[DF] Doom Eternal PS5 vs Xbox Series S/X

My take from this thread is that there are a LOT of people that are either ignorant, or are deliberately acting ignorant, about VRS technology - both what it does and the benefit it provides.

All those people need to know is that DF have flat out said there is a visible difference in resolution in favour of the XSX. Visible. With your eyes, when playing the game.

Choosing to focus on a zoomed shot of a small section of an image proves nothing - it doesn't mean the XSX has soupy textures, and it doesn't mean the XSX has inferior image quality.
 
BigLee74 said:
My take from this thread is that there are a LOT of people that are either ignorant, or are deliberately acting ignorant, about VRS technology - both what it does and the benefit it provides.

All those people need to know is that DF have flat out said there is a visible difference in resolution in favour of the XSX. Visible. With your eyes, when playing the game.

Choosing to focus on a zoomed shot of a small section of an image proves nothing - it doesn't mean the XSX has soupy textures, and it doesn't mean the XSX has inferior image quality.
Click to expand...
 
BigLee74 said:
My take from this thread is that there are a LOT of people that are either ignorant, or are deliberately acting ignorant, about VRS technology - both what it does and the benefit it provides.

All those people need to know is that DF have flat out said there is a visible difference in resolution in favour of the XSX. Visible. With your eyes, when playing the game.

Choosing to focus on a zoomed shot of a small section of an image proves nothing - it doesn't mean the XSX has soupy textures, and it doesn't mean the XSX has inferior image quality.
Click to expand...
I don't think they understand or want to understand it, instead of just being lower resolution and even sub 1080p at times it's better to have a technology like this that is invisible during gameplay.
Of course you can freeze frame and zoom in 400% to try and find it but since the objects are shaded on a per frame basis even that is pretty pointless as they would resolve full detail when you looked at them in game.
Like DF said it's very difficult to spot and if it gives you a framerate and resolution advantage well worth it as it's "free" in the Xbox Series hardware.
Funny how absolutely nobody spotted the vastly inferior emulated Tier 1 VRS in Modern Warfare on last gen consoles.
 
BigLee74 said:
My take from this thread is that there are a LOT of people that are either ignorant, or are deliberately acting ignorant, about VRS technology - both what it does and the benefit it provides.

All those people need to know is that DF have flat out said there is a visible difference in resolution in favour of the XSX. Visible. With your eyes, when playing the game.

Choosing to focus on a zoomed shot of a small section of an image proves nothing - it doesn't mean the XSX has soupy textures, and it doesn't mean the XSX has inferior image quality.
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I watched the DF video on my 4k TV yesterday and i couldnt notice any of the VRS downgrades.

But then again, i didnt see a difference between the PS5 and XSX either.
 
Physiognomonics said:
Not a word about the blur caused by VRS on Xbox like if that tech had no tradeoffs at all. But they do tell that the game sometimes ouputs at a higher res on Xbox. But what's the point if the game actually looks higher res on PS5 in those 2 modes most of the time? Better not talk about it cause that's not good for their narrative.

On the other hand they don't forget to state that the 120hz mode looks visibly blurrier on PS5 (even if they actually can't show it). But why omit to tell us the XSX game actually look blurrier in the 60fps modes? what an odd omission.

So their narrative for the whole gen will be: "VRS RDNA2 (only on Xbox), is perfect, only good stuff, and it allows the game to output at a higher res." Gotcha.
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The game never looks higher resolution on the PS5. Don't let selectively chosen screengrabs or zoomed in shots fool you. The game is flat out sharper on Xbox Series X, and DF says that clear as day that the game is indeed sharper on Xbox Series X, and regularly runs at a higher resolution.

The max for PS5 in 120fps mode is 1528p, and can in rare moments drop below 1080p. I don't expect that's a regular thing, but that's what they say. Series X in 120fps still successfully hits the high 1800p mark set for its ray tracing mode, and then will vary with dynamic resolution, but even then DF makes clear Series X still roughly matches up with its Ray Tracing mode in 120fps mode.

Taken from VGTech regarding the Ray Tracing mode for both consoles. Series X isn't at all blurrier than the PS5.

