Digital Foundry - Halo Infinite Gameplay Trailer Analysis: Are The Graphics Really 'Flat'...?
- Thread starter LordOfChaos
- Start date
FunkMiller
Banned
My take on this video is a little different. He sounds like somebody not wanting to put the boot in too hard on something so clearly fucked already.
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DarthFeanor
Banned
Because other objects in the scene are in shadows.
After watching the video and doing a little research I think that a next gen patch with RT and other features we are becoming familiar with PC can be a game changer.
If there are no problems with the game story and game play I think MS should release the game as it is and add those features later.
It doesn't look to be a complete disaster like Anthem or Fallout 76.
Riven326
Banned
Why weren't there any comparisons to the original 2018 demo? That was the vision.
I don't follow DF, but apparently this guy goes soft on Xbox. That's really lame if true. It's like look, you're an adult. That sort of fanboy bullshit is for children and teens. Analyze things as they are and be honest. Or maybe he's afraid of upsetting Microsoft.
I don't follow DF, but apparently this guy goes soft on Xbox. That's really lame if true. It's like look, you're an adult. That sort of fanboy bullshit is for children and teens. Analyze things as they are and be honest. Or maybe he's afraid of upsetting Microsoft.
LordOfChaos
Member
Yeah I'm not getting the appologism angle in this thread. He explained what went wrong with the techniques used and how other games addressed them. It's not all about lighting, but they're a large part of it, he also touched on other areas like pop in and textures. And then as you said, mentioned that maybe it couldn't do 4K if they were using RT, which is why we got a demo like this.
DarthFeanor
Banned
Was there any problems with Gears 5?
Well, for me the game was a wonderful experience with Game Pass on my old Xone and my Gamer PC.
It run flawless at 1080p 60fps ultra on my GTX2070 + Ryzen 5.
13 Teraflops
Caffeine
Gold Member
I knew something looked off there was no blood.If it only looked like this on the right
DarthFeanor
Banned
Zoro7
Banned
They don't bleed in the shadows only in direct sunlight.
Well even if all of his points are valid...it doesnt really matter at all.
I dont really care why it looks mediocre...if it looks bad, it looks bad.
If driving game plays like crap, i dont need to be told about how difficult it is to do good physics/driving model.
All that matters is the final result.
I dont really care why it looks mediocre...if it looks bad, it looks bad.
If driving game plays like crap, i dont need to be told about how difficult it is to do good physics/driving model.
All that matters is the final result.
Optimistic Gamer
Member
Well, not in the time they have left.
iamvin22
Industry Verified
I respect this post but there's so much more wrong with this trailer than lightning. I'm glad publication's are putting the game on blast because it needs it. MS already has sent out damage control notices which shoes everything you said.
To me Xbox is about getting gamepass out to gamers vs hardware and content. I realized this when Spencer said both Nintendo and Sony wanted no part of gamepass on their platform
Unless digital foundry went for blood and started insulting Microsoft executives by name it won't be enough for the warriors who have this imagery axe to grind. It is hilarious it is like Patriots fans having this axe to grind with the Cleveland browns. I am trying to figure out the blood lust for a side who won every time and already drove 1 company out of the space last generation. You figure they be chill with all the trophies ready to win another with a 80% chance of driving the last competitor out of the space. Guy shits on xbox game. Guy is Microsoft shil because he did personality insult Phil, Matt and the team at 343. This place these days.
diffusionx
Gold Member
This is not an explanation considering I can point to many, many PC ports of current gen games that look amazing and use high end technology. I could play Control or Metro Exodus for example on a Xbox One or a high end PC with ray tracing and they both look amazing.
HoodWinked
Member
really good video from DF in explaining how objects in shadow can look pretty bad
someone else made a thread about ghosts of tsushima pointing out the game looked really bad in some areas, i had also noticed many games struggle to look correct in overcast shadow. feels good to know that i was right and now know the technical issues why this visual phenomenon is prevalent.
the DF video does highlight an upside though, since the assets aren't using fake baked shadows this does make them essentially future proof so with the correct lighting model they should look correct.
someone else made a thread about ghosts of tsushima pointing out the game looked really bad in some areas, i had also noticed many games struggle to look correct in overcast shadow. feels good to know that i was right and now know the technical issues why this visual phenomenon is prevalent.
the DF video does highlight an upside though, since the assets aren't using fake baked shadows this does make them essentially future proof so with the correct lighting model they should look correct.
Fbh
Member
What BS?
It switches over from one game to the other and the change really isn't as big as you'd expect.
Play a clip of Gears 5 and then instantly change to gears 2, even at 16x resolution the difference will be very obvious
Tchu-Espresso
likes mayo on everthing and can't dance
The game looks very average and that is putting it as kindly as possible.
