So Hufflepuff is CLEARLY the best house...

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Tbe whole idea of houses messes up peoples lives. It's self fulfilling prophecy bullshit. You're in Slytherin! Guess you're gonna be evil. If you tell someone they're going to grow up to be evil then that's exactly what they'll be. Students aren't given a chance to form their own identity. They're straight out told on the first day what they're going to become when they grow up. You're in Griffindor. Congratulations on the success good guy! Nobody gives a shit about you Hufflepuff guy. You're already a failure. Maybe Hufflepuff students could be more successful if they weren't already essentially told that they didn't matter.
 
Yeah, and it's pretty bullshit. The other schools don't do that too or at least never make a big deal about the house.

Also it's telling that most of the misfortunes in the story can be blamed at the school as well.
 
It's really a shame that all the best Dursley house openings to the books were either cut out completely or shortened significantly. I really would have liked to see the Weasley's come and pick Harry up via the closed off fireplace in Goblet of Fire (The film cuts immediately to Harry at the Burrow.) or Harry lying under the window waiting for something to happen and being after saving Diddykins getting pissed off and threatening to leave only to be told to stay and Aunt Petunia gets that howler about her promise from Order of the Phoenix (It just starts with Harry at the playground and Dudley and his gang come to him.) or Dumbledore coming to pick up Harry in Half-Blood Prince. (Which was completely replaced with Harry at the restaurant for some reason.)

More Dursley's is all I really wanted I guess I'm saying.
 
The final book didn't really treat them properly though, was kinda hoping we'd get a nice goodbye but instead it's just Dudley giving a handshake.

But what's more sore is that they cut out from a movie a movie-exclusive scene where Harry and Petunia talked for a moment. It was a nice character build for Petunia ("You didn't only lose a mother in Godric's Hollow you know.") but was removed for some odd reason.
 
I like to think Hogwarts goes through really long periods.

The Harry Potter period has brave Gryffindors and dastardly Slytherins, but at one time it could've been different. Say, hundreds and hundreds of years ago?

Devilishly brilliant Slytherins stealthily saving the world with world class potions and genie-level deals with goblins, whilst boneheaded elitist show-offy Gryffindors try to stop them.

It could happen.

Maybe even Hufflepuff once had its day.

Maybe Ravenclaw will one day be the only bastion of sanity and reason, and will have to save Hogwarts, and the world, from its own stupidity!

So you can't get rid of even one house, because when its time comes, you'll be thanking the stars for it.

It's possible, I mean this is a simpler example but back in primary school one house was notorious for winning the football competition every year, I know that changed later after I left. Having said that the Hogwarts world seems pretty set on the type of people that get placed house to house, I'd like to think after the events of the battle of hogwarts they'd switch it up and randomize it more - stop putting such like minded people together.

Slytherins are just cartoonishly bad. When I was reading Deathly Hallows and I saw the Slytherins bail out, I was so angry at Rowling. They should have fought for the school, I have no idea why she decided to write it like that.

Yeah they could have had some redemption here, but nooo they have to be the absolute chaotic evil.

It's really a shame that all the best Dursley house openings to the books were either cut out completely or shortened significantly. I really would have liked to see the Weasley's come and pick Harry up via the closed off fireplace in Goblet of Fire (The film cuts immediately to Harry at the Burrow.) or Harry lying under the window waiting for something to happen and being after saving Diddykins getting pissed off and threatening to leave only to be told to stay and Aunt Petunia gets that howler about her promise from Order of the Phoenix (It just starts with Harry at the playground and Dudley and his gang come to him.) or Dumbledore coming to pick up Harry in Half-Blood Prince. (Which was completely replaced with Harry at the restaurant for some reason.)

More Dursley's is all I really wanted I guess I'm saying.

In the books they at least had a better send off than in the movies, the Dursleys were nowhere near present enough in the movies.
 
