Tom Brady's Suspension Appeal News

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Dosia said:
Yeah, too bad Kraft was too much of a pussy and caved.
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you're simplifying the issue.

Suing the league would basically make the Krafts the black sheep of the NFL. Robert doesn't want to hand down a damaged family image where you're the most hated team owner. Not to mention suing the league never, ever works out for the team that does the attacking.
 
Troy Vincent comes off looking, unsurprisingly, like an incompetent buffoon and a lackey. Basically responded 'no' for several pages of testimony. My favorite: "I didn't include science, no, sir". I'm sure the stuff about the manual not even being presented to players will be a pretty big part of the case.

teruterubozu said:
The Scarborough, Maine police out here is refusing to protect Goodell's vacation home from harassment. Goodell's been holed up for days.

Why does he vacation in New England? What a moron.
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Lots of beautiful summer spots up here in NE, Scarborough is nice. It's a good thing he's not chilling on the Cape or something though.
 
TheLostBigBoss said:
you're simplifying the issue.

Suing the league would basically make the Krafts the black sheep of the NFL. Robert doesn't want to hand down a damaged family image where you're the most hated team owner. Not to mention suing the league never, ever works out for the team that does the attacking.
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Did the Pats punishment and Brady's come at the same time? Didn't Kraft accept the Pats punishment months ago. I think Kraft thought he was taking the hit and they would fine Brady and let it go. I bet he regrets taking a deal now that there was nothing in it for him.

The NFL is a joke. They had two ways to make their case, either the ballboys spill everything and it is all documented in texts. There are texts but they come off as being jokey about their job and none of them implicate Tom Brady in any way. OR they have irrefutable scientific evidence which doesn't exist because a seen by the Troy Vincent testimony the procedure for inflating and testing the balls was highly unscientific and lacked the rigor and accuracy required to prove the balls were under inflated.
 
Faddy said:
Did the Pats punishment and Brady's come at the same time? Didn't Kraft accept the Pats punishment months ago. I think Kraft thought he was taking the hit and they would fine Brady and let it go. I bet he regrets taking a deal now that there was nothing in it for him.
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That's basically what Kraft said during his recent press conference. He took the hit because Brady did nothing wrong, Goodell didn't give a shit, and so he wishes he didn't roll over.
 
TheLostBigBoss said:
you're simplifying the issue.

Suing the league would basically make the Krafts the black sheep of the NFL. Robert doesn't want to hand down a damaged family image where you're the most hated team owner. Not to mention suing the league never, ever works out for the team that does the attacking.
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Oh please, Al Davis has sued the NFL three times over, it will take a lot of work for Kraft to get into as bad as place as the Davises.
 
Faddy said:
Did the Pats punishment and Brady's come at the same time? Didn't Kraft accept the Pats punishment months ago. I think Kraft thought he was taking the hit and they would fine Brady and let it go. I bet he regrets taking a deal now that there was nothing in it for him.

The NFL is a joke. They had two ways to make their case, either the ballboys spill everything and it is all documented in texts. There are texts but they come off as being jokey about their job and none of them implicate Tom Brady in any way. OR they have irrefutable scientific evidence which doesn't exist because a seen by the Troy Vincent testimony the procedure for inflating and testing the balls was highly unscientific and lacked the rigor and accuracy required to prove the balls were under inflated.
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I think that's exactly what Kraft thought. He thought not bothering to fight would make them not bother with Tom.

The NFL is basically full of shit and everyone saying this was just a witch hunt look to be right.
 
schwagger15 said:
Troy Vincent comes off looking, unsurprisingly, like an incompetent buffoon and a lackey. Basically responded 'no' for several pages of testimony. My favorite: "I didn't include science, no, sir". I'm sure the stuff about the manual not even being presented to players will be a pretty big part of the case.
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How does this surprise anyone at this point after his clownshoes antics involved in the whole Adrian Peterson mess last year?
 
Draxal said:
Oh please, Al Davis has sued the NFL three times over, it will take a lot of work for Kraft to get into as bad as place as the Davises.
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And it never worked out for Al, did it?

