Makes you grow a long ass horn because you're pure evil.
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SPOILER: Spoiler Metal Gear Solid V (TPS) Spoiler Thread (Contains Spoilers, Thanos).
- Thread starter Love Deterrence
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Makes you grow a long ass horn because you're pure evil.
freikugeln
Member
The twist did nothing for me. Mgs2s twist made the game. Here l didn't feel neither disappointed nor angry, just empty. Like what's the point? To somehow pass a message about us the player being Big Boss and helping shaping his legacy? Was it worth it when you hurt the narrative so bad with the whole silent Venom Snake character and create an even bigger mess with the storyline.
The characters motivations were shaky and actions made no sense
Why did BB go solo when Kaz was his best friend and instrumental in setting up and expanding his operations. Also he casually left Skull face, the man who destroyed everything he had built, killed most of his comrades and put him in a 9 year coma for a body double to take care of?
Speaking of Skull face, couldn't Zero get rid of him for 9+ years?
Then we have Kaz in the end decide to destroy BB (but somehow join him again in Foxhound some years later)
Instead of watching BB descend to evil we see Zero in a more favorable light. Even Venom looks like a cop out compared to Kaz , Huey and Eli.
In the end the most disappointing thing is that Kojima had the perfect premise ready if only he didnt go off the rails. Follow BB in setting up Outer Heaven, showcase the origin stories of characters like Sniper Wolf,Frank Jaeger,etc and bridge everything to MG1.What we got is another side story with some ham-fisted twists and retcons just to be able to justify its relevance in the series.
The characters motivations were shaky and actions made no sense
Why did BB go solo when Kaz was his best friend and instrumental in setting up and expanding his operations. Also he casually left Skull face, the man who destroyed everything he had built, killed most of his comrades and put him in a 9 year coma for a body double to take care of?
Speaking of Skull face, couldn't Zero get rid of him for 9+ years?
Then we have Kaz in the end decide to destroy BB (but somehow join him again in Foxhound some years later)
Instead of watching BB descend to evil we see Zero in a more favorable light. Even Venom looks like a cop out compared to Kaz , Huey and Eli.
In the end the most disappointing thing is that Kojima had the perfect premise ready if only he didnt go off the rails. Follow BB in setting up Outer Heaven, showcase the origin stories of characters like Sniper Wolf,Frank Jaeger,etc and bridge everything to MG1.What we got is another side story with some ham-fisted twists and retcons just to be able to justify its relevance in the series.
The Silver
Member
Those games already exist in some canon limbo slightly above Portable Ops, the only things you need to keep from them are the main plot points, i.e the only things mentioned in the Solid games.
All the bosses would probably be changed up besides Grey Fox and BB, the characters will act differently(unlikely BB will be the full on warmonger he was in MG2), Ocelot might show up or have an actual good reason for not being around, all that shit about oil will probably be gone, etc etc.
Really the actual details of the Zanzibar Land Disturbance as seen/told through the MGS games are vague as shit, Outer Heaven Uprising is a little better since people keep copying it so we have an idea of what it was like.
choclaterra
Member
Can't pinpoint it but it definitely sounds like most of SH2's OST.
Ether_Snake
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Thanks. No idea why it reminds me of a Silent Hill track. Maybe, my memory is fuzzy lol.
Oh no. Oh nooo! Watch MG1's Foxhound Big Boss be Miller. Master Miller, Master of Disguise!
He also has the berret BB had in TPW.
Yeah, like it's making the good guys look evil, and the bad guys look good. Even Ocelot looks like a good guy. Ok Eli was always kind of evil though. Is it The Patriots rewriting history??
edit: Is Miller blind? He says it's just bright when V asks him, but his iris are messed up.
Doctor_Thomas
Member
DID YOU LIKE MY EYEPATCH?
robotoboy20
Banned
Wow... Huey is a horrendous POS... what a horrible character... he's the real villain in all of this.
Doctor_Thomas
Member
Constantly. He has no redeeming features what so ever.
Which is sort of cool, to have someone who isn't a typical villain but is a piece of shit all the way through.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
You gotta feel for him though, they've thrown him down stairs multiple times. That gets to you!
Huey's only purpose is to make Otacon seem far better by comparison.
Speaking of Sins of the Father, I laughed when I realized "words that kill" was literal.
Big Boss and Solid.
Huey and Otacon.
Solidus and Raiden.
It's all about kids being better than the Sins of the Father. By that logic, Sunny is going to surpass them all.Huey and Otacon.
Solidus and Raiden.
Speaking of Sins of the Father, I laughed when I realized "words that kill" was literal.