The final book didn't really treat them properly though, was kinda hoping we'd get a nice goodbye but instead it's just Dudley giving a handshake.

But what's more sore is that they cut out from a movie a movie-exclusive scene where Harry and Petunia talked for a moment. It was a nice character build for Petunia ("You didn't only lose a mother in Godric's Hollow you know.") but was removed for some odd reason.

*checks*

Wow this is different.

[Deleted scene; Harry finds Aunt Petunia standing alone in the empty living room]

Petunia Dursley: I have lived in this house for twenty years, and now in a single night, I'm expected to leave.

Harry Potter: They'll torture you. If they think for a moment you know where I'm going, they'll stop at nothing.

Petunia Dursley: [pause] You think I don't know what they're capable of? You didn't just lose a mother that night in Godric's Hollow, you know. I lost a sister.

Petunia Dursley: [leaves]


ahhaha

Harry Potter: [about Ron, after he returns] You're not still mad at him, are you?

Hermione Granger: I'm always mad at him.

tumblr_n9mzjsfaun1tc7d3jo1_500.gif
 
The best house in Hogwarts is the one least recognised for its services. House Elf. Its members slave away tirelessly and thanklessly for the good of everyone
 
The final book didn't really treat them properly though, was kinda hoping we'd get a nice goodbye but instead it's just Dudley giving a handshake.

But what's more sore is that they cut out from a movie a movie-exclusive scene where Harry and Petunia talked for a moment. It was a nice character build for Petunia ("You didn't only lose a mother in Godric's Hollow you know.") but was removed for some odd reason.


I think Rowling might have requested that cut. I remember an interview with her talking about that scene in the book and how she felt that Petunia thought about saying something, but that she hated her sister so much that she couldn't bring herself to say anything.
 
The final book didn't really treat them properly though, was kinda hoping we'd get a nice goodbye but instead it's just Dudley giving a handshake.

Why on earth would they get a nice goodbye? Vernon and Petunia are set in their ways - they hate Harry until the very end. They're the evil stepmother, beating Cinderella for no good reason. They're lucky they weren't killed for the Happy Ever After.
 
I always figured he lost his touch with Lily after the whole incident when they were at school. I forgot which, but I think something happened that made Lily think of him less.

I always thought the hat could be wrong though, since sometimes he pressures students, sometimes he doesn't. And I always figured Snape kept his heritage to himself since he made sure the HBP's identity wasn't connected to him (until Harry tried to force it out by using his spell).

He lost touch with her because he was a dick
 
Any chance you could dig up that analysis again? Seems like a cool read.

Sure thing! Here it is:
http://pottermoreanalysis.tumblr.com/post/29570824705/the-traits-of-the-four-houses-by-request
I found it very interesting, although of course it's up to the individual how much weight they put in this analysis. Unfortunately Slytherin is rather overlooked even by the quiz, according to the author.

Edit: so that analysis is quite old...I don't know if the Pottermore questions are updated or not, so this may not apply to new members quite so much. Still interesting though.
 
Slytherins are just cartoonishly bad. When I was reading Deathly Hallows and I saw the Slytherins bail out, I was so angry at Rowling. They should have fought for the school, I have no idea why she decided to write it like that.

You'd think that there would be at least one Slytherin that would recognize the shortest path to their dreams of status and self-preservation would be straight through Voldemort's dead body.

*checks*

Wow this is different.

Well now I feel a bit robbed that this wasn't in the movie.
 
Slytherins are just cartoonishly bad. When I was reading Deathly Hallows and I saw the Slytherins bail out, I was so angry at Rowling. They should have fought for the school, I have no idea why she decided to write it like that.

Yup. If she decides to revisit the universe post Harry Potter events (I think she may in the far future) I would like to see Slytherins portrayed as ambitious and maybe manipulative for the greater good but not all of them should be sneering villains.

Heck, a Slytherin protagonist would be cool as hell.
 