Suing the league is going nuclear, you will become hated by every owner for damaging the golden goose that is the NFL.
 
Question: “So prior to this game, okay, had you ever heard of the Ideal Gas Law?”

Vincent: “No sir.”

Question: “Do you know if anyone in the NFL Game-Day Operations had ever discussed the impact of the Ideal Gas Law in testing footballs?”

Vincent: “Not with me.”

Question: “You had never heard to that?”

Vincent: “Never.”
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This league. It's no wonder Roger didn't want the appeal to go to anyone other than himself.
 
OSHAN said:
That's basically what Kraft said during his recent press conference. He took the hit because Brady did nothing wrong, Goodell didn't give a shit, and so he wishes he didn't roll over.
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A fine for Brady (for being less than helpful, no implied involvment) and a 1st and 4th round pick taken away would have been a big win for the NFL. They got way over their head with a 4 game ban and now all their "independent reports" and "science" is out in the open and can be seen immediately to be nonsense.

Kraft gave Goodell the out to look like a winner but now he is going to get slammed so hard it might cost him his job
 
Faddy said:
Did the Pats punishment and Brady's come at the same time? Didn't Kraft accept the Pats punishment months ago. I think Kraft thought he was taking the hit and they would fine Brady and let it go. I bet he regrets taking a deal now that there was nothing in it for him.
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The NFL handed the Patriots and Brady their punishment at the same time. Brady has better recourse than the Patriots, the cba affords him to appeal the punishment, Kraft not many options which didn't involve taking the NFL to court.

Kraft, and others, assumed that by the Patriots taking the hit on the chin the NFL would vacate Brady's suspension, especially since the Well's report did not have an conclusive evidence of Brady's involvement (if their was any illegal deflation to begin with).
 
DrForester said:
I think that's exactly what Kraft thought. He thought not bothering to fight would make them not bother with Tom.

The NFL is basically full of shit and everyone saying this was just a witch hunt look to be right.
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According to Pats fans Kraft had enough power to destroy Goodell six weeks ago but now is so out of the loop he had no idea the commissioner still planned to go after Brady?

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In Goodells ruling, he said Brady when asked about the increased communication between him and the ball boy, it was only to discuss preparations for the super bowl, which Goodell took as a lie and a cover up.



Read the transcript.. Brady openly admitted he talked to the ball boy about the situation along with preparing for the super bowl.

Just like the judge in the ray rice trial stated.. Goodell is a liar.
 
hom3land said:
In Goodells ruling, he said Brady when asked about the increased communication between him and the ball boy, it was only to discuss preparations for the super bowl, which Goodell took as a lie and a cover up.



Read the transcript.. Brady openly admitted he talked to the ball boy about the situation along with preparing for the super bowl.

Just like the judge in the ray rice trial stated.. Goodell is a liar.
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Yeah I thought that was pretty fucked up. Also pretty crazy he chooses 100 fucking footballs for the super bowl as well.
 
So Brady/NFLPA are releasing a ton of info per the judge's order, including the transcript and a bunch of Brady's emails. Has the NFL released anything yet? Is that a dumb question?
 
BigAT said:
This is truly hilarious. The delusion is reaching new levels as this thing keeps going.
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Really? So if this goes to court, not only the NFL is being dragged through the mud, but so are the Colts and Baltimore (where it all started) along with ESPN and especially Mort. Do you think any of these parties would look fondly on Goodell and how he (the NFL) handled this whole thing?

Even though they want this to stick with the Pats, they did not want the whole thing blowing up. The transcript REALLY hurts the perception of the NFL and how it handles things such as appeals in general.

This is why the NFL did not want this being public. i.e. Thanks NFL for filing in NY!
 
It's always been clear that Troy Vincent has been salty about the Patriots since his playing and hasn't been professional enough to get over that working for the NFL. Amazing that he is in the position he's in.
 
hom3land said:
10 minutes into sportscenter and no mention of this story.

