He is correct that they have no control over how the game sells. But SE is going to be interesting to observe over the combing months. This game will sell less than TR2013, Just Cause 3 has really weird release timing (and many complaints of bad performance), and the game that would get everyone to forget all of this was delayed six months. Whoops X 3.
"Microsoft and Square are very happy with Rise and the dev team" says Brian Horton
- Thread starter foxbeldin
- Start date
Darkstorne
Member
Though keep in mind that the first game's end scene also heavily hinted at
Croatoan Island
tearsintherain
Member
I think one good thing out of this is publishers hopefully don't do any more exclusives like this, either side. I really enjoyed RoTR and I'd put it in my top 3 games of the year, easy, but it makes me sad that the devs probably won't get the acclaim they deserve because of stupid marketing/business decisions.
I can't imagine any scenario where they wouldn't have been better off (1) x-platform simul release, (2) maybe pushing the date back to late jan or february. Heck, Valentines Day would have been an AMAZING day to release this game. I didn't really see that much microsoft promo of TR, and don't know a single person who really thought they need to go buy an xbox one to play the game now. Tons of people bought xbox ones, but I think all the fabulous deals were the incentive, not this game.
I can't imagine any scenario where they wouldn't have been better off (1) x-platform simul release, (2) maybe pushing the date back to late jan or february. Heck, Valentines Day would have been an AMAZING day to release this game. I didn't really see that much microsoft promo of TR, and don't know a single person who really thought they need to go buy an xbox one to play the game now. Tons of people bought xbox ones, but I think all the fabulous deals were the incentive, not this game.
Steverulez
Member
Because they got paid for it by MS. We don't know what they paid or what the internal thinking from CD/SE was, MS said they were investing in the game, perhaps they felt the MS money would help them make a better game, they'll go again multiplatform for TR3 and I'm sure it'll sell as you'd expect
Because at that time the deal was already made?
Xplatformer
Member
Everthing you said is true.
Getting this for my pc when it's available.
Well...if I have $$ after The Division and Uncharted 4 which come out 2 and 3 weeks earlier.
I'm assuming Microsoft paid them a LOT of $$$ for timed exclusivity. Otherwise they wouldnt be content no matter how great the actual game is.
Turning Lara Croft into a psychopath murderess with daddy issues hellbent on revenge against a private militia and yet another undead army is nothing to be happy about IMO. Terrible character assassination continues.
Couldn't have the "i told you so" stayed in the UK sales thread though? Now we have another thread that was about what the dev said in the sales thread and it slowly turns into the same ole "i told you so" - type of thread. We all get it, it is a timed exclusive regardless of who's decision to make it that way.
I'm sure Microsoft and Square are happy with the game itself, and I'm sure CD are as well (as reflected by the dev). Would like they like better sales? Sure, who wouldn't in any industry? But it's whatever.
I just hope that everyone who wanted to play this on PS4 buys it when it comes out instead of just talking like they truly care.
I'm thinking about getting it for PC...I do kinda want it on my XBO though. I want to see if it will be cross-buy with Windows 10, that would entice me even more.
John Wick
Member
Sony would never waste money on tying this up as an exclusive because they have something better in Uncharted.
It would sell far better on PS4 because Sony wouldn't be Dumb enough to release it against the holiday juggernauts
This is something people seem to not get.
Lots of people comment about how Sony doesn't have games launching for the holidays, but they tend to launch games in the beginning of the year for a reason.
Tomb Raider should not have launched in November.
Zok310
Banned
Yeah right, Sony would have launched it mid January 2016 and laughed all the way to the bank when it sells 1 mil week 1 on PS4. Sony clearly have better decision makers when it comes to stuff like this and they ain't usrsty. TR would not have bombed on PS4 simply because the deal would have been handled better.
Chobel
Member
Do you think TR3 will have similar, lower or higher budget than TR2? This question is mainly for Nirolak and Y2kev, but I would love to hear everyone's opinion.
Personally I think TR3 will have less resources allocated to it, mainly because this time there will be no MS money and because of the low sales of TR2.
