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[snake_eater_raiden]

Unbelievable.



Those scenes are not in the fucking game. Snake falls to his knees TWO TIMES, one at mother base and one was in africa, it's not just the "to his knees falling", it's the whole scenes from the beginning of the E3 2014 trailer, same for the kids learning how to shoot. IT IS MISSING.

It's one thing to cut something that isn't even close to finish, concept art etc. but those scenes were pretty much done. The africa walking over burned corpses scene for example was from the fucking E3 2014 trailer.

Now that i see all this it could be one of the reasons for the Kojima and Konami fallout. Kojima wanted to keep those scenes in but Konami said nope too taboo. Remember Kojima said he's not sure if he can release the game at this state.

Goddammit.

Dude, Please stop blaming Konami.

Kojima had:

1. $80 million budget
2. Seven years

To make mgs5. He failed to meet deadlines. Simple. Remember he is the producer as well so completing the game is his responsibility. Instead of working on the game he wasted his time on Twitter, stupid events etc.

Konami is evil sure...but whatever happened with MGS5 is 100% Kojima's fault.

So stop blaming Konami in this case Boss.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

I think it was. I remember he made it sound like it was bone and I'm pretty sure he said it would grow as the game progressed, as you do worse shit. But nah, it's just a piece of metal.

It actually does grow if you raise your 'demon' points up.

Dude, Please stop blaming Konami.

Kojima had:

1. $80 million budget
2. Seven years

To make mgs5. He failed to meet deadlines. Simple. Remember he is the producer as well so completing the game is his responsibility. Instead of working on the game he wasted his time on Twitter, stupid events etc.

Konami is evil sure...but whatever happened with MGS5 is 100% Kojima's fault.

So stop blaming Konami in this case Boss.

If Kojima had a habit of shipping incomplete games, I'd agree with you. But Konami probably forced him to rush out the release. I mean, things like the Lisa decoy which were in the game at some point were removed for no reason, except for most likely exec meddling.

 

[ZeroX03]

I would blame Konami for wanting to get the game out as fast as possible, yes it got delayed multiple times and over budget but just rushing the game out of the gate doesn't help anyone. Also they created a brand new engine basically for this game, to make MGS into an open world game, what did they expect? of course it would be a very ambitious project.

Five years isn't fast enough to get a game out?

What about Kojima? He was told when he needed the game to be out by and how much money he would be given. And you're saying it's Konami's fault for not acquiescing to him when he couldn't do that? Actually, they did. They gave him more money and more time. And he still couldn't do it so they fired him. And that's their fault?

Step back and think about this if it was someone other than Kojima and a company other than Konami.

 

[Arion]

I would not mind a cutscene only ep 51 as DLC. I don't really want to fight Sahelanthropus again anyway.

Fighting a powered up Sahelanthropus+Eli+Psycho Mantis with the entire Diamond Dogs legion backing you up would have been awesome. It would be a great way to tie up the game.

 

[NeonBlack]

What pisses me off is that in Kojimas goodbye video --- He talked with Baker... Don't get me wrong Baker's not bad, but that man is a DIVA! He acts so hoity and hot... and he's a giant narcissistic douche... he got lucky in his career in VA because he was originally the lead singer for Trip Fontaine who had a one hit wonder, and they were going for like a "nickleback/nirvana" thing... needless to say he was an idiot then too. He's even tried making an album starring just himself recently because that's what he wants... music fame, not VA fame lol. Again he's not a complete ass, but he a pretty ditsy, and airheaded drama queen.

Anyways Baker gets to be in the "goodbye MGS" video they made, and he's like "Thanks for letting me known for this legendary series!" even though Hayter has been in EVERY SINGLE MGS title until this one (and GZ) and Bakers been in this one, voicing Ocelot in a bored John Wayne impression... Like Hayter isn't iconicized as the voice of Snake... the titular character of the series.

