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[MLiD] AMD Magnus APU Full Leak: RDNA 5, Zen 6, 110 TOPS NPU = XBOX Next-Gen Console!

The specs are good. 250-350W power is more like it. Not sure why PS6 will only use 160W ? He also says that it will run steam, windows, apps. Which sounds more like a hybrid device than a gaming console.
PS6 will use 160W to save on costs. Sonys main goal is making a more affordable console which was not a goal with the PS5. PS6 will be more similar to the modest PS4 in that sense.

Xbox is targeting a higher end market occupied by pre built companies like HP, Dell, Lenovo etc. Therefore the next Xbox needs to be powerful enough to compete with prebuilts that have dedicated Nvidia GPUs. Gaf console gamers will be very critical of the next Xbox due to its price.
 
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Hope worst not situation? The fuck is that hat.
 
So many questions remain to be answered. Usually we would just be wondering about performance/price, but with this it starts with what category it even falls in. I cant even begin assess value.


I don't think it was ever on the table, people just liked the idea. It never seemed credible to me AMD could have that platform ready a year before the PS6, when the PS6 design started early enough it probably had some influence on the Magnus product line. It makes sense that they both hit production within a quarter or two.
Nah it's more like RDNA5 is not ready till 2027. Which would mean MS would be stuck on RDNA4 but RDNA4 is going to be greatly outclassed by RDNA5 so there's no point hamstringing yourself releasing a year earlier. Think how much worse the Xbox Series X and S would have been if they used RDNA1 instead of 2 because they launched in 2019.
 
I won't lie, the specs look impressive, and what the PS6 should have been close to instead of whatever 160W bandwidth starved fuckery the leaks gave us. I am curious about the purpose of the NPU. The gpu already has insane TOP capability how would the NPU contribute?...dont tell me they are going to force Copilot on it, running on the NPU. If they allow steam on this well, this thing looks mighty tasty and a surprising value proposition. High-tier pc specs for around 800$ with access to a vast steam library and the xbox lineup...I would buy it, honestly, just for the PC games.

This brings in an interesting question will Microsoft allow full Windows on this thing, knowing the possibility of it getting cracked quickly and how will they monetize their ecosystem when the majority will just use steam instead of gamepass on this thing. How will they sustain their ecosystem, especially since now they are going all in on software?
NPU is significantly more efficient than the GPU and can handle its own tasks while the GPU can do other things. But the GPU does have advantages as well, that said by 2027 I expect software to leverage the NPU more than currently. Right now NPUs are largely untapped as software developers are waiting for more hardware adoption. Only gaming use for NPU I know off is Microsofts Super Resolution AI upscalers.
 
Consoles at launch offer better value. 3 yrs down the line, its a different story. I suspect that could be the situation here also.

Hopefully we get a complete refresh of magnus every 4-5 yrs, even if its not a generational leap. That way it will keep offering good value for most of its life, while keeping up with advancements in pc space.
Consoles also used to offer better value down the line. The PS4 launched in November 2013 for $400. By September 2016, it was $300, a whopping 25% price decrease. The PS5, if it had followed the same trajectory, would be selling for $375 for the disc drive model and $300. Instead, they're now $500 and $550 in the US.
 
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Also bigger RnD in absolute numbers and significantly bigger RnD per unit cost as expected sales will be much lower. Plus marketing cost and sga costs.
I doubt higher clocks has a significant effect on RnD costs per unit.

And zero effect on marketing costs. :)

Again, I'm talking about a lower (160W) wattage PS6 vs a higher (250W) wattage PS6 here. Not PS6 vs NextBox.
 
The video doesn't hold up btw.

He's talking about that the MS strategy is to use the same dies as AMD PC dies.

And then he shows a spreadsheet that clearly says the full PC AT2 is 64 CUs.

Followed up by the Magnus spec that clearly says that the GPU die is 70 CUs.

These 3 statements can't all be true.

(same goes for the CPU btw that, as drawn, has no PC counterpart)
 
PS6 will use 160W to save on costs. Sonys main goal is making a more affordable console which was not a goal with the PS5. PS6 will be more similar to the modest PS4 in that sense.

Xbox is targeting a higher end market occupied by pre built companies like HP, Dell, Lenovo etc. Therefore the next Xbox needs to be powerful enough to compete with prebuilts that have dedicated Nvidia GPUs. Gaf console gamers will be very critical of the next Xbox due to its price.
I dont think sony is going for cheap.. I think they are going for higher margins
 
Aren't you doing the same thing?

