SPOILER: Spoiler Metal Gear Solid V (TPS) Spoiler Thread (Contains Spoilers, Thanos).
- Thread starter Love Deterrence
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Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
And the gunfire in the background is Solid Snake killing your Diamond Dogs.
Naw, Metal Gear ends with Big Boss saying he is still alive.
That's literally been what he's doing for years. Metal Gear is born out of Kojima's love for B action movies. It's just him trying to transplant cheesy one liners into a a more serious context.
Anyway, if we're using gameplays events as explanation, he grows the horn because he makes a nuke. Likely Metal Gear.
What if that's Venom saying he's still alive?
What if the real Big Boss actually died at the end of Metal Gear 2?
What if it was Venom at the end of MGS4?
What if they needed Solidus' body to make Venom look like the real OG Boss without scars and shrapnel?
What if Kojima played us like a damn fiddle?!
Blackstarhat
Member
how do i get mission 43
Oh shit, I forgot about that, That had got my hopes up at the start for something SolidSnakey. I'm still a bit underwhelmed that we're not likely to see remakes of MG/MG2.
I want to like this ending. But it's kind of pissing me off.
There's so much they could've done with this to close the circle and instead it's "lol you weren't really Big Boss for the last 40 hours, you were you! GOTCHAAAAAAA. Oh by the way, Liquid was there, and Psycho Mantis was there, and Volgin was there, see it's all connected! Now get ready, Solid Snake's coming to push your shit in! Have fun, k bye."
There's so much they could've done with this to close the circle and instead it's "lol you weren't really Big Boss for the last 40 hours, you were you! GOTCHAAAAAAA. Oh by the way, Liquid was there, and Psycho Mantis was there, and Volgin was there, see it's all connected! Now get ready, Solid Snake's coming to push your shit in! Have fun, k bye."
Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO?!
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
Actually the more I think about it the more I like the idea that Big Boss has basically fucked over some random dude and sent someone to kill him.
Still wish Phantom did some more evil shit in MGSV, I wanted to be evil.
Still wish Phantom did some more evil shit in MGSV, I wanted to be evil.
Ether_Snake
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Which one, exactly? I don't remember this.
Northeastmonk
Gold Member
I'm going over this in my head and trying to just get it down to a simple thought.
So you got to see MGS3/PW/GZ's Snake, but he didn't really lose an arm? He sorta left the legend and the name to Medic?
I'm still shocked that you weren't the BB.
I got the whole mirror crashing scene and his information, but I'm just wondering if I'm putting this together right. I read here in the thread that BB is the legend. It's probably already been said before in this threat, but I'm a bit shocked. I saw the scene, but I didn't want to believe it.
Edit: It was just answered. I'm still shocked.
So you got to see MGS3/PW/GZ's Snake, but he didn't really lose an arm? He sorta left the legend and the name to Medic?
I'm still shocked that you weren't the BB.
I got the whole mirror crashing scene and his information, but I'm just wondering if I'm putting this together right. I read here in the thread that BB is the legend. It's probably already been said before in this threat, but I'm a bit shocked. I saw the scene, but I didn't want to believe it.
Edit: It was just answered. I'm still shocked.
It's literally the first thing you see.
It's what had me convinced the twist was gonna happen as soon as I turned on the game, haha.
I'm not sure if the "Outer Heaven" thing is real or not to be taken literally, since the cutscenes take place on Mother Base obviously.
Also seems odd that Venom wouldn't age at all in 11 years also makes me think it's not supposed to be taken literally.
Not to mention the Diamond Dogs logo plastered everywhere instead of Outer Heaven.
Also seems odd that Venom wouldn't age at all in 11 years also makes me think it's not supposed to be taken literally.
Not to mention the Diamond Dogs logo plastered everywhere instead of Outer Heaven.
Miller didn't know about Venom until the end, thats why he DNA tested Eli, because he thought Venom was BB
I think there's just a conscious effort here to retcon the whole shindig to fit with what see in MGSV.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
What do you mean no?
The tape says "Operation Intrude" on one side, and Big Boss telling Phantom that his entire life has been a lie on the other.
Operation Intrude is MG1, so Big Boss basically told Phantom the truth right before MG1
Well, technically, you, the player are Venom Snake.
It's very 4th wall breaking in that you were Big Boss's most trusted soldier, and you took over.
