VulcanRaven
Member
Looks like Series S.
Microsoft Amy Hood Says Xbox Console Hardware Sales Had Weaker Than Expected Performance
digdug2
Member
You're 100% correct about the lineup being on them. The 2nd biggest company in the world had over a decade to rectify their missteps that started with the announcement of the Xbox One. All they had to do was harness the talents of their world-class studios and produce multiple excellent games YOY and they wouldn't be standing here today with their thumbs up their asses wondering what went wrong.
Mister Wolf
Member
The whole Xbox One era was a wash. They honestly should have begun buying all of these studios and IP at the beginning of that generation.
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RPS37
Member
Holy shit I think you’re right. Came here to post this.
This is what happens when you have nearly no worthwhile first party games.
Probably the last first party game I actually finished.
yazenov
Member
This year will be much worse than last year without a question. I don't see MS slowing this downward spiral of decline anytime soon.
It's not only hardware. It also affects software sales and subscription growth. All of these things are tied together with the all-important hardware sales.
It's not only hardware. It also affects software sales and subscription growth. All of these things are tied together with the all-important hardware sales.
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Team Andromeda
Member
To be expected with way XBox gave up on PR and getting consoles in stores to get the ABK deal done.
Think it will be very different this year more so if Xbox looks to do another price cut to get rid of old stock before the new models come on line
XBox line up this year is the best in the history of the brand for In- House games
Think it will be very different this year more so if Xbox looks to do another price cut to get rid of old stock before the new models come on line
XBox line up this year is the best in the history of the brand for In- House games
bitbydeath
Gold Member
Problem is, he didn’t try with games last-gen either. It’s the equivalent of:
As soon as Don left the games dried up.
balls of snow
Gold Member
Not even that. 3rd party games like Armored Core and Avatar are on sale now on the xbox store and all im thinking about is when is the psn store gonna update with the same sales. Its just too much of a risk to invest in the ecosystem if the next iteration will be...what?
A streaming console? An Xbox made by asus?
GHG
Gold Member
Frankly, I don't believe her. I side with what
D
Darsxx82
was saying. In light of her statements I have to acknowledge he was not spinning:
I repeat, not spinning, it is myself and Amy Hood who are the ones spinning:
I repeat, not spinning, it is myself and Amy Hood who are the ones spinning:
LOL. Typical of you, not reading what is said and spinning what you don't like to read.
I was talking about the hardware. MS expected a decline for this quarter and there has still been growth despite the large discounts.
I have faith that you will understand it
Then, about the layoffs?? I have already given my opinion. It seems like a disgusting move and difficult to justify by a 3T company. That said, this is capitalism and the industry is seeing an extreme layoff process seeking to maintain profits or avoid losses. MS just added 17,000 new employees to its gaming business.... Disgusting mainly because MS's promise and expectations towards ABK employees were different but that is the reality. You have Sony itself in the leaked docs imposing layoffs or cuts to its Studios and even a willingness to close some despite record income....
Now if you want we talk about numbers and not about how friend or enemy video game companies are for us....
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digdug2
Member
This is the answer. There really is no other answer or excuse. I am completely baffled that a fucking SOFTWARE company doesn't realize that their console is lacking quality first party software. Are they really that blind? The fix was not to buy Activision/Blizzard, it was to release one killer first party game per quarter. They had years and years to plan this out and get it right. Instead, they squandered their opportunities at every turn.
Is clear there She is not referring specifically to XSeries sales. In fact, in terms of income, it has met the expectations of his previous Q.
Clearly She is referring to the general income that XSeries has generated in this Q and that is where first party games come in (FM has not met expectations for sure), and/or 3rd party games that have generated fewer (lower microtransaction, users buying fewer games..) and no best sellers un this end of the year, and/or fewer gamepass subscriptions than expected...
But In fact, the words "CONSOLE MARKET" when talking about ABK's performance would not rule out that She was referring not only to the revenue from XSeries but also to the revenue from other consoles where they also release games. In fact, Xbox is already the largest 3rd party for PS5 and to a lesser extent Switch (COD, Diablo, Overwatch, Fallout, Quake, Minecraft, etc, etc etc...).
digdug2
Member
They'll probably never post sales or engagement numbers ever again because it's hard proof that they are floundering.
