Wkd Box Office 04•01-03•16 - BvS has 'worse legs than Barbara Gordon' -- Sibersk Esto

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Cipherr said:
Wait a minute, what are yall even discussing. These movies or the comics? Because those are two TOTALLY different things. Especially comics from over 60 years ago man..
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Exactly this! My image of Cap is from these old comics. And my image of Superman is from the 70s/80s. The white knights, patriotism, christianity. All that light and beauty and swell stuff. Bleh.

I guess we can move on. I'm just too old to know these new types of white capes. I guess I need to recap with some of them.
 
A name like Captain America is going to mean your character is going to be very loaded with what many writers believe America should be. This can ironically lead to Cap being one of the most anti-establishment heroes ever.

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Of course this can get taken just a smidgen too far

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I get what you are saying. I didn't start reading comics until I was in high school (mid 90s to 2000), and I remember being hesitant to buy a Captain America book because he seemed so cheesy (I am Canadian). However, the Mark Waid run was getting good WOM, so I checked it out and really liked it. I wouldn't say that Captain America is my favourite Marvel character, but he's probably in my Top 10 (when he's not being grumpy old man Steve).


But back on Topic, The Winter Soldier made more overseas than all of the MCU films save the Two Avengers and Iron Man 3. I don't think that worldwide audiences have an issue with Captain America films for the most part, and this one has Iron Man and Spider-Man.
 
tomtom94 said:
I mean Winter Soldier made a significant amount of money internationally ($450m). I guess it depends on if it makes Captain America sequel money or Avengers money.
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This is the point.

If people treat it like a Captain America sequel, you're looking around $800-900 million.

If people treat it like an Avengers sequel, expect $1 billion plus. Probably around $1.3 billion is my guess.
 
Arguably Civil War could be called Avengers 3 instead. Can't think of many people who believe this is a Captain America movie at this point.
 
Mrbob said:
Arguably Civil War could be called Avengers 3 instead. Can't think of many people who believe this is a Captain America movie at this point.
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Cap 3 should be called Avengers 2: Civil War

Age of Ultron should be Iron Man 4: Goddamnit Tony Fucking Stop It
 
MHWilliams said:
This is the point.

If people treat it like a Captain America sequel, you're looking around $800-900 million.

If people treat it like an Avengers sequel, expect $1 billion plus. Probably around $1.3 billion is my guess.
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I think people will treat it like something in between, so that's why I said $1.1B tops
 
inky said:
I think people will treat it like something in between, so that's why I said $1.1B tops
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I don't think there are enough MCU films to really make any fast and hard upper-bound predictions.

Iron Man 3 almost made as much as Avengers overseas while Thor 2 made half as much. The previous films in both series weren't all that far apart overseas.


Iron Man 3 got a 159% bump over Iron Man 3
Thor the Dark Age got a 63% bump over Thor
Winter Soldier got a 135% bump over First Avenger
 
Neither Cap nor Superman are USA propaganda anymore nor are they icons of Christian morality. Especially in the movies. Both characters are heavily scrutinized by the American government.

People will come in with the Snyder hate boner and claim that Superman is still presented as Jesus but aside from imagery he acts nothing like Jesus. He's presented more like Dr Manhattan if anything, feeling distant from the human race.

Cap is the closest to the prototypical "hero" in the current movie universes but even then he has a hard edge to him. He will kill people in his way and not bat an eye. That's not Christian son and not entirely heroic. But he's still all about doing good because it's good and saving innocents no matter what.
 
Cap in the films have done a good job and defining his character as more than just a tool for propaganda and a symbol for patriotism.

I also was turned off by Cap as a symbol (on a superficial level) growing up but the films have turned me around on the character, especially since they draw from a lot of his modern stories that really dig into what it means to be "a man out of time".

MCU Cap probably has had the most compelling stories in the MCU thus far and I think the reason he has been a success internationally is because people can relate to the character and don't see him as that superficial symbol. Otherwise, I would have expected TWS to be a middling success like TFA was and have a bigger domestic take than international (or at least be pretty even like most films that don't really resonate overseas) but TWS had a nice international increase over TFA.
 
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I actually find that CA panel kinda disturbing. What he says sounds like a zealot's reasoning. He could follow it up by saying "and that's why I need to kill these infidels" and it would logically follow.
 
Slayven said:
Could BvS make people a little gun show the first weekend?
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I've never seen any evidence of a movie's poor reception having a negative impact on another film. There's sometimes an assumption that a film disappointing will result in another movie grossing way more, as if the box office is a zero sum game. Don't really see it that, and in general a film or series of films disappoints, it's probably pointing to the BO in general cooling off.

If BvS was great and making something like $500+M, perhaps that would be another story, but even then... Not sure history would back that up. Avengers obviously made plenty of cash in the wake of the Hunger Games, Inside Out just recently made $350M directly in the shadow of Jurassic World, Frozen with Catching Fire as well, etc.
 
AmaterasuOni said:
I always think like that when the American flags are being waved in any movie. It's an issue I have. :)
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Then you should definitely watch the movies and get more context. I always thought Captain America was lame as hell growing up, but movie Captain America is great.

Cap is purposely used by the US for propaganda in the first film, he sees it as a joke, as he doing stage shows to sell bonds and such since it's World War 2.

In the Winter Soldier he became a fugitive due to the corruption that is entrenched to the very core of government that was meant to protect the American people.
 
Captain has become my favorite hero in the MCU despite being one of my least favorites going into the MCU from the comics.

He's easily the most relatable of the Avengers cast.
 
