SPOILER: Spoiler Metal Gear Solid V (TPS) Spoiler Thread (Contains Spoilers, Thanos).

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ColourRevolt said:
I don't believe ANY of this information circulating the web. I think it's utter bullshit. Plain and simply, the character we play as is the real Big Boss. Most of what I've read falls very short of anything remotely logical or practical to the plot. If we see Gray Fox in this game, he will be an entirely separate character that we encounter -- not who we've been playing as.
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Came from the guide bruh.
 
UPDATE WITH ADDITIONS/CORRECTIONS.

Just to refresh, the official Italian version of the The Phantom Pain guide printed by Piggyback states the following points.

This information is from these pictures, which where taken by PumaWarrior on the MGS Reddit, who owns the original manual:

http://batmariafg.imgur.com

Videos proving the validity of the these pictures were also upload by PumaWarrior and can be seen here, where information has additionally been taken from:

http://a.pomf.cat/vmqfmv.mp4

http://a.pomf.cat/qzeauc.mp4

I am semi-fluent in Italian and have personally translated these points myself from the pictures in the link.

Other native Italian speakers have also verified the below points.

Thanks to Crossing Eden, Sickboy007, DevilFox on here and Sangivstheworld and Damnfiddles over on the MGS Reddit for further translating and organising some of this information.