Yup. If she decides to revisit the universe post Harry Potter (I think she may in the far future) I would like to see Slytherins portrayed as ambitious and maybe manipulative but not all of them should be sneering villains.

Heck, a Slytherin protagonist would be cool as hell.

I would rather have a Gryffindor villain, but one who still embodies all the traits of the house, unlike Wormtail.
 
Yup. If she decides to revisit the universe post Harry Potter events (I think she may in the far future) I would like to see Slytherins portrayed as ambitious and maybe manipulative but not all of them should be sneering villains.

Heck, a Slytherin protagonist would be cool as hell.
Very cool idea! Maybe even one of Harry's descendents or at least someone that is traditionally Gryffinor, the thing Ron feared. Just imagine the pressure of someone whose family is traditionally a house and he or she gets into another. And then that hosue is Slytherin. Would make good stories about predjustice.
 
Yup. If she decides to revisit the universe post Harry Potter events (I think she may in the far future) I would like to see Slytherins portrayed as ambitious and maybe manipulative for the greater good but not all of them should be sneering villains.

Heck, a Slytherin protagonist would be cool as hell.

Have you ever read any of the Johannes Cabal stories by Jonathan Howard? Johannes is exactly what I'd imagine a Slytherin protagonist to be like.
 
That would be cool too! It certainly would flip everyone on their heads to have a mastermind villain come out of Gryffindor.

Zod and Lobo are the two styles I imagine Gryffindor villains coming in.

Captain Cold is a Hufflepuff villain if ever there was one.

Artemis Fowl is a Slytherin hero.
 
The final book didn't really treat them properly though, was kinda hoping we'd get a nice goodbye but instead it's just Dudley giving a handshake.

Maybe i read to much into it, but i always felt the moment where Harry and Dudley say their good byes felt like it was more charged than just a handshake, i felt there was the clear implication that Dudley finally accepted him like a true cousin and made peace with Harry after being an asshole all those years.

The little doodle the version of the book i read had helped too.
 
You'd think that there would be at least one Slytherin that would recognize the shortest path to their dreams of status and self-preservation would be straight through Voldemort's dead body.

AFAIK, they basically said that Dark Wizards (not Slytherin per-se) want to run amok and attack the Muggles and Mudbloods and maybe get into fights with the purebloods who defend them (if they really have to), but they don't want to stick their necks out (an influence of Slytherin), so when a Dark Lord emerges, they fall in line and follow the leader.

But the Dark Lord is not only at the top of the do-gooders' hit list, they're also the target of any Dark Wizard who thinks they could be the Dark Lord.

When Voldemort was first destroyed in an attempt to kill Harry, the Dark Wizards steered clear of The Boy Who Lived for a few years, because they were terrified of/in love with Voldemort, and they feared/hoped that Harry Potter was a Dark Lord of the caliber that could smack down a half-blood scrub like Voldemort, while only just a baby. When Voldemort returned and tried to resume his war, he found that his Death Eaters were hesitant to move, because they wanted to wait for the results of Harry vs Voldemort before committing to one side or the other.

No Dark Wizards stepped up to stop Voldemort, because no Dark Wizards currently wanted the job, and the seat was empty when Voldemort claimed it.

If Harry had sorted into Slytherin, he probably would've been the Dark Wizard who took the title of Dark Lord away from Voldemort by killing him.
 
Maybe i read to much into it, but i always felt the moment where Harry and Dudley say their good byes felt like it was more charged than just a handshake, i felt there was the clear implication that Dudley finally accepted him like a true cousin and made peace with Harry after being an asshole all those years.

The little doodle the version of the book i read had helped too.

No, you were right! I read all the books again very recently and it's clear that Dudley respects Harry (although I forget the exact words, he says something to or about Harry that makes this clear). I think he started to realise after Harry had saved his life that he was a decent person, and with Dudley being young he has more potential to let go of his prejudice than his parents do. All in all, I really liked the fact that we would have a section with the Dursleys at the start of each book to keep the world of Harry Potter grounded; I liked the "muggle perspective" and thought there was a lot of potential for the Dursleys' character growth that unfortunately wasn't put to good use in the films.
 