-- Hey Baker! You're not that awesome okay... you do good work when you need to be in some dramatic TV acting type stuff... You did a decent joker (assuming you just liked the joker, and that's why you tried so hard) and Joel from Last of Us wasn't awful... Hell I love you as Rhys in Tales from the Borderlands... but you are not the end all be all of VA, you're a pretty boy and a name... but that's it... so was Nolan North, you 're replaceable.

Troy, I think you have a disgruntled stalker.

 

[Lemonte]

Kids learning to shoot scene is not missing. It was in one of the first missions in africa but it wasn't a cutscene.

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

This page seems to be lacking something....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xeGE_5kSI0

 

[Zombie James]

It actually does grow if you raise your 'demon' points up.

What's a demon point? Did I seriously put over 50 hours into this thing and never knew about it?

 

[BrokenIcarus]

I think it was. I remember he made it sound like it was bone and I'm pretty sure he said it would grow as the game progressed, as you do worse shit. But nah, it's just a piece of metal.

Urgh, I somehow really dislike this, but on the other hand I really love how MGS2 does the same thing.

I don't know what to feel anymore ;_;

 

[TheLostBigBoss]

What's a demon point? Did I seriously put over 50 hours into this thing and never knew about it?

u build nukes and kill people

but it doesn't matter because u r already a demon

 

[Sn4ke_911]

Konami waited 7 years to go from MGS4 to MGSV. If that's Konami wanting it out "as fast as possible" they really are patient.

They let Kojima put his team on a PSP game. They let his team spend years on a spin-off that Konami has to eventually pay another development studio to make.

Let's not slander Konami now. They've been fantastic with Metal Gear for 28 years.

That includes creating the Fox Engine so if you think about it that isn't really that long. Just look at other open world games like GTA or Fallout, these games are a looong ass time in the oven.

Again i blame Konami for underestimating Kojima, they've been working now with this man for over 28 years they should know how passionate he is.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

Ive met the man. Ur pulling this out of ur ass.

I think he's upset he's a good looking, charismatic guy. Salt. lol

I can't get over the feels of that timeskip ending. It's by far my favorite part of the game. The way it's set up, though, makes me feel like what we see are actually two different scenarios presented in an artistic manner:

-Venom listening to the tape about the truth. I don't think this actually happens in this scene, but at some point before. It has to be soon before as both sides of the tape imply that it was sent in '95.

-Venom listening to Operation Intrude and going to carry it out/fight Solid Snake.

The Diamond Dogs logos on his suit and the door make it seem like this isn't '95, but '84. But again, that has to do with the whole "things are not as they seem" motif this game has going. As soon as Venom punches the mirror, the Diamond Dogs logo transforms into the Outer Heaven logo, and the "truth" is revealed and we see that he really is in Outer Heaven. He was probably reminiscing about when he was first "born" as Big Boss - and the DD logos symbolize the first thing he did with the identity. Also notice he's never seen listening to the Man Who Sold the World side of the tape in that particular scene, and its contents play in his head. Interesting stuff.

 

[Nighteyes]

Yes, you have to wear the butterfly emblem you get by eliminating a lot of enemies with Quiet

Thanks for this. Worked like a charm. Now I can go back and look at which Missions to do in order to concentrate only on story-critical ones.

 

[Broken Joystick]

This page seems to be lacking something....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xeGE_5kSI0

wrong one

should be in the OP tbh
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31dsolM10ng

 

[Papercuts]

I would blame Konami for wanting to get the game out as fast as possible, yes it got delayed multiple times and over budget but just rushing the game out of the gate doesn't help anyone. Also they created a brand new engine basically for this game, to make MGS into an open world game, what did they expect? of course it would be a very ambitious project.

It's a business ultimately and if something is bloating the budget like crazy and being delayed repeatedly they eventually take nothing but massive losses on it.

It's really unlikely this is all one sided.

 

[aly]

This page seems to be lacking something....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xeGE_5kSI0

This never stops being hilarious.