It reminds me of when Rocket League changed their server count. It used to show exactly how many people were on at any time, but the minute that number started to drop, they changed it to "high", "medium", or "low."
YOU PC BRO?!
Gold Member
What does she expect? Lets go through the list...
> Worst 1st party launch software line-up in Xbox history
> Lack of identity, unassuming inoffensive box
> No new gamepad innovation
> Initial mandatory cross-gen support for new releases
> Worst console name of all time 'Series'
> Few compelling 1st party exclusives
> No console only exclusives
> Simultaneous release of titles on Xbox/PC
> Hardware performance tiers i.e. Series S/Series X
> Underutilised next-gen hardware features i.e. SFS, DirectML, VRS2
> Adorably all digital future no-one wants, attempts to lock users into their ecosystem
> General lack of confidence and poor overall communication
> No known plans for a 'Pro' device tier
Terrible hardware sales is the reality check Microsoft deserves. That's the simple truth.
> Worst 1st party launch software line-up in Xbox history
> Lack of identity, unassuming inoffensive box
> No new gamepad innovation
> Initial mandatory cross-gen support for new releases
> Worst console name of all time 'Series'
> Few compelling 1st party exclusives
> No console only exclusives
> Simultaneous release of titles on Xbox/PC
> Hardware performance tiers i.e. Series S/Series X
> Underutilised next-gen hardware features i.e. SFS, DirectML, VRS2
> Adorably all digital future no-one wants, attempts to lock users into their ecosystem
> General lack of confidence and poor overall communication
> No known plans for a 'Pro' device tier
Terrible hardware sales is the reality check Microsoft deserves. That's the simple truth.
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Varteras
Member
I dunno, man. Sounds like word games. I wish they would be more transparent.
GHG
Gold Member
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You don’t even need one per quarter. 1-2 games per year which baffle influencers and gaming media. Just games which are great and not just good or very good and release without major flaws. Even if they aren’t system sellers, their push your reputation and especially casual players buy by reputation. Gears of War, Halo 3, Mass Effect, Forza Motorsport 3, those games brought Xbox to gaming Olymp. Their are struggling to hit this quality levels regularly since Xbox One.
Unfortunately it does not seem that they are going to improve in transparency, much less when their gaming business is now so diversified and reaches so many different platforms.
But this possibility still makes sense as they clearly distinguish between XBOX and "consoles" in all their manifestations. "Console market" is too general and, with ABK, they can certainly speak in general because it has become the largest 3rd party in the console market.
I could perfectly well be wrong, but that expression today fits perfectly with the new reality of XBOX where the returns generated by PS5 and Switch are as much a part of its business as those of XboxSeries.
digdug2
Member
You're absolutely right... I set a pretty high bar, in all reality. I don't understand what the major malfunction is with Xbox's leadership. They have one job: make money. In order to make money, you have to keep your employees and customers happy. Happier employees create a better product, and a better product not only keeps current customers, but it brings in new customers too. I just don't get it.
Varteras
Member
Introducing the anthem:
Introducing the anthem:
I'm waiting for the moment where you try a little and argue why what I'm saying doesn't make sense.....
No, just kidding, I only expect from you what is usual in your contributions in this forum, which is well represented with this answer you have made.
Keep it up
Killjoy-NL
Gold Member
Well, last-gen, I was already saying that I believe that Spencer was put in place to oversee the transition to 3rd party publishing, should things get worse (although at first it was more of a joke).Problem is, he didn’t try with games last-gen either. It’s the equivalent of:
As soon as Don left the games dried up.
If you look at it from that point of view, everything makes sense.
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That comment from Benji is simply his general perception of the situation. He's not explaining Amy Hood's words.
In fact it mixes things without meaning.
That MS has obtained large income in the gaming business has nothing to do with whether or not its expectations have been achieved or that the "console market" has not met.
I repeat, I could be wrong. But the console market for MS is no longer just XSeries. And that can be seen in the latest statements from MS where "consoles" were defined as a portion of the gaming business in general.
