I find it a bit paternalistic to tell Xbox what it should do to become great again, when I'm quite obviously no longer its target group. Microsoft increasingly focuses on an online GaaS model of iterative franchises to push microtransactions. It's great. I want nothing to do with it. But I recognize it's a valid business model. Probably more valid than creating high risk singular entertainment pieces. So they do them, I'll focus on mine.
What does Microsoft need to do to make Xbox successful again?
- Thread starter Montresor
- Start date
paragonpro
Banned
Focus on new interesting first party, hell throw from software some cash to make you an ip and leave them alone til its done. Like sony did during the ps3 days just court a ton of developers into the first party, but improve relations greatly. That seems to be the biggest issue that they dont let them make games but rather try to controll the process as much as possible. Risk is the key here.
XBO currently have
- The best controller IMO (specially for FPS / Shooters)
- Nice console design (XBOS)
- Stellar / improved OS (march update)
- Robust online service
- Variety of exclusive services (Game Pass - EA Access - Backward Com - Play Anywhere)
- Strong 3rd party AAA support < something Switch is lacking a lot.
- UHD Blu-Ray support < something PS4/Pro is lacking
Micro is doing great on a lot of fronts, they just need to support it with 1st party exclusives and give their devs more freedom
If I was given the choice of purchase between PS4/XBO I'll choose PS4 without a doubt atm ... Micro needs to make it's console more desirable than it is now.
- The best controller IMO (specially for FPS / Shooters)
- Nice console design (XBOS)
- Stellar / improved OS (march update)
- Robust online service
- Variety of exclusive services (Game Pass - EA Access - Backward Com - Play Anywhere)
- Strong 3rd party AAA support < something Switch is lacking a lot.
- UHD Blu-Ray support < something PS4/Pro is lacking
Micro is doing great on a lot of fronts, they just need to support it with 1st party exclusives and give their devs more freedom
If I was given the choice of purchase between PS4/XBO I'll choose PS4 without a doubt atm ... Micro needs to make it's console more desirable than it is now.
Ninja Scooter
Member
Hope that Sony fucks up again.
Some are disappointed, but the rest see the thread title and inherently understand that the contents within are more inflated than they need to be.
The talking points have been regurgitated almost every goddamn day at this point. I get it. And I'm pretty sure others get it too. At some level the sentiments expressed in this thread and all the rest are justified.
But at some point--and we've reached that point a long fucking time ago--people started to ignore any arguments to the contrary. On a matter which itself is so much up to personal taste that it's fucking laughable that we've been on the fifth fucking thread this week talking about the same shit.
And then people started making it "objective". "The number of games Sony has is astronomical compared to Microsoft!" So fucking what? I can't play Sunset Overdrive, I can't play Quantum Break, I can't play ReCore, I can't play Ori and the Blind Forest on a Sony machine.
And that's fucking fine.
I don't have to care about the games you get to play, and honestly after all of this, I'm starting to care even less about them. Maybe they're good games. I don't know, I haven't played them. But the people constantly yapping about how Microsoft doesn't have anything like them are making me want to play them even less.
I am not personally unhappy with my choice of box. Could it be better? It can always be better. But right now, I am more than satisfied. Someone being satisfied with their purchase should be enough.
But somehow it never isn't.
I'm not gonna spoon feed you. If there's no games you like move on...
Honestly I'd rather they left Fable for a while and created something new in the RPG space, obviously somthing that can shine on Scorpio, obviously open world perhaps a shooter/RPG hybrid which is a strength for MS but different at the same time. A traditional WRPG would also be great.
Interesting and varied 1st party games.
That's all.
I've never owned a Nintendo console before. Zelda BotW happened. Now I'm the proud owner of a Switch.
I've never owned an Xbox console before. They just need a good games.
Also, I'm not trying to add fuel to the fire but actually I was planning to buy an Xbox One for Scalebound.
Oh well... but yea, give me great games I am interested in, I'll give them my money. Simple as that.
That's all.
I've never owned a Nintendo console before. Zelda BotW happened. Now I'm the proud owner of a Switch.
I've never owned an Xbox console before. They just need a good games.