 

[TheMagician]

Am I ok to sell precious metals in my resources?

What about placed weapons in the resources?

 

[Auctopus]

Such a lust for revenge in this thread

 

[ZeroX03]

That includes creating the Fox Engine so if you think about it that isn't really that long. Just look at other open world games like GTA or Fallout, these games are a looong ass time in the oven.

Again i blame Konami for underestimating Kojima, they've been working now with this man for over 28 years they should know how passionate he is.

So you blame Konami for giving Kojima a budget and deadline, and then not expecting him to miss it? Do you realize how ridiculous that sounds?

Am I ok to sell precious metals in my resources?

What about placed weapons in the resources?

You need some precious metals but anything over 5000 or so you might as well sell.

 

[snake_eater_raiden]

It actually does grow if you raise your 'demon' points up.



If Kojima had a habit of shipping incomplete games, I'd agree with you. But Konami probably forced him to rush out the release. I mean, things like the Lisa decoy which were in the game at some point were removed for no reason, except for most likely exec meddling.

Even if Konami forced him...I can understand the company's position. For five years, if all you are doing is aiming for this so called "perfection" then ye, Konami had no choice.

The problem with some MGS fans is that they are unable to see the business side of things. Imagine your $80 million invested and there is zero return on it for 7 years and in the meantime Kojima attends parties, makes non sense videos with Quiet VA, attends useless events, wasting time on Twitter etc

Heck I would be annoyed as well.

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

Such a lust for revenge in this thread

"WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO??!???!?"

Subtitle: Who?!

 

[RK9039]

WHO AM I?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CGH_1A-3bDg

 

[Garrett Hawke]

Soon.
Probably.

Wait. This, with Quiet's animation...

Ashamed of my NOTHING, Kojima

 

[Sn4ke_911]

Dude, Please stop blaming Konami.

Kojima had:

1. $80 million budget
2. Seven years

To make mgs5. He failed to meet deadlines. Simple. Remember he is the producer as well so completing the game is his responsibility. Instead of working on the game he wasted his time on Twitter, stupid events etc.

Konami is evil sure...but whatever happened with MGS5 is 100% Kojima's fault.

So stop blaming Konami in this case Boss.

He wasted his time? what? he slept 4 hours a day just to be most productive.

No i blame Konami for underestimating this project.

Five years isn't fast enough to get a game out?

What about Kojima? He was told when he needed the game to be out by and how much money he would be given. And you're saying it's Konami's fault for not acquiescing to him when he couldn't do that? Actually, they did. They gave him more money and more time. And he still couldn't do it so they fired him. And that's their fault?

Step back and think about this if it was someone other than Kojima and a company other than Konami.

Again compare it to other open world games, 5 years or more is the norm.

 

[Trey]

That includes creating the Fox Engine so if you think about it that isn't really that long. Just look at other open world games like GTA or Fallout, these games are a looong ass time in the oven.

Again i blame Konami for underestimating Kojima, they've been working now with this man for over 28 years they should know how passionate he is.

That doesn't mean they are wrong in not giving him a blank check. How can you properly estimate a project in which the producer himself is missing deadlines?

 

[Scotia]

I knew people would defend Kojima. After playing this game, I just can't anymore. Never thought I'd say this, but this series needed saving from Kojima.

 

[RK9039]

I knew people would defend Kojima. After playing this game, I just can't anymore. Never thought I'd say this, but this series needed saving from Kojima.

Yup. I think they should just sell the IP to Platinum, they'll make better Metal Gear games.

 

[snake_eater_raiden]

He wasted his time? what? he slept 4 hours a day just to be most productive.

No i blame Konami for underestimating this project.



Again compare it to other open world games, 5 years or more is the norm.

Your arguments have no basis. It does not depend on how many hrs Kojima puts in. Corporate structures dont work like that. They are only interested in the results. Kojima failed to ship on deadline resulting in loses and possibly job removals at Konami.

