To each their own. Outrage is probably a strong word for what I feel. 'Severe disapointment' fits better.
-
Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!
SPOILER: Spoiler Metal Gear Solid V (TPS) Spoiler Thread (Contains Spoilers, Thanos).
- Thread starter Love Deterrence
- Start date
- Status
To each their own. Outrage is probably a strong word for what I feel. 'Severe disapointment' fits better.
Mister Negative
Member
Okay, I just finished mission 46 and I'm currently going through the truth tapes. I have a lot on my mind!
First, I'll say that i haven't beaten mission 45 yet, but who gives a shit about that right now?
Second, the moment I heard "self-hypnosis" I had to pause the tape and get up from my desk to take a walk. God dammit, Ocelot.
Third, after the reveal but before the post credits conversation, I was livid. Up until the post credits conversation you're meant to believe that the Big Boss we saw in MG1, MG2, and MGS4 was actually just some merc they gave plastic surgery to, and that the MGS3 big boss was just off living a quiet civilian life somewhere. Thankfully they put a kibosh on that by saying BB was just working on outer heaven the whole time and is the real BB in MG2 and MGS4.
After beating Chapter 1, I really thought that the COBRA unit just having parasites was going to be the end of Kojima's "connect every game to the other games" stuff, but boy was I wrong.
I don't know how to feel. I'm a little peeved that the twist was so easily guessed by a lot of people based on something as simple as the medic having big boss's voice, I'm a little peeved that a lot of "hints" in trailers were just flat out too obvious. Something like this was in the back of my mind the whole time I played. I just wish it had been hidden better I guess, but then I suppose everyone would have thought it made no sense if there wasn't so much setup.
On the one hand, this is the Kojima level fuckery I was waiting for. A massive twist. On the other, I feel like how people who didn't know about Raiden must have felt the first time they played MGS2. A little betrayed that I wasn't actually playing the character I know and loved.
But I get it. I know what you're saying, Kojima. That little speech in the mirror scene, I get it. You're saying that us, together, big boss and the player, built big boss's memory. I understand that you're thanking the player in a way, giving yourself a little sendoff. I just wish you hadn't done it in such a ridiculous way. I WANT to feel good about helping Big Boss shape his legacy as the player character pretending to be Big Boss, but right now I feel like I'd rather have been Big Boss the whole time.
Back to the truth tapes.
First, I'll say that i haven't beaten mission 45 yet, but who gives a shit about that right now?
Second, the moment I heard "self-hypnosis" I had to pause the tape and get up from my desk to take a walk. God dammit, Ocelot.
Third, after the reveal but before the post credits conversation, I was livid. Up until the post credits conversation you're meant to believe that the Big Boss we saw in MG1, MG2, and MGS4 was actually just some merc they gave plastic surgery to, and that the MGS3 big boss was just off living a quiet civilian life somewhere. Thankfully they put a kibosh on that by saying BB was just working on outer heaven the whole time and is the real BB in MG2 and MGS4.
After beating Chapter 1, I really thought that the COBRA unit just having parasites was going to be the end of Kojima's "connect every game to the other games" stuff, but boy was I wrong.
I don't know how to feel. I'm a little peeved that the twist was so easily guessed by a lot of people based on something as simple as the medic having big boss's voice, I'm a little peeved that a lot of "hints" in trailers were just flat out too obvious. Something like this was in the back of my mind the whole time I played. I just wish it had been hidden better I guess, but then I suppose everyone would have thought it made no sense if there wasn't so much setup.
On the one hand, this is the Kojima level fuckery I was waiting for. A massive twist. On the other, I feel like how people who didn't know about Raiden must have felt the first time they played MGS2. A little betrayed that I wasn't actually playing the character I know and loved.
But I get it. I know what you're saying, Kojima. That little speech in the mirror scene, I get it. You're saying that us, together, big boss and the player, built big boss's memory. I understand that you're thanking the player in a way, giving yourself a little sendoff. I just wish you hadn't done it in such a ridiculous way. I WANT to feel good about helping Big Boss shape his legacy as the player character pretending to be Big Boss, but right now I feel like I'd rather have been Big Boss the whole time.