GENERAL

  • Avatar creation is for the online elements only.
  • The are 50 main missions.
  • There are 157 side missions.
  • The alternate name of the ST-84 Metal Gear is confirmed to be the Sahelathropus.
  • The ST-84 Metal Gear has 6 body parts. Every part has its own life bar and destroying each part gives different advantages.
  • Zero orders Dr. Strangelove, who now works for DARPA, to develop The Patriots' AI to keep his control over the world.
  • In the penultimate mission of the main story, you must make contact with and recover Code Talker. Code Talker is being guarded by The Skulls.
  • The final mission of the main story is against the Metal Gear, which is being controlled by "The Third Child".
  • The "Man on Fire" is Volgin. You have to get recover his body in Chapter 2.
  • The guide says it's safe to assume that Eli is Liquid Snake.
  • The map confirms there are three main locations; Afghanistan, Africa and Mother Base.
  • Mission 46 is missing from from the guide. It does exist, but the player has to fulfill very specific conditions to access it. Konami asked Piggy Back to not to reveal how to unlock the mission or detail it's content. However, Piggy Back will gradually supply information and updates online as they become available. The website will be www.piggyback.com/it/mgsv or the player can use a Quick Response code.
SKULLFACE
  • The guide states that Skullface is the main antagonist of Ground Zeroes and The Phantom Pain and that he was born in Hungary, where his parents worked in a secret weapons factory.
  • During the bombing of the weapons factory he was knocked down and trampled on by terrified crowds fleeing in search of safety. This caused Skullface very serious injuries.
  • Abandoned in critical condition and without any possibility of cure with conventional means, he survived thanks to a innovative therapy with parasites. However, this therapy also it caused his deformation and damage to his nervous system, meaning he can no longer feel pain.
  • He was then recruited in secret by Major Zero and his mandate with the XOF unit was to watch over Big Boss and make sure that his important missions didn't fail. This includes Operation Snake Eater from Metal Gear Solid 3.
  • Working for Zero and watching over Big Boss for many years led to him resenting the two of them, particularly Zero.
  • Skullface attacks Mother Base in 1975 during the events of Ground Zeroes and tries to kill Big Boss by implanting bombs inside Paz
  • When Skullface discovers that Zero and Strangelove are making The Partriot AI, he develops a parasite that infects peoples' voice boxes and stops them from speaking. This parasite is developed by Code Talker, who has the cure, but does want to share it.
  • Because of the information supplied by Paz at the end of Ground Zeroes, Skullface finds Zero and infects him with the parasite. This causes Zero to slowly go into a vegetive state.
  • Skullface plans to spread the parasite using the ST-84 Metal Gear.
  • Skullface nearly completes his plan, but his overthrown by "The Third Child" after Mantis becomes enraged by Eli's presence in the XOF helicopter.
  • Skullface is crushed by the ST-84 Metal Gear and Miller and Big Boss decide to leave him to die, so he can suffer.
  • However, Huey ignores this idea and finally kills Skullface.
BIG BOSS/AHAB
  • The guide strongly suggests through clues that the Medic from Ground Zeroes is the version of Big Boss who awakens from the coma in the hospital. This version of Big Boss is known as Ahab.
  • The guide notes that Big Boss and the Medic have similar voices, so he is a strong candidate for being the version of Big Boss/Ahab that awakens from the coma in hospital.
  • The guide continues by saying that in Ground Zeroes, the Medic is one of Big Boss' "most trusted men".
  • The guide also says that the Big Boss we see on the operating table in the "Don't you die on me dammit!" scene from the trailers does not have shrapnel in his head. The guide suggests that the Medic is the person to most likely have the shrapnel in his head, while also being the same hospital room, as he protected Big Boss from the Paz's bomb blast in the chopper in Ground Zeroes.
  • Huey is not sure of Big Boss/Ahab's identity when he first meets him.
  • The guide says that the version of Big Boss/Ahab that awakens from the coma in hospital has a DNA test done with Eli. Their DNA does not match. The guide goes on to state that since Eli is a clone of the real Big Boss, their DNA should match. The guides says this again gives a glue to Ahab's identity.
  • The guide notes that when Eli asks Ocelot where his father is, Ocelot replies that "Your father isn't here". This is despite the fact that Ahab is watching their conversation behind a two-way mirror.
ISHMAEL
  • The guide doesn't say who Ishmael definitely say who Ishmeal is. Konami and Kojima Production asked Piggyback, the creators of the guide, not to reveal it. Ishmael's identity is revealed in an optional mission after the main story has ended.
  • The guide does however, go over some fan theories and gives clues towards the true identity of Ishmael.
  • The guide discusses the theory that Ishmael is imaginary. It says that this can't be the case as Quiet sees Ishmael when she comes to assassinate the version of Big Boss/Ahab that awakens from the coma in the hospital.
  • The guides further states that as Big Boss/Ahab is sat in the left-hand seat of the right-hand driven ambulance that's used to escape the hospital, Ishamel must be real.
  • However, Ishmael suddenly disappears when the ambulance crashes. Ocelot rescues Big Boss/Ahab from the ambulance after the crash. Big Boss/Ahab asks Ocelet who Ishmael was, but Ocelot deliberately ignores the question.
  • The guide says that the fact that there are "The Star of Bethlehem" lilies in the Ishmael's and Big Boss/Ahab's room is a strong clue to the real identity of Ishmael. The guide also states that these lilies hold a significance to The Boss.
  • When Ahab sees the ghost of Paz the first time at Mother Base, he has an hallucination where there are clearly two versions of Big Boss on the chopper.
QUIET

  • Quiet's hearing is ten times more sensitive than normal soldiers.
  • Her vision is unaffected by time of day, so there is no difference in her sight between night and day.
  • Quiet leaves you after mission 43 and to finish her story you will have to find her after the main story is over.
  • Quiet goes to the hospital to kill Big Boss at the start of the game and speaks while doing so. She specifically says "Not yet. The patient in the next bed saw my face" in regards to if she has assassinated Big Boss/Ahab.
  • Water has a negative affect of Quiet's powers.
  • If you spray Quiet with water she will "writhe", because the parasites inside her are absorbing the water. She also reacts to rain.
  • The guide states that Big Boss' relation with Quiet is based on mutual respect and has no traditional romantic connotation. It goes on to say that this doesn't diminish the importance of their relationship or Quiet's sacrifice when saving Big Boss.
THE SKULLS
  • The are three versions of The Skulls; A fog Version, an armoured version and a camouflage version.
  • All versions of The Skulls have health that slowly regenerates over time.
  • Like Quiet, they also have a negative reaction to water and rain.
  • You can fulton every type of Skull, leading to different rewards.
  • Like Quiet, they have perfect vision during night time and you can them breathing if you listen aiming with one of thier sniper rifles.
  • Destroying the "fog version" Skulls' body parts rapidly reduce their health and resistance.
  • Fultoning the "armoured version" Skulls will reward with the player with parasite enhanced armour.
  • Fultoning the "camouflage version" Skulls leads to the creation of an item that grants the player 30 seconds on invisibility.
  • The "camouflage version"'s body parts can't be destroyed, so headshots are the most useful way to defeat these Skulls.
THE ENDING

NOTE: The excerpt of the guide that this translation is taken from does not clearly state which "Big Boss" is being referred to.