That's strange to me too.. Kaz really loses a lot here, he believed in the MB and it get destroyed, he then loses limbs (and more) and BB's trust. He acts from start like a mad man, he gets worse but not that much.. so, while his arc is not really well done (he jumps from point A to point B in a blink of an eye, basically), he's the only one in the group that actually feel like a "demon". Something similar for BB would've worked, by making him experience nightmares and hallucinations like the one with Paz..
When we kill our soldiers, for example, it would be nicer if we did not have a good reason. Let's say BB goes to sleep and we play some kind of MGS3's nightmare, just to realize later, when he wakes up, that we killed a lot of our men. Anything would work better than this Punished Venom Snake aka Idonthavemuchtosay Snake.
Doctor_Thomas
Member
Selfish, a bit naive and a bit vindictive, he's also a massive hypocrite. He's not a threat to the world, as such, but a liability to all around him, which is a
robotoboy20
Banned
This is an extremely meta-game... Not necessarily in a witty way, but it is.
The FOB's mirror outerheaven, and both players can play as Snake/BB... you can effectively have your Operation Intrude 313 in the form of multiplayer... I know it's kind of a pathetic way to insert that... but that's what FOB's remind me of.
The FOB's mirror outerheaven, and both players can play as Snake/BB... you can effectively have your Operation Intrude 313 in the form of multiplayer... I know it's kind of a pathetic way to insert that... but that's what FOB's remind me of.
Certinty
Member
It's still hilarious how he pleads innocent all the time. He's the type of guy that would murder someone on CCTV with 100 witnesses and still plead innocent in court. Thankfully he wasn't in the game much anyway.
robotoboy20
Banned
I don't though... Huey killed Strangelove, and tried to use his son to experiment.. not to mention constantly betraying BB... that dude is a sociopath, and sociopaths deserve nothing... glad his "legs" had to get ditched into the ocean.
The Silver
Member
What about Little John, well he be the Snake to Sunny's Otacon/Huey
but then who was Raiden's Otacon, can two people share an Otacon?
What about Solidus, does Fatman count, he's smart right?
what am I talking about?
SomedayTheFire
Member
Huey is the REAL villain of the series anyway. Horrendously awful character.
yeah. i liked the revelations about huey and it definitely made him more than just faux-otacon.
that tape where he points out how the whole base is deluded into calling DD a dog when he's clearly a wolf is great.
robotoboy20
Banned
Lol, right!? I will always dream of that mission... it's the one that got away.
Ether_Snake
å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®
Well I think Miller is being setup to be a villain from BB's point of view. Solid Snake being trained by him makes sense considering that he'll be used to take out BB. Plus, if the next game has you play Big Boss or V again and end with SS being sent to take OH down, Miller being behind this in some way even in MG1 not just MG2, it makes sense.
Miller is all about revenge, it's like his super power. Eventually, Eli or Ocelot kills him though
BTW I said it before but; why the heck didn't Zero make a phantom of his own? Guy is as much if not more wanted than Big Boss, and if he did make one Skull Face would have failed in infecting him, he would have infected the phantom.
edit: Yeah I like Huey being crazy, but he seemed more naive than anything no?
Gotta train people to take down Outer Heaven! VR Mission!
Miller is all about revenge, it's like his super power. Eventually, Eli or Ocelot kills him though
BTW I said it before but; why the heck didn't Zero make a phantom of his own? Guy is as much if not more wanted than Big Boss, and if he did make one Skull Face would have failed in infecting him, he would have infected the phantom.
edit: Yeah I like Huey being crazy, but he seemed more naive than anything no?
Gotta train people to take down Outer Heaven! VR Mission!
The Silver
Member
Just pretend Liquid stashed it in the same place he put the RAY "he" stole at the end of MGS2, he didnt use it again because Mantis got nerfed somehow.
funkystudent
Member
I kind of liked how he wasn't just a Otacon double like he was in peace walker but yeah. A weird direction to go with him for sure
Doctor_Thomas
Member
Responsible for the Peace Walker incident
Responsible for the destruction of MSF
Responsible for the Sahelanthropus incident
Killed Strangelove
Used Otacon as a test subject.
He should have been pushed down the stairs more.
entremet
Member
How does he do it? He attracts beautiful women like nobody's business lol.
METAL GEAR FUTURE:
Mobile Microtrans Action
He's strange when it comes to love.
SomedayTheFire
Member
As an Otacon clone he was the worst written, most pointless character. As this piece of shit he's just unbearable.
JehutyRunner
Banned
So where does Zero pop up in the game? I've to see him (if in cutscenes at all) or hear him on any of the tapes.
Cassette: Truth Records after beating the Truth mission.
Is there a cutscene with it or anything? I have the materials for it but I don't really want to blow them if it's literally just a "wipeout someone's FOB troops" thing (since that'd make them invade me over and over and that's the last thing I want).