Also, I'm not trying to add fuel to the fire but actually I was planning to buy an Xbox One for Scalebound.
Oh well... but yea, give me great games I am interested in, I'll give them my money. Simple as that.
Toni
Member
I really feel like, being 3 years into this gen that, that ship has sailed. They tried to distinguish themselves with Kinect and bundling it with Xbox while advertising its one-handed motion features and it was a monumental hit and miss.
Microsoft just doesn't the fan following, the worldwide appeal and strong brand recognition to stand out big with innovative ideas.
Apple and Sony can as market leaders.
Microsoft thinks they are up there with the big boys and they are not.
What they really need to focus on is remain fiercely price competitive for what's left of the gen to keep up with Xbox 360 and really need to get their shit together with 1st party exclusive output. And they really don't get this part. Its highly essential they create exclusive talent for the next-gen round, and 3 years to this gen, they are killing off whatever 1st party studios they have left.
They are purposely not thinking ahead for the future of Xbox. And that should sound some alarms.
Microsoft just doesn't the fan following, the worldwide appeal and strong brand recognition to stand out big with innovative ideas.
Apple and Sony can as market leaders.
Microsoft thinks they are up there with the big boys and they are not.
What they really need to focus on is remain fiercely price competitive for what's left of the gen to keep up with Xbox 360 and really need to get their shit together with 1st party exclusive output. And they really don't get this part. Its highly essential they create exclusive talent for the next-gen round, and 3 years to this gen, they are killing off whatever 1st party studios they have left.
They are purposely not thinking ahead for the future of Xbox. And that should sound some alarms.
therealbigrich
Member
This is really interesting to me . Always thought MS was considered a "big boy" of a company but I guess not
SneakersSO
Member
Hey OP, great topic. I really enjoy some of these ideas and wanna discuss your list point by point. Personally though, I just don't see why these initiatives would restore Xbox to the age of market relevancy it enjoyed up until this generation:
1) I do agree that 343 should've been tackling new projects within the Halo universe, but this should've been done before they were formed solely to make a new Halo trilogy. We don't need to go over the decline of the series since then, but suffice it to say, I just think this talented team of devs need to do something that is wholly their own. Having them do Perfect Dark is just another extension of the IP shackles that they are currently under; they'd just be trading one franchise for another one that has been far less successful. And while Halo's lore can be rich to a degree, it just doesn't have the sort of cast and nuance that makes me want to 'explore' it to any degree of depth beyond what we get from the mainline FPS games.
343i should be allowed to tackle a new IP, full-stop. Let them make what they think would be a fantastic game, with no preconceived notions as to what that is or from some entrenched fanbase.
2) Rare pretty much has been a new IP factory for a long, long time. Sure, we got the Kinect Sports trilogy from them, but prior to that they were pursuing a lot of different takes - Kameo, Perfect Dark, Banjo & Kazooie NaB, Viva Pinata - the only problem is that, and this seems to be a reoccurring theme with MS, is that none of these ever 'took off' the way Forza, Gears, or Halo did. Sea of Thieves already has a lot of warning signs that its going to underperform, but more than that, the whole thiing is seemingly built as a service game. I don't think taking the original devs off of a service game they launched would be a good idea if you're hoping you can foster & grow a community after a smaller launch.
What I want to see from MS in regards to Rare is to see them try & communicate to the audience that likes the kind of games Sea of Thieves is emulating, and convince them to try it. Cause right now, it just seems like MS is hoping the Xbox audience will rally around it, and those two groups don't really share a ton of overlap.
3) I don't think the lack of Single-player DLC is what is holding these two games back from thriving. These games needed bigger sales upon their respective release. I think it would be nice to see some sort of follow-through on these projects in regards to their SP, particularly QB, but its unfortunately clear that MS is no longer going to be working with Remedy (since they've very publicly moved on from anything with MS, as cited in the Polygon story) and its hard not to assume lower sales isn't a big factor as to why this happened.
4) This is one of MS' biggest problems, but not necessarily because all these games skipped the Xbox, but moreso WHY they skipped them. For a lot of these developers, they all have relationships with MS on some level, so its not like they just hate Microsoft. Moreover, the reality is that many of these developers know that these games do not sell well on their platform, and they learned this lesson from having released content throughout the years & seeing the level of support & returns that they got from it.