Where's the panel of explayers that were part of teams that repeatedly had their asses kicked by the pats talking about this case?
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Christ Mortenson reported a lot of false info, they dont wanna throw him under the bus
 
schwagger15 said:
So Brady/NFLPA are releasing a ton of info per the judge's order, including the transcript and a bunch of Brady's emails. Has the NFL released anything yet? Is that a dumb question?
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In the transcript, Brady's team wanted it all to be as transparent as possible; NFL says everything will remain sealed.

Goes to court, judge orders to unseal everything.

Nothing else to show. There will be no new evidence for the judge. It will be based off this testimony.
 
I think people would be shocked at how many people defending Brady aren't Patriots fans. Personally, I'm shocked at how many people trusted (are still trusting?) the league after we've seen Goodell repeatedly botch investigations.
 
Gigglepoo said:
I think people would be shocked at how many people defending Brady aren't Patriots fans. Personally, I'm shocked at how many people trusted (are still trusting?) the league after we've seen Goodell repeatedly botch investigations.
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yep pretty much

panthers fan here

hate the pats

I find it laughable how many people just blindly cheered on goodell and the nfl for this, especially after the season they just had
 
Gigglepoo said:
I think people would be shocked at how many people defending Brady aren't Patriots fans. Personally, I'm shocked at how many people trusted (are still trusting?) the league after we've seen Goodell repeatedly botch investigations.
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I'm a Rams fan here.

I in no way absolve the Patriots of any guilt, because we just don't know, but it was clear thet there was never any real evidence that they cheated. It's fucked up how the NFL can just run a witch hunt, punish teams, and suspend players with no threat of repercussion, and I'm glad it's blowing up in his face.

Goodell should have been fired after the Ray Rice incident.
 
After seeing these data dumps the last few days from the Patriots/NFLPA/Brady side (Pash emails, appeal testimony, Brady emails, etc.), how can anyone seriously support the narrative that Brady was uncooperative with the investigation, which was a key fact of both the suspension and upholding of it?

It seems totally based on the fact that Brady did not turn over his personal cell phone to the NFL, when he wasn't under any legal, ethical, or punitive responsibility to do so, and at a time when the league office was leaking like a faucet.
 
schwagger15 said:
After seeing these data dumps the last few days from the Patriots/NFLPA/Brady side (Pash emails, appeal testimony, Brady emails, etc.), how can anyone seriously support the narrative that Brady was uncooperative with the investigation, which was a key fact of both the suspension and upholding of it?

It seems totally based on the fact that Brady did not turn over his personal cell phone to the NFL, when he wasn't under any legal, ethical, or punitive responsibility to do so, and at a time when the league office was leaking like a faucet.
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His phone wasnt even that valuable to the investigation, they got all his meta data and matched it to the two pats employees phones. So they already had the content anyway.

And it seems Brady gave them emails too since I read about his failure to get a white pool cover and his odyssey of rugby fabric polo shirts.
 
Bob Kravitz
‏@bkravitz
And seriously who cares what Bill Simmons think? He's a self styled Boston super fan who has limited reporting experience
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Oh my god, it's the same argument we're getting in the forums! Doesn't Bob Kravitz realize he's an Indy sports reporter?
 
I think people who knock Bill Simmons from where he is from, really don't listen to Simmons too often. The only thing he really gets kind of annoying with is his Celtics fandom, and even that is done in a "geek" sort of way. He kind of makes it obvious or separate when he is discussing larger points.

That's my observation, and I don't really like Simmons a great deal.
 
Deadspin's take:

http://deadspin.com/5-thoughts-on-tom-bradys-case-from-a-guy-who-read-the-w-1722183616

Overall, it's a pox on both your houses. It's pretty obvious that the balls were deflated below the legal limit, it was done at Brady's behest, and he lied as did at least some members of the organization. However, it cannot be definitively proven. Goodell and the NFL have also lied, leaked bullshit to the press, and acted awfully, over a transgression that is minor at best.