Ronin_7
Member
Varteras
Member
Saying hardware forecast for next quarter is a YoY decline doesn't sound like perception to me. I didn't listen to the earnings call, but he seems to have, and he seems to be coming away with the idea that it's not getting better. You couple his words, with an actual YoY decline in hardware forecast for next quarter, on top of the comment that the console market for Xbox did worse than they expected... I really think that you may be stretching here. I mean, for the sake of just trying to prove that they weren't surprised by bad hardware performance? I'm not saying that in a dickheaded way. I just don't think there's much reason to really argue this. It's bad. The impressions are bad. The forecasts are bad.
PharaoTutAnchAmun
Member
When the PC exceeds the Xbox series S its more then enough couse most Xbox owners are owning the S
Cyberpunkd
Member
This is the very definition of a publicly listed companies. Another one for you: share buyback to boost share price.
Cyberpunkd
Member
No, it was the idea of a GP itself. Everyone that wanted a GP bought one, now you have zero growth in both GP subs and console sales, since now we say the Xbox consoles are bought only because of GP. Whereas both Nintendo and Sony make it very clear - no first party games on subscription service, pony up the cash.
FunkMiller
Banned
Absolutely the best thing for them to do at this point is get out of the console making business. I'd imagine it'd please the shareholders. The games are where the profit clearly is.
Kerotan
Member
Could be an even worse year this year.
I have also seen the words and the context live and clearly Benji is not doing more than a drawing of the general situation and not about Amy Hood's words
When she talks about having detected a non expected decline in income in the "console market" she does so from the mention of the acquisition of ABK and the Xbox gaming business in general.
Hardware sales expectations for the next Q were made separately. As I said, hardware revenue expectations were met if the predictions of the previous Q are taken into account.
I don't think the "console business or market" is specifically referring to income from hardware sales. This would also include the sale of games, subscriptions, DLCs, microtransactions..... And of course I do not rule out that the income that comes from PS5 and Switch is also included, which is definitely income from the "console market."
I don't know, we'll see in the next presentation of results. Perhaps this aspect will be clarified. Even more necessary if, as everything indicates, more Xbox games will reach PS5/Switch and of course those incomes must be quantified and named appropriately.
Sony
Nintendo
They can't possible be so dumb that they are surprised by this result. Their phisical presence in stores - and therefore in the mindset of consumers - is also cratering. They already have a near impossible task in staying relevant vs. PlayStation, yet they are scaling down.
It's basic logic that they need to increase the Xbox ownership to able to increase GamePass subscriptions.. if that's their goal. Truly baffling decisions at Xbox leadership.
Then again, I do agree with the notion that Xbox lost one of the most important generations, Xbox One vs. PS4.
It's basic logic that they need to increase the Xbox ownership to able to increase GamePass subscriptions.. if that's their goal. Truly baffling decisions at Xbox leadership.
Then again, I do agree with the notion that Xbox lost one of the most important generations, Xbox One vs. PS4.
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mcjmetroid
Member
There's a few issues here. The main one being their games just aren't good enough. Everything for years now has been " coming" and wait for it and everything that is coming is an unknown entity. Avowed looked ok, Hellblade 2 is a sequel to a very niche game, fable we don't know anything about etc.
The Pleasure
Gold Member
What about J-Lo Infinite?
Imagine you got married and then you bragged to your friends how your income doubled. I mean, yeah, but also, not really.
mcjmetroid
Member
If HALO infinite was an 11/10 game and was actually released when it was originally supposed to be. It might have made a dent but again..
They had nothing else. It was like they gave up completely in the generation before and they had to kick-start everything back up again during the beginning of the next consoles life. They were not prepared and Sony were not in the world's best position at the start of the gen either, that was when it was time to strike.
It's insane.
But alas I think at this stage the Xbox consoles as a front to sell gamepass. They'll happily take the loss on each console made if it gets their subscriber base up. That's what it's always been about this generation and that's the only reason I think Phil Spencer was allowed throw around as much money as it is.
Im sure they'd be happy with higher console sales but it's not the end all be all for them.