To these publishers, MS just doesn't seem to have done any effort to try & attract more of the audience that enjoys the type of games they produce, ESPECIALLY in this generation. The state of Xbox JP is a travesty, and it seems any of the 'effort' they wanted to put into that region faded once they saw some of their initial sales. The thing is - I get it; the console didn't sell well there, so why continue trying to cultivate an audience in that territory. Honestly, MS probably just never saw Japan having this sort of rise that they wound up having, and had they known this might've happened, they'd have done something. But for many people in the know, the signs of a resurgence were there - several JP devs were adopting western development toolsets & methodologies, and the growing reception of non-traditional games in the West (the more niche titles that we used to see) growing, particularly after Dark Souls.
The situation regarding From Software, the Souls series, and MS/Sony is a perfect example of this. Demon's Souls comes out, Sony misreads its initial launch in Japan & lets Atlus handle the localization to the west. The game does well, but its not this mega-hit, but it is a huge hit culturally. Namco then uses Xbox to better sell the new Dark Souls IP in the west; in fact, Dark Souls 2 & 3 both were featured at MS E3s. Now, seeing all this, you would think MS understands that there is a growing demand for this type of game and see the effect its having on gameplay design across the industry. So, why didn't MS pursue something with From Software? Sony fixed the situation - they admitted they were wrong about Demon's Souls, patched things up with From, and they got Bloodborne out of it. MS was in prime position to secure their own Souls-like from From Software, and didn't do it. This is the sort of niche-genre audience cultivation MS just leaves by the wayside and suffers from it in the long-term.
5) Wholly agreed here.
1) I do agree that 343 should've been tackling new projects within the Halo universe, but this should've been done before they were formed solely to make a new Halo trilogy. We don't need to go over the decline of the series since then, but suffice it to say, I just think this talented team of devs need to do something that is wholly their own. Having them do Perfect Dark is just another extension of the IP shackles that they are currently under; they'd just be trading one franchise for another one that has been far less successful. And while Halo's lore can be rich to a degree, it just doesn't have the sort of cast and nuance that makes me want to 'explore' it to any degree of depth beyond what we get from the mainline FPS games.
343i should be allowed to tackle a new IP, full-stop. Let them make what they think would be a fantastic game, with no preconceived notions as to what that is or from some entrenched fanbase.
2) Rare pretty much has been a new IP factory for a long, long time. Sure, we got the Kinect Sports trilogy from them, but prior to that they were pursuing a lot of different takes - Kameo, Perfect Dark, Banjo & Kazooie NaB, Viva Pinata - the only problem is that, and this seems to be a reoccurring theme with MS, is that none of these ever 'took off' the way Forza, Gears, or Halo did. Sea of Thieves already has a lot of warning signs that its going to underperform, but more than that, the whole thiing is seemingly built as a service game. I don't think taking the original devs off of a service game they launched would be a good idea if you're hoping you can foster & grow a community after a smaller launch.
What I want to see from MS in regards to Rare is to see them try & communicate to the audience that likes the kind of games Sea of Thieves is emulating, and convince them to try it. Cause right now, it just seems like MS is hoping the Xbox audience will rally around it, and those two groups don't really share a ton of overlap.
3) I don't think the lack of Single-player DLC is what is holding these two games back from thriving. These games needed bigger sales upon their respective release. I think it would be nice to see some sort of follow-through on these projects in regards to their SP, particularly QB, but its unfortunately clear that MS is no longer going to be working with Remedy (since they've very publicly moved on from anything with MS, as cited in the Polygon story) and its hard not to assume lower sales isn't a big factor as to why this happened.
4) This is one of MS' biggest problems, but not necessarily because all these games skipped the Xbox, but moreso WHY they skipped them. For a lot of these developers, they all have relationships with MS on some level, so its not like they just hate Microsoft. Moreover, the reality is that many of these developers know that these games do not sell well on their platform, and they learned this lesson from having released content throughout the years & seeing the level of support & returns that they got from it.