Is there a specific website for these? They're awesome.
robotoboy20
Banned
I think that's the point, you're supposed to hate him. He sounds endlessly manipulative and full of himself constantly... he tries to play up his innocense by whining all the time, and ends up sounds extremely sociopathic... which it seems all of Diamond Dogs sees through.
It made all the main characters look stupid though. He keeps betraying them and they know it but they do nothing about it until the later half of the game.
I love how he somehow survived adrift in the pacific ocean just to die in his swimming pool decades later. Ultra poetic deserved death for a total wanker.
Stallion Dan
Member
I don't see the point in making a nuke, since you can get invaded while offline in the middle of the night and have no defense against it.
And that can cost you your entire staff? Why would anyone do that?
Would reloading a backed up save stop that?
And that can cost you your entire staff? Why would anyone do that?
Would reloading a backed up save stop that?
robotoboy20
Banned
Eh he mostly made Venom Snake/Big Boss look stupid... because he was the one who kept forgiving him. Ocelot was enjoying the quality time he got to spend with him, and Miller never trusted him.
Death Metalist
Member
You lose 50,000 hero points as well.
Edit: Apparently you'll get all bloody as well and you can't wash it off until you get more hero points. Aside from the stuff you mentioned.
It's a pretty smart way of Kojima stating his opinion of nuclear arms.
The one thing I don't understand is why Ocelot seems different in this one, especially since he is the main constant in the series.
- In MGS3 he was cocky and made cat noises.
- In TPP he seems mostly serious.
- MGS1 onwards, he seems to have gone insane, maybe senile from old age.
This is why I think going more serious for this game makes it stand out because everyone seems to have gotten serious for 5 years of their life before they go back to being loons in the timeline.
- In MGS3 he was cocky and made cat noises.
- In TPP he seems mostly serious.
- MGS1 onwards, he seems to have gone insane, maybe senile from old age.
This is why I think going more serious for this game makes it stand out because everyone seems to have gotten serious for 5 years of their life before they go back to being loons in the timeline.
SkylineRKR
Member
You know I think this story isn't so bad, Ch 2 is pretty good. Bar the clone thing. But Huey should be executed. This was too weak. He also fucked up the Skull Face cutscene. Though an Emmerich always fucks up a certain scene so that I could dig.
I dunno, but the timeline confirms it anyway.
I dunno, but the timeline confirms it anyway.
What I've experienced of FOBs has been terrible. Remaining in offline mode.
EMERGENCY MISSION
*Accept Mission*
*Can't create session*
*Can't create session*
"Uhh, okay I'll go offline"
*Emergency sign hangs over ACC*
*Go do a couple missions*
*After finishing missions get a call from Miller to come back to Mother Base, boohoo cutscene about how we were attacked.*
When I actually did some infiltrating and defending, it wasn't that fun anyway. Most people don't have the money to have more than one platform.
I REALLY hope your SP game isn't online when playing MGO.
EMERGENCY MISSION
*Accept Mission*
*Can't create session*
*Can't create session*
"Uhh, okay I'll go offline"
*Emergency sign hangs over ACC*
*Go do a couple missions*
*After finishing missions get a call from Miller to come back to Mother Base, boohoo cutscene about how we were attacked.*
When I actually did some infiltrating and defending, it wasn't that fun anyway. Most people don't have the money to have more than one platform.
I REALLY hope your SP game isn't online when playing MGO.
what happens to venom snake is so fucked.
imo, the fact big boss just goes along with it is his pivotal turn to 'evil'. he lets one of his best men undergo the almost total erasure of their personality in order to create himself a body double to draw fire when the whole world is out to kill him. sounds like when saddam was using body doubles when he feared being assassinated. not to mention he pretty much abandons miller. more or less left him to die had venom snake not been successful at rescuing him. no wonder he defected to cipher.
by the time of the ending of the truth mission, venom snake seems so fucking warped by war and the idea of being big boss that he just rejects his own identity despite knowing the truth, so he can continue to be big boss. the idea of big boss sharing his legend with venom snake is fucked up too, being big boss is to be forever at war. it's not a blessing, it's a curse. his clones know that by simply being his genes, let alone like venom snake being his meme.
why does big boss do this? i dunno. i think nine years in a coma was enough to convince him to get out of the for-profit war game and create a military nation instead. just went "fuck this, someone else can draw the fire while i do the important stuff and realise the boss' will". in one of the tapes there are mentions jokingly about how mother base's finances don't add up and it's implied miller's burger operation is the cause, but what if it were big boss skimming off the top to finance outer heaven?
what's even more fucked up is that the timeline at the end of the truth mission implies big boss made venom snake die in his place. maybe the MSX loading noise was a way to trigger something in venom snake's brainwashing, ala the manchurian candidate. his mission is to protect the real big boss at all costs, even if that means dying for him.