  • The guide states that at the end of The Phantom Pain, the parasite that mutates peoples' vocal chords infects Mother Base. This forces Big Boss to exterminate his soldiers to prevent a global catastrophe.
  • The guide continues by saying that although he takes on this responsibility without any apparent remorse, it's impossible from him to ignore the fact that he has contributed to these events. This causes him to unleash his "inner demon".
  • The guide states Big Boss becomes the antagonist gradually, slowly consumed by what happens to him until all that is left is his obsession.
  • After these events, Big Boss is more determined than ever to reinforce his troops, with the aim of forming a nation free from the governments' hegemony, a dream he will be on the verge of realising in the 1990's.
BOSS FIGHTS
  • THE SKULLS

    Fog Version - Missions 1 and 6.

    Armoured Version - Missions 16, 29 and (And 37, 42 on Extreme Difficulty Only).

    Camouflage Version - Missions 28 and 46.

  • QUIET

    Mission 11 (And 40 on Extreme Difficulty Only)

  • THE "MAN ON FIRE"

    Prologue and Mission 20

  • ELI

    Mission 23 (and Optional Mission 113).

  • SAHELANTHROPUS (METAL GEAR ST-84)

    Missions 12 and 31 (And Mission 50 on Extreme Difficulty Only)
MUSIC TAPES

The map from the guide also confirms that these are some of the music tapes that are collectable from different locations.

These are in addition to some of the other music tapes that have already been confirmed:
 
Ekoria said:
will be super pissed if it turns out i'm playing an impostor in the final mgs game.
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I believe it.

Its been circulating since the very announcement of MGS:V TTP, or shortly after it basically. Venom Snake has different traits (electronic cigars? heh), there is stuff with him that doesn't add up. Same as the 2 coma states.

Ishmael teaches him the ropes like a pro.

Medic saved BB's life, somehow shared his VA... I think they never revealed his face in GZ either. Not saying he's VS but he's certainly odd.

As for Emmerich, he should cause the downfall. Its in his veins.
 
The guide states Big Boss becomes the antagonist gradually, slowly consumed by what happens to him until all that is left is his obsession.
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All I think of with this plot is how we just seem to be repeating Star Wars with this plot of "Big Boss turning to Dark Side".
 
Tookay said:
It's three lines. Kiefer is in the booth. Yes, it is more economical for them to use Kiefer in that instance.
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Or, you know, they could do that when Honda "Bland" Takeshi is in the booth.

You're acting like a twist regarding BB's identity is the ONLY twist that can happen. It's pure confirmation bias.
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Nope, I'm going from a hell of a lot of evidence (some of which comes directly from an official guide).
 
I've played MGS on the PS1 (my favorite all-time game), MGS 2, MGS 3 (both fantastic classics) & MGS 4, which I didn't particularly enjoy. I'm reading this so-called spoiler thread & you know what? It's not a spoiler thread for me personally per se, why? Because the story elements shared here are so convoluted I actually still have no idea who is who or what the story in this game is about.

I only know Para-Medic (are we even talking about the same 'medic'?) because she was the codec 'expert' who gave information on whether a particular snake was edible or poisonous in MGS 3.

I feel MGS has long since veered into the super nerdy (no offense intended) & has moved far beyond merely mortal gamers such as myself who always enjoyed MGS for what it was: a stealth action game with awesome boss battles, fun gameplay mechanisms (distraction via porno magazines was always hilarious) & other cool stuff. My own favorite character was actually Revolver Ocelot, especially in MGS3, for what it's worth.
 