Hating on MLiD seems to generate a lot of likes on here.

I'm not hating on MLiD to generate hits though. You have this completely mixed. I'm hating for the miss information and how he shapes his content to maximise engagement. Even if it's not his actual opinion.

He knows exactly what he is doing and has even finally admitted it.

Now, I have people liking my comments because they probably agree with me and for the same reasons, or more.

He's just exposed himself that's all. It's absolutely shilling as you can see in his way he talks about each company.
 
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miss information and how he shapes his content to maximise engagement. Even if it's not his actual opinion.

He knows exactly what he is doing and has even finally admitted it.
Is there real evidence or is it again something you are inferring from something you felt when watching his content? Where has he clearly misinformed / lied?

YouTube streamer maximise engagement in and of itself seems like odd criticism and borderline very very naive ("he will try to get people engaged with a thumbnail that is not exactly the same opinion he will state in a 30 mins video if you watch it!"… uhm… alright…).
 
Is there real evidence or is it again something you are inferring from something you felt when watching his content? Where has he clearly misinformed / lied?

YouTube streamer maximise engagement in and of itself seems like odd criticism and borderline very very naive ("he will try to get people engaged with a thumbnail that is not exactly the same opinion he will state in a 30 mins video if you watch it!"… uhm… alright…).

He literally admits it in this video. Watch it.

If you follow the pc tech industry it's well known that he farms engagement and builds hopes and dreams for Sony and AMD fans as it makes them watch his videos. In terms of AMD and sometimes Sony. It usually backfires.

I think he does more harm to AMD fans and their products than helps, imo.

He's farming engagement massively. It's in his language of how he speaks.

The issue is now, Sony has potentially painted him into a corner so it will be interesting how his videos go over the next couple of years.
 
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He literally admits it in this video. Watch it.

If you follow the pc tech industry it's well known that he farms engagement and builds hopes and dreams for Sony and AMD fans as it makes them watch his videos.

He's farming engagement massively. It's in his language of how he speaks.

The issue is now, Sony has potentially painted him into a corner so it will be interesting how his videos go over the next couple of years.
Timestamp it please.
 
What is fixed? Every UE5 game have stuttering on consoles and PC.
The consoles don't have anywhere near the severity of stuttering that PC builds do in UE5. So many games I've refunded on Steam and ended up getting on PS5 due to it. I can handle the blurry image quality and dips below 60fps on PS5 Pro, but constant stuttering even when at a higher FPS on PC is far worse.

A shame as 1080p DLAA looks vastly better than whatever PS5 is doing with its image reconstruction.
 
Timestamp it please.
I don't have the timestamp, but what he said was that when he got the info on Magnus, he wasn't sure, and was only 50/50 which Console it belonged to. So he chose to say it was for PS6, because that gets better clicks, he apologized for any misleading early video, saying, that wasn't his goal.
 
The consoles don't have anywhere near the severity of stuttering that PC builds do in UE5. So many games I've refunded on Steam and ended up getting on PS5 due to it. I can handle the blurry image quality and dips below 60fps on PS5 Pro, but constant stuttering even when at a higher FPS on PC is far worse.

A shame as 1080p DLAA looks vastly better than whatever PS5 is doing with its image reconstruction.

This sounds wild to me. PCs do not have "Constant" stutters at all, on any of the UE5 games ive played. Which games are you playing specifically with issues?
 
This sounds wild to me. PCs do not have "Constant" stutters at all, on any of the UE5 games ive played. Which games are you playing specifically with issues?
At this point. Most of them. From worse traversal stutter, to simply panning the camera. Variable refresh can't do anything for it.

I am on an aging AM4 build which obviously has a much slower I/O than even the base PS5, but we've seen many others also having the issue on high end PC's.

The general consensus from most people is that it is a much more apparent issue on PC.

To name a few. Silent Hill 2. Oblivion. Stalker 2. Star Wars. Hogwarts. Wuchang.
 
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The consoles don't have anywhere near the severity of stuttering that PC builds do in UE5. So many games I've refunded on Steam and ended up getting on PS5 due to it. I can handle the blurry image quality and dips below 60fps on PS5 Pro, but constant stuttering even when at a higher FPS on PC is far worse.

