Y'all missing the point. It's a political revolution. Together we can get things done. This defeatist thought process has to stop at some point.
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The South Carolina Primary & Nevada Caucuses |Feb 20, 23, 27| Continuing The Calm
- Thread starter NeoXChaos
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Y'all missing the point. It's a political revolution. Together we can get things done. This defeatist thought process has to stop at some point.
AnotherNils
Member
So that's where Trump is actually spending money.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
maybe you should just let them vote for you, clearly it's what they want!
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
Really pretty lame to be following posters around on other websites and reposting their shit here. Kind of creepy in all honesty.
Sure there will always be a few who go that way, but there was a CBS poll this week that basically said something like 80% of Sanders supporters would support Hillary if she got the nomination. I can only imagine that number would go up after watching Trump for a while as well.
My godfather completely despises the man as he thinks his revolution talk is bullshit having lived through the CR era.
My parents and cousins aren't too far off from his sentiments
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
Oh my god, please continue to show old footage about Clinton and what she used to believe in. Because apologizing, learning, and being redeemed is for chumps.
Did you know she also voted for the Iraq war? You should link to a video on that too.
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
But that's exactly what you did....
No, I did not get the information that way. Therefore, you can rest easy, there are more pressing matters to concern yourself with.
Exactly. This was 20 years ago, people's attitudes and thoughts change consistently in life so I don't think you can hold things against someone from that long ago, especially if they have demonstrated they have changed.
Bernie has many young voters than maybe will simple stay in home on election day because Hillary doesn't appeal to them. The same thing that happen with some conservatives that don't vote in moderate republicans.
plagiarize
Banned
It just isn't as sexy. But it looks like the pragmatist is well positioned not only to win the nomination but to win the presidency.
shinra-bansho
Member
If they did, I don't think it would last long.
But it would be better I think if we avoid going all DetectiveGAF outside of the forum.
User 463088
Banned
It's a revolution that no one is showing up for. Bernie is running on getting an unprecedented number of people out to vote. He's not doing that. He's getting a huge share of the young people who turn out, but he's not drastically increasing the number of supporters. He's not making inroads with minority voters, especially African Americans. The revolution is not being televised. He's not making inroads with older voters. He's not making inroads with the party who, no matter how anyone feels about them, he needs to win in November.
He has a message. It's a good message. But he's running on things that are simply never going to happen in the next 4-8 years.
Yeah the only progressives that count are the ones that never once "progressed" in their opinions on anything. Lol this gold standard people are holding Bernie up to be is hilarious when you look at the other side.
Roland_Gunner
Member
Social elite? You just elected the son of a Prime Minister. Our equivalent elite just crashed out of the primary.
Dissapointed Sanders supporter checking in: I think Clinton's victory in Nevada pretty much seals her nomination.
I can't agree with this more. We've essentially had a broken government since 2010 when the Republicans took over the House. Because the House and Senate write the laws, there really isn't a realistic way for a Democratic president to get his or her proposals enacted into law. As is going to be dramatically illustrated within the next couple of months, Democratic presidents even are going to have trouble getting their nominees for important government positions nominated (cough - Supreme Court).
The importance of this fact extends far beyond this primary.
Going by Sander's dominance among younger voters, if the Iowa and Nevada caucuses were held in 2020, Sanders would have won. As for the general election, Sanders beats all of the Republicans by larger margins than Hillary Clinton. I know people love to dismiss these polls, but considering the vast majority of people in the polls indicate they have heard of Sanders and pretty much every media description indicates he is a "self-described democratic socialist", I don't think they can just be discarded.
The supposed "unpopularity" of Sanders policies comes from Nixon/Reagan era messaging that played on the racism and nationalism (fear of communism) of white voters. That cohort represents a smaller and smaller portion of the electorate every year.
At the very least, I would hope by the late 2020's or early 2030's (which would be about the end of the Hillary Clinton administration if she makes it through two terms), there wouldn't be any questions regarding the acceptability of Sander's policies to the broader electorate.
The truth is probably somewhere in between. We will know more in the coming days. At the very least, Sanders must have won at least a significant portion of Hispanic voters, if not a majority. That's far more than people were saying he would win at the beginning of this primary.
Realistically, now that the Democratic primary is pretty much over, this line of rhetoric needs to die for all of our sakes. Hillary Clinton is going to need the votes of both her own and Sanders supporters to win in 2016 and 2020. Fomenting divisions among the Democratic base helps nobody.
And if, like me, you are a disappointed Sanders supporter, for God's sake please vote for Clinton in November. Clinton losing would not only cause a lot suffering for people Sander's policies were supposed to help, but Clinton losing would also push the enactment of those policies even further away. I know that seems somewhat counter-intuitive, but its true. All Clinton losing would do is convince the Democratic establishment that they need to be even more conservative.