Back to the truth tapes.
Reizo Ryuu
Member
Oh damn, I didn't even notice this option becomes available because I've been using a different soldier pretty much non stop.
Edit: this is badass, time to retire my lara croft lookalike for a bit and use the true venom snake!
This is my first MGS game. I am not oturaged. I think it this you harder when you are a fan of the series and used to more and better story. The game was entertaining enough and I was able to shrug the weak stories and characters off. I think a lot of players are like me and only now entered the game because of the amazing marketing and gameplay. That's why there's no outrage.
i think it's dumb to say the people who aren't outraged are fanboys
i stopped believing in godjima with mgs3 and totally gave up on the series after 4, and i'm not even remotely mad about V. there are plenty of hardcore mgs fans in this very thread who were very mad about V.
loaf of bread
Member
MGSV just doesn't feel complete or finished at all. I looked forward to it forever and now I've played through the whole game and honestly? It kind of feels like I never really played it, it just feels like there was nothing of significance there, the story just kind of came and went and that was it. I feel like I still have two thirds of the game left to play but theres nothing left.
DarkChronic
Member
Just beat it.
Huh.
10/10 for gameplay.
And I have no fucking idea/10 for the story. Some incredible moments, some really boring moments, and some what the hell were they thinking moments.
What a bizarre game.
Huh.
10/10 for gameplay.
And I have no fucking idea/10 for the story. Some incredible moments, some really boring moments, and some what the hell were they thinking moments.
What a bizarre game.
Tribes of Trusty
Member
MGS III, sorry MGS2 was even originally set in Iran, until geopolitical developments at the time rendered the idea "tasteless".
Also that robbed us of showing Arsenal Gear crashing into Manhattan and the epilogue coverage of the incident.
Edit : What I meant was Kojima's team aren't as insensitive as some of you might fear.
Medics are the best ! #Represent
I wonder if episode 51 was cut not only due to cost and time limits but also because you shoot Eli, who's a kid. It was a mission where you as an adult actually shot a kid, which is pretty big imho, so I can see the Konami executives not wanting to spend more money on this. The idea was pretty neat though.
Oh God no, I didn't mean it like that. Sorry if people thought I meant it like that. All I meant is that I've seen a lot of people defending the game strongly because they felt like they owed it to Kojima instead of actually admiting whether or not they thought the story was weak af
Napalm_Frank
Member
So what was the deal with Paz at MB? You can't return to give the last photo right? Kinda weird addition, I just assume it was all a dream or something.
Mister Negative
Member
It's not that the story is weak, people should be outraged because you're not big boss (john) in this game. It's the raiden twist but even worse. At least you know you're raiden while you're raiden. Big Boss is a character a lot of people have a fondness for, and to give a player an experience with him and then take it away after the fact is massive.
So the thing is, I get why he's silent now. Every time Kiefer appears as the actual Big Boss, he talks quite a bit. He actually seems like the real Big Boss. So I guess I'll give credit to Kojima for that, but I couldn't help but think, "wow, I wish I was playing as that big boss, because he seems way more fun to play as."
Yeah, I really think they finished the Fox Engine and then the gameplay elements and then started to produce the story from the beginning and while at work Konami stormed in and told them to wrap it up. And so they did. The game side is amazing. If only they would've had more time and money.
I am sorry, but no. The story in MGSV is weak. It had a few great scenes and moments, but the story overall was weak. The problem is that Skullface really is an uninteresting villain with an uninteresting plan. I think he would be fine for a Disc 1 villain.
Kenzodielocke
Banned
Big Boss is a great talker, people will do everything for him.
Not to mention Solidus awkwardly clinging to an invisible US flag in his death scene
Actually, on the list of interesting plans, I'd put Skullface's pretty up there.
Amentallica
Unconfirmed Member
Kojima spent five years making "MGS: VR".