Stealth edit: Of course "lower or higher" in this context means "significantly lower or significantly higher"
Personally I think TR3 will have less resources allocated to it, mainly because this time there will be no MS money and because of the low sales of TR2.
Stealth edit: Of course "lower or higher" in this context means "significantly lower or significantly higher"
Walker_Boh
Member
And the deal would have made more sense. TR has been a PS/PC franchise for twenty years, that is where the fanbase is. Plus, PS deals typically don't screw over PC gamers.
CrichtonKicks
Member
I could see it being cheaper just from the standpoint that they have already gone through the learning curve of creating content for current generation. So their pipeline should be pretty mature at this point. That's assuming that they keep to the current design and don't try to make it open world or something.
Prototype Viktor
Member
Even more so when publishers are using the 1st game as a loss lead for the 2nd fame where they finally make money
MisterR
Member
No different than film or music. You can brag about your films reception with critics, but if it flops, that's what people will be talking about.
Pathfinder
Member
Are you kidding? That's part of what intrigued me about the game.
I want Lara to be a real person with real problems.
MisterR
Member
You know, people who get paid lots of money to make decision, make bad decisions all the time. I think they probably miscalculated a lot of things on this one.
And she was a 1 dimensional animal killer in the previous games. She has more character and charisma in these games and doesn't solely rely on short shorts/clevage to get attention. Old Lara was a horrid character, good riddance
Prototype Viktor
Member
Did the 1st game sell a crap ton on PC? If no, there's little to believe that it will sell enough on PS4 for the time frame it'll come out next year even with PS4 possibly having 50 million~
Plus Naughty Dog might even have DLC for Uncharted 4 lined up for around the time as it'd be 6+ months after release
giant_frying_pan
Member
As someone who bought TR2013 day one on PC...I doubt I will do the same with Rise. Why would I pay the same to get the game later?
CrichtonKicks
Member
I'm sure they felt like the Xbox brand would be healthier and there was a lot of assurances from MS about "this is going to be our real centerpiece of the season- a one-two punch with Halo leading off. We are really going to put this title into the mainstream and make the launch an event."
Whether they started backing off on that before or after Fallout 4's release date announcement I would love to know. Because it feels like there was more fanfare from MS over the exclusivity announcement than the actual release of the game.
Because it's a bigger and better game?
Ninja Sharingan
Banned
Yeh ot must have been a boatload of cash. Or maybe their predictions were that it would probably do the same to a little more than the last game did at launch. Hopefully we find out at some point. Game is awesome tho so hats off for the critical aclaim. I will buy the pc version as well.
giant_frying_pan
Member
And I would have loved to have played this bigger and better game in Nov 2015.
EatinOlives
Member
This is definitely the feeling I get. Somewhere along the way MS must've begun thinking this wasn't a good investment, because their own level of enthusiasm for this game noticeably dropped off the closer we got to launch, which is completely backwards.
Chobel
Member
10 million.
CrichtonKicks
Member
So your saltiness over a business decision affects your desire to purchase the game in a few months? I just don't get it.
Further if this had actually been multiplatform then I expect you wouldn't be playing until 2016 anyway. I don't think SE would have stayed on the Holiday 2015 date.
AyaisMUsikWhore
Member
That makes it look even more like Square Enix goofed up their projections lol
Xplatformer
Member
I don't understand your logic. It'll be a new PC game on April 1st. Probably still be $59.99 on the one that same month.
You're not willing to pay $60 for that? Why not?
Unknown One
Member
Wait for bargain bin prices like most pc gamers did on TR2013. 5-10 dollar range.
It certainly won't be "new" at least, by the time PC and PS4 get it.
... And by then, there will be a whole new year's worth of new, quality games to compete for my dollars. 2016 for PS4 in particular is looking legendary, and Tomb Raider's going to get swallowed up yet again.
It was a bad deal, bad timing, and it hurt interest in the game, pure and simple.
Dargor
Member
Pathfinder
Member
They need to be taught a lesson. Duh.