Bottom line: Kojima failed and people are in denial about this.

 

[Alienous]

That includes creating the Fox Engine so if you think about it that isn't really that long. Just look at other open world games like GTA or Fallout, these games are a looong ass time in the oven.

Again i blame Konami for underestimating Kojima, they've been working now with this man for over 28 years they should know how passionate he is.

GTA had Red Dead.
Fallout had Skyrim.

Metal Gear Rising was supposed to fill that gap, I think. That kind of 'engine transitional' game.

I don't blame Konami for reaching the end of their tether. I can understand why they think they'd be able to continue Metal Gear, perhaps spending less and making more money. I think it was a mistake to fire Kojima, though, but I doubt they could have transferred the series into other hands while Kojima was there.

Ideally Kojima will work on something other than Metal Gear, and Metal Gear will continue with a different vision, and it looks like we're getting that.

Konami are like The Boss. They made the sacrifice people don't understand yet. It's the only way Kojima could be free and Metal Gear can continue. It's a shame that MGSV wasn't unscathed, though.

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

Yup. I think they should just sell the IP to Platinum, they'll make better Metal Gear games.

If Rising is anything to go by, no they won't.

MGSV is still a better game than Rising.... hell, Rising is the worst game with Metal Gear in the title.

 

[Arion]

I think it was. I remember he made it sound like it was bone and I'm pretty sure he said it would grow as the game progressed, as you do worse shit. But nah, it's just a piece of metal.

It does permanently grow bigger when you kill a lot of people.

 

[snake_eater_raiden]

Yup. I think they should just sell the IP to Platinum, they'll make better Metal Gear games.

Konami getting rid of Kojima is the best think to happen for the series. The guy just lost his head after MGS3. He went more and more Hollywood and when the big bill came in Konami got hold of him.

Give some talented writer a chance and reboot the series.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

If Rising is anything to go by, no they won't.

MGSV is still a better game than Rising.... hell, Rising is the worst game with Metal Gear in the title.

Thank you.

Also, as far as writing is concerned - Ghost Babel is still the best sequel to MGS we ever got.

 

[Death Metalist]

Yup. I think they should just sell the IP to Platinum, they'll make better Metal Gear games.

 

[Papercuts]

If Rising is anything to go by, no they won't.

MGSV is still a better game than Rising.... hell, Rising is the worst game with Metal Gear in the title.

Rising is a project that looked like a disaster that was given a very short turnaround before release. It's a really rough game but all things considered I think it's amazing it turned out as well as it did.

 

[Scotia]

Konami getting rid of Kojima is the best think to happen for the series. The guy just lost his head after MGS3. He went more and more Hollywood and when the big bill came in Konami got hold of him.

Give some talented writer a chance and reboot the series.

Exactly what I want to happen now. Just do a new game with young Solid Snake as the protagonist and loose the Kojima bullshit and I'm there day one.

 

[RK9039]

If Rising is anything to go by, no they won't.

MGSV is still a better game than Rising.... hell, Rising is the worst game with Metal Gear in the title.

Rising is the best Metal Gear game of all time. Raiden suplexes a Metal Gear, meanwhile the final boss of TPP is missing from the game.

 

[Mexican Sting]

No i blame Konami for underestimating this project.

 

[snake_eater_raiden]

Exactly what I want to happen now. Just do a new game with young Solid Snake as the protagonist and loose the Kojima bullshit and I'm there day one.

Exactly. MGS games dont need a twist. All we wanted was a simple and straight forward story. Here are my thoughts what the story should have been:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=178067534&highlight=#post178067534

MGS5 Plot that should have been. Sorry for the English.