To these publishers, MS just doesn't seem to have done any effort to try & attract more of the audience that enjoys the type of games they produce, ESPECIALLY in this generation. The state of Xbox JP is a travesty, and it seems any of the 'effort' they wanted to put into that region faded once they saw some of their initial sales. The thing is - I get it; the console didn't sell well there, so why continue trying to cultivate an audience in that territory. Honestly, MS probably just never saw Japan having this sort of rise that they wound up having, and had they known this might've happened, they'd have done something. But for many people in the know, the signs of a resurgence were there - several JP devs were adopting western development toolsets & methodologies, and the growing reception of non-traditional games in the West (the more niche titles that we used to see) growing, particularly after Dark Souls.
The situation regarding From Software, the Souls series, and MS/Sony is a perfect example of this. Demon's Souls comes out, Sony misreads its initial launch in Japan & lets Atlus handle the localization to the west. The game does well, but its not this mega-hit, but it is a huge hit culturally. Namco then uses Xbox to better sell the new Dark Souls IP in the west; in fact, Dark Souls 2 & 3 both were featured at MS E3s. Now, seeing all this, you would think MS understands that there is a growing demand for this type of game and see the effect its having on gameplay design across the industry. So, why didn't MS pursue something with From Software? Sony fixed the situation - they admitted they were wrong about Demon's Souls, patched things up with From, and they got Bloodborne out of it. MS was in prime position to secure their own Souls-like from From Software, and didn't do it. This is the sort of niche-genre audience cultivation MS just leaves by the wayside and suffers from it in the long-term.
5) Wholly agreed here.
Come back down to reality son. Sony is a pimple on Apple, Google, Amazon, and MS ass.
Nintendo
Advantages: They have some of the best game designers in the industry. They own the most iconic, recognizable IP.
Weaknesses: They're pitiful at online services, network infrastructure, digital distribution, etc.
Sony
Advantages: They know how to make beautiful, well-designed consumer electronics. They know how to create successful entertainment across a wide range of vectors (video games, music, TV, film, etc).
Weaknesses: They're not good at software.
Microsoft
Advantages: They're one of the best software and online services companies in the world.
Weaknesses: They're not good at creating new entertainment IP, and their track record of internally developed games is mixed at best.
These companies should play to their strengths rather than trying to mimic each other.
Advantages: They have some of the best game designers in the industry. They own the most iconic, recognizable IP.
Weaknesses: They're pitiful at online services, network infrastructure, digital distribution, etc.
Sony
Advantages: They know how to make beautiful, well-designed consumer electronics. They know how to create successful entertainment across a wide range of vectors (video games, music, TV, film, etc).
Weaknesses: They're not good at software.
Microsoft
Advantages: They're one of the best software and online services companies in the world.
Weaknesses: They're not good at creating new entertainment IP, and their track record of internally developed games is mixed at best.
These companies should play to their strengths rather than trying to mimic each other.
Breaking Normal
Member
I wonder if Microsoft would ever consider marketing the Scorpio as a PC a la the steam box. I really like their play anywhere initiative and I think they could further enhance that by making the Windows Store a lot better or put their games on Steam (like they've already done with Quantum Break).
But more importantly, I wonder if Microsoft could put games on the Scorpio that are exclusive to PS4/PC like Nier: Automata and Ni No Kuni 2. But unlike Automata on the PC, the Scorpio version will be optimized and will get rid of the stuttering making it the best way to play that game.
Also, most Xbox One games run at a lower resoultion (900p) then their PS4 counterparts (1080p) and a game like Mass Effect Andromeda is apparently somewhat blurry on Xbox One. The Scorpio should be able to fix this issue.
Lastlt as many people have pointed out, Microsoft has made a lot of good steps recently. I don't understand the announcement of the tech series line of controllers though. They need to forget about controller variety and start focusing on first party games.
But more importantly, I wonder if Microsoft could put games on the Scorpio that are exclusive to PS4/PC like Nier: Automata and Ni No Kuni 2. But unlike Automata on the PC, the Scorpio version will be optimized and will get rid of the stuttering making it the best way to play that game.
Also, most Xbox One games run at a lower resoultion (900p) then their PS4 counterparts (1080p) and a game like Mass Effect Andromeda is apparently somewhat blurry on Xbox One. The Scorpio should be able to fix this issue.