A shame as 1080p DLAA looks vastly better than whatever PS5 is doing with its image reconstruction.

This sounds wild to me. PCs do not have "Constant" stutters at all, on any of the UE5 games ive played. Which games are you playing specifically with issues?

Even in games with fucked up shader compilation stutters will happen only once for every shader, after that all that is left is traversal stutter.

And with traversal stutter to you get to experience them on all platforms:

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In some games with good enough CPU (and 60fps lock) you can even avoid stutters present on consoles:

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At this point. Most of them. From worse traversal stutter, to simply panning the camera. Variable refresh can't do anything for it.

I am on an aging AM4 build which obviously has a much slower I/O than even the base PS5, but we've seen many others also having the issue on high end PC's.

The general consensus from most people is that it is a much more apparent issue on PC.

Yeah, this is problematic in some UE5 games, you have to lock framerate to specific values to avoid this:

 
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Not always limited to UE5 though.

Dead Space remake is shocking for it on PC. RE4 REmake has worse traversal stutter than on console too.
 
I don't have the timestamp, but what he said was that when he got the info on Magnus, he wasn't sure, and was only 50/50 which Console it belonged to. So he chose to say it was for PS6, because that gets better clicks, he apologized for any misleading early video, saying, that wasn't his goal.
And what's the problem with it? He got corrected quite quickly and he admitted error himself
It's leaks and there bound to be some uncertainty and even errors and if there is a fork, absolutely majority will choose something that more benefitting to them
 
I was wondering how much time until Bojji Bojji jumped with a cherry picked example of a couple of games or a slight stutter when every other technical analysis verifies what Ellis Ellis said.
Season 2 Time GIF by American Gods

15 seconds.

Better to tell the truth than to lie to defend your favorite piece of plastic.

UE5 is full of issues, and those issues manifest on all platforms. That camera stutter Ellis Ellis mentioned is not on consoles because... console games are locked to 60fps most of the time. Locking fps is also a fix for this.

Not always limited to UE5 though.

Dead Space remake is shocking for it on PC. RE4 REmake has worse traversal stutter than on console too.

Dead Space is broken on PC, same with Jedi Survivor. There are games that are objectively worse on PC.
 
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Better to tell the truth than to lie to defend your favorite piece of plastic.
And the truth is that the stutter problem, as he said, is way worse in PC, as in more frequent, in more games and in many cases more milliseconds per stutter. Not that I care, I loved my saving stutter in Halo 3, but better tell the truth than be a PC jihadist. That's a thing for Germans...
 
And the truth is that the stutter problem, as he said, is way worse in PC, as in more frequent, in more games and in many cases more milliseconds per stutter. Not that I care, I loved my saving stutter in Halo 3, but better tell the truth than be a PC jihadist. That's a thing for Germans...

I showed screenshots where traversal stutter was bigger on PS5 Pro than on PC with Ryzen 3600...

Prove what you are saying. Prove that traversal stutter is worse on PC in many games.
 
Better to tell the truth than to lie to defend your favorite piece of plastic.

UE5 is full of issues, and those issues manifest on all platforms. That camera stutter Ellis Ellis mentioned is not on consoles because... console games are locked to 60fps most of the time. Locking fps is also a fix for this.



Dead Space is broken on PC, same with Jedi Survivor. There are games that are objectively worse on PC.
I've tried this myself on PC. Even dropping the refresh from 120 to 60hz. It did not fix the issue.

Unless I'm doing something wrong that others are not.

From my own experience, and what we see here and elsewhere every day, it's an issue more on PC than console. There are definitely exceptions, but those are rare.
 
And what's the problem with it? He got corrected quite quickly and he admitted error himself
It's leaks and there bound to be some uncertainty and even errors and if there is a fork, absolutely majority will choose something that more benefitting to them
Normally not a problem, he could've simply stated that he wasn't fully sure which Console it belongs to. But instead of doing that, he specifically labeled it PS6, then created a false narrative trying to reinforce that idea. Like saying this massive die with a chiplet design is exactly something Mark Cerny would design....

Like really? Right then, that was very fishy, I thought, maybe Mark Cerny is doing opposite of fast and small now. He created an entire video supporting the false premise.

That's fine, I still don't mind giving him his views, still interesting leaks overall.
 
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I've tried this myself on PC. Even dropping the refresh from 120 to 60hz. It did not fix the issue.

Unless I'm doing something wrong that others are not.