Matt said:
I actually find that CA panel kinda disturbing. What he says sounds like a zealot's reasoning. He could follow it up by saying "and that's why I need to kill these infadels" and it would logically follow.
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Honestly, yeah. I think it's a great example of the way that Cap's reflection of American values isn't always a good thing - so much of, say, America's toxic foreign policy pulls from exactly the kind of rhetoric in those panels.

He's not a tool for the government, but he's still a tool for American values. And not everyone in the world is going to agree 100% with those values.
 
AmaterasuOni said:
I always think like that when the American flags are being waved in any movie. It's an issue I have. :)
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Captain America isn't "Murica fuck yeah" guy, maybe watch the movies before you pass judgement. I hate the shitty "Holy shit look how awesome America is and how big our army dick is" movies but I like Captain America, if anything he's the opposite of that.
 
Dahbomb said:
Captain has become my favorite hero in the MCU despite being one of my least favorites going into the MCU from the comics.

He's easily the most relatable of the Avengers cast.
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He is the best character they have. They really managed to make him the heart of the universe
 
Matt said:
I actually find that CA panel kinda disturbing. What he says sounds like a zealots reasoning. He could follow it up by saying "and that's why I need to kill these infadels" and it would logically follow.
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It's been appropriated those ways in the past. Often rubs me the wrong way when posted. It's a hop and a skip from Rorschach's rhetoric.
 
Sephzilla said:
He's the best written
and best acted
hero in the MCU by far
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Not even close on the latter. He's the most likeable for sure but him in the hospital with peggy is just...wooden

RDJ is the GOAT mcu hero performance. Really steals scenes with his presence. If Douglas' pym counted at all because of his past I'd put him over evans too
 
Discotheque said:
Not even close on the latter. He's the most likeable for sure but him in the hospital with peggy is just...wooden

RDJ is the GOAT mcu hero performance. Really steals scenes with his presence. If Douglas' pym counted at all because of his past I'd put him over evans too
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I think Evans as Cap > RDJ as Stark. He's able to deliver more emotion to the screen than Downey does (not slamming RDJ at all, I just think Evans brings more to the table)
 
Biggest-Geek-Ever said:
I've never seen any evidence of a movie's poor reception having a negative impact on another film. There's sometimes an assumption that a film disappointing will result in another movie grossing way more, as if the box office is a zero sum game. Don't really see it that, and in general a film or series of films disappoints, it's probably pointing to the BO in general cooling off.

If BvS was great and making something like $500+M, perhaps that would be another story, but even then... Not sure history would back that up. Avengers obviously made plenty of cash in the wake of the Hunger Games, Inside Out just recently made $350M directly in the shadow of Jurassic World, Frozen with Catching Fire as well, etc.
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Ya, I doubt BvS matters that much to Civil War.


Actual Thursday gross for BvS ended up being $2.72M. I don't see Zootopia numbers yet.


Boxoffice.com updated their Long Range forecast list. They bumped Jungle Book up to a $70M opening and $220M total (I think it was low 60s and 195M before). They also put their initial prediction for Turtles 2 at $55M.

I'm not seeing anything else that is noteworthly. I do think they are underpredicting Barbershop at an $18M opening though. The first two were over $20M, and had decent enough legs.
 
Sephzilla said:
He's the best written
and best acted
hero in the MCU by far
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Best acted is still probably Tony Stark by RDJ. His character and films work despite being in the middle of mediocrity and bad writing. I mean people went all in for IM2 and IM3 because of RDJ.

Mr. Poolman said:
MCU Captain America is a better Superman than Superman.
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I have said this a million times already (referring to DCU Superman though).
 
Sephzilla said:
I think Evans as Cap > RDJ as Stark. He's able to deliver more emotion to the screen than Downey does (not slamming RDJ at all, I just think Evans brings more to the table)
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Nah see i don't see much in the way of emotion from cap. He's way too stoic...sometimes wooden line delivery too. I've seen a way greater range from RDJ

Agree to disagree though no doubt
 
broncobuster said:
It's been appropriated those ways in the past. Often rubs me the wrong way when posted. It's a hop and a skip from Rorschach's rhetoric.
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I think it hurts without the full context. That logic could extend to anyone that believes in anything. It could be used by the people that support all the nonsense going on in the south as equally as the people fighting against it.
 
HomerSimpson-Man said:
Then you should definitely watch the movies and get more context. I always thought Captain America was lame as hell growing up, but movie Captain America is great.

Cap is purposely used by the US for propaganda in the first film, he sees it as a joke, as he doing stage shows to sell bonds and such since it's World War 2.

In the Winter Soldier he became a fugitive due to the corruption that is entrenched to the very core of government that was meant to protect the American people.
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I've seen them both. First movie was ok'ish, it was fun and all. But the Winter Soldier, I think it's my least favorite Marvel movie, even behind Ang Lee's Hulk.
 
Sephzilla said:
I think Evans as Cap > RDJ as Stark. He's able to deliver more emotion to the screen than Downey does (not slamming RDJ at all, I just think Evans brings more to the table)
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RDJ is inconsistent in these films. Great in Iron Man 1&3, okay in Avengers, sleepwalking in IM2 and AoU. Evans puts in the effort in all his appearances. It's admirable. Even scenes with Bucky, when he's getting nothing back to work with, he does a good job.
 
Mr. Poolman said:
MCU Captain America is a better Superman than Superman.
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I watched Winter Soldier for the first time yesterday, and for some reason the second half of his speech reminded me really heavily of the Superman I thought the MoS trailers were building up to, and whose absence was the cause of much distress in BvS reactions. We need a crossover so Captain America can lead Snyder's Superman into the sun.
 
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