big boss is a true scumbag.
imo, the fact big boss just goes along with it is his pivotal turn to 'evil'. he lets one of his best men undergo the almost total erasure of their personality in order to create himself a body double to draw fire when the whole world is out to kill him. sounds like when saddam was using body doubles when he feared being assassinated. not to mention he pretty much abandons miller. more or less left him to die had venom snake not been successful at rescuing him. no wonder he defected to cipher.
by the time of the ending of the truth mission, venom snake seems so fucking warped by war and the idea of being big boss that he just rejects his own identity despite knowing the truth, so he can continue to be big boss. the idea of big boss sharing his legend with venom snake is fucked up too, being big boss is to be forever at war. it's not a blessing, it's a curse. his clones know that by simply being his genes, let alone like venom snake being his meme.
why does big boss do this? i dunno. i think nine years in a coma was enough to convince him to get out of the for-profit war game and create a military nation instead. just went "fuck this, someone else can draw the fire while i do the important stuff and realise the boss' will". in one of the tapes there are mentions jokingly about how mother base's finances don't add up and it's implied miller's burger operation is the cause, but what if it were big boss skimming off the top to finance outer heaven?
what's even more fucked up is that the timeline at the end of the truth mission implies big boss made venom snake die in his place. maybe the MSX loading noise was a way to trigger something in venom snake's brainwashing, ala the manchurian candidate. his mission is to protect the real big boss at all costs, even if that means dying for him.
big boss is a true scumbag.
i'm giving the twist way more credit than it deserves
AHA-Lambda
Member
Okay, just finished!
I have a lot of questions!!
1) Why does the phantom have Big Boss' voice? Was this part of the surgery?
2) Why does the phantom believe he is Big Boss? Why does Ocelot know this also?
3) Why change his face to Big Boss' anyway? Was the doctor in on it and all this was planned from the off, for the phantom to take his place?
4) Did Big Boss wake up from his coma at the same time? Pretty convenient.
5) Credit list mentions that Zero got attacked by the parasites, is this referenced anywhere in game?
6) Zero is listed in the credits, where is he?
7) So Big Boss was trying to establish Outer Heaven, how? Surely that's what Ocelot, Kaz and the phantom were doing anyway?
8) What about Eli? One of the tapes says he can't be Big Boss' clone?!
9) I'm not exactly seeing how after the events of the game that this puts Big Boss or his phantom in the position as the bad guy for Metal Gear 1 and 2 really =/
10) What was on the Operation Intrude tape? I know that's the events of MG1.
Some other observations:
One of the early trailers showed Big Boss on the Triumph bike but with the horn in his head, so that scene is missing.
Also the song "Friday I'm in Love" came out in 1992.
I have a lot of questions!!
1) Why does the phantom have Big Boss' voice? Was this part of the surgery?
2) Why does the phantom believe he is Big Boss? Why does Ocelot know this also?
3) Why change his face to Big Boss' anyway? Was the doctor in on it and all this was planned from the off, for the phantom to take his place?
4) Did Big Boss wake up from his coma at the same time? Pretty convenient.
5) Credit list mentions that Zero got attacked by the parasites, is this referenced anywhere in game?
6) Zero is listed in the credits, where is he?
7) So Big Boss was trying to establish Outer Heaven, how? Surely that's what Ocelot, Kaz and the phantom were doing anyway?
8) What about Eli? One of the tapes says he can't be Big Boss' clone?!
9) I'm not exactly seeing how after the events of the game that this puts Big Boss or his phantom in the position as the bad guy for Metal Gear 1 and 2 really =/
10) What was on the Operation Intrude tape? I know that's the events of MG1.
Some other observations:
One of the early trailers showed Big Boss on the Triumph bike but with the horn in his head, so that scene is missing.
Also the song "Friday I'm in Love" came out in 1992.
SkylineRKR
Member
How is Truth unlocked btw?
I had done all yellow Side ops, and main missions until 47 or so. And Command centre at 4/4, rest at 3/4 and 2/4. Truth was unlocked with missions until 50. It doesn't seem clear.
I had done all yellow Side ops, and main missions until 47 or so. And Command centre at 4/4, rest at 3/4 and 2/4. Truth was unlocked with missions until 50. It doesn't seem clear.
Death Metalist
Member
It isn't. It's an engaging story with or without the twist. I was engaged before the twist and by the time the twist came well the game ended lol. It's an alright story, great tapes on many different things and amazing gameplay. Better than PW in every way but falls short when compared to the first four.
You know after knowing wormholes existed in MGS5 I was thinking that the twist would include some time travel lol. I mean that's how far and batshit insane I thought Kojima would go, then again I always loved MGS for the over the top insanity, great memorable characters, stories, themes and all.
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