I hope she's tall enough to do the human shield move that Joel did.
The Last of Us Part II announced
- Thread starter Greatest Ever
- Start date
I hope she's tall enough to do the human shield move that Joel did.
That would be lazy writing.
SolidSnakex
Member
But Joel's lie didn't paint the Fireflies in a negative light. He just told her that there are dozens of more people like her and that they'd given up on finding a cure.
Lys Skygge
Member
This ain't Scooby Doo.
"Haha! I was the villain the whole time!" *twirls mustache*
Chaplain
Member
No. More like, "
You killed innocent people trying to save humanity with a cure...deceived me by not telling me that you murdered them, and then pretend like nothing happened.
The game should be a loop of
.
Ellie interrogating Fireflies for answers as to why they attacked Tommy's town (presumably) after they stopped looking for a cure, and Joel shooting the Fireflies before they can answer, until Ellie begins to believe the shootings aren't really accidental
Chuck Norris
Banned
He saved her life. The Fireflies didn't even give her a choice, just kept her unconscious straight to surgery.
It's like harvesting an unconscious body for organs because the organs could save ten different people. Maybe the result is mathematically better but it's still murder
It's like harvesting an unconscious body for organs because the organs could save ten different people. Maybe the result is mathematically better but it's still murder
Venuspower
Member
That is a must-have-feature if you ask me.
It was really awesome to have another way to beat the level.
Much more intense.
I still think about some locations in the main game where that feature would be really nice. One of my favorite locatios would be in the winter level
after Ellie killed James and escaped.
restauraunt while you are fighting David
If I am right they removed the feature from the main game because they ran out of time. That is why they only have that feature in the DLC.
Lys Skygge
Member
You're talking to someone who 100% supports Joel's decision.
It is not like she doesnt know that. She knew he was lying, and the "okay" in the end was her ultimate acceptance.
TimeEffect
Member
Ellie doesn't give a shit. She cares most about Joel
And seeing as they've been together for a long while, I doubt she'd hate him long for it
Chaplain
Member
I fully understand your viewpoint. However, that doesn't change
that Ellie might not respond the same way you and others are. The fact remains, the remaining survivors on earth continue to suffer because Joel (the Judas of the story) decided what was the best for humanity (i.e, utilitarian ethical theory). Ellie would have given her life for humanity had she been given the option to choose. Joel dehumanized Ellie by robbing her of her capacity to choose between right and wrong (i.e., freewill). ["The Last of Us twice hints that Ellie would’ve accepted her death if given the opportunity to choose" (Source)]
Lys Skygge
Member
We don't truly know what Ellie would have decided. All we know is that it sounded like she might be coming to terms that she might have to be sacrificed, it it's never really spelled out for us. For all we know she could have been upset that her and Joel might have to part ways.
Also, Joel didn't rob her of a decision. The Fireflies decided that she should be sacrificed. Joel didn't agree with them. Ellie had no say either way.
Heckler456
Banned
This is why I don't envy Neil Druckmann and his co-writer at the moment. They basically have to somehow marry the pragmatic and realistic way of interpretering the story, and the more surface level way in which some other people interpret the story.
There is just no way that a vaccine would have done anything in and of itself to help humanity along. The worst atrocities are still committed by man, and the fireflies's hands aren't clean in that regard either. Let alone the fact that we have proof that humanity can thrive without a vaccine: Tommy's dam.
Also, Ellie was in no way capable of making the right decision for herself in that situation. She clearly suffered from survivor's guilt, and she was 15 years of age. She shouldn't be making that decision until she's at least a little older, or even until her past issues are resolved. But even then, the Fireflies never even gave her the opportunity for a choice! Not to mention that there are multiple occasions where Ellie mentions doing things with Joel past the point where they've found the Fireflies.
Also, Ellie was in no way capable of making the right decision for herself in that situation. She clearly suffered from survivor's guilt, and she was 15 years of age. She shouldn't be making that decision until she's at least a little older, or even until her past issues are resolved. But even then, the Fireflies never even gave her the opportunity for a choice! Not to mention that there are multiple occasions where Ellie mentions doing things with Joel past the point where they've found the Fireflies.