Golicz said:
I only know Para-Medic (are we even talking about the same 'medic'?) because she was the codec 'expert' who gave information on whether a particular snake was edible or poisonous in MGS 3.
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The Medic ain't Para-Medic. Medic was a guy who was obscured by BB in some cutscenes in Ground Zeroes. People have had some theories about why he was purposefully obscured and why he sounded a bit like Kiefer since the game came out.
 
BlastKiller said:
Did i get it right ? If we don't play the true ending, we were believed to play the real Big Boss.
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I don't think we know. From the sounds of it no-one has played the post-game mission yet because it only unlocks on Sept 1st or something. The guide has a code to go on a website to see the "strategy" for the epilogue mission but that doesn't go live till Sept 1st.
 
BossDarkseid said:
I don't think we know. From the sounds of it no-one has played the post-game mission yet because it only unlocks on Sept 1st or something. The guide has a code to go on a website to see the "strategy" for the epilogue mission but that doesn't go live till Sept 1st.
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Ok, i see.

And what is it with the boss fights i.e. Quiet from the guide.

QUIET
Mission 11 (And 40 on Extreme Difficulty Only)
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No 2nd boss fight on normal ? that makes no sense
 
BlastKiller said:
Ok, i see.

And what is it with the boss fights i.e. Quiet from the guide.



No boss fight on normal ? that makes no sense
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Well I'm going to go out on a wing and say that Extreme/Harder difficulties are either "non-canon" or just have extra quirks and features because if we also know Quiet leaves around Mission 43 or so then unless you cannot use her for 41 and 42 it'd be quite odd. I mean you fight three different various of the Skulls across several missions and there's an Eli fight as something in a side op among others so I think the 40 Extreme is probably...just...eh, I'm not that sure.

It could be that Extreme remixes enemies somewhat, sooooooooooort of in the way that say Devil May Cry does (I think) but in this way it could be the added element of Quiet having god-tier eyesight. Her vision is not affected by light levels so...imagine GZ's Hard mode daytime guard vision, upgraded to TPP, then imagine it across a valley or wide open plain <_<
 
Reading the boss fights, I feel disappointed. No more super crazy boss fights/intro like in the previous Metal Gear Sold games? They were always my favorite part :(
 
Sumio Mondo said:
Wonder why they're locking boss battles to Extreme mode only? Seems weird. And no Skull Face boss battle? That's certainly disappointing.
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Isn't the second Quiet fight the only one on relegated to Extreme? As for Skull Face...as an ex FOXHOUND/XOF agent it would have been a cool sneaking fight, imagine XOF troops and Skull Face in a sort of amped Ocelot Unit situation, but otherwise unless he becomes a bullet sponge I'm not really sure what his fight would be, or what his "gimmick" would be.

We seem to get 5 or so bosses at the moment, the Skulls having two or three different versions and I guess it's easier to focus on a few and try and "nail" them with the vastly exapnded sandbox element rather than go Peace Walker route and throw everything in, and it ends up being kinda shit.
 
If anyone is shocked or disappointed at the impostor Big Boss concept, they very clearly haven't been paying attention to anything MGSV related until this... spoiler thread.
Kojima has been so, so heavy handed and on the nose about it with all his song choices, his mask stunt, the Ishmael stuff, medic stuff etc.

Cigar VS E-Cig, eye color and so on, all these details people kind of shrugged off. I mean think about this really, Kojima playtested hanging from goddamn platforms in MGS4's Shadow Moses section himself, he is detail oriented and he doesn't put things in games like that for no reason, there is always a purpose, be it an easter egg or plot related.

The Medic "placeholder" theory was one of the more baffling ones, the voice, face, literal head model being an exact duplicate of Snake's with less hair, MGS has never had things like that in the games for no reason, even Raikov in MGS3 served a purpose, as did Pliskin in MGS2 looking suspiciously like Solid Snake.

It's been 20 years, I would have thought people would catch on better by now.