As an example, in one scene the PS5 dropped to approximately 2986x1680 and the Xbox Series X rendered that scene at 3200x1800.
Click to expand...
 
CurtBizzy said:
So XBSX has soupy textures but higher resolution ?
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Happy Season 5 GIF by The Office
 
carloseduardocd said:
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How does it avg out when the PS5 is visibly sharper?

This whole narrative of not noticing the poor image is like saying 2d cardboard trees don't matter in a driving game because you drive too fast to notice.

It's not about how observant an individual is, this is a tech comparison and Sony is bringing the goods in this one, the other is trailing behind. It's not subjective when it's a fact.
 
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dcmk7 said:
So higher resolution is gained from better VRS, the compromise is it has a blurrier look.

Makes sense. Can see why it evens out.
Click to expand...

But it doesn't 'even out'.

The whole image is at the higher resolution.

The vast majority of the image will be with the intended sharp textures/full pixel shading.

Selected peripheral areas won't get the full attention. These areas aren't the focus of your attention, and in regular gameplay are likely to be blurred via post-processing etc.

It is definitely not the case that the whole screen has a 'blurrier look'.
 
BigLee74 said:
But it doesn't 'even out'.

The whole image is at the higher resolution.

The vast majority of the image will be with the intended sharp textures/full pixel shading.

Selected peripheral areas won't get the full attention. These areas aren't the focus of your attention, and in regular gameplay are likely to be blurred via post-processing etc.

It is definitely not the case that the whole screen has a 'blurrier look'.
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I'm just going off John's tweet where he said..

"You get a higher average pixel count but you give up some in-surface detail. It kinda averages out, I think."

Haven't read/watched any analysis yet, just been in and out of this thread.

Past comparisons have shown similar results with a worse IQ but a higher resolution on XSX, it's become a pattern. But maybe I'm wrong here with Doom Eternal, who knows.

Seems to look and play great with the new features and the addition of ray-tracing, regardless of whether you're playing on a XSX or a PS5.
 
SenjutsuSage said:
The game never looks higher resolution on the PS5. Don't let selectively chosen screengrabs or zoomed in shots fool you. The game is flat out sharper on Xbox Series X, and DF says that clear as day that the game is indeed sharper on Xbox Series X, and regularly runs at a higher resolution.

The max for PS5 in 120fps mode is 1528p, and can in rare moments drop below 1080p. I don't expect that's a regular thing, but that's what they say. Series X in 120fps still successfully hits the high 1800p mark set for its ray tracing mode, and then will vary with dynamic resolution, but even then DF makes clear Series X still roughly matches up with its Ray Tracing mode in 120fps mode.

Taken from VGTech regarding the Ray Tracing mode for both consoles. Series X isn't at all blurrier than the PS5.
Click to expand...
Yep. Don't let image captures or your lying eyes fool you.
 
SenjutsuSage said:
Seriously, why the hell not? I assume you're primarily a console gamer, so that's why you don't have a PC, but you just haven't been able to find Series X or PS5?
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I live in Brazil. This place sucks for gamers unfortunately :(

I'm even more fucked since I'm about to get married so I have to be really careful about where to spend my precious pennies.
 
dcmk7 said:
I'm just going off John's tweet where he said..

"You get a higher average pixel count but you give up some in-surface detail. It kinda averages out, I think."

Haven't read/watched any analysis yet, just been in and out of this thread.

Past comparisons have shown similar results with a worse IQ but a higher resolution on XSX, it's become a pattern. But maybe I'm wrong here with Doom Eternal, who knows.

Seems to look and play great with the new features and the addition of ray-tracing, regardless of whether you're playing on a XSX or a PS5.
Click to expand...


Games like Hitman 3 were already getting higher resolution numbers on Xbox Series X even before VRS tier 2 was used, so it's not why it's targeting a higher resolution, it certainly is wise to use a feature that makes the use of resources more efficient, so why not use it? Funny thing is, warriors are trying to make a next gen feature of RDNA2 seem like it's something bad lol. Games back in the day used to render EVERYTHING, even what the player couldn't see. This VRS warrior argument is like enabling a flyby and looking behind the FPS to show that nothing is there OMG!! there ZERO textures and rendering in this version 🤡

You cannot tell while playing the game, this analysis are pausing and looking a peripheral areas and then zooming in 400%, honestly it's a waste to render information there, and that's where VRS comes in.
 