Yup. If she decides to revisit the universe post Harry Potter events (I think she may in the far future) I would like to see Slytherins portrayed as ambitious and maybe manipulative for the greater good but not all of them should be sneering villains.

Heck, a Slytherin protagonist would be cool as hell.

IIRC, Rowling had several scenes planned out with a Slytherin boy who was on par with Draco in terms of upbringing and family name, but not a complete shit head.

Basically one of the biggest issues with Slytherin in the books is that we see them through the vein of Draco, Crab, Goyle and Pansy Parkinson; a bunch of degenerate shit bags of kids who are some of the main 'school-yard' antagonists of the series. Not every Slytherin is outright evil, or at least, not supposed to be. They're ambitious, they're power hungry, and above almost all, they're self serving.


Which going back to the TMNT is why you would switch Leo and Raph. Leo wants to be a leader, and sure he wants to prove himself, but in the end the biggest thing that would keep Leo out of Slytherin is that he is selfless, while Raphael is more selfish.
 
AFAIK, they basically said that Dark Wizards (not Slytherin per-se) want to run amok and attack the Muggles and Mudbloods and maybe get into fights with the purebloods who defend them (if they really have to), but they don't want to stick their necks out (an influence of Slytherin), so when a Dark Lord emerges, they fall in line and follow the leader.

[more insightful words about Dark Wizards]

But as interesting/correct as a lot of this post was it doesn't answer my question of why there were no Slytherins in school who saw a chance for power in being a part of Voldemort's downfall. I get that the forces at Hogwarts were basically the resistance but I didn't think Slytherins were about the status quo so much as favorable environments. So Voldy in charge helped the kids who wanted to be on the Dark Wizard path but that goes back to the problem of ALL the kids being like that without much justification. There wasn't one kid that was even a glimmer like Slughorn and thought they'd benefit more from the luxuries of a freer society?

"He's been stopped once so why not twice? Harry's an arrogant punk but if he wins this he's going to be popular beyond anyone else in the wizarding world. The Ministry's going to need a lot of new blood if Voldemort falls, and if I make a stand now and do well on my exams at the end of the year I'd be a shoo-in..."

It doesn't feel like it would have been difficult at all to slap in a character that thought like that.

It's funny though. As much as I get frustrated and pick at things like this I still really like the books and the setting they created.

edit:

Which going back to the TMNT is why you would switch Leo and Raph. Leo wants to be a leader, and sure he wants to prove himself, but in the end the biggest thing that would keep Leo out of Slytherin is that he is selfless, while Raphael is more selfish.

Nothing's stopping a Slytherin from being selfless. But they would do it only for the sake of their specific group or their loved ones. Narcissa wouldn't (and didn't) hesitate to betray Voldemort for the sake of Draco. She probably wouldn't take that risk for anyone else, though, and that's part of the distinction.
 
Nothing's stopping a Slytherin from being selfless. But they would do it only for the sake of their specific group or their loved ones.

But sentence one directly contradicts sentence two. If they would do it for only the sake of people important to them, then they are incapable of selfless acts.

They are still capable of sacrifice though, which I think is what you're trying to get at.
 
But sentence one directly contradicts sentence two. If they would do it for only the sake of people important to them, then they are incapable of selfless acts.

They are still capable of sacrifice though, which I think is what you're trying to get at.
If you could choose to have either your kin or a whole city die, a Slytherin would generally without hesitation choose their own blood, while member of other houses would be a lot more reluctant and independently to what conclusion they may come at the end, not just throw a whole city under the bus. Is what I think.
 
But sentence one directly contradicts sentence two. If they would do it for only the sake of people important to them, then they are incapable of selfless acts.

They are still capable of sacrifice though, which I think is what you're trying to get at.