DarkLordMalik said:
Reading the boss fights, I feel disappointed. No more super crazy boss fights/intro like in the previous Metal Gear Sold games? They were always my favorite part :(
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There were reports awhile back that fighting Quiet before you recruit her was a pretty insane boss fight that supposedly measured up to "The End"

Just because they seem to be introduced in an unusual way, doesn't mean the fights won't be glorious.
 
Kojima could also be triple rusing us at the same time, dropping clues left and right that hint towards Venom really isn't BB, but in the end he actually is the one and only John.

YeaYong deleted his tweet about being absolutely sure Big Boss was Venom Snake during his day 1 impression Q and A. He's probably seen all the hints by now.
 
Mendrox said:
So..what if these leaks are staged and the story is totally different? Masterpiece.
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A few people have suggested maybe importing your Gound Zeroes save affects the story, which in my mind made me think "I could totally see Kojima splitting the game where just booting up TPP has you play as Venom, but importing Ground Zeroes has you playing as Big Boss and changes things."

Which to me would explain why we've seen both the fake and real BB in the same scenes/parts of the game, but I assume that's just the whole replacing Raiden with Snake thing in trailers troll again.
Especially since I'm pretty certain that all the press playthroughs of MGSV were most likely without importing GZ stuff, so they would never see the real/full story.
 
I always thought the whole "You don't play as Big Boss" thing was so silly... but it may be happening. So surreal.

There are still a lot of questions.

Who is Ishmael?
Who is Ahab?
Who is the Medic?
Is anyone Gray Fox?
If we are Fake Big Boss, what was the real Big Boss doing?
What is the fate of our player character?
What is Ocelot doing? The spoilers never mention him, yet I can't believe Ocelot is in a MGS game without pulling some shenanigans.
What's the significance of Psycho Mantis being a Big Boss clone? He was a memorable character in MGS1, but didn't have a whole lot of significance in terms of the meta story.
If Mantis is the third Big Boss clone, what's up with Solidus?
Why the eff is Volgin back? How is he on fire?

These spoilers just give me more questions than answers.
 
Forkball said:
I always thought the whole "You don't play as Big Boss" thing was so silly... but it may be happening. So surreal.

There are still a lot of questions.

Who is Ishmael?
Who is Ahab?
Who is the Medic?
Is anyone Gray Fox?
If we are Fake Big Boss, what was the real Big Boss doing?
What is the fate of our player character?
What is Ocelot doing? The spoilers never mention him, yet I can't believe Ocelot is in a MGS game without pulling some shenanigans.
What's the significance of Psycho Mantis being a Big Boss clone? He was a memorable character in MGS1, but didn't have a whole lot of significance in terms of the meta story.
If Mantis is the third Big Boss clone, what's up with Solidus?
Why the eff is Volgin back? How is he on fire?

These spoilers just give me more questions than answers.
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1. We don't know till the epilogue mission
2. Whoever we play as
3. Batman
4. -shrug-
5. Some say Big Boss sets up Outer Heaven while Diamond Dogs etc gather the attention of Zero
6. Well if it's Frank Jaeger or Solidus (as evident by the no shared DNA with Eli) then it's self explanatory
7. Some spoilers do mention him as keeping up the ruse of Fake Big Boss (if it's all true). He and Kaz seem to be the only ones aware of it.
8. Some people suspect Psycho Mantis was part of the Joy Division idea, even if it's not called that, with a US Project to clone The Joy and her Cobras (which would make Mantis a clone of the Sorrow, somewhat explaining their connection)
9. -shrug- we have to wait and see. Mantis could have nothing to do with LET and more of the Cobra thing.
10. Psycho Mantis ofc. I mean are people saying "Wtf Volgin" ad not "Wtf flaming whale" even tho just after the flaming whale the helicopter crashes into hospital entrance and shreds XOF troops.

in the end we'll not know fo sure until cutscenes are leaked or we play it ourselves. then we'll realise we were played like a fiddle.
 