Armorian said:
VRS is part of RDNA2 architecture and PS5 doesn't support it... We have it confirmed right now



WTF happened to colors, are you seriously playing like that? It's like digital vibrance setting in nvidia driver with values to the max.
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Playing on a HDR display that's why the color look saturated on the screenshot
 
NonPhixion said:
I wonder what AMD have confirmed?
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It's RDNA2 Architecture, but it doesn't implement the full RDNA2 set of features. VRS being one of those features.

Xbox Series S/X have the full RDNA2 feature set, including hardware to take advantage of it. The PS5 is RDNA2, but is missing some features and hardware to use those features.
 
MrFunSocks said:
It's RDNA2 Architecture, but it doesn't implement the full RDNA2 set of features. VRS being one of those features.

Xbox Series S/X have the full RDNA2 feature set, including hardware to take advantage of it. The PS5 is RDNA2, but is missing some features and hardware to use those features.
Click to expand...
Other than VRS what other features is it missing?
 
NonPhixion said:
Other than VRS what other features is it missing?
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AFAIK we don't know. Have Mesh Shaders and Sampler Feedback along with dedicated hardware support for them been confirmed on PS5? I genuinely don't know.

What we do know is that it is confirmed to not have hardware support for VRS, which means it is not "full" RDNA2. If that's an actual issue is debatable, but it is true, and you should probably stop arguing.
 
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Just play and enjoy the game.

PS5 version is my 3rd playthrough. 1st was on my One X, 2nd on my Pro and it's always looked good with solid performance.

In RT mode the PS5 version feels like I'm playing the One X version but with Ray Tracing as the One X was 1800p. When I played through again on my Pro, I could tell the difference in resolution and image quality but it felt slight and didn't detract from my experience. The game is fast paced and during heavy combat you aint looking at surface details, image quality etc.
 
dcmk7 said:
Is that supposed to be confirmation.. did you read the article?

Their source is a forum post which literally begins "My hunch is..".

That's pretty weak evidence if you ask me.
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Really surprised all of this chatter regarding RDNA2 is coming back up nearly 8+ months later …

So where is the evidence to the contrary?

If you want confirmation.. look to the official statements and PR material released to the public regarding the architecture for each console.

The road to PS5 video confirmed primitive shaders.

Continued silence from a company on specific features and functionality on their product versus their competitors speaks volumes regarding what is or isn't available…

Microsoft confirmed mesh shaders (and other key hardware based features in support of "full" implementation of the RDNA2 architecture) on XSX/S here:

news.xbox.com

A Closer Look at How Xbox Series X|S Integrates Full AMD RDNA 2 Architecture - Xbox Wire

We here at Team Xbox would like to congratulate and celebrate our amazing partners at AMD on today’s announcement of the Radeon RX 6000 Series of RDNA 2 GPUs. It was incredible to see AMD demonstrate the power and potential that the new AMD RDNA 2 architecture can deliver to gamers around the...
news.xbox.com news.xbox.com

That's not to say that there aren't alternative solutions (software based) that the PS5 can implement and ultimately utilize to achieve the similar results …

Whether or not it makes a difference in games, etc., is yet to be seen. Both consoles are still in their infancy with respect to devs (and their games) taking full advantage of each respective console architecture and platform…

It will be interesting to see how discussions here will potentially change in 2-3 years time when we begin to see devs really push the capabilities of these consoles.
 
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MrFunSocks said:
It's RDNA2 Architecture, but it doesn't implement the full RDNA2 set of features. VRS being one of those features.

Xbox Series S/X have the full RDNA2 feature set, including hardware to take advantage of it. The PS5 is RDNA2, but is missing some features and hardware to use those features.
Click to expand...

Pretty much. No VRS, no Mesh Shaders, no Machine Learning acceleration, and no Sampler Feedback Streaming. PS5 may be based on RDNA 2, but it's almost certainly not a fully feature complete RDNA 2 GPU in the same way that RDNA 2 on PC or Xbox Series X|S are.
 
