How?
Giant Bomb: PS4.5 / PS4K is codenamed NEO, more info
- Thread starter bananafactory
- Start date
How?
SmartWaffles
Member
Maybe, 14nm could benefit thermal overhead massively.
GhostTrick
Banned
If it's 36CU, so double PS4 GPU, it might means it's a 40CU chip with 4CU disabled. R9 390 is a 40CU. So it might be physically a R9 390 equivalent, in the same sense that PS4 GPU is an HD7870 physically, in the core count. But in term of raw power, because of the clocks and the disabled CUs, PS4 is closer to HD7850 and PS4K might be closer to R9 280x.
Toadthemushroom
Member
Yeah, all but one of the games were scaled *up* to the N3DS rather than down. Hyrule Warriors Legends is the exception, though again that's the kind of game that had a CPU bottleneck on original 3DS, and the N3DS CPU is a lot, lot faster.
PS4 NEO isn't improving CPU by a lot so we probably won't get a game like that on it...unless there's something which is heavy on GPU compute I guess (and maybe PS VR stuff).
This seems like wishful thinking on your behalf.
Having a Premium model next to a basic model doesn't suddenly invalidate peoples' preference for consoles, lol
No doubt some will wish to migrate to a PC ecosystem upon hearing this news, but so what? PlayStation is a global brand and will have significant user bases for their home consoles.
Hydrargyrus
Member
Well, I will probably buy it day one...
gundamkyoukai
Member
How is it turning into a steam box ?
Does a steam box have all the features \ user ability of a consoles ?
I just want to play at higher framerates without building a PC. By forcing developers to keep the games compatible with first generation PS4s, maybe higher framerates will be the go to difference for Neo mode.
I don't want better graphics or 4K, I just want games that don't give me a migraine, and maybe this will make up for the apparently shitty coding of Fallout 4 and Just Cause 3.
I would love even just 45fps for Bloodborne/DS3.
I don't want better graphics or 4K, I just want games that don't give me a migraine, and maybe this will make up for the apparently shitty coding of Fallout 4 and Just Cause 3.
I would love even just 45fps for Bloodborne/DS3.
You make absolutely no sense. No, a console is not a PC. Releasing a console, in the middle of the gen, with better specs (instead of an ordinary slim version) is actually nice.
Console gaming still has it's benefits.
Good, because the PS is not turning into a Steam box. With or without the PS4K.
His original point is that you make a better console for $399. My point is, is that they easilt could of done at that price point, they just fell extremely unlucky. The premium is the amount of silicon space, not what's on it.
A lot of these games dont seem to be very complicated on the sim side but it's probable as you go up to 90 or certainly 120 that things are tight on both CPU and GPU for these games. But the spec bump here will probably help most vr games move up to the next framerate target I would think. From 90 to 120 needs a neat 33% speed up which the CPU bump pretty much provides.
Toadthemushroom
Member
Cheers!
Actually nice for who? People with enough money to blow on another console. Can't afford another £400 every 3 years? Fuck you, play your 20fps game pleb.
SmartWaffles
Member
Lol 45fps is a nightmare. As long as you are targeting a 60Hz display, you can only do either 30 or 60fps, anything else will introduce massive judder due to uneven frametime. Actually 45fps is the exact worst point because half of the frames will be displayed differently with the rest.
I don't understand that logic.
Again, with PS4 "Neo" :
Regular PS4 owners : still getting all games, and all games designed to work on regular PS4.
PS4 "Neo" owners : will get the same games, but with potentially performance and IQ improvements
Without PS4 "Neo" :
You just get the PS4 games as they are designed to work on regular PS4...no chances to have improved version outside of PC.
So, no-one is getting slighted, there is just an additional option to get "better". Are people afraid that Sony would just gimp the PS4 versions (of course we can't "exclude" that, but it's just as realistic as the consiparcy theories where MS would pay devs to not optimize more for PS4)?
This might indeed end up with most devs aiming for 900p (or lower) on PS4 to target 1080p with more bells and whistles on PS4 "Neo"...but should we go back in time to higlight all those "late releases" last gen that were sporting some 576p resolutions and terrible performance at times to try and deliver something more ambitious? We would have been stuck with that with or without PS4 "Neo".
I need more info from Sony to know if it's worthwhile. I have a decent PC enough to have "better" multiplat games so I'm not in a rush. But I was anyway going to have a second PS4 at some point (I always do that mid-gen, moved to slim PS2 and Slim Xbox 360 previously) so if I invest, I would be even more please if it would be for a better hardware all-around.
Sell your vanilla model and use that to fund your mid-gen refresh. Going forward, simply don't buy launch models (assuming iterative consoles are here to stay).
Might wanna do that soon though, resale values might take a hit once this news becomes official.
gundamkyoukai
Member
You were going to have to do that anyway .
Just look at last gen and most people did not care .
Just look how much TLOU , COD , GTA5 just for eg sold .
You think 4 or 5 years into this gen devs were not going to start cutting stuff ?
They start doing it since this gen started .
wapplew
Member
How is it different from Steam box aside from library if they give up traditional generation?
New hardware every 2-3 years maybe less, all play same titles with different performance. No more first party exclusive make use of latest hardware, just same ultra setting with more frames or more res.
GazzaScotland
Member
Sorry if it's been covered but will be interesting to see what happens to online games with the NEO versions are running at a higher frame rate.
GHG
Member
Now now, no need to be rude towards people who play on the Xbox One.
There are already games that run at 20fps on the ps4...
Dreathlock
Member
I hope all Neo games come with a 60 fps requirement.
Toadthemushroom
Member
I can already see Namco rereleasing older games with code to make them run better on PS4 NEO, instead of patching pre-existing games.