-Arcadia-
Banned
-Arcadia-
Banned
Given this video's explanation, it might be prudent to wait for the ray-tracing update before playing it.
There's structural problems here that go deeper than lighting, so it won't magically turn into one of the best looking games, but chances are, it could be quite an improvement over the base game.
There's structural problems here that go deeper than lighting, so it won't magically turn into one of the best looking games, but chances are, it could be quite an improvement over the base game.
Dodkrake
Banned
Resolution Bumps
720p = 921 600 Pixels
1080p = 2 073 600 Pixels
1440p = 3 686 400 Pixels
4k = 8 294 400 pixels
Of course 4k is a bloody mistake for native rendering, and is a "big dick" move that will compromise graphics, it's 4 times 1080p! You basically need a 7TF GPU to render TLOU2 in Native 4k. This is why I feel a bump to 1440p with checkerboarding to 4k would be more than sufficient to give us a next gen resolution bump and then increase graphical fidelity. You can see this in the UE5 demo, where it is running at 1440p but you can't actually make up the resolution...
As for Alex's excuses, same old same old. While 4k would require 7TF to render a graphical demanding game like TLOU2 in native 4k, the Xbox still has plenty wiggle room to render decent looking textures, which was not the case.
720p = 921 600 Pixels
1080p = 2 073 600 Pixels
1440p = 3 686 400 Pixels
4k = 8 294 400 pixels
Of course 4k is a bloody mistake for native rendering, and is a "big dick" move that will compromise graphics, it's 4 times 1080p! You basically need a 7TF GPU to render TLOU2 in Native 4k. This is why I feel a bump to 1440p with checkerboarding to 4k would be more than sufficient to give us a next gen resolution bump and then increase graphical fidelity. You can see this in the UE5 demo, where it is running at 1440p but you can't actually make up the resolution...
As for Alex's excuses, same old same old. While 4k would require 7TF to render a graphical demanding game like TLOU2 in native 4k, the Xbox still has plenty wiggle room to render decent looking textures, which was not the case.
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Mokus
Member
He actually talked about "first person shadow".
Tiamat2san
Member
People make fun from character models in halo infinite, but NPCs in pretty much every game looks worse during gameplay. For example here's how character models in gears 5 looks like in cutscenes
Maybe try to have the same character and an image that is not deformed
People make fun from character models in halo infinite, but NPCs in pretty much every game looks worse during gameplay. For example here's how character models in gears 5 looks like in cutscenes
And here's gameplay
And here's gameplay
Maybe try the same character with an image that is not deformed.
You are not on Facebook here.
I play the game every day and character models are beautifully made On X.
MastaKiiLA
Member
I watched the video. I didn't see the bias others are stating. Then again, I go into this with no prior baggage, as this is only the 3rd video of theirs that I've ever watched, after the PS5 and XSX reveal reaction videos. Seems like he's explaining the cause of the visible flatness of the game assets, which is indeed a major cause for the disappointment. He also noted the pop-in, texture quality, and shadows. Seems pretty comprehensive. I don't feel like reviewing any other past videos, so was this Alex guy much more fanboyish in the past? I didn't see any major issues with the PS5 vs XSX reveal videos, other than they seemed to get more technical in the PS5 video. But they kinda acquitted themselves in the XSX video by noting that due to the CG nature of most videos, they really don't know what is what. So I assume it would have been a pointless exercise.
azertydu91
Hard to Kill
Wait let's not confuse things sure it runs on xsx but it may just be 343 royally fucking things up.
-Arcadia-
Banned
You're speaking to religious fanatics, but with a console. Listen to what your common sense is telling you.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Doesn't "soften" the BS he's spitting, it only further proves that there is no such thing as real time lighting and he's only trying to fool the audience. How you explain the lack of shadow under other objects as well?
UE5 PS5 demo did 16K real-time shadows instead of those flickery low res shadows shown on the demo.
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Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
It is quite possible that, while the game was possibly going through some development troubles, MS decided to shift this game to XSX and not polish it for the One and release it, but to spend time and resources to scale it up and start preparing an RT graphics patch which understandably will arrive after the game's launch.
Not dissimilar from what Nintendo did with BotW... although well BotW was pushing the Switch comparatively a lot more...
MasterCornholio
Member
They did the same with the brute Force comments and the claims they Xbox has no games.
I don't see the issue with moderating either unless there's solid evidence to back up the claim. Which nobody has done yet for any of those things.
-Arcadia-
Banned
Well, you just accused him of being a liar, yet here he is stating the same thing you accused him of being a liar for not mentuoning.
Perhaps you ought to address that before trying to shift the conversation?
But to address that, it's clearly real time lighting. Time of day shifts, as we see in the demo, wouldn't work without it.
How about you and the rest of your booger and glue eating crew do some thinking for a change instead of waging your console holy war?
