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[Sandfox]

I'm not a fan of this but it is what it is.

 

[Zophar]

Incremental is right. This barely seems worth doing, it's more of a DS -> DSi than a 3DS -> New 3DS situation.

 

[Pancake Mix]

Watch the vanilla PS4 outsell this if it's still being produced and at a lower price at the same time. People like power, but console gamers also like generational leaps and not feeling screwed over and out of the best console experience after only 3 years.

So, its like the rumors suggested, with the NEO being a New 3DS equivalent to the OG PS4 and both will play the same games. Plus, the "NEO Mode" will not negate the OG PS4 user as both will have the same network, store front, core OS and other such features.

......I will repeat what I originally said a few weeks back; cool with this as long as OG PS4 games don't run like crap. Even then, not expecting thousands to flock to this upgraded system day one and with this new system out, more OG systems will start dropping in price like crazy.

All of that leads to the OG PS4 system to get the most support and will be the 'main' system despite the fact stronger hardware is on the table for developers to play with.

Interesting that every future PS4 game (likely starting this June) will ship with "NEO Mode" support well before this new system even releases; will be a major selling point I would image.

I agree with this, though the New 3DS actually had a few exclusives, including one retail game (Xenoblade Chronicles 3D).

I expect the vanilla PS4 to outsell the NEO PS4 to be the standard bearer this gen and outsell the NEO PS4, which will sell well on account of it being a PS4 and a PlayStation console not named the PS3, but not provide anything of real substance or a new standard.

As for mandatory "NEO Mode" support, that's starting in October the article says, with games shipping in late September requiring day one patches to include NEO support, so effectively late September is the beginning, but games that month seemingly do not have to go gold with the new mode and that can just be added in right before launch. So Final Fantasy XV will have the mode, but probably in a day one patch. Tales of Berseria releases in Japan in August, so that shouldn't need it, even though the Western versions will obviously release after the transition, if I'm reading this right.

I see quite a few people that are pleased. Myself and other people I know with PS4s already included.

You clearly didn't read my post.

 

[Man-is-Obsolete]

It's honestly a perfectly reasonable spec increase. The nice thing is its not a big enough power gap to make "standard" versions for PS4 much more difficult and still provide a tangible benefit.

This is the kind of performance boost where FFXV could be the version we see now and the NEO version could lock in that 1080p, rock solid 30fps, and add AA. In other words a still fine experience for PS4 and an improved one on NEO

Yep, People should only really expect games that were sub resolution and sub target 30 and sub target 60 to then run native on the Neo with maybe better AA. Those that feel this separates the user base are missing it entirely. This in no way separates the user base or changes the base experience. The PS4 is already getting unsteady frame rates and sub native resolution games since the start really, without the existance of the Neo. The Neo simply offers a solution for those that want the best possible experience to be able to obtain it.

 

[jbug617]

Is there a possibility that Sony makes a last second upgrade like they did with PS4?

If I remember right PS4 rumors had it at 6GB but at the unveiling they revealed it to be 8GB and it surprised devs.

 

[Movalpolos]

If NX is more powerful than OG PS4, I guess a lot of people, myself included, would likely switch to NX for their multiplatform needs. If NEO is more powerful than NX, that at least "stops the bleeding". I guess Sony recognizes that their power advantage is significant in an age where all consoles are pretty much the same, and first party output is lacking all around.

You won't be playing multiplatform games on NX. It won't have 3rd party support.

 

[Daft Punk]

Yeah and assuming that wont happen surely isnt sticking your head in the sand either.


"The leaks says that wont happen so lets not even discuss the potential of that happening!"

There's a difference between rational discussion and sounding like Rick Valassi from The Division.

 

[MMaRsu]

So it's not a major upgrade? What's the point then? Just seems unnecessary. I personally won't be paying another 350 for some nicer textures and a bit of a smoother frame rate. It's pointless really. And I'm not sure most of the console crowd will do either. How's about give us good games instead?

To get people to spend another 399 on Playstation hardware next to PSVR ( Which I am really looking forward to :/. )

 

[ethomaz]

280X, and do we have any confirmation that this isn't just going to be enhanced GCN 1.0?