Xiraiya said:
A few people have suggested maybe importing your Gound Zeroes save affects the story, which in my mind made me think "I could totally see Kojima splitting the game where just booting up TPP has you play as Venom, but importing Ground Zeroes has you playing as Big Boss and changes things."
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This sounds dank as fuck, too bad it probably won't happen :/ Would have loved it and it would have been a pretty Kojima-esq thing to do.
 
BossDarkseid said:
Isn't the second Quiet fight the only one on relegated to Extreme? As for Skull Face...as an ex FOXHOUND/XOF agent it would have been a cool sneaking fight, imagine XOF troops and Skull Face in a sort of amped Ocelot Unit situation, but otherwise unless he becomes a bullet sponge I'm not really sure what his fight would be, or what his "gimmick" would be.
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No different than it was fighting Ocelot in MGS1 and MGS3, they could have come up with something with regards to Skull Face especially considering that he is the main antagonist.

And no, they've also locked some boss battles against the Skulls and the Metal Gear into Extreme difficulty also, read it again.
 
Forkball said:
I always thought the whole "You don't play as Big Boss" thing was so silly... but it may be happening. So surreal.

There are still a lot of questions.

Who is Ishmael?
Who is Ahab?
Who is the Medic?
Is anyone Gray Fox?
If we are Fake Big Boss, what was the real Big Boss doing?
What is the fate of our player character?
What is Ocelot doing? The spoilers never mention him, yet I can't believe Ocelot is in a MGS game without pulling some shenanigans.
What's the significance of Psycho Mantis being a Big Boss clone? He was a memorable character in MGS1, but didn't have a whole lot of significance in terms of the meta story.
If Mantis is the third Big Boss clone, what's up with Solidus?
Why the eff is Volgin back? How is he on fire?

These spoilers just give me more questions than answers.
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Ahab and Medic seem to be the same person, if you are Ahab then you're Medic, he protected Big Boss at the end of GZ, BB seems to have no shrapnel in his head in the hospital cutscene
Venom/ahab/medic is probably either Decoy Octopus or a body double, either way, nanomachine hypnotism is what makes the doppelganger think they're the real Big Boss.

Ishmael was also voiced by Keifer, so he's either the real Big Boss, or he's Solidus, Solidus was born after Eli and David (and to a different woman, his mother is not Eva) but he aged much faster in general so he could potentially nearly be an adult by the time Eli is a young teenager, who knows if that's how it worked.

The real Big Boss is probably trolling everyone from a cardboard box somewhere.

I don't believe Mantis being the third child is referring to the sons of Big Boss, Eva just had twins, she said so herself, and Solidus is the 3rd "son", so if they were trying to say Mantis is a clone/child of Big Boss, he would be the 4th child.
We also know from MGS1 that he grew up in a small village, he had a father that he killed, but when he opens the secret passageway for Solid Snake, he does comment that he never used his powers to help anyone before now, but that it still felt nostalgic.

How is Volgin back? Illusions, psychic projection, corpse manipulation, take your pick, Mantis can do all that with no real trouble, illusion fire was a thing he did in MGS1, so it was kind of easy to assume he was just making you see stuff that wasn't really there.
 
Does save transfer for PS3 -> PS4 requires uploading save to ps+ cloud? I sold my PS3 with GZ save on it thinking bonuses will be nothing more than a few staff members, but now this two storylines theory is making me nervous.
 
Mifec said:
This sounds dank as fuck, too bad it probably won't happen :/ Would have loved it and it would have been a pretty Kojima-esq thing to do.
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Well we'll find out soon enough. But Kojima did say what the GZ upload would do is kind of a big part of the game and not really something that had been done before in video games, so whatever it is, it's apparently much more than an extra bonus mission.
I think two stories is far fetched but Kojima is kojima and what we've/seen heard so far to me doesn't necessarily quite add up to the cost and drama that making the game exactly how he want it to be has caused.
 
Sumio Mondo said:
No different than it was fighting Ocelot in MGS1 and MGS3, they could have come up with something with regards to Skull Face especially considering that he is the main antagonist.

