a Mac where there is less options than a windows machine so many times they'll just list what macs you can play it on (You have to have this year or newer one or this mac with this processor or newer).

I would rather have just taken a slightly compromised version and not have to sit there and worry on whether I could play it or not or even at what quality it would end up playing at on my computer (like am I going to have it run like crap or will it at least run decently).

If you build a PC with the most popular gaming parts and play your games on average to above average settings, you will have the exact pick up and play experience as on a console. Because that's exactly what I do.

For this entire gen if I want to play something I grab my controller to boot up Steam, purchase the game I want to play, and start playing.

 

[BlackBuzzard]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

No.

Try again next generation.

 

[Bjomesphat]

Until November I had never played a PC game. I have hundreds of Steam games now, and only one game has not been pick up and play for me (Fallout 3 needed a GFWL installer that was not explained on the store page). I buy a game, download it, and play. Not really seeing what people think is so hard about that. Sure, I could go in and dick about in settings, but I don't and it hasn't impacted my enjoyment.

And current PC games are completely standardized now, which means a Fallout 3 situation would never happen again. Current gen consoles can't even play Fallout 3 so even being able to play a 2008 game on a 2015 machine is just an added bonus.

 

[Finale Fireworker]

1. People like gaming on their couch on their HDTV. Most people are not going to commit thousands of dollars to an immobile desktop that cannot be comfortably controlled with a mouse and keyboard for non-gaming related tasks. Most people with a budget for a personal computer are budgeting for a laptop, which has function and convenience that a stationary PC rig operated from across the room does not.

2. Let's assume people already have a laptop or a tablet for their basic computing tasks. Then a gaming rig would be a dedicated machine, just like a console.

How are you going to convince the average consumer to develop the knowledge to build, maintain, and upgrade a gaming PC AND spend three or four times the cost of the standard gaming console that requires no knowledge, maintenance, or upgrades?



PC gaming requires a technical fluency the mass market does not have. It's not happening any time soon.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Unless I'm mistaken you're forgetting the two biggest reasons why consoles have been popular: price and uniformity. For $400 I bought a system that will play games that came out last year and will play those coming out 5 years from now, without having to worry about having to upgrade because most games that come out are designed around the specs of the system.

You said it best.

Some of us have bigger priorities in life than spending $$$ for videogame performance.

 

[Nzyme32]

You said it best.

Some of us have bigger priorities in life than spending $$$ for videogame performance.

But we can sure prioritise talking about it a lot haha!

 

[Bjomesphat]

1. People like gaming on their couch on their HDTV. Most people are not going to commit thousands of dollars to an immobile desktop that cannot be comfortably controlled with a mouse and keyboard for non-gaming related tasks. Most people with a budget for a personal computer are budgeting for a laptop, which has function and convenience that a stationary PC rig operated from across the room does not.

2. Let's assume people already have a laptop or a tablet for their basic computing tasks. Then a gaming rig would be a dedicated machine, just like a console.

How are you going to convince the average consumer to develop the knowledge to build, maintain, and upgrade a gaming PC AND spend three or four times the cost of the standard gaming console that requires no knowledge, maintenance, or upgrades?



PC gaming requires a technical fluency the mass market does not have. It's not happening any time soon.

This is me, sitting comfortably on my couch 12 ft away, controlling my computer one handed with a wii remote.

 

[Spineker]

You picked a remarkably weird time to post this, considering the PS4 is on track to becoming the fastest and highest selling console in history. Gaming consoles are far from dead.

 

[outunderthestars]

1. People like gaming on their couch on their HDTV. Most people are not going to commit thousands of dollars to an immobile desktop that cannot be comfortably controlled with a mouse and keyboard for non-gaming related tasks. Most people with a budget for a personal computer are budgeting for a laptop, which has function and convenience that a stationary PC rig operated from across the room does not.

2. Let's assume people already have a laptop or a tablet for their basic computing tasks. Then a gaming rig would be a dedicated machine, just like a console.

How are you going to convince the average consumer to develop the knowledge to build, maintain, and upgrade a gaming PC AND spend three or four times the cost of the standard gaming console that requires no knowledge, maintenance, or upgrades?



PC gaming requires a technical fluency the mass market does not have. It's not happening any time soon.

The technical fluency I needed to get into PC gaming was to hit a single button on Amazon and then poof! I had a living room ga!ing PC that is smaller and more powerful than an Xbox One, that came with $100+ in free games, free online, and an absurdly large catalog of games that I could play on day one.

Not sure where this 3-4 times the cost bullshit comes from. You could buy an Alpha last week for $500.

 

[Dirtyshubb]

You forgot a few steps for buying a console game though:

3. Install it

4. Buy DLC

5. Download patch

6. Download another patch

To be fair, those things are either much simpler on console or not mandatory to play the base game (Downloading DLC)

For people who actually know about file directories etc on a PC they should be fine to get a game running for the most part but many people don’t ever deal with that stuff on PC and so even though it’s a simple task for some it becomes much more complicated and a hassle. Im no computer expert but amongst my family I am the go to PC guy and yet I can’t stand the extra hurdles there are when it comes to PC gaming, imagine what its like for someone who just browses the internet on their computer!

 

[TheHall]

This is me, sitting comfortably on my couch 12 ft away, controlling my computer one handed with a wii remote.

Hey can you give my mom a call and explain to her how to make a Wii Remote compatible with her laptop?