...They were the only publisher daring enough to do that on N3DS, with Ace Combat: Assault Horizon Legacy+. Welp.
...They were the only publisher daring enough to do that on N3DS, with Ace Combat: Assault Horizon Legacy+. Welp.
Yes, people who want a more powerful console, can get a more powerful console. People who don't want a more powerful console, can keep their ordinary PS4 / buy the ordinary cheaper one. Who says that the games are going to run with 20fps on the ordinary PS4? You? Okay! And who else? Sony? The developers? Where is your proof? Oh wait, let me guess, the 'see cross-gen / PS4 and PS3 games' excuse? Yeah right....
Stop feeling insecure because other people can play their games with better graphics/performance. It doesn't make your experience worse.
Paying more and getting better stuff? Why not?
Exactly
ninjablade
Banned
This would make get a ps4k day one, 60fps is such a huge difference.
bitbydeath
Member
You have an option to upgrade if you don't upgrade then nothing changes for you.
Simple as that.
Toadthemushroom
Member
It's all opportunity cost, though. Even if you know there will be iterated hardware down the line (e.g. Nintendo handhelds have done this, though N3DS was the first to impact power) most would rather have the hardware and games for 3 years starting at launch, than wait 3 years for a potential upgrade.
I know I would.
Though for anyone still on the fence about the hardware then it makes sense not to buy a PS4 now if you didn't have one already, but again I can see some big Uncharted fans buying one when Uncharted 4 comes out, rather than waiting.
I guess it also depends on how tight a secret Sony can keep about the new model. Nintendo kept N3DS under wraps without any leaks, but it sacrificed actual N3DS support for it. Only a few publishers had early access to N3DS dev kits (Capcom for example), so when it launched only a handful of games supported N3DS mode, and most the improvements were in the actual hardware, Amiibo support and the OS.
killatopak
Member
woah there.
How do you know games won't start running worse on PS4 when PS4K becomes the target?
Would, could, might...
All bla bla, they lost it at concept stage and the failure of the bone is partly explained by this. A non focus to hardware and market. This CPU in the Neo is still a significant upgrade, the GPU is great. For 399 not really nad and all in all considrably faster than your xbone.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
I saw nothing that supports this. Draw distance would be an graphical update expected in the upgraded mdoel. Would you also expect the PS4 Neo to have the exact same framerate drops in competitive MP games as well?
All Neo PS4 mode games are to meet or exceed original PS4 framerates.
The biggest problem would be playing online against Neo players if you have the old PS4. 30FPS vs 60FPS. And developers using time on the neo version instead of focusing on the old PS4 version. I kinda feel like Sony and Microsoft should have released a better console from the start. This gen, with the crappy software, feels like a beta gen.
Still so many things missing from the UI... And where the hell is Persona 5
Still so many things missing from the UI... And where the hell is Persona 5
Aren't most mp games already running 60fps at lower resolutions? In this case only the resolution would be higher so performance will be similar for all. SP games is where the advantage would be noticeable imo
20fps ? Actually your ps4 will benefit from this.
I didnt realise valve made all steam boxes. Its closer to an ipad than a steambox.
You're not seeing the full picture. I'm not talking about the NEO, I'm talking about the possibility of Sony continuing deeper and harder down this path, going the Apple route. Constant new PS4s, watering down the console space, ending up being nothing more than Steamboxes with a recogizable brand on it. The end of developers optimizing for the console itself, and settling instead for shitty cross-gen versions of games across countless SKUs. That's not why I like consoles. That's not what I'm looking for from consoles.
How do you know games are going to run worse on the PS4? You don't.
Would it make more sense to target the ordinary PS4? You know, the '36 millions sold' PS4? Not the 'not released' PS4K.
I'm still not sure why devs would bother optimizing their game for another spec once the initial novelty wears off, unless the neo is massively popular or something.
OP says they'll be required to have a "NEO mode" but I doubt there are specific details beyond that.
Basically, unless the ps4k sells millions quickly and people start to decide their game purchase based on performance on that machine, I don't get what devs have to gain in this story.
OP says they'll be required to have a "NEO mode" but I doubt there are specific details beyond that.
Basically, unless the ps4k sells millions quickly and people start to decide their game purchase based on performance on that machine, I don't get what devs have to gain in this story.
Hydrargyrus
Member
Any estimated release date?
My guess is Q1 2017.
You assume that the GPU will amount to more than double the power of the PS4 on GFLOPS alone, we hardly know anything else.
But hey, when we start seeing games like Uncharted 4 at 1440p then I'll agree with you.
You are the one claiming things, not me.
I wouldn't make more sense to target PS4 when PS4K allows to sell better graphics.
TLZ
Banned
Thank you.
It is just that simple!
Halph n Halph
Member
That would seal the deal for me. I'm Not too concerned about medium to high shadows, textures etc as I'm happy with what we get now on a £299 machine.
Every game at 60 fps would persuade me to upgrade in a flash.
Makoto-Yuki
Banned
so is it just gonna be a PS4 with the same parts but higher clockspeeds? an overclocked PS4? if so i don't think there will be much of a difference unless they actually change the CPU/GPU to something else. it might help some games maintain a more solid framerate but not sure if it would be worth buying a new console for.
i hope they also take this opportunity to put in better networking. the internet connection is terrible on PS4. also, would love to see support for SATA3 so we can stick SSD's in and use their full speed.
i hope they also take this opportunity to put in better networking. the internet connection is terrible on PS4. also, would love to see support for SATA3 so we can stick SSD's in and use their full speed.
gundamkyoukai
Member
Ease of use .
Does steam box use disc base games ?
Is a steam box going to be subsides by hardware makers ?
Also how is the steam box OS going to be comapre to consoles .
Maybe you should wait until steam boxes comes out to see what happens .