SPOILER: Spoiler Metal Gear Solid V (TPS) Spoiler Thread (Contains Spoilers, Thanos).

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SkylineRKR said:
btw, The Man who sold the World is a solid choice I think.

The song is about someone who suffers an identity crisis or hates himself.

I also like Elegia - New Order
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Tbh when everyone thought that it was from Zero I kind of knew it was BB's tape. My issue with this game isn't the body double theory, I predicted that back in the Metal Gear Community thread OT2, (check out my post history from March/April/June if anybody doesn't believe me) I like the idea of a body double. My issue is the whole retcon of MG1 and now the whole franchise.

Anyway I agree with you on Bowies lyrics and how they fit Venom.
 
Ishida said:
Being included or not in timelines doesn't mean much. Word of god from Kojima himself says that the main events of Portable Ops are canon, but that some details may not be as they may contradict other games in the series.
That's from Kojima himself.
So we, as fans, can assume that all events in Portable Ops, as long as they don't contradict something else, are canon.
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Only the core story is canon, and even then it's only canon until something replaces/contradicts it. So the core of that story is the Fox Uprising and the fact BB acquired funds, it's pretty safe to say bullshit like Null can be ignored.

Gray Fox was just a highly skilled regular soldier, not an experimental super soldier Ninja, at least not until he "died" fighting Snake.
Gray_Fox.jpg
 
Xiraiya said:
Only the core story is canon, and even then it's only canon until something replaces/contradicts it. So the core of that storythe Fox Uprising and the fact BB acquired funds, it's pretty safe to say bullshit like Null can be ignored.

Gray Fox was just a highly skilled regular soldier, not an experimental super soldier Ninja.
Gray_Fox.jpg
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For starters, I will make it clear that I didn't like Gray Fox's story in Portable Ops. At all.

But having said that, does it actually contradict the future titles?
 
shocky2002 said:
Having Venom be Gray Fox would've been even worse. The entire game would practically have no importance at all in the plotline when you look at it from afar.
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I would've been fine if we played as Gray Fox (not looking like BB), observing BB's change (enter MGS2).. But we're not.. We're some random guy that looks and sounds exactly like BB. Putting BB in the periphery on a character story about BB and have you believe you're him when you're not is stupid..

Just you can't have a character driven story about a character that doesn't participate.


Ignoring PO of course, this could've been GF introduction. Honestly is the only one except Solid which was on par with BB
 
Venom Fox said:
I'm 100% convinced that Kojima has done this to sabotage Konami from carrying the series forward, that I'm not complaining about because after this the series is dead anyway.
Why fuck over the fans though? Why create this peice of shit storyline? There was literally NO NEED to do this, he already had the lore established, he only had to create a game showing us the story he'd already laid out. He has blatantly deceived fans for the sole purpose of fucking Konami over.
Fuck that man, I hope his wife took a shit in his birthday cake yesterday.

The guy is another Peter Molyneux, hypes things up so much, the whole world trembles when it all falls apart.
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It would be a shame though cause Konami is about to hire him back under his conditions following TPP sales success.
 
Ishida said:
But having said that, does it actually contradict the future titles?
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Well that's debatable, because technically no, artistically yes. Everything we've ever had about Frank implied he was just a Soldier before he was a Cyborg, PO made him seem like he was always crazy and super powered, which is not how he was ever portrayed before MGS1, every instance of art we got pre-cyborg has him dressed as a regular soldier, so I felt like that's what they were painting him as, and it makes him far better that way, regular guy who is awesome and then becomes even better by becoming a mechanical killing machine.

If he was always a crazy ninja it wouldn't have taken as much for Snake to figure out who he was, and it would cheapen him in general.

From everything I read about Kojima's stance, I interpreted as "Yes stuff happened when and where PO took place...buuuutt what PO showed you may not necessarily be how it went down"
Which adds up when Miller refers to the location in PW as if he was there.
 
Knowing this, the scene of Venom smashing the DD mirror has meaning now. I'm going back to watch the trailers with this revelation on my mind.
 
KJRS_1993 said:
The fact we're having this discussion to begin with already makes it debatable brother.