I can't agree with this more. We've essentially had a broken government since 2010 when the Republicans took over the House. Because the House and Senate write the laws, there really isn't a realistic way for a Democratic president to get his or her proposals enacted into law. As is going to be dramatically illustrated within the next couple of months, Democratic presidents even are going to have trouble getting their nominees for important government positions nominated (cough - Supreme Court).
The importance of this fact extends far beyond this primary.
Going by Sander's dominance among younger voters, if the Iowa and Nevada caucuses were held in 2020, Sanders would have won. As for the general election, Sanders beats all of the Republicans by larger margins than Hillary Clinton. I know people love to dismiss these polls, but considering the vast majority of people in the polls indicate they have heard of Sanders and pretty much every media description indicates he is a "self-described democratic socialist", I don't think they can just be discarded.
The supposed "unpopularity" of Sanders policies comes from Nixon/Reagan era messaging that played on the racism and nationalism (fear of communism) of white voters. That cohort represents a smaller and smaller portion of the electorate every year.
At the very least, I would hope by the late 2020's or early 2030's (which would be about the end of the Hillary Clinton administration if she makes it through two terms), there wouldn't be any questions regarding the acceptability of Sander's policies to the broader electorate.
The truth is probably somewhere in between. We will know more in the coming days. At the very least, Sanders must have won at least a significant portion of Hispanic voters, if not a majority. That's far more than people were saying he would win at the beginning of this primary.
Realistically, now that the Democratic primary is pretty much over, this line of rhetoric needs to die for all of our sakes. Hillary Clinton is going to need the votes of both her own and Sanders supporters to win in 2016 and 2020. Fomenting divisions among the Democratic base helps nobody.
And if, like me, you are a disappointed Sanders supporter, for God's sake please vote for Clinton in November. Clinton losing would not only cause a lot suffering for people Sander's policies were supposed to help, but Clinton losing would also push the enactment of those policies even further away. I know that seems somewhat counter-intuitive, but its true. All Clinton losing would do is convince the Democratic establishment that they need to be even more conservative.
I'd actually rather Bernie didn't get nominated despite preferring his policies because I fear the backlash that would occur as his supporters realize nothing will get done. Then we'll never get a shot at a true socialist who can pass legislation for thirty or forty more years.
Manmademan
Member
not the point.
we can see it in this very thread that there is a very vocal very visible segment of sanders supporters both online and IRL that give the campaign a bad name. Deny they exist all you want, but they have done very real damage to the reputation of the campaign among minorities.
It may be impossible for bernie himself to rein them in at this point, but his rhetoric has encouraged it.
this as well. Perhaps "hate" wasn't the right choice of words, but its clearly gone past "liking both but preferring clinton." Black voters are rapidly trending towards disliking bernie sanders.
Inuhanyou is a textbook example of the Bernie supporter that turns off other Bernie supporters like me. He(or she) literally said that a vote for Hillary was a vote for fascism. After that I pretty much just started skipping his posts. Hyperbole is one thing, but some people are just living in a fantasy world.
No, it's not necessarily better. The Republican Congress is far to the right. Meeting them in the middle is still right-of-center in so many cases, especially with the budget. This is why a lot of us liberals are so depressed with Democrats. There's got to be a point where they are willing to hold the line.
Yep. Agree.
Yeah sorry if I can't buy someone who stands for a whole lot of really bad shit magically shifts her opinions right around the time she wants to become president.
If this was any other Democrat, Elizabeth Warren, Nancy Pelosi, even Barney Frank, I'd be perfectly fucking ok with voting for them, even supporting some of them enthusiastically. But Hillary's slimy as fuck and I fucking refuse to just jump on her bandwagon because I have to. So please continue blasting every goddamn person who doesn't want to fall in lockstep with the Ready For Hillary campaign because this kind of shit is what's going to get Trump elected.
Well as a Canadian I can't do much, but I do wish AmericanGAF the very best. I don't want to say Bernie is the right choice, but he is.
Joking aside, I do really wonder what people see in Clinton. The more and more I think about it, she really is a Carcetti/Underwood figure. She isn't a republican, sure, but her constant flip-flopping and her support of the status-qou that devalues lower and middle class schmucks like me and the majority of the West is absolutely disturbing from a progressive in this day and age.
Oh I don't deny the existence, I just think they won't end up mattering. At least I hope not.
LegendofJoe
Member
Bernie's revolution is going to take another 20 years to arrive. Bernie's supporters are by and large ignorant of state and local politics though so they don't understand that.
I'm voting for Bernie during Super Tuesday because I want to show my support for a farther left agenda for the Democrats, but I am coming to terms with Hillary as the nominee. I don't love her but will definitely vote for her in November.