Ass of Can Whooping
Gold Member
But she says ABK performance was stronger than expected and helped to offset the weaker console market
midnightAI
Member
That's a catch-22 statement, don't bother trying because people aren't buying our games/console....... people arent buying the games/console because they arent trying hard enough to make good games
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Horseganador
Member
And this year will be much worse for Xbox, lucky if they sell 6 million consoles.
PectacularOz
Member
Series S however....
Killjoy-NL
Gold Member
The only way to grow GamePass, is to release it on other platforms (Playstation/Nintendo).
But that's the next problem they'll encounter.
What if both say "no" or come with very high demands?
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PectacularOz
Member
The positives are still all fake news.
Of course you sold twice as many games - you can count all CoD sales now.
Of course subscription revenue is way up - You can count WoW now.
Of course in game purchases are up - You can count Candy Crush.
All said and done - those "gains" likely dont amount to 69 (edit: 75.4) BILLION. So they just moved money from one pocket to another, and still dropped half (edit: most) of it on the way.
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Xion_Stellar
People should stop referencing data that makes me feel uncomfortable because games get ported to platforms I don't like
That's how revenue works it's money that is flowing through your business so in a sense you could say that your business is doing "great" because you could see all of this cash flowing around.
They won't use the word "profit" because that would imply that they actually made some money so you are correct all they did was lump the revenue of Activision Blizzard with their revenue in order to make it look good to the shareholders.
And in the same paragraph she indicates that hardware revenue grew by 3% YtoY, which was more than their expectations in the previous Q....
Of course there is a lack of clarity and confusion. I suppose the situation leads to that and different interpretations are possible.
I don't remember a case where a console manufacturer is also the main 3rd party of the rest of the competing consoles
.I guess they should clarify what the "console market" is for them now.
PS. To add another point, the data says that the console market has seen a decrease in revenue compared to the previous year. In fact, the mass layoff processes have to do with that situation...
Doctor Hades
Member
The Xbox's biggest weakest is also its strength for PC gamers: that its exclusive games are available on Xbox and PC on Day One release. That means if you own a gaming PC then there is no reason to buy an Xbox console, well unless your system is ancient, I suppose. You could just buy a PS5 instead which has more exclusives anyway. This is why Sony will never release PlayStation exclusives on PC on the same day as the console version (Helldivers 2 is a live service game so that is the obvious exception for revenue reasons) and instead are releasing them 18-24 months later. It makes perfect business sense and ensures that people have a reason to own one of their consoles.
Granted, I am happy that Microsoft are doing this for Xbox games because, let's face, at the moment there are very few decent exclusives on the system anyway and since the Xbox Series X|S launch it has just been disappointment after disappointment, at least for me. Halo Inifinite was mediocre, The Medium was boring, Red Fall was more Red Fail, Starfield was overhyped and Bethesda's most disappointing RPG to date, and Forza Motorsport is just a dull grindfest with downgraded visuals from the release trailer. Most of these games have not been received as well as expected. The console basically lacks a system seller and I don't see that changing any time soon under the current Xbox management who seem focused only on GamePass.
Granted, I am happy that Microsoft are doing this for Xbox games because, let's face, at the moment there are very few decent exclusives on the system anyway and since the Xbox Series X|S launch it has just been disappointment after disappointment, at least for me. Halo Inifinite was mediocre, The Medium was boring, Red Fall was more Red Fail, Starfield was overhyped and Bethesda's most disappointing RPG to date, and Forza Motorsport is just a dull grindfest with downgraded visuals from the release trailer. Most of these games have not been received as well as expected. The console basically lacks a system seller and I don't see that changing any time soon under the current Xbox management who seem focused only on GamePass.
Kokoloko85
Member
But Aaron Greenberg said it was selking faster than the Xbox 360.…Though he failed to say the Xbox 1 also was selling faster than the 360. lame attempt at hype
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Consoles are much cheaper (you don't get a good gaming PC for $500), and are plug-and-play. Stuff just works. Those are the reasons.
But clearly not strong enough reasons for Xbox. People choose the PS5 instead, which has the same benefits but also a bunch of good exclusives etc. And also because that's what all their friends already have of course.
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