You're gonna play MGSV and you're gonna love how it plays and the options available to you, as well as the attention to detail. (I hope!).
Ignore the silly plot yourself and watch as people who take it way too seriously piece apart every line of dialogue and every possible metaphor to justify that the plot isn't bad and Kojima is a legit storytelling genius.

Also:

Absolute gold.
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I hope so, I mean that part when I said I hope Kojima's wife took a shit in his birthday cake. He has totally screwed up MGS.
 
Been a fun thread, but I think I'm going on blackout now. The reviews got me hyped.

Enjoy ladies and gents, I'll see you on the other side!
 
Jesus the meltdowns in this thread :lol Even if the story is bad, you're all going to be buying and playing the game anyways!
 
Venom Fox said:
I'm 100% convinced that Kojima has done this to sabotage Konami from carrying the series forward, that I'm not complaining about because after this the series is dead anyway.
Why fuck over the fans though? Why create this peice of shit storyline? There was literally NO NEED to do this, he already had the lore established, he only had to create a game showing us the story he'd already laid out. He has blatantly deceived fans for the sole purpose of fucking Konami over.
Fuck that man, I hope his wife took a shit in his birthday cake yesterday.

The guy is another Peter Molyneux, hypes things up so much, the whole world trembles when it all falls apart.
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He didn't do it to fuck over Konami because he never knew Konami would fuck over him in the first place. Kojima had planned this twist since the very beginning. I'd say 2011, but definitely by the time Ground Zeroes was revealed.

I'm still sure that MGSV was never supposed to be his last MGS title. He laid the groundwork for an MGS6 down the line.
 
shocky2002 said:
He didn't do it to fuck over Konami because he never knew Konami would fuck over him in the first place. Kojima had planned this twist since the very beginning. I'd say 2011, but definitely by the time Ground Zeroes was revealed.
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He was going to leave the MG team anyway so if he wanted to he could do it. Anyway, after a little thinking I'm warming to the "story" I still hate the MG1 retcon though, that shits fucked.

Anyway did that guy PM anyone? I wanna see his stream.
 
shocky2002 said:
Nope. MGS1-3 stories were made up on the fly, but they were never trash. Try again.
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You're not too sharp when it comes to the whole "opinions" thing are you m80?
I don't doubt you've got another A grade rebuttal to explain how my opinion is wrong, but I'll pass on replying as I don't want to derail any further.
 
shocky2002 said:
He didn't do it to fuck over Konami because he never knew Konami would fuck over him in the first place. Kojima had planned this twist since the very beginning. I'd say 2011, but definitely by the time Ground Zeroes was revealed.

I'm still sure that MGSV was never supposed to be his last MGS title. He laid the groundwork for an MGS6 down the line.
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MGS4 was where he wanted it to end, but when they started PW they wanted it to be MGS5 as it was first advertised, but they weren't getting anywhere and after the fuck up of Portable Ops, he had to come back and do it himself.
BUT, after he did PW he said he felt inspired once again, first time since MGS3, so that's where MGSV came from.
 
Just read about the "twist." I think it's awesome, quite frankly. If I could get past the iffy dialogue and VA performances I've seen, and the uncomfortable surgery and torture scenes (I'm squeamish), I'd be interested in this game.

I do still feel a yearning to try it, though. Even though MGS4 was terribly fractured and flawed, it had a certain something to it that makes me nostalgic.
 
KJRS_1993 said:
You're not too sharp when it comes to the whole "opinions" thing are you m80?
I don't doubt you've got another A grade rebuttal to explain how my opinion is wrong, but I'll pass on replying as I don't want to derail any further.
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You never supported your opinion in the first place. You just called the MGS plotline trash because they were "made up on the hoof", whatever the fuck that was supposed to mean. MGS had never been bad story wise until Fukushima left and Kojima decided he needed to explain everything for us.
 