PS4 is GCN 1.1 (features 8 ACEs).

 

[Obliterator]

"Noticeable" by GAF, or by the general public? Because I'm not necessarily seeing that.

My other worry with this is more about the power of PSVR. Is this thing already underpowered?

Nah it's enough of a boost to offer a noticeable difference. That GPU is a lot better

 

[boredandlazy]

Explain this comment to me like I'm a five year old

Well based on the (assumed) tone of the post I was replying to, he/she was making fun of the apparently low clock speed of the GPU. So, I just posted an easy to understand comparison showing that even the most powerful PC GPUs on the market don't have that much higher of a clock speed.

 

[Falcs]

This sucks! I'm sure the Neo won't come out until at least early 2017, but I was finally going to buy a PS4 when FF15 came out in September. Now of course I won't buy one if a better version of the console is about to be available.
So now I might have to wait about another whole year.

 

[badb0y]

"Noticeable" by GAF, or by the general public? Because I'm not necessarily seeing that.

My other worry with this is more about the power of PSVR. Is this thing already underpowered?

Well there is a significant difference everytime you double your GPU's performance on PC. I don't see why that won't be the case on consoles.

 

[ecosse_011172]

The NX had better best these specs as well. Seems solid but not upgrade worthy if you've already taken the plunge on the OG4

Not a chance in hell.
The very best you could reasonably expect is slightly ahead of PS4.
Anyone expecting a powerhouse is mad.

 

[Coffinhal]

You won't be playing multiplatform games on NX. It won't have 3rd party support.

So many insiders on gaf.

 

[i HeaR MusiC]

As long as this bump is enough to take games from 990p to 1080p and 30fps to 60fps I will be satisfied.

 

[onQ123]

4.197 Tflops GPU?

 

[Mobile Suit Gooch]

This doesn't sound too bad at all actually.

 

[McHuj]

280X, and do we have any confirmation that this isn't just going to be enhanced GCN 1.0?

Front page spec says improved GCN. Ps4 is GCN 1.1, Tonga GPU was 1.2, Polaris is 1.3. I doubt we'd get an upgrade to Polaris so 1.2 seems likely. Unless it's something custom.

 

[Vena]

PS4 is GCN 1.1 (features 8 ACEs).

PS4 has features of GCN 1.1, I don't think its a full 1.1. But I may be wrong.

Front page spec says improved GCN. Ps4 is GCN 1.1, Tonga GPU was 1.2, Polaris is 1.3. I doubt we'd get an upgrade to Polaris so 1.2 seems likely. Unless it's something custom.

Says nothing of changing GCN generations. Just says improved GCN, whatever that is supposed to mean.

 

[-Horizon-]

I doubt sony cares about what the NX is. They probably know about as much as we know lol.

If anything, its to push VR and 4K adoption rates.

 

[Hexa]

How do you know CPU is bottoeneck? These any evidence/comparison?

I mean the CPU/GPU are based on pretty well known hardware so it's pretty easy to figure out considering that there's a significant gap.

Also there have been multiple reports by devs saying the same, such as:
http://www.inquisitr.com/1612173/xb...ty-cpu-bound-and-slower-on-the-playstation-4/

 

[Sandfox]

I have no desire to buy a platform I already own, but I'm sure people will enjoy this. I'm curious to see what this is eventually replaced with though.

 

[MMaRsu]

There's a difference between rational discussion and sounding like Rick Valassi from The Division.

Sure whatever man. I dont even know who that is and I dont care.

The fact is this sets a dangerous precedent.

But hey if you dont want to discuss it and assume everything in the leak is true and old ps4 owners wont get shafted in any way then fine. I just see it as a way to get people to plunk down another 399.

 

[Shambala]

My body is ready. Nice spec bump 😁

 

[CertifiedFP]

Man, while I suppose it's nice to not split up the userbase, I can't help but feel that a PS4K model is going to be kneecapped from the start if the only thing devs are allowed to do with it is make enhanced graphics/framerate versions of base-PS4 games, with no features that would only be possible via improved hardware.