Enter the Dragon Punch
Banned
masturbating to pictures of the boss and crying
Mister Negative
Member
I'm not saying the story wasn't weak, I'm just saying that wouldn't be the real reason for any outrage. Story was weak, but don't be angry about that, be angry that you're some dude with a big boss mask.
We had the 2013 trailer where BB and Kaz were going to build an army and do evil shit just to get revenge on Cipher. Then we get Ground Zeroes with this incredibly dark tone where women and children are tortured and killed and motherbase is destroyed which sets us up for a great reason to get revenge on Cipher.
Finally TPP comes out and the story just flatlines after the intro. I can't believe how shitty the story is. I can forgive awkward dialogue or cutscenes but man... I don't think I can write anymore I'm getting too worked up.
Finally TPP comes out and the story just flatlines after the intro. I can't believe how shitty the story is. I can forgive awkward dialogue or cutscenes but man... I don't think I can write anymore I'm getting too worked up.
Roufianos
Member
Are the Cobras in this game actually explained by parasites? Anyone know which tape?
For all this talk of Kojima taking MGS4's criticism to heart, he sure didn't learn his lesson about nanomachines.
Not everything has to have a scientific explanation. Characters like Mantis and The Sorrow have already established that the supernatural exists in this universe.
For all this talk of Kojima taking MGS4's criticism to heart, he sure didn't learn his lesson about nanomachines.
Not everything has to have a scientific explanation. Characters like Mantis and The Sorrow have already established that the supernatural exists in this universe.
Wasn't it rumored somewhere that America was one of the playable locations in the game? I remember weeks before release clicking on a spoiler somewhere which revealed 3 locations. It may have even been more than 3. So maybe it was part of the cut content. Episode 51 led to some chapter that had an US angle.
Enter the Dragon Punch
Banned
gbay was rumoured
Reizo Ryuu
Member
I'd say the game is about ~70% complete, and that's being generous.
The first chapter is 100% complete, the second chapter is extremely condensed and it has its ending/boss fight missing, chapter 3 (road to outer heaven ) is entirely absent.
Fox engine has been used years prior for Pro evo, this isn't even the first game that uses it.
Kojima had all the time and money he realistically needed. He should've had someone to reign his crazy spending and deadline missing ass in.
Mister Negative
Member
Also, turns out it wasn't cipher at all. woops! in fact, cipher was the reason for the whole phantom plan in the first place!
Mister Negative
Member
It's one of code talker's research tapes, I think. He basically explicitly says he did his research off of The End's body parts, and that there were "others" who could control insects and such.
Kenzodielocke
Banned
I am repeating myself, but he should've just focused on the revenge story line, men becoming demon's. Nothing else, no fucking nanomachines, ehm I mean parasites.
Focused stories are the best, that's why a lot of people love MGS3 the most.
EDit: Also the game misses a scene where I would get really emotional, like some scenes in MGS3 and 4.
Tribes of Trusty
Member
Bangin' EVA and smoking cigars.
Or this. Or sex roleplay with EVA as The Boss.
Yuck.
I think the whole genocidal weapon that targets specific language is a pretty awesome concept for a horrible weapon. It is far more effective for wiping out an ethnicity / religion than DNA based weapons. If you wanted to eliminate Jews or Muslims who are very diverse ethnically you'd just have to aim for Hebrew or Arabic for example.
It's a shame the villain has pretty confusing motives and is super hammy (WHOOOOOOOOOOOOO
let the (diamond) dogs out
I felt the game was that way, which was fine by me because I love VR missions. I just wish the missions were a bit more varied.
The Silver
Member
MGSV marketing about demon Big Boss being a bold faced lie wouldn't bother me if it was capitalized on in the themes of the game.
MGS2 had a reason for doing what it did with the marketing, it's themes of how digital information or misinformation can be manipulated to create context, the game went all in on it.
MGS2 had a reason for doing what it did with the marketing, it's themes of how digital information or misinformation can be manipulated to create context, the game went all in on it.
throwawayname
Member
Great character development, right?