SenjutsuSage said:
The PS5 is dropping to below 1080p in this game, meanwhile the Series X is regularly achieving superior resolution and performance, but somehow it's the Series X that's doing worse? How exactly does that work? And suddenly after months of downplaying VRS' performance impact, it's now being used as part of an effort to downplay Series X by suggesting Series X somehow desperately needed it as a crutch?

The reality is Xbox Series X would have had the advantage in resolution and performance regardless of VRS Tier 2. What VRS Tier 2 does in this game is it further ensures on top of the better GPU in Series X that in cases where the game might have miss its target frametime that the console has some extra performance headroom to better protect against fps drops. In the best case scenario together with dynamic resolution scaling it totally eliminates the need altogether to even use the dynamic resolution, just as it did with Gears 5.

devblogs.microsoft.com

Moving Gears to Tier 2 Variable Rate Shading - DirectX Developer Blog

The team at The Coalition haven’t stopped innovating since bringing Tier 1 VRS to Gears Tactics, and have brought Tier 2 VRS support to both Gears 5 and Gears Tactics. The team saw similarly large perf gains from VRS Tier 2 – up to 14%! – this time with no noticeable visual impact. See for […]
devblogs.microsoft.com devblogs.microsoft.com




Whatever happened to when people use to claim it's only ever going to give 8-12% better performance at best so it's a waste of time after that blog post by Coalition? People saw savings of 8-12% or 14%-20% and completely wrote it off, not realizing those frametime savings can be crucial to performance no matter how tiny they may appear. This is the reason that Series X doesn't dip quite as hard as the PS5 appears to.

There are other games where Series X has both the resolution advantage as well as the performance advantage without Tier 2 VRS playing a factor, so we can end the excuses. And btw utilizing a built in hardware feature of a more advanced GPU is never a crutch.
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According to VG tech it is dynamic 4K on both for balanced mode. Dynamic 1800P in RT mode. They both drop resolution, 23% and 14% more pixels in favor of SX in these mode but these are dynamic and depend on the scene. 120fps the worst case scenario for PS5 is 1992*1120 and 2266*1275 for SX which is 29% more pixels.

if you look at the performance of RX 5700 which is 36CU 1.7ghz boost mode, 8tf console compared to these console it is disappointing but even more for SX because it specs are 52CU 1.8ghz, 12tf with VRS.
 
Riky said:
That's really desperate, you can do the same glory kill at any point in the game on any level which all have different DRS values as you can see by the backgrounds it's not the same area and we don't even know if it's the same graphics mode.

Sad.

We've just seen many comparisons from professionals who have all said basically the same things.

"Xbox Series X operates at a dynamic 1800p, while PlayStation 5 tops out at 1584p - and it is visibly blurrier"
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I couldn't agree more. That is definitely landing him on my ignore list. How desperate can a person get... People are not taking this game being better in every category on Series X too well at all. You can perform that kill anytime and see that what's on display there in that screen is inaccurate and doesn't match what the Series X is actually outputting.
 
Neo_game said:
According to VG tech it is dynamic 4K on both for balanced mode. Dynamic 1800P in RT mode. They both drop resolution, 23% and 14% more pixels in favor of SX in these mode but these are dynamic and depend on the scene. 120fps the worst case scenario for PS5 is 1992*1120 and 2266*1275 for SX which is 29% more pixels.

if you look at the performance of RX 5700 which is 36CU 1.7ghz boost mode, 8tf console compared to these console it is disappointing but even more for SX because it specs are 52CU 1.8ghz, 12tf with VRS.
Click to expand...

DF confirms lower than 1080p for PS5 in 120fps mode though it's rare..

All in all it doesn't matter. Personally, I believe the Series X will achieve quite a bit more performance when SFS is used. I think the GPU is literally made to operate with it in use.
 