From my own experience, and what we see here and elsewhere every day, it's an issue more on PC than console. There are definitely exceptions, but those are rare.

It's mostly about locking the framerate, SHf has (or had after patches?) and locking the framerate with in game limiter was enough.

Just watch all the videos from DF five years from now.

Show examples of MANY games, with screenshots showing the stutters. I usually provide sources when I talk about something.
 
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Even in games with fucked up shader compilation stutters will happen only once for every shader, after that all that is left is traversal stutter.
'All that is left'.
Traversal stutter has plagued UE games for the entire existence of the engine (granted - 25 years ago the pauses were so long they were literally just loading screens without a loading screen notification). For a tech that markets itself as 'high end' they never resolved the most basic of issues it has.

/rant
 
It's mostly about locking the framerate, SHf has (or had after patches?) and locking the framerate with in game limiter was enough.
SHf is the most recent games I refunded and picked up on PS5 Pro.

This was before patches, but I could not remedy the stutter. The PS5 version has zero camera stutter, just FPS drops which VRR can eliminate. Traversal hitching is also less apparent on PS5, but again, that could be due to my PC being AM4.
 
I might be Spanish but not even us have that much time while working.

'All that is left'.
Traversal stutter has plagued UE games for the entire existence of the engine (granted - 25 years ago the pauses were so long they were literally just loading screens without a loading screen notification). For a tech that markets itself as 'high end' they never resolved the most basic of issues it has.

/rant

Just like I said earlier in this thread. This is a software problem, there is no good reason why we see ANY stuttering on machines with 16GB+ of memory and 5GB/s storage...

UE5 produces some incredible looking games but some fundamental aspects of the engine are broken.
 
I was wondering how much time until Bojji Bojji jumped with a cherry picked example of a couple of games or a slight stutter when every other technical analysis verifies what Ellis Ellis said.
Season 2 Time GIF by American Gods

15 seconds.

Please provide evidence of this. At least Bojji Bojji provides evidence. Can you provide evidence to show how drastically different it is on PC vs PS5. Any games from this gen will be fine. Let's make it fair.
 
Just like I said earlier in this thread. This is a software problem, there is no good reason why we see ANY stuttering on machines with 16GB+ of memory and 5GB/s storage...

UE5 produces some incredible looking games but some fundamental aspects of the engine are broken.
Well, of course it is a Tim Sweeny problem! His and the devs that decide to use that POS engine instead of making one of its own (when indy devs like the guys of the rats games can). The thing is that you can't brute force that, as you said: there is no reason why this has to have stutter on a 32GB + 16 GB RAM/VRAM machine with M2 of 7000MB/s. And Tim Piggy is focused on optimizing his deadweight on consoles (or at least so it seems from the games so far), which is why the discussed value proposition of the Magnus being discussed here is valid (if it finally doesn't run on Windows) and it'll probably outperform in many cases similarly priced PCs.
My great grandad was a Spaniard. That fucker only had one real job in his life, and it was working on the Titanic's hull when he emigrated here. That didn't go well in the end 🤣.
Letting anglos drown while going to the Americas to spread the superior Spaniard DNA, what a hero...
But you have time to comment and make statements that a poster is being disingenuous ;)
A little bit of banter with my favourite Pole can't be compared to go to a whole channel looking for examples, but since Ellis Ellis mentioned Dead Space...
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From the average German gamer stereotype himself.
 
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One thing is definitely for sure. Most of us really didn't give a shit about these issues 25 years ago. I happily played games like Duke 3D at 10fps without a single care.
It probably helped that CRTs weren't shit with motion like today's offerings.
 
Yeap this will have prebuilts level prices not PS5 pricing.

Speculation in the video is it could cost between $1,000 to $1,200 and offer performance on par with a $2 to $2.5k prebuilt.

Sounds good to me and will separate Xbox's next console drastically from Sony, which is what I have always wanted. The question is, does it even come out?
 
Speculation in the video is it could cost between $1,000 to $1,200 and offer performance on par with a $2 to $2.5k prebuilt.

Sounds good to me and will separate Xbox's next console drastically from Sony, which is what I have always wanted. The question is, does it even come out?
I don't think a pre-built with a 5080-tier GPU will cost $2-2.5K in early 2027. More like $1.5K I'm guessing.

Edit: Never mind, you did mention pre-built and those are far more expensive. Was thinking of a DIY build.
 
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