Remember S-E was complaining very loudly that TR fell far below their expectations and didn't recoup costs when it was console only. It was only after PC and quite a long time after that that they finally said it finally made a profit and/or met/exceeded expectations.
As for 2013's numbers I don't believe I stated the PS3 sold more, only that the franchise built it's console fanbase on Playstation first by being on PS1. Undoubtedly it sold better on 360 in NPD since the 360 murdered the PS3 in the US. I don't know what the worldwide numbers are though.
CrichtonKicks
Member
Most seem to think the PC version will be release in early 2016 so it's likely only a couple of months away.
Fall 2015 was always awful timing for the game, even if it had been multiplatform. Spring or Summer 2015 likely would have been great but it probably wasn't feasible (especially given they had Eidos Montreal on as a full co-developer this time despite there being no multiplayer). So a TR sequel that wasn't MS exclusive was probably always going to be a 2016 title no matter what.
Doctor_Thomas
Member
I don't see how this will sell in a year from now, when it couldn't sell, well, now. I'm not going to pay full price for a game when it'll be on shelves, on another format, for probably a third of the price.
They didn't just kill the game, they've killed the sales potential of the entire franchise because someone thought putting the game on the platform that sold the least copies of the previous title was a good idea, so I hope the pay off was good because the knock on effect is that SE will maybe not see CD as a worthwhile studio and potentially shutter them or relegate them the "Lara Croft" games rather than AAA action games. A worst case, but very real scenario.
They didn't just kill the game, they've killed the sales potential of the entire franchise because someone thought putting the game on the platform that sold the least copies of the previous title was a good idea, so I hope the pay off was good because the knock on effect is that SE will maybe not see CD as a worthwhile studio and potentially shutter them or relegate them the "Lara Croft" games rather than AAA action games. A worst case, but very real scenario.
Pathfinder
Member
Oh brother... the doom and gloom is alive and well.
Doctor_Thomas
Member
Well, it's a pretty "doom and gloom" situation.
Zok310
Banned
Might be damn near 60 mil a year from now. At that point anything you put on it will hit 1 mil in sales close to launch.
The thing is though, business isn't solely about dollars. Even if MS paid them enough for them to be fine with the low sales, it's not good for the Tomb Raider brand if no one is buying the newest game. 300k in the first week is nothing to scoff at but isn't exactly lighting the charts on fire. And no one is talking about it other than to make snide remarks about how poorly it sold considering the stature of the IP and how hyped up it was by MS.
SE might be fine with the bottom line but the mindshare of the game doesn't bode well for the PC/PS4 release and certainly not for another sequel. I can't see the game selling in large numbers months/a year down the line.
giant_frying_pan
Member
Do you know something I don't?
More time for the game to be *even better*? Sounds like a win-win scenario?
Probably over that with ease at the rate they're going.
It's Square Enix though. They'll make the mistake of charging $60 for this. I'm almost certain it doesn't even sell 200K on PS4 in the first month.
Wuthering_Heights
Banned
Imagine how happy they are going to be when the PS4 and PC versions outsell it handily.
If you mean the precursor to Rise of the Tomb Raider, no it didn't sell the most on 360. The PS3 version outsold 360 and the remastered version on PS4 outsold XB1.
giant_frying_pan
Member
1.) I doubt the game on Xbox One will still be full price by 1st April 16 (and is that date confirmed? Or just assumed from retailer placeholder dates?)
2.) Why should I pay full price when a different category of users got the game 153 days earlier?
Pathfinder
Member
Only if you're wishing for the franchise to fail. In which case, you need to take a step back and reevaluate your priorities.
Doctor_Thomas
Member
I'm not wishing for the franchise to fail. I was a big fan of the reboot, I'm saying that Rise of the Tomb Raider will never hit those previous numbers - numbers that Square Enix were already disappointed with - and that the franchise has, in the space of two games, risen from the ashes and been completely dismantled, from a sales perspective. Game could be fantastic, wouldn't know, I can't play it.