I don't agree with that view of selflessness. It's not a none/all switch. A selfless act can be directed at one person and not another.
 
No, you were right! I read all the books again very recently and it's clear that Dudley respects Harry (although I forget the exact words, he says something to or about Harry that makes this clear). I think he started to realise after Harry had saved his life that he was a decent person, and with Dudley being young he has more potential to let go of his prejudice than his parents do. All in all, I really liked the fact that we would have a section with the Dursleys at the start of each book to keep the world of Harry Potter grounded; I liked the "muggle perspective" and thought there was a lot of potential for the Dursleys' character growth that unfortunately wasn't put to good use in the films.

Didn't the original version of the epilogue feature Dudley and his Muggleborn child, who he presumably accepted, or did I imagine that?

Shame it was cut but the epilogue was crowded enough as it was I guess.
 
Didn't the original version of the epilogue feature Dudley and his Muggleborn child, who he presumably accepted, or did I imagine that?

Shame it was cut but the epilogue was crowded enough as it was I guess.

I think Rowling commented that Harry and Dudly occasionally have family get-togethers. I don't remember anything about him having a magic child though.

From the HP Wiki, based on comments from Rowling.


In Dudley's adult life, he got married and became a father of two. He and Harry remained on "Christmas card terms," and Harry sometimes took his children to Dudley's when they were in the neighbourhood, occasions dreaded by James, Albus and Lily. During these visits Dudley and Harry would sit silently together rarely talking while their children interacted and played together. It is unknown if Dudley ever returned to Little Whinging or if their family had stayed in the place they were relocated to.
 
I know you have a method of madness behind this. Explain please.

1st, I'm talking comic Cold. TV Cold is definitely a Gryffindor as hell.

Captain Cold however is pure practicality and hardwork. He has put together a team that through practice and planning have become the most efficient and effective group of super powered criminals ever assembled. Their ultimate goal? Make some money and go home.

He has rules for the team that include not killing unless they absolutely have to. Not because he has any moral compunction against killimg whatsoever, but because it brings too much heat.

He values the team over any individual member of the team and anyone who steps out of line is dealt with.

Basically he's simultaneously blue collar amd hyper-efficient, which is the distilled essence of Hufflepuff.

More mind-blowing? Batman's Hufflepuff. But I have to wait until I have a keyboard to elaborate on that.
 
lol wow, I thought this was a thread about Jigglypuff's new evolution. Shows what I know about Harry Potter. I leave dissapointed.
 
When Rowling decides it's time for another book set in the Harry Potter universe, I bet we'll see more of the other houses. Maybe the main "gang" will consist of people from different houses this time?
 
Didn't the original version of the epilogue feature Dudley and his Muggleborn child, who he presumably accepted, or did I imagine that?

Shame it was cut but the epilogue was crowded enough as it was I guess.

I heard rumors that this was going to be inserted in the final movie (it doesn't happen in the books) but for whatever reason they didn't do it.
 
I heard rumors that this was going to be inserted in the final movie (it doesn't happen in the books) but for whatever reason they didn't do it.

Rowling probably said no, but I would have liked it. The epilogue is already schmaltzy as hell, going all the way could only have improved it.
 
If there was one thing I thought was a misstep in HP, it was the fact that there were 4 houses but only two of them seemed to matter.
there were many missteps. what a lot of people also don't seem to realize is that (while what you said in essence is true, but) gryffindor is basically a combination of all 3 other houses.
 
But as interesting/correct as a lot of this post was it doesn't answer my question of why there were no Slytherins in school who saw a chance for power in being a part of Voldemort's downfall. I get that the forces at Hogwarts were basically the resistance but I didn't think Slytherins were about the status quo so much as favorable environments. So Voldy in charge helped the kids who wanted to be on the Dark Wizard path but that goes back to the problem of ALL the kids being like that without much justification. There wasn't one kid that was even a glimmer like Slughorn and thought they'd benefit more from the luxuries of a freer society?