Afghanistan - Chapter 1

1. No body double, we are playing as Big Boss. Big Boss awakes from his coma and Ocelot rescues him and brings him to DD, a offshore unit that is funded by Cipher and under check by Kaz, so that Zero can manipulate Big Boss. DD is nothing but the war arm of Cipher but BB does not know about this.
3. Big Boss, Ocelot and Miller keep on building Motherbase but BB is unaware that Kaz is a Cipher spy.
4. Kaz wants revenge but only against Skullface. Since Skullface defected and destroyed MB in GZ, Kaz suffers massive revenue loss. Remember he is in it for business. Zero tells Kaz to manipulate BB and gain revenge and remove his nemesis: Skull Face
5. They finally get hold of Skullface and gets him killed not before Skullface leaves a cassette tape for Big Boss which reveals the truth about Kaz and Cipher. He reveals that Kaz is only in it for business purpose. Big Boss also defeats the new Metal Gear and gets hold of it.
6. However after learning the truth about Kaz, Big Boss is angry and reacts but almost the whole of DD turns against Big Boss. Big Boss kills each one of them and Kaz escapes. DD is disbanded and Cipher's plans are unfolded.

Africa - Chapter 2

1. Big Boss now takes whatever he can from the old Motherbase, including the new Metal Gear and loyal soldiers and begins to form OH in Africa. Ocelot makes sure that this information is not leaked to Cipher.
2. Ocelot makes sure that Cipher is unaware about BB'a location. Cipher in retaliation uses Solidus to spread the legend of BB. Lies and deceit spread about Big Boss.
2. Fultoning out Soldiers, and gaining resources, Big Boss keeps on building OH. He extracts Huey who is doing research for Cipher for a new Metal Gear which does not work out. Gray Fox, Naomi and Sniper Wolf and several other original members are extracted/saved as well and Big Boss starts forming his own war machine.
3. Ocelot then informs him about Liquid Snake in Africa. Big Boss extracts him. Liquid learns about his father but hates him. This leads to a retaliation and Liquid along with child soldiers forms Kingdom of Flies and runs away with the new Metal Gear. However Big Boss defeats him and leaves him to starve. Somehow Liquid manages to escape and reaches UK. BB once again manages to extract the Metal Gear and with the help of Huey, repairs and enhances it and names it as TX55.
4. Big Boss now completely forms OH with Cipher having no knowledge about it. But at the right time, Big Boss returns to US, makes amends with Zero and Kaz.

Chapter 3: OH

1. Fast Fwd 1995.
2. Big Boss finally meets Solid Snake. Trains him along with Kaz.
3. However, due to a proxy network of the Patriots, Cipher comes to know that a certain mercenary unit is retaliating in Africa. Outer Heaven.
4. Big Boss gets wind of this information and purposely sends Gray Fox, his best soldier and lieutenant. Gray Fox and Big Boss purposely create a drama where the former will get captured.
5. Big Boss reports back to Cipher and insists the mission wont work since they now have Gray Fox, one of their best soldiers captured and they cant afford to lose any more good men.
6. However, Cipher insists through a proxy that BB needs to send Solid Snake.
7. With no option left, he does as Cipher commands, however he makes it harder for SS to infiltrate by purposely setting traps.
8. Much to his surprise, SS gets through, defeats all the bosses. On his journey, SS collects cassette tapes which makes him aware about what actually is going on. In the end he receives a cassette tape Number 46 title "From The Man Who Sold The World" where a recording is present between Gray Fox and BB, which reveals that BB is the leader of OH.
9. Big Boss gets hold of this and has no option but to reveal himself in OH. Boss Battle ensues with Metal Gear. Snake "kills" Big Boss.
10. Game ends.

 

[Broken Joystick]

Exactly what I want to happen now. Just do a new game with young Solid Snake as the protagonist and loose the Kojima bullshit and I'm there day one.

Maybe the could fill in the gap where Solid Snake ant Otacon travel the world taking down Metal Gears. No need to interfere with other characters, and whoever makes it can create their own characters.

 

[ZeroX03]

Again compare it to other open world games, 5 years or more is the norm.

Five years may be normal for total development time, but studios don't go five years without releasing games. Studios work on different titles and have proper team splits so they're releasing games every year or two years.