Neo_game said:
According to VG tech it is dynamic 4K on both for balanced mode. Dynamic 1800P in RT mode. They both drop resolution, 23% and 14% more pixels in favor of SX in these mode but these are dynamic and depend on the scene. 120fps the worst case scenario for PS5 is 1992*1120 and 2266*1275 for SX which is 29% more pixels.

if you look at the performance of RX 5700 which is 36CU 1.7ghz boost mode, 8tf console compared to these console it is disappointing but even more for SX because it specs are 52CU 1.8ghz, 12tf with VRS.
Click to expand...
Do you think the DRS is TOO effective at maintaining 120 fps? and that its coming at the cost of a lower resolution? After all, they are targeting 1585p and 1800p as the base resolution for these modes so there was clearly more headroom available here.

2dviFWZzU2cQWwVvnTTzTK-970-80.png.webp


The PS5 should be on par with the 5700xt but I see that there are some drops to 117 fps which means the DRS system has to adjust the resolution down to maintain the 120 fps.

The XSX is on par with the 2080 so it should be easily able to do 1800p at 120 fps but again due to those 1% drops the DRS kicks in and lowers the resolution.

i think they shouldve just gone with 1440p and an unlocked framerate with a 120 fps cap. this way you get a consistent image with some drops in those 1% instances that you wont even notice because the average framerate is what matters.

I have been saying this for a while now, but DF's insistence on finding the worst case scenario and using that to judge the entire game performance is simply not accurate. They should take average framerates across various different levels and report that. Finding a drop here and there does nothing to report the performance of the game other than to feed console wars. And now we are seeing these really aggressive DRS scalers that are downgrading the image quality to 1080p and sub 1080p in Metro exodus because devs are too afraid to drop a single fucking frame.
 
Shmunter said:
How does it avg out when the PS5 is visibly sharper?

This whole narrative of not noticing the poor image is like saying 2d cardboard trees don't matter in a driving game because you drive too fast to notice.

It's not about how observant an individual is, this is a tech comparison and Sony is bringing the goods in this one, the other is trailing behind. It's not subjective when it's a fact.
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Hey! Aren't you more concerned about the sudden lurch to 109fps Mr pixels don't matter it's all about the framerate.
 
Shmunter said:
Locked 60 here!
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Strange that you point out your preference for frame rate in past threads when PS5 and X have been locked at 60fps but Ps5 has a edge in 120fps mode. Yep chances are you haven't got a 120 hrz compatible tv. Wouldn't surprise me if you even haven't even got a Ps5.
 
SlimySnake said:
Do you think the DRS is TOO effective at maintaining 120 fps? and that its coming at the cost of a lower resolution? After all, they are targeting 1585p and 1800p as the base resolution for these modes so there was clearly more headroom available here.

2dviFWZzU2cQWwVvnTTzTK-970-80.png.webp


The PS5 should be on par with the 5700xt but I see that there are some drops to 117 fps which means the DRS system has to adjust the resolution down to maintain the 120 fps.

The XSX is on par with the 2080 so it should be easily able to do 1800p at 120 fps but again due to those 1% drops the DRS kicks in and lowers the resolution.

i think they shouldve just gone with 1440p and an unlocked framerate with a 120 fps cap. this way you get a consistent image with some drops in those 1% instances that you wont even notice because the average framerate is what matters.

I have been saying this for a while now, but DF's insistence on finding the worst case scenario and using that to judge the entire game performance is simply not accurate. They should take average framerates across various different levels and report that. Finding a drop here and there does nothing to report the performance of the game other than to feed console wars. And now we are seeing these really aggressive DRS scalers that are downgrading the image quality to 1080p and sub 1080p in Metro exodus because devs are too afraid to drop a single fucking frame.
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Are Ps5 and X Ultra though ?
 
SlimySnake said:
They are not which means they should easily be able to do 1440p.
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Maybe these consoles end up being like any other generation where games are a mixture ow low, medium high, with the odd ultra setting of pc. The main difference is they have a better cpu this time.

we get so hyped for these consoles but in the end there's only so much skilled designers can do with a 400 to 500 dollar budget.
 
Md Ray said:
Infinity cache is part of RDNA2 architecture and Series X|S doesn't have it...
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Like I mentioned earlier, please don't do this. Infinity cache is for pc gpus that have shared system memory and gpu memory, why would a console with super fast gddr memory for its entire memory pool have infinity cache?
 
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