 

[Deadstar]

Thank goodness for this new console because Final Fantasy 15 runs like garbage on the current machine. It's going to be glorious if they can hit 60 fps.

 

[General Lee]

Tech guys. Tell us, will this even amount to any type of significant improvement in performance and/or resolution. Seems like nominal upgrades....

It's around that rumored 2x performance upgrade. Doubling the compute units to 36 won't alone give twice the performance, but raising the clock speeds will probably account for the rest, and you'll also need to raise the memory bandwidth to feed that. What's not seen here is that the newer GCN will have better delta color compression that reduces raw bandwidth requirements, so the number doesn't have to be double the previous.

The CPU part won't be 2x, but usually games are GPU bound, so maybe it's enough for games on PS4 Neo to run at 60 FPS without being a bottleneck.

 

[Lister]

A lot of people complaining about the CPU staying the same. That thing does indeed blow but devs are getting better at offloading tasks normally handled by the CPU to the GPU. Those extra CUs combines with a modest CPU clock boost will make a real tangible difference

There are many workleads that will not benefit from GPu off-loading, or would perform worse than on CPU though.

 

[Hendrick's]

Sony gonna be keeping Digital Foundry busy.

 

[Fess]

Crankily upgrade is what they'll do. Hand over the money with a scowl.

In many cases, yes.

Quite ironically, after getting flamed for launching a future-proofed $599 console they now got away with launching a $798 console with split payments instead. And they even got cheers at E3 when announcing the $399 PS4 price. Priceless move, Sony. Hah

 

[R3TRO]

But they are expected though, at the price it will retail at. Can't really do too much to improve without raising the price.

I guess that makes sense.

 

[dezzy8]

This is interesting, so NEO would mainly give better resolution/framerate rather than expand gamemodes that can't be done on the old hardware. Stuff like LOD would be improved though of course.

Obviously. What the fuck were people thinking this upgraded ps4 was going to do?

 

[TheExecutive]

So this spec bump is specifically for VR? I never doubted it but if true it would seem this is the case. VR ON THE CURRENT PS4 specs is very limited.

 

[bomblord1]

Sounds like SNES Nintendo level of attempted content control and curation on third parties

A good way to sour relations.

 

[SmiteOfHand]

Reminder that Sony's primary revenue stream for Playstation is software, not hardware.

 

[gundamkyoukai]

Pretty much. I have zero faith that devs will continue to optimize for the lower spec'd PSPoor.

They will just like last gen
Where they cut things like fps , res , etc etc as time goes on .

 

[dex3108]

Yep, People should only really expect games that were sub resolution and sub target 30 and sub target 60 to then run native on the Neo with maybe better AA. Those that feel this separates the user base are missing it entirely. This in no way separates the user base or changes the base experience. The PS4 is already getting unsteady frame rates and sub native resolution games since the start really, without the existance of the Neo. The Neo simply offers a solution for those that want the best possible experience to be able to obtain it.

So instead of pushing devs to optimise games they are going with easy route by giving them better hardware.

 

[pooh]

You won't be playing multiplatform games on NX. It won't have 3rd party support.

Rumors have been saying otherwise >_>

 

[Hexa]

Sure whatever man. I dont even know who that is and I dont care.

The fact is this sets a dangerous precedent.

But hey if you dont want to discuss it and assume everything in the leak is true and old ps4 owners wont get shafted in any way then fine. I just see it as a way to get people to plunk down another 399.

I mean people keep saying that, but Sony makes like no money on console hardware. They don't sell at a loss anymore yes, but they're far from making a profit. So that's definitely not the reason. That's just not how the console market functions. They're doing this because they think it'll result in selling more software/PS+ subs.

 

[MMaRsu]

So instead of pushing devs to optimise games they are going with easy route by giving them better hardware.

.

 

[family_guy]

Absolutely, but why not separate these 2 major releases to 2 different years? It doesn't make any sense fiscally. If I had a choice to make, I would go with the 4k. Many PSVR reservations would be cancelled.