-Arcadia-
Banned
But Xbox too!
Nobody asked for your input, wannabe moderator, nor is it relevant to what was said.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Maybe they should go for Unreal Engine to lift up the graphics to at least meet current gen graphics... Oh wait, Epic Games are Sony shills now.
-Arcadia-
Banned
Maybe they should go for Unreal Engine to lift up the graphics to at least meet current gen graphics... Oh wait, Epic Games are Sony shills now.
No, I actually agree.
Because I don't see the world through the pathetic lens of PS vs. Xbox console warring constantly. That goes for both of your sides.
MasterCornholio
Member
Have I ever been disrespected to you?
If you post in a thread you open your comment to replies from other users. That's how a public forum works.
Just saying the admins are cracking down on all sorts of console warring bait. They don't just focus on what's negative towards PlayStation.
Games ship with missing shadows all the time, since developers can decide which objects cast shadows and which don't, to save performance. And SSAO is normally used for self shadowing, which is absent here.
Mister Wolf
Member
Maybe they should go for Unreal Engine to lift up the graphics to at least meet current gen graphics... Oh wait, Epic Games are Sony shills now.
There's always CryEngine 3.
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-Arcadia-
Banned
Have I ever done anything worth being disrespected for? Nobody likes you playing wannabe moderator every time something comes up. It isn't said as much on the forums, but I assure you it is in private conversations.
I told you this super kindly and politely. You persisted. Now I'm telling you roughly.
No duh. Except you always run in where you aren't wanted, or needed, to deliver a hot take about moderation. This time, it wasn't even relevant to the subject being discussed, like you too can only see the world through PS vs. Xbox. People asking for protection against disruption is hilarious, when they themselves constantly disrupt. That was the point. Not hard to ascertain.
Slap me with a citizen's arrest though, hall monitor.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Relax, you sound angry not sure if you've been fighting someone around this thread prior to replying to me.
It's flat and has no shadows under many objects because they failed to ray-trace it, that's why it's launching without ray tracing. You either have baked lighting or realtime ray tracing, real time lighting is a new BS. The UE5 global illumination is still using a software based ray tracing using voxels as they say, and casting 16K shadows in real time, there is no amount of damage control can overcome the disastrous graphics of Halo Infinite, especially that they claimed that part has been polished for this demo and it's been in development since 5 years with pseudo sources saying with $500 million budget.
The more people accept it and move on the better, most current gen shooters look way better.
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WellSheet
Member
I've never paid much attention to DF as my IQ and ability to comprehend these things is far too low.
But, Jesus, I agree- it feels like they are just making excuses and sucking on Microsoft's Microhard
Jtibh
Banned
Ok guys and sexy ladies.
Just watched this ..........hahaha.....excuse video.
I must say. Alex. You nobody. Pm trudeau is a much much better bullshiter than you ever be.
If you would work for me i would shove your crysis box up your ass and would put you on the street.
The worst car sales man would sell me a used car before you would ever convince me that i got it all wrong about why halo looks WORSE than halo 5.
Df really is becoming a joke.
Nx gamer is soo much better. John is soo much more proffesional than you ever be. And richard is richard. But at least he has the entertainment factor with his wacky waving blow up guy hands.
Just watched this ..........hahaha.....excuse video.
I must say. Alex. You nobody. Pm trudeau is a much much better bullshiter than you ever be.
If you would work for me i would shove your crysis box up your ass and would put you on the street.
The worst car sales man would sell me a used car before you would ever convince me that i got it all wrong about why halo looks WORSE than halo 5.
Df really is becoming a joke.
Nx gamer is soo much better. John is soo much more proffesional than you ever be. And richard is richard. But at least he has the entertainment factor with his wacky waving blow up guy hands.
Mister Wolf
Member
I couldn't be a journalist.
Me: Does your band new Slipspace Engine support Voxel GI.
343: No, but we have a GI solution using light probes.
Me: Is that as good as Voxel GI.....................
These people created a brand new engine that doesn't even have features as good as CryEngine 3 or Unreal 4. What was the point? To save money?
CryEngine has supported a better lighting engine then what's seen in Slipspace for 5 years now.
Me: Does your band new Slipspace Engine support Voxel GI.
343: No, but we have a GI solution using light probes.
Me: Is that as good as Voxel GI.....................
These people created a brand new engine that doesn't even have features as good as CryEngine 3 or Unreal 4. What was the point? To save money?
CryEngine has supported a better lighting engine then what's seen in Slipspace for 5 years now.
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Jtibh
Banned
Leave my princess alone or i smack you.
Like you both though.
Make peace. Kisses and hugs.
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Bo_Hazem
Banned
I like Arcadia, but maybe I rubbed him/her the wrong way or I came in the middle of a fight as I just checked now.