"He's been stopped once so why not twice? Harry's an arrogant punk but if he wins this he's going to be popular beyond anyone else in the wizarding world. The Ministry's going to need a lot of new blood if Voldemort falls, and if I make a stand now and do well on my exams at the end of the year I'd be a shoo-in..."

It doesn't feel like it would have been difficult at all to slap in a character that thought like that.

It's funny though. As much as I get frustrated and pick at things like this I still really like the books and the setting they created.

Yeah, it was clearly a missed opportunity to do something interesting with Slytherin at the end of the series.

Slytherin does not equal Dark Wizard. Dark Wizard society exists in the Wizarding World, and is a significant part of the population. They've got areas openly dedicated to them like Nocturne Alley, and good people like Hagrid even shop there (although he warned it's not a place for good kids to hang out).

And Hogwarts/Slytherin House/the Sorting Hat aren't creating these Dark Wizards from nothing or turning good people evil (although they are providing a breeding ground). Snape was raised in a Muggle community and he became a Wizard Supremacist before he ever reached Hogwarts. Dumbledore (a Gryffindor!) was raised in a Wizard community and he was a Wizard Supremacist in his youth, with real plans to invade and conquer the Muggle world "for their own good".

Dark Wizards don't go to Hogwarts to learn the Dark Arts, they get sent there by their parents for the prestige of the green "S". The education they get there is secondary to social networking. Draco had been taught by his parents/private tutors to fly a broom before his first official flying lesson (although Snape joined Slytherin and emerged a Potions Master). Draco bemoaned that he would've preferred to join a real school, one that teaches Dark Arts like Durmstrang, but his parents made him go to Hogwarts, because all the best members of Dark Wizard society take pride in their green "S".

And by being sent to Hogwarts, these kids have a real chance to change their fate, like Sirius Black who got sorted into Grffindor (and disowned by his family as a result), or by simply interacting with a wider variety of people, and learning to lose the hate. Is it truly wise to abolish Slytherin House (if such a thing was even politically possible, seeing how Lucius Malfoy was nearly able to have Dumbledore removed as headmaster, on an ordinary day), when the Dark Wizard society will simply move somewhere else? What would've happened to Sirius Black if he didn't meet James Potter and join Griffyndor, if his parents had signed him up to learn Dark Arts from Durmstrang? On the other hand, was Viktor Krum (the Durmstrang Champion) truly evil?

And Ron once said that all the Dark Wizards come through Slytherin, but Gellert Grindelwald (the big bad before Voldemort) was a Durmstrang washout.

Slytherin clearly doesn't equal Dark Wizard (it's more complicated than that), but the end of the series didn't do that idea any favors. And then Harry just turns around and tells his kid it's okay to become a Slytherin, because Snape was a Slytherin and he was a real stand-up guy. Real bros, those Slytherins. Will only occasionally argue unanimously in favor of handing your head to the Dark Lord on a plate. Two or three times, at most.
 
there were many missteps. what a lot of people also don't seem to realize is that (while what you said in essence is true, but) gryffindor is basically a combination of all 3 other houses.

...So griffyndor was the real "everyone else" house all along.

What a twist!
 
So how did Crabbe and Goyle make it into Slytherin? They have no cunning, they have no wits, they have no ambition.

They wanted it.

I think there's a quote in CoS where Dumbledore says choices trump abilities or w/e. The Sorting Hat clearly puts people mostly where they want to be.
 
So how did Crabbe and Goyle make it into Slytherin? They have no cunning, they have no wits, they have no ambition.

Draco suggested (and I think he was serious) that they couldn't even read.

I'm guessing they insisted, because their parents are Death Eaters, and they know that their lot in life is to be Draco's lackeys, and be therefore protected by Draco. Until one of them (depends on book/movie) gets it in his head to try and overachieve, and nearly burns the school down.
 
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