GTAV is not something you want to compare yourself to unless you think MGSV is going to sell 50 million copies. They also had Red Dead Redemption in the meantime. Bethesda has Fallout and Elder Scrolls. Peace Walker and Rising are not the same.

Also Kojima didn't finish his open world game in five years. Are you completely unwilling to accept that someone being given a deadline and budget and failing to meet it is not their fault?

 

[snake_eater_raiden]

Maybe the could fill in the gap where Solid Snake ant Otacon travel the world taking down Metal Gears. No need to interfere with other characters, and whoever makes it can create their own characters.

You mean between MGS and MGS2? That is an inter-prequel. Could be amazing...but please no more Kojima. I am done with the guy after the shit we got in MGS5.

 

[Shouta]

One thing I noticed while rewatching the ending is that Solidus isn't mentioned anywhere. Kind of odd. Zero could have mentioned a third clone in one of the tapes and a line thrown in during the timeline portion and that would have been enough, but instead he gets no mention at all. Wonder what's up with that.

Solidus was created after Liquid/Solid and probably in secret. It wasn't until MGS2 that anyone even know Solidus was a thing at all as I recall so it probably was a secret to aside from the core folks on the other side.

 

[Yen]

Any guesses as to what the project that Kojima wasted a year on, back in 2011 was? Just interested now that it seems MGSV most have had a bit of development hell.

https://mobile.twitter.com/HIDEO_KOJIMA_EN/status/72826101772201985

 

[snake_eater_raiden]

Five years may be normal for total development time, but studios don't go five years without releasing games. Studios work on different titles and have proper team splits so they're releasing games every year or two years.

GTAV is not something you want to compare yourself to unless you think MGSV is going to sell 50 million copies.

Also Kojima didn't finish his open world game in five years. Are you completely unwilling to accept that someone being given a deadline and budget and failing to meet it is not their fault?

Sn4ke_911 does not realizes that The Witcher 3, a game bigger, better and massive than MGS5 had a dev cycle of 4 years and $81 million budget.

 

[Imm0rt4l]

Any guesses as to what the project that Kojima wasted a year on, back in 2011, was?

https://mobile.twitter.com/HIDEO_KOJIMA_EN/status/72826101772201985

Zoe3 probably

 

[TheLostBigBoss]

Exactly. MGS games dont need a twist. All we wanted was a simple and straight forward story. Here are my thoughts what the story should have been:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=178067534&highlight=#post178067534

to be fair every MGS game has had a twist, or multiple ones that change the user's perception of the story post-revelation,

I would say MGS's stories are built around that concept.

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

Any guesses as to what the project that Kojima wasted a year on, back in 2011, was?

https://mobile.twitter.com/HIDEO_KOJIMA_EN/status/72826101772201985

Probably Zone of the Enders 3. We'll never get a Zone of the Enders 3. Think about that for a moment.

MGSV's reference to Jehuty is all we have. No dreams now, only tears.

 

[snake_eater_raiden]

to be fair every MGS game has had a twist, or multiple ones that change the user's perception of the story post-revelation,

I would say MGS's stories are built around that concept.

MGS3 never had a big twist. It had a straight forward story. One of the reasons why it's considered the best in the series.

 

[Scotia]

Exactly. MGS games dont need a twist. All we wanted was a simple and straight forward story. Here are my thoughts what the story should have been:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=178067534&highlight=#post178067534

This is way better than the dreck Kojima wrote.

Maybe the could fill in the gap where Solid Snake ant Otacon travel the world taking down Metal Gears. No need to interfere with other characters, and whoever makes it can create their own characters.

This would be good, but I'd rather have a reboot.

MGS3 never had a big twist. It had a straight forward story. One of the reasons why it's considered the best in the series.

Correct. MGS3 is the best series 'cause there's no bullshit that ruins it. All the twists are done well and have a reason. Venom Snake ultimately adds nothing to the series.