That whole mindfuck reminds me of a Kojima quote from 2014

There’s something of a big feature involved. It’s never been done in the games industry before. So I can’t go into detail about it, but I think when you experience it for yourselves you’ll be surprised. It’s something that’s only possible through video games.
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ToMjGpuDlPJP9k5NHdC.gif
 
shocky2002 said:
You never supported your opinion in the first place. You just called the MGS plotline trash because they were "made up on the hoof", whatever the fuck that was supposed to mean. MGS had never been bad story wise until Fukushima left and Kojima decided he needed to explain everything for us.
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But here's the deal (And I'm playing Devil's Advocate here since I disagree with you both). How can you objectively demonstrate that all Metal Gear plotlines are NOT trash?

I mean, you seem pretty insistent on MGS4 starting the "trash" storytelling tendency, yet you don't provide any objective arguments on that. The only difference between your opinion and his, is on where they started being trash.

And yes, as he said, they are only opinions.
 
shocky2002 said:
You never supported your opinion in the first place. You just called the MGS plotline trash because they were "made up on the hoof", whatever the fuck that was supposed to mean. MGS had never been bad story wise until Fukushima left and Kojima decided he needed to explain everything for us.
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Can you explain to me the repercussions of Fukushima leaving, and who is he?
 
I personally love this idea. But you have to look at it in the right way.

Having something like this spoiled in this way really lessens the impact obviously but also changes the person's entire outlook on the game.

Now just imagine if you wouldn't have spoiled the game for yourself. Imagine PLAYING the game actually assuming that you were BB.. then slowly piecing it together. You might be mad, and even angry with Kojima. You might think it's stupid and an awful idea.. and it might be... but you are in the same boat as the character. You feel betrayed and lied too and taken advantage of. It's a pretty devious thing to do.. and everyone is in on it except you.

Knowing fully everything that's happened totally changes the experience and instead you go in pissed off cause you aren't playing at the real BB. Then you're just mad..but not in the way the game wants you to be.
 
After knowing all this, I'll have lots of fun trying to analyze everything that happens to prove/disprove all of this

Spares me a second run with my limited time

But I guess it's time to get out of this thread
It has been a joy being here with you all

Salute
 
Remij said:
I personally love this idea. But you have to look at it in the right way.

Having something like this spoiled in this way really lessens the impact obviously but also changes the person's entire outlook on the game.

Now just imagine if you wouldn't have spoiled the game for yourself. Imagine PLAYING the game actually assuming that you were BB.. then slowly piecing it together. You might be mad, and even angry with Kojima. You might think it's stupid and an awful idea.. and it might be... but you are in the same boat as the character. You feel betrayed and lied too and taken advantage of. It's a pretty devious thing to do.. and everyone is in on it except you.

Knowing fully everything that's happened totally changes the experience and instead you go in pissed off cause you aren't playing at the real BB. Then you're just mad..but not in the way the game wants you to be.
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.
 
bad said:
Can you explain to me the repercussions of Fukushima leaving, and who is he?
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He was co-writer for 1-3. He left, then we got 4, PW, and now TPP. I was convinced it was just an unlucky trend before the TPP spoilers came.

Ishida said:
But here's the deal (And I'm playing Devil's Advocate here since I disagree with you both). How can you objectively demonstrate that all Metal Gear plotlines are NOT trash?

I mean, you seem pretty insistent on MGS4 starting the "trash" storytelling tendency, yet you don't provide any objective arguments on that. The only difference between your opinion and his, is on where they started being trash.

And yes, as he said, they are only opinions.
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He's wrong and I really don't feel like going over the brilliance of Metal Gear Solid 2 again when it should be well known by now.
 
BlastKiller said:
That whole mindfuck reminds me of a Kojima quote from 2014
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That was in reference to some kind of import bonus from GZ, not the main campaign. And we still don't know what that is.

My own personal headcanon is that Cipher sent Big Boss that tape to fuck with him. As far as I'm concerned, he's still the real Big Boss. None of this doppleganger bullshit.
 
shocky2002 said:
He was co-writer for 1-3. He left, then we got 4, PW, and now TPP. I was convinced it was just an unlucky trend before the TPP spoilers came.



He's wrong and I really don't feel like going over the brilliance of Metal Gear Solid 2 again when it should be well known by now.
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What's brilliant to some can be crap to others. And viceversa.

Remember, there is no "universal opinion" about anything.
 
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