X
Xpike
Unconfirmed Member
It says Outer Heaven 1995 IIRC, plus the whole Operation Intruder N313 tape.
I think we're supposed to think the Outer Heaven Snake infiltrated in his first mission was a "failed" vision of the thing that Diamond Dogs evolved into, while the "real" Outer Heaven was Zanzibarland that Big Boss was forced to flee into after his phantom was killed.
TheAquaticApe
Member
Parasite suit question. Do I have to keep extracting skulls to get the use of the power?
IE: I extract 1 skull and can use that as 1 power.
IE: I extract 1 skull and can use that as 1 power.
I really don't like that, since I view Solid Snake as a rube, so I'll just pretend I kicked his ass
me being Venom and all.Ether_Snake
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I mean no BB isn't a jerk, he speaks to V as a friend. V nods and smiles, he agrees and understands BB. And that cut audio link I posted just makes it even more obvious, did you listen?
We don't know what happens next, the only hint we get is "hey, eventually MG1 happens". For all we know V went to put some blood makeup to play his role on the stage after the MSX turns on. But until then, there's no indication BB is a jerk, or that V sees him as such at all.
Kaz is a jerk.
I've been saying this for 11 years. This just solidifies it.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
Big Boss endorses child soldiers and destroying third world nations to fuel the flames so he can recruit more kids into the war machine.
Big Boss is a jerk
X
Xpike
Unconfirmed Member
Big Boss didn't even care enough to go rescue Kaz in Afganistan after being his best friend for a while. I'd say Big Boss is a massive jerk.
Northeastmonk
Gold Member
That's such a huge what if scenario. You could almost imagine yourself doing that in other games as well.
"Step aside...I'll be taking over". It's interesting and slightly disappointing.
They could make another game showing what the real BB was doing during the Phantom Pain, but in all honesty I'm fine like this. There's a few loose ends, but I think time and aging did a lot of it.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
XANDER CAGE
Member
I'm pretty sure that reads as a smirk, not a smile. And he... punches the mirror because he's just so stoked about his friend playing him?
Big Boss may be speaking to Venom genuinely, but that doesn't make him any less of a jerk. Just because Big Boss thinks this was a rad idea and that Venom is awesome for doing it, it... doesn't change the fact that he's manipulated the guy pretty heavily.
I disagree I totally love the aspect of being part of the Big Boss mythos. The idea that the player is someone who has been with BB and essentially gets tasked with taking over and becoming part of the legend.
I think most of the people who are disappointed are the ones who were dead set on the game being about BB turning into some mustache twirling villain that they could hate. If there's anything MGS has taught it's that very rarely are there people who are truly evil.
To be technical.. he starts with "Do you remember your mission?" This could mean that Venom knew all along, what his purpose was. He knew all along that he wasn't Big Boss, but we the player who inhabited him, did not, he merely kept the recording to remind himself of why he was doing the things he was doing. To remember his mission, loyalty to the end after all.
Contrived? Yes, would it be fitting for Kojima? Yes.
Alright, I've kind of breezed through the denial phase of this whole thing.
That was terrible. Probably one of the most crushingly disappointing things I've ever experienced. I knew that was going to be the twist almost the moment they made me customize and avatar. Shit, I even made his eyes heterochromic and crazy colored so I could recognize him, because I had a feeling he was either Ishmael or actually BB. After a few hours I forgot that theory because it'd be so fucking dumb. But here we are.
Don't get me wrong, I love the meta idea that "you" the player are Big Boss and the experiences that you've had in MGSV and past games will stay with you even after the series ends, but instead it's that the player was a MSF soldier in-universe who actually took over for Big Boss. I still love the game and think that 99% of it is brilliant, but I want to just ignore that last 1%.
That was terrible. Probably one of the most crushingly disappointing things I've ever experienced. I knew that was going to be the twist almost the moment they made me customize and avatar. Shit, I even made his eyes heterochromic and crazy colored so I could recognize him, because I had a feeling he was either Ishmael or actually BB. After a few hours I forgot that theory because it'd be so fucking dumb. But here we are.
Don't get me wrong, I love the meta idea that "you" the player are Big Boss and the experiences that you've had in MGSV and past games will stay with you even after the series ends, but instead it's that the player was a MSF soldier in-universe who actually took over for Big Boss. I still love the game and think that 99% of it is brilliant, but I want to just ignore that last 1%.