Wakes up, escapes hospital, smokes a cigare, rides off into the sunrise on a motorcycle.
A true demon.
"The Missing Link that Completes the Saga"
Mister Negative
Member
The ending just seems like Kojima realized Big Boss was lame in this game, so he had to explain away Big Boss being lame. And put in the actual Big Boss being pretty cool very briefly.
I get what Kojima did. Breaking taboos. Something that can only be done in videogames. He did the one thing nobody expected.
He intentionally made a disappointing story. He wanted us to feel how Snake felt when The Boss betrayed him. We are Snake. Kojima is The Boss. He promised us the greatest MGS game yet. And he betrayed us.
I guess you could say he made us suffer from... Phantom Pain.
This man is a genius.
He intentionally made a disappointing story. He wanted us to feel how Snake felt when The Boss betrayed him. We are Snake. Kojima is The Boss. He promised us the greatest MGS game yet. And he betrayed us.
I guess you could say he made us suffer from... Phantom Pain.
This man is a genius.
Nah, the entire game is filled with heavy foreshadowing that you aren't actually playing as Big Boss. Not to mention the hints go back to even Ground Zeroes.
It feels like an idea that came after they decided to tell a Big Boss story.
"Oh, I can't really make him a demon" even though Venom Snake is the most heroic Big Boss has ever been (it isn't his mission and he isn't doing it for payment/facilities, it's straight up "I'm taking you down and stopping your evil plan, Skully").
Enter the Dragon Punch
Banned
There was one thing Boss didn't plan for, though: Mulder.
Mister Negative
Member
Like I said above, the whole "we built Big Boss's legacy together" part in the mirror scene is definitely him talking to the player, and that part was a little cute. But maaaaan.
I mean I know it wasn't actually that way, it just sucks to play as this depressed lame-o who's sad about pretending to be big boss. That's what it is, right? When does he discover that he's not big boss? when, chronologically does the mirror scene takes place?
I identified with punished snake because I was depressed about having to pretend to be big boss too. The game got a little boring to me at points.
Napalm_Frank
Member
The whole ''men become demons'' angle just feels so wrong now. The game was pretty tame in the end, BB does nothing wrong really, I guess he shot his own men to save them from napalm. Ocelot tortured Huey I guess and that ended up being justified and that's what Ocelot does anyway. Miller was suspicious of an enemy agent sent to kill them. I guess torturing her was the biggest sin of the group.
It isn't.
There's nothing core to the plot that suggests you aren't Big Boss. All there is are cutscenes, dialogue and other events that are tangential to the core story.
If this had been the story of a man struggling with his own identity I'd be inclined to agree with you. But this is a fairly standard Big Boss story with 4-5 references that he might not be Big Boss hidden amongst evidence to the contrary.
Don't forget about trying to "reintegrate" kids to society, which is something that the real Big Boss was against.
I actually haven't gotten to the end yet, but I'm pretty sure he doesn't know the whole game that he's fake.
Oh there's much more than that. The intro alone has like 4-5 references, including Kiefer voicing Ishmael, picking your avatar face, Ocelot saying that a certain man gave him two jobs, one to get Venom out and the other to get the man himself out, and a few others I'm sure I can find. Then there's Eli, the Boss AI, the entire Paz storyline which ties into Venom's hallucinations, Ocelot bringing up disassociate identity disorder (though not about Venom at that point and time, obviously).
Of course there's nothing core to the plot that suggests you aren't Big Boss. It wouldn't be a twist at all then.
He makes smoking look cool to kids. A true demon
Somehow, despite his doctor showing him his actual face in a mirror and in a photograph before doing the surgery.
"Please don't remember this"
Kenzodielocke
Banned
It's on your birthday and you need max bond with Quiet.Anyone seen this cutscene in the game?
Enter the Dragon Punch
Banned
Anyone seen this cutscene in the game?
yes
it's part of the birthday event
no you don't
lol like we have any authority on whether or not he should keep making games
- Status
Similar threads
- Poll