If Goodell weren't so incompetent, I'd think the whole thing was a ploy to keep the NFL and its biggest star in the news through the offseason. Shut up, lift the suspension, and add a .5 to Brady's uniform number for the rest of his career. Everyone wins.
 
Sanjuro said:
I think people who knock Bill Simmons from where he is from, really don't listen to Simmons too often. The only thing he really gets kind of annoying with is his Celtics fandom, and even that is done in a "geek" sort of way. He kind of makes it obvious or separate when he is discussing larger points.
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Emphasis on listen, perhaps. I think his fandom is more annoying in print, the podcasts are pretty much fine.
 
DeaconKnowledge said:
According to Pats fans Kraft had enough power to destroy Goodell six weeks ago but now is so out of the loop he had no idea the commissioner still planned to go after Brady?

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It's so funny watching them get backed up into a corner and just throwing shit till something sticks.

Thread has been very entertaining.
 
oatmeal said:
Please post evidence that proves they were deflated.

kthx.
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The text messages are pretty damning. Oh wait, I forgot, McNally called himself the deflator because of his weight loss. Mm-hmmm.

There's also the sentence directly following what you quoted where I said it cannot be definitively proven, so you may wanna work on your reading comprehension.
 
So you've had ~350 pages of Brady's private emails released to the public today, all having such critical evidence as Brady discussing what pool cover to buy for him and Giselle's pool, and how the pool company only has black covers and no white covers (Brady = racist?)... And also private emails between him, Giselle, Bridget Moynihan, Tom's kids with Bridget, and so on.

ANd blogs are going through these emails and pulling out funny ones and posting them online... Like Tom trying to schedule a dinner with some NHL owner and how the owner wants him to talk to the team, etc.

It's all garbage.

So... Why wouldn't you want to give your private phone if you have nothing to hide? Because of shit like this. So far, in the 350+ pages of private emails that have been made public, there isn't anything about deflated footballs, or football in general, yet everybody gets to snoop into Tom Brady's private life reading emails with his ex-wife and current wife about his kids.
 
Catchpenny said:
Overall, it's a pox on both your houses. It's pretty obvious that the balls were deflated below the legal limit, it was done at Brady's behest, and he lied as did at least some members of the organization. However, it cannot be definitively proven. Goodell and the NFL have also lied, leaked bullshit to the press, and acted awfully, over a transgression that is minor at best.
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Very good summary. Too many people are making it sound like you have to support Roger Goodell if you think Tom Brady and the Patriots were cheating. There's absolutely no reason why that should be the case. It seems fairly clear to me that Brady is most likely guilty of what he's been accused of. It's also been clear for a long time that the NFL has a serious problem in how it handles player discipline, with Goodell being the main source of that problem.
 
Catchpenny said:
The text messages are pretty damning. Oh wait, I forgot, McNally called himself the deflator because of his weight loss. Mm-hmmm.

There's also the sentence directly following what you quoted where I said it cannot be definitively proven, so you may wanna work on your reading comprehension.
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Keep in mind that text is from before the season in May and later in October there are texts complaining about the refs over inflating footballs and Tom being mad about it, and that was a home game.
 
Late Flag said:
Very good summary. Too many people are making it sound like you have to support Roger Goodell if you think Tom Brady and the Patriots were cheating. There's absolutely no reason why that should be the case. It seems fairly clear to me that Brady is most likely guilty of what he's been accused of. It's also been clear for a long time that the NFL has a serious problem in how it handles player discipline, with Goodell being the main source of that problem.
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Also, ball manipulation was handled with fines in the past. See: Vikings vs Panthers (last season) and the Jets being fined in 2009 for tampering with kicking balls. No players were implicated, let alone suspended. The NFL has always said that this is a minor equipment violation, it's only now worthy of a seven month investigation with massive penalties.
 
Catchpenny said:
The text messages are pretty damning. Oh wait, I forgot, McNally called himself the deflator because of his weight loss. Mm-hmmm.

There's also the sentence directly following what you quoted where I said it cannot be definitively proven, so you may wanna work on your reading comprehension.
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avatar quote?
 
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