Dragon1893
Member
Yup, it's great.
Futurevoid
Member
Druckmann has been clear in the past that interpretations of the ending are perfectly valid in so far as that as long as they are within the context of the facts presented in the story - then feel free to interpret. However, the original intention is not what's been mentioned in those quotes.
Ellie's "okay" as being nothing more than acceptance of the lie being the general interpretation. Quite the opposite, in fact as it misses the part where Ellie's arch is brought to its conclusion. A summary of Druckmann's words at the IGDA keynote concerning the ending:
The next piece of information is perhaps the most interesting thing discussed during the keynote. Apparently Druckmann and his team of writers intended Ellie’s reaction to Joel’s lie to be interpreted very differently than many gamers have.
“Then we come to that ending and that lie and that okay and what does that okay mean? It’s definitely not a complacent ‘yea I’ll go along with you’, in fact, it’s the opposite. It’s Ellie waking up for the first time, waking up and realizing she can’t rely on him anymore. While she loves him for what he’s done for her, she hates him for robbing her of that choice. She knows that she has to leave him and make her own decisions and mistakes.”
The next piece of information is perhaps the most interesting thing discussed during the keynote. Apparently Druckmann and his team of writers intended Ellie’s reaction to Joel’s lie to be interpreted very differently than many gamers have.
“Then we come to that ending and that lie and that okay and what does that okay mean? It’s definitely not a complacent ‘yea I’ll go along with you’, in fact, it’s the opposite. It’s Ellie waking up for the first time, waking up and realizing she can’t rely on him anymore. While she loves him for what he’s done for her, she hates him for robbing her of that choice. She knows that she has to leave him and make her own decisions and mistakes.”
So yeah. Add that to the discussion in so far as what kind of direction Part II will take.
I would highly recommend watching it if you haven't (that goes for everyone in the thread). It's a fantastic discussion on the first game.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Le6qIz7MjSk
For this conversation I'd recommend to start watching at 33:00 for a discussion on the finale.
GravityInsanity
Member
Wow, loving her new look. Naughty Dog really loves light blue colors when it comes to shirts and jackets lol. Drake, Sam, Tommy, and now Ellie.
Heckler456
Banned
Same. Also hoping we get a few different outfits throughout the game like in the original.
I loved Ellie's tattoo, it's so cool, it kind of reminds me of Chloe's tat from lis.
Also I know I'm repeating what I said before in this thread, but Ellie looks like arya in this concept, her design is awsome, what I loved most about Ellie's older design is that naughty dog seem to have make her really "rough" looking, of course that's to be expected because it is the end of the world, but I think in comparison to Ellie's younger design, she looked much more softer and innocent, here the soft edges and innocence is completely gone, it's just an interesting contrast between the two games, also on a personal note, I like how they how Ellie stands out from the some of the female protagonists, going back to Chloe from lis, despite Chloe looking rough and punk, dontnod, still made her look aesthetically pleasing to look at, however with Ellie, naughty dog seemed to forgone to what looks nice to look out and instead focused on making the character design for the character, it's really cool that they did that.
I hope it's Ellie by the end of it. Would be cool to see a character we all care about believably turn dark over the course of the two games.
Do we want the Fireflies as the villains again? Overall as far as factions go, they are definitely better than the government and the individual hunter groups. If we had them as the enemies again, it would almost be like Neil is trying to hammer some "obey the authority!" message that discourages protest groups and going against the authority. While I would like to keep them in the game, maybe the antagonists that Ellie wants to hunt be a new hunter-like group? My ideal premise would be a new group that attacks Tommy's town, and also to have as little about the cure as possible- in fact I would like the game no not at all dwell on either the cure or Joel's choice at the end of "The Last of Us".
What I would like is some "young Joel" sections ala young Vito from The Godfather part 2- if the theme of this game is hate, seeing Joel's life as a hunter could make a worthwhile parallel to Ellie's story.