Lastlt as many people have pointed out, Microsoft has made a lot of good steps recently. I don't understand the announcement of the tech series line of controllers though. They need to forget about controller variety and start focusing on first party games.
x Dredgen Yor x
Member
I feel the Xbox is lacking a grime/dark single player focused third person shooter. Gears 4 for all its talk didn't go dark enough/horror enough.
Also, Microsoft drop a large money hat to EA to bring back dead space as an Xbox exclusive PLEASE.
Also, Microsoft drop a large money hat to EA to bring back dead space as an Xbox exclusive PLEASE.
LMAO MS as a whole is much bigger then Sony.
Make sure Scorpio launches at a price no higher than PS4's launch price in 2013.
Remove the Xbox Live Gold paywall.
Fully BC with Xbox 360 and OG XBOX games.
Open up a two new studios in each territory.
More permanent exclusives.
Show us what Scorpio can do at both native 4K and also what kind of crazy graphics it can pull off when only having to render at 1080p.
Get R&D working overtime with AMD (or even Nvidia) to make sure the future Xbox is more powerful than PS5 can be with contingencies to release either the same year as PS5 or a year after, depending on market conditions and how well XB1S & Scorpio sell.
Remove the Xbox Live Gold paywall.
Fully BC with Xbox 360 and OG XBOX games.
Open up a two new studios in each territory.
More permanent exclusives.
Show us what Scorpio can do at both native 4K and also what kind of crazy graphics it can pull off when only having to render at 1080p.
Get R&D working overtime with AMD (or even Nvidia) to make sure the future Xbox is more powerful than PS5 can be with contingencies to release either the same year as PS5 or a year after, depending on market conditions and how well XB1S & Scorpio sell.
Sangetsu-II
Member
I don't know what else they can do a this point, but they better do something before Nintendo Switch catches up to XB1, it be pretty bad being in 3rd place again for 3 generations in a row.
Hate to break it to ya. The only thing they got going hardware wise is PS. Nothing else is selling for them. They are basically a high risk company with Playstation and Insurance keeping them afloat. You can't even compare them to the big boys.
Astral Dog
Member
Forget green and Go Republican
ShadowkillXNA
Member
Apple doesn't have a console, so try again.
Golgo 13
The Man With The Golden Dong
Vulcano's assistant
Banned
Sony revives Crash, then MS revives Banjo.
Sony gets Final Fantasy VII remake, MS pays for KOTOR 3.
Sony gets open world by Guerrilla Games, MS funds open world by Remedy.
Sony gets Final Fantasy VII remake, MS pays for KOTOR 3.
Sony gets open world by Guerrilla Games, MS funds open world by Remedy.
It's not making them money, but they still know how to make good consumer electronics. They have great industrial designers. It's in their company DNA. Their TVs, headphones, receivers, cameras, etc are solid, even if they aren't as great as they once were.
Microsoft is clearly working at it, and has made some tremendous strides, but of the three companies, I would say Sony is still the best when it comes to hardware.
A lot of this talk is pretty redundant until we at least see how MS intends to frame whatever the Scorpio is. I'm sure they're aware they need to land big with this thing to penetrate the larger market the people who don't come into forums like this and do the whole inside baseball thing.
The X1 started off on the backfoot with multiple issues. That MS has still been able to turn that around and get things back into shape bodes well.
The X1 started off on the backfoot with multiple issues. That MS has still been able to turn that around and get things back into shape bodes well.
privitsan02
Member
They should focus on what they are good at: multiplayer experiences. They've tried and failed at the single player experiences that Sony are very strong at, (just like Sony kept failing at making huge multiplayer games that could compete against Call of Duty, Halo, Battlefield and etc last generation).
Halo and Gears of War have become stale. Titanfall could've been bigger but then it went multiplatform. They should focus on capturing and maintaining that market, which made Xbox Live so big back in the days. Either by reviving their declining franchises or investing in new experiences to shake things up.
Microsoft's culture is different from that of Sony when it comes to their gaming divisions. Can't just expect them to buyout studios and make their versions of Horizon, Uncharted and God of War, just like how Sony weren't able to get their Halo.