I never really subscribed to the idea that Hillary would get loads of shit through while Bernie wouldn't, though. Both would have to compromise loads and I wouldn't be disappointed if we didn't get free college and medicare for all in the first four years if Bernie was elected. I just want someone that doesn't feel like there's some sort of cliff that they will fall off if they move a little farther to the left.
I never really subscribed to the idea that Hillary would get loads of shit through while Bernie wouldn't, though. Both would have to compromise loads and I wouldn't be disappointed if we didn't get free college and medicare for all in the first four years if Bernie was elected. I just want someone that doesn't feel like there's some sort of cliff that they will fall off if they move a little farther to the left.
Still pathetic.
RPGCrazied
Member
He did?
Well, if a Republican wins, its probably going to go away. Cruz wants to get rid of it. Rubio I heard wants to have the states decide. And most states I'm sure have a problem with it.
Specially where I live in Texas, homophobia runs rampant here.
Manmademan
Member
they matter in that they've damaged sanders enough that black voters have turned a deaf ear to his campaign. well-- I won't go that far, his rhetoric never resonated in the first place among that community. the vocal minority have made that worse.
had that not been the case, maybe sanders wouldn't be in a position to be blown out in the next dozen states or so.
who can say?
but as for the general? I expect most of those that actually intended to vote in the general election and not as an act of protest to show up for clinton.
I don't buy that. Obama voters generally seem to understand that he's been stymied by gridlock in congress. Bernie has framed the fight as him vs. a corrupt system. If the corrupt system wins, I think his supporters will continue to blame the system, not Bernie for losing.
Now that his name is out there, he can campaign for progressive candidates. I think he can still do a lot to pull us left.
Of course that's what would happen, but it wouldn't stop the backlash anyway.
If the economy goes through another recession/downward trend before another 20 years pass I could see something resembling it happening sooner.
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
Bernie really has gotten the benefit of not having the Republican's pretty hate machine turned on him.
If he did, polls would likely be different.
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/berned-up
No. Sanders losing would "kill the dream" for many young voters, while a Sanders presidency would massively legitimize leftism in America regardless of the effectiveness of his policies.
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
Obama voters bailed on him in 2010. And there was so much distrust and dislike from the left that some were even looking to primary him in 2012.
Not even that long. In the span of 8 years, economic inequality has become one of the biggest talking points in America, same-sex marriage became the law of the land, and support for transgender rights is constantly rising. America is moving leftwards far quicker than most people realize.
Manmademan
Member
the american public tends to respond to economic downturns by voting in republicans. It's knee jerk, not rational.
look at voting in reagan after the carter years, or voting in republicans en masse in 2010 after the downturn of 08.
This, I love one part:
I had a long time FB friend unfriend me because I called him out on this shit. It's demeaning and it needs to stop no matter why wins the nom.
We'll probably get more an-caps because that's the type of country we live in.
Arkos
Nose how to spell and rede to
Dude fuck you and fuck that, whatever happened to voting your conscience and beliefs, regardless of the level of elections?
This thinking is the reason we have our 2 party system and it continues to thrive on this garbage.
Basileus777
Member
The trend is more of them voting in the opposing party than specifically Republicans.
Jack The Nipper
Banned
Is it really going to boil down to trump versus hill?
Or does Cruz really have a chance while being a super liar?
Feel sanders looks old even though he may not be older.. But old folks vote.
Or does Cruz really have a chance while being a super liar?
Feel sanders looks old even though he may not be older.. But old folks vote.
tearsintherain
Member
The supreme court has already ruled that gay marriage is legal. To override it, a constitutional amendment would be required that would need 75% senators and congresspeople to pass it, AND 75% of the states to approve. Just like changing the 2nd amendment, that isn't happening.
The next president is going to appoint 1+ supreme court justices, set our foreign policy terms, and be the nations cheerleader. Thats about it, with the current massive gridlock in Congress very little else can be done, no matter who wins.
Actually, this is the kind of shit that gets Trump elected.
(To be clear, I'm talking about liberals who sit out the general as a form of protest, as if that has ever actually helped their cause in the slightest.)
7DollarHagane
Banned
The more I read about kasich I wish that trump would just disappear.
Kasich seems like a much more moderate and reasonable kind of guy.
I wonder what people think of him here. He opposed a lot of military spending, reduced corporate tax loopholes, and seems generally to be bullish about waste without targeting necessary programs like education or infrastructure.
Kasich seems like a much more moderate and reasonable kind of guy.
I wonder what people think of him here. He opposed a lot of military spending, reduced corporate tax loopholes, and seems generally to be bullish about waste without targeting necessary programs like education or infrastructure.
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