One supplements the other's experience. That's why.

 

[Wereroku]

Though there likely won't be anything stopping them from releasing games that are NEO-only in a practical sense like Hyrule Warriors. Like, games that DO have a Base Mode, but it runs at 720p/20fps.

Shit like that is already happening just look at the original release of Unity. This really isn't some mindblowing thing. Devs already handle this when they port for PS4 to PC. They have a minimum spec they design for and anything above that gets to add additional effects/res/framerate. In this case the devs will have total control. You are probably just going to be seeing 900p ps4 game being full 1080p or higher and maybe having better framerates. I doubt there will be many 30->60 though that is usually bottlenecked by the cpu on the consoles and it is getting a smaller upgrade. I expect to see ps4 being medium setting 1080/900 and psneo being high/ultra settings and full 1080.

Incremental is right. This barely seems worth doing, it's more of a DS -> DSi than a 3DS -> New 3DS situation.

This is a bigger upgrade then 3ds-n3ds overall. That just had a cpu upgrade. This is both a cpu and gpu upgrade.

 

[AcademicSaucer]

You won't be playing multiplatform games on NX. It won't have 3rd party support.

Have you being verified by mods?

 

[Elginer]

This doesn't sound too bad at all. I really have no desire as I don't own a 4K TV and for the most part frame rates are good enough for me. Love that Sony isn't going to make NEO only games so I can play pretty much anything. In the future if I want I can easily get a new system and just trade mine in and pay the difference for a slightly better one. Kind of like the whole 3DS thing.

 

[Suzushiiro]

Though there likely won't be anything stopping them from releasing games that are NEO-only in a practical sense like Hyrule Warriors. Like, games that DO have a Base Mode, but it runs at 720p/20fps.

Keep in mind that Hyrule Warriors was a somewhat unique situation in that it was a port of a game made for significantly more powerful hardware. Same for the only actual N3DS exclusive I can think of off the top of my head (Xenoblade.) Not quite the same situation as a game made for close that level of power from the start.

I think the likelihood of that happening here is dependent on if MS does the same thing, where the NX winds up being power-wise, and how all three of the consoles in question sell. If the install base of platforms with Neo-level power is high enough relative to the install base of PS4/XBone-level platforms you might start seeing that occasionally, but in practice I think that it's not in the interest of third-party or first-party devs to encourage the idea that it's not worth buying a game if you only have the "weaker" platform no matter how many people choose to upgrade.

Of course, that's not going to stop internet forum posters from complaining that a game was clearly made with the Neo in mind and base PS4 owners are second-class citizens every time the base PS4 version's framerate stutters a bit.

 

[Obliterator]

There are many workleads that will not benefit from GPu off-loading, or would perform worse than on CPU though.

Well no doubt but were people expecting a generational difference? That was never in the cards we will still get a PS5.

This is the S version of the IPhone line. Those specs increases will add some nice stability to framerates and improve image quality. To some that's more than worth it.

Putting a new CPU in the thing would have been a bit crazy and really caused some issues with cross support between both platforms. This is the same architecture just with some nice improvements to the package

 

[TheExecutive]

Man, while I suppose it's nice to not split up the userbase, I can't help but feel that a PS4K model is going to be kneecapped from the start if the only thing devs are allowed to do with it is make enhanced graphics/framerate versions of base-PS4 games, with no features that would only be possible via improved hardware.

30fps to 60 fps for VR to be viable for normal games no? that's kinda the point right? I mean I am total layperson so I could be wrong

 

[Instro]

Pretty much. I have zero faith that devs will continue to optimize for the lower spec'd PSPoor.

Frankly I'd expect the opposite considering how devs currently optimize PC games. I wouldn't expect any significant amount of work being put into the neo version unless that system upgrade sells like gangbusters.

 

[Varg]

Even with that bump in power, your not going to be getting 60fps in every game guys especially the new final fantasy. I'll be waiting to see what Microsoft has as far as new consoles go but for the time being I don't see myself swapping out my ps4 for this new model.