And no, they've also locked some boss battles against the Skulls and the Metal Gear into Extreme difficulty also, read it again.
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Eh, I'll have to disagree about the same as Ocelot etc. Unless they take away our tools and confine us into a small space it is different, but we'll see anyway when we actually play the game.

I see they have locked an encounter or two more on Extreme, kinda peculiar since Mission 50 isn't extreme only etc (unless that's what they call boss only missions) but we'll know soon enough.
 
Xiraiya said:
Well we'll find out soon enough. But Kojima did say what the GZ upload would do is kind of a big part of the game and not really something that had been done before in video games, so whatever it is, it's apparently much more than an extra bonus mission.
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That's the part which makes me think this could be a thing, yeah. I really hope it's as epic a thing as the wording suggests or something even better that we didn't think of yet.
 
I believe Ishmael is the legendary Big Boss and the evidence I'm about to use isn't so obvious.

Watch the GDC gameplay of Ishmael and Snake in the hospital. If any of you watch OHN on twitch. 3Dogg will sometimes comment on this.

If you watch Ishmael he literally has the same exact crouch walk animation as Big Boss and same voice just a different pitch. Now many of us assumed he was imaginary and BB used him to help him out of the hospital.

But it's becoming more and more obvious that Ishmael is a real person and I'm led to believe it's BB.

Now why is BB using this "Venom Snake" to achieve certain goals? I have no idea.
 
The thing I don't like about this Venom Snake stuff is it feels like we got cheated out of seeing Big Boss himself turn into a villain. It is neat that he and Zero are occupying the same space though, blurring the lines of who the bad guy is since they're both treating you like a puppet.

The part at the end where Snake has to kill his own men, that really seems like something we'd be using BB himself for.
 
shocky2002 said:
Anyone know what the references to Moby Dick's Ishmael and Ahab mean exactly?
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Well one of the themes of the game is revenge before reason which goes in line with the book. The GDC trailer had a huge whale on fire swallowing the chopper, the chopper in TPP is called Pequod which is the name of the ship in the book.
 
The Silver said:
The thing I don't like about this Venom Snake stuff is it feels like we got cheated out of seeing Big Boss himself turn into a villain. It is neat that he and Zero are occupying the same space though, blurring the lines of who the bad guy is since they're both treating you like a puppet.

The part at the end where Snake has to kill his own men, that really seems like something we'd be using BB himself for.
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That's what I'm thinking, too. And I've kind of come around to the idea of playing as a fake BB. With that in mind, I'd love for BB to nonchalantly walk up to Venom in a cutscene and shoot him in the head without ceremony, and then for control to shift over to him so we can kill everyone in Diamond Dogs and level the place.

This could even be a cathartic moment for him (while he has been away, he has been constructing Outer Heaven in secret), as he destroys what has become a competitor to his vision. Kaz seems to be fully invested in DD from what we've seen, so he may see thais act by the real BB as a betrayal of trust from a friend, thus enabling him to dub Big Boss a "monster" in MG2.

Just random speculation.
 
shocky2002 said:
Anyone know what the references to Moby Dick's Ishmael and Ahab mean exactly?
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I think it's referencing the distinction between Narrator and Protagonist, not unlike the allusion to Sherlock Holmes (Protagonist) and Watson (Narrator) that Kojima made when talking about the relationship between Raiden (Narrator) and Solid Snake (protagonist) in MGS2.
 
NeoGiff said:
That's what I'm thinking, too. And I've kind of come around to the idea of playing as a fake BB. With that in mind, I'd love for BB to nonchalantly walk up to Venom in a cutscene and shoot him in the head without ceremony, and then for control to shift over to him so we can kill everyone in Diamond Dogs and level the place.

This could even be a cathartic moment for him (while he has been away, he has been constructing Outer Heaven in secret), as he destroys what has become a competitor to his vision. Kaz seems to be fully invested in DD from what we've seen, so he may see thais act by the real BB as a betrayal of trust from a friend, thus enabling him to dub Big Boss a "monster" in MG2.

Just random speculation.
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That's what I want the end of the game to be actually, I want the person we play to be killed by BB after he is thoroughly used up and broken by the events of TPP.
 
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