I really love how she looks here
Via Purifico
Banned
Most likely mentioned already but her look to me looks like an homage to Riley. I really hope they dig into that part of her character and what she felt for her and how that might have a drive into her hatred.
You know, that could really work.
Via Purifico
Banned
When Joel asked her are you instead of we made me think of a few things.
And agree with the above, she should be able to do similar things like in the first but will use her knife more compared to Joel.
Something real brutal like breaking a fireflies kneecap with a good stomp and slitting their throat. I mean have you seen the look on her face in that trailer? lol.
The theory going around that Joel is dead and killed by the fireflies as revenge and he's not really there but is some sort of guide on her morality
He is alive but trying to keep her from becoming just like him cause at this point she's his daughter to him and he doesn't want her making the same mistakes and potentially become worse
And agree with the above, she should be able to do similar things like in the first but will use her knife more compared to Joel.
Something real brutal like breaking a fireflies kneecap with a good stomp and slitting their throat. I mean have you seen the look on her face in that trailer? lol.
You could only swing your blade for normal melee, which wouldn't interrupt enemy animations so was pretty ineffective. If the enemy was stunned, from a brick throw for example, then you could run in and get a one hit kill. She couldn't use melee weapons, choke people out or use enemies as human shields.
I imagine they will flesh it out for the sequel, but I doubt it will be identical to Joel's.
Via Purifico
Banned
I want to ask you guys something, what are you expecting out of this is there anything from a narrative or gameplay standpoint you want to see.
And what type of end out of this journey do you want.
And what type of end out of this journey do you want.
Via Purifico
Banned
I am still holding out hope that despite the potential darker tone mid gameplay it will still have moments like this.
https://youtu.be/ZeAL9fCAA7o?t=2m13s
I don't really want anything specific narrative wise, whatever ND delivers there it'll be great
gameplay wise I want them to:
- retain the clicker/human ai manipulation that was in Left Behind
- more enemy variety, wouldn't mind seeing some infected animals like in Thomas Wievegg's art
- Max Payne 3 has a moment where Max combines a water bottle and tape to use as a temporary silencer for his pistol. Stuff like that could work really well in TLoU as a way to expand on crafting
The Cretan
Member
On Ellie's tattoo:
I was wondering why Druckmann choose a moth as a tattoo. So, I searched what moth means as a symbol and I found that it represents things like death, personal growth and transformation.
Does anybody know what's the name of the plant?
fern
Shambala
Member
The plant is derived from fernicus. It's said it confuses the person that comes in contact with it and makes them hallucinate.
im talking shit
The Cretan
Member
Thanks. I searched it, too. It represents things like health and protection.
HelenKeller:BlindDeafDTF
Member
I don't understand how so many people have such black and white interpretations of the first game's ending. Ellie can be mad at Joel for what he did while also eventually understanding and forgiving him. Joel stopping Ellie from being sacrificed can be seen as negatively impacting what's left of humanity without being an ultimate damnation. So many of you have been warped by the shitty writing of a bunch of games with binary "morality" choices.
DirgeExtinction
Member
I love how much more Ellie looks like her VA now.
comshoplesce
Member
VA? what does mean.
Ellie never had breasts? Kinda too flat :/
The Last of Us artbook anywhere cheaper then 30€/30$ or so?
GravityInsanity
Member
You know this creepy. She was just 14 in the last game and now she needs big breasts in a post-apocalyptic world?
comshoplesce
Member
I know just, saying....not a problem at all 
Not a thingy....she's great character.
Not a thingy....she's great character.
alexbull_uk
Member
Voice actor. Ellie's new design looks more like Ashley Johnson.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
LastMinuteHero
Member
comshoplesce
Member
I apolgize if offended anyone in any way....
Never my attention at all.
Great fan of TLOU, UNCHARTED 4, ND....
Never my attention at all.
Great fan of TLOU, UNCHARTED 4, ND....
Whether you are a fan of the games or not is most certainly not the issue here.
You're disappointed at the size of a virtual 14 year old's virtual beasts.