The Silver
Member
hm well Venom doesn't resent Big Boss at all and it seems he would be fine with still working for him, also looking like BB probably didn't send Solid in to Outer Heaven with the intent to kill Venom.
goddamnit wtf happened at Outer Heaven, I'm waiting for the 3rd Big Boss now.
well this is cut content so it shouldn't be taken as gospel but yeah.
Ether_Snake
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He smiles, nods, and only after the MSX turns on does he come back and punch the mirror.
Plus, the cut audio is even later after the reveal and he's all "let's make the world a better place" thing. You guys really think an MSX literally turned on right there? What about him being inside the mirror?
Exactly, and the cut audio ends with "another mission uh Boss?".
I think SS is sent to kill BB in the same way BB was sent to kill The Boss. The Patriots/whoever wanted so, but BB/The Boss used it as an opportunity to pass over their legacy. In this case, BB wants SS to hate him so he never becomes like him.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
Phantom had no idea, that's why we the player had the last mission be TRUTH.
I mean, the dude smashes the mirror, I don't think he's exactly happy that he has found out his current existence is nothing but a lie to cover for some for an entire decade, and I'm sure he was very pleased to find out that Big Boss was sending his personal protege to fucking kill him.
XANDER CAGE
Member
No, that's actually specifically why it's disappointing. Because we don't actually see what the real Big Boss is up to, he is still basically a mustache twirling villain that we don't really understand from MG1 up until his speech in MGS4.
MGSV's twist and story is disappointing specifically because it doesn't show us things from Big Boss's perspective. We don't get to see him as a rounded out villain. He's off in the shadows preparing to become the bad guy in a different game.
The cut audio was cut for a reason, clearly. I'm discussing what I think of the ending as it is, not what it could have been.
But it does tie into the overall theme that has been going through all of the games. Legends are rarely all they are cracked up to be. And with Big Boss, his legacy was filled with lies and mis-representation. In the end, Big Boss isn't a person, he is an Icon, an idea to people. It doesn't matter who he is, what matters is what he stands for. Big Boss is a title after all, not a person.
So I'm guessing this old poster was referring to BB and V, not Solid and Liquid like most of us assumed?
This makes it a little easier to swallow. I like that interpretation of it. I just want to know if that was Kojima's intent all along, or if that's us trying to rationalize a bad ending.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
MGSV story is disappointing not only because of what it was, but because of what it wasn't.
This should have been the bridge, the bridge between what Big Boss did between MSF and Metal Gear. The game to fill the gap to see Big Boss really turn into a bad person and start doing some not good shit, to see the actual development of Outer Heaven and into the intro of Metal Gear to come full circle.
Instead of have more questions and no fucking answers over that very gap that we were hoping was going to be filled. The only question I got answered was why Kaz had a falling out with Big Boss, that was it, everything else is still a mystery to me and the world.
This should have been the bridge, the bridge between what Big Boss did between MSF and Metal Gear. The game to fill the gap to see Big Boss really turn into a bad person and start doing some not good shit, to see the actual development of Outer Heaven and into the intro of Metal Gear to come full circle.
Instead of have more questions and no fucking answers over that very gap that we were hoping was going to be filled. The only question I got answered was why Kaz had a falling out with Big Boss, that was it, everything else is still a mystery to me and the world.
Ether_Snake
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Same reason as the rest. You couldn't have ANOTHER ending right after the ending. It was probably meant to be an ending post mission 51/more missions.
Whatever the case, V looks like he's fine with what BB says. It's only after putting in the N313 tape in and the MSX turns on that he comes back looking evil. And it's only after the MSX turns on that nothing looks real at all anymore.
MAX PAYMENT
Member
So... when is the mother base massacre?
Edit: 43. Didn't see someone answered me earlier.
Edit: 43. Didn't see someone answered me earlier.
XANDER CAGE
Member
I really cannot agree that he looks "fine" with what he's being told. He smirks, perhaps even grimaces, and punches the mirror. He's not a happy camper.
Ether_Snake
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Why do you reinvent what actually happened? He smiles, then nods. Tape goes in, MSX turns on, magically comes back with blood and punches a mirror in which he is on the other side of. So what actually happens for sure is what happens before the tape is in. He does not "smirk and punches the mirror".
V remembers what his mission is and proceeds with the "next" one.
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