Best wishes.
Halo and Gears of War have become stale. Titanfall could've been bigger but then it went multiplatform. They should focus on capturing and maintaining that market, which made Xbox Live so big back in the days. Either by reviving their declining franchises or investing in new experiences to shake things up.
Microsoft's culture is different from that of Sony when it comes to their gaming divisions. Can't just expect them to buyout studios and make their versions of Horizon, Uncharted and God of War, just like how Sony weren't able to get their Halo.
Best wishes.
What? None of those things sell expect for PS. As a hardware company they are failing besides Playstation. Everything else they are losing badly.
In purely hardware MS is easily the most exiting company.
facetheslayer92
Member
Really good read. I guess it's never too late for From or Sega or whomever to get in bed with Microsoft. The question is whether people will buy these types of niche experiences you're more likely to find on PlayStation.
You found Phil's loophole.
Console isn't good enough by PC gamer standards? What the fuck does that even mean?
MS puts games on PC. PC Gamers don't like "port quality"...no sale.
MS keeps games off PC. PC Gamers don't like "console quality"...no sale.
Yea, your argument truly makes sense. -_-
rokkerkory
Member
Yusef already outlined the keys to success yesterday. It's really focus on the voice of customer at the end of the day which they lost their way during end of 360 and start of X1.
GTR R35_Supra RZ
Banned
We'll find out very soon @ E3 when Scorpio hurricane hits this Nov.
LOL! PSN followed a template MS created with XBL among many other things. Sorry but this is not true at all. As a company, Sony are irrelevant next to MS and Apple
VlaudTheImpaler
tl;dr
To think that Sony is irrelevant as a company is just as dumb as thinking that Sony is anywhere near the same status as MS.
Both companies are plenty relevant. MS for the very obvious reasons. Sony for one because they have their Sony PlayStation brand name front and center on the entertainment stands of millions and millions of peoples homes and it gives them joy. Especially the younger generation, the one that is most influential for our future, therefore relevant.
Any company that achieves that is relevant no matter what you compare it to.
Mass Effect
Member
That's not what relevant means.
VlaudTheImpaler
tl;dr
Please explain then.
Original Man
Member
You can play good games on the xbox one. The problem is that they are all multiplatform, and Sony has way more quality exclusives. Dont know about anyone else but I'm not paying $400-500 for slightly better looking graphics on Call of Duty. Quality exclusives is the answer. Sony gets it, MS doesnt, thus why Sony is winning this generation
See and it's clear to me that that's what Microsoft is finally doing. Nintendo bowed out of the horserace after the GameCube and decided to focus on what they're good at, playful reinvention. Microsoft, buoyed by a good headstart with the 360, has been trying to catch up to PlayStation for the past decade and a half. They finally realized they're not an entertainment company so they can never really catch up. Microsoft has great creative talent at their research division, but they're never going to be allowed to take center stage in the company, it's just not what they are. It has to bubble up and get commissioned to death until another division is allowed to bring it to market when the market has already shifted. Their corporate structure will always make them fail at being an entertainment enterprise. They're a services business. So now they're trying to make services out of games. Time will tell whether they succeed, but it at least finally fits their DNA.
This thread reads like 'what does Microsoft have to do to make Xbox like PlayStation'. When the truth is they can't.
More importantly, they shouldn't.
Honesty what are they the market leader other then games?
dead souls
Member
It's weird as somebody who owns 100+ Xbox 360 games but I don't think there is anything Microsoft could do to get me to buy another Xbox console in the future.
Sony will always have more Japanese third party support and Nintendo has their first party stuff but Microsoft doesn't have a hook to sell me anymore. I'd be fine with them bowing out of the market.
Sony will always have more Japanese third party support and Nintendo has their first party stuff but Microsoft doesn't have a hook to sell me anymore. I'd be fine with them bowing out of the market.
Toni
Member
Honestly?
They are practically #1 in the music industry and very big in the movie bussiness with several subsidary cinema companies and holds stock in Bluray.
But I see this thread has turned into "who's the bigger company" between Sony and Microsoft on company market cap.
Yes Microsoft has bigger